How to make a girl feel wanted without being needy?

Winston · Nov 27, 2022

I am trying to set up a date with a girl that I know from social circle and who is a legit 8,5. So kind of above my league. And she is flaky.

A friend of mine, a natural very good with women (lay count north of 300), looked into my texting and told me that the problem is that I don't make her feel wanted enough/I don't show my desire enough in my texting.

I have tried to ask him specific things to say but he answers me with no specific things. He just tells me that I am afraid to show my desire because I am afraid of rejection because I lack balls. And that she shows not much interest in meeting me because she doesn't see the point.

He also told me that he got plenty of girls above of his league by being very persistent, but it's a kind of persistence where he shows his desire at the same time.

So how we do that exactly? It's like this is the recipe of his game. He uses a mix of fearless persistence loaded with communication of his desire. But I am pretty sure if I try to do that with only these pointers and guidelines, I am going to come across as needy.

So how to be persistent, and convey desire, without being needy?

Rakehell · Nov 27, 2022

Your friend was incredibly vague with his response, I’m sure theres probably more that he’s not telling you, not out of malice, but because he probably doesn’t even know himself.

Imo you’re better off posting the texts you showed him, so that someone can try and communicate to you what he meant, but with more context.

Winston · Nov 27, 2022

Ok, one important element of context is that she has a boyfriend (my friend told me that it's part of the reason of why I need to be more forward).

Also, I have already tried to set up a date with her one year ago when she was single, and she avoided it by saying she was busy.

I'll redacted the parts between [ ] for privacy reasons.

I didn't talk to her since 3 months and out of the blue she sent me on insta the following message. :

Her: Hi Winston. How are you? Do you remember I told you that my boyfriend is in [the same field as you]. He would like to ask some questions about [what you are doing]. Could he call you? Have a good evening. Kisses

Me: Hi Linda. I am good and you? I don't feel comfortable talking about my business to someone I don't know, there are secret things! But if you want, we can go for a drink or a restaurant and you'll be able to ask me all the questions you want.

Her: Hahaha don't worry he is not working for the police. But yeah if you prefer, we can go for a drink when you are back in [our city].

Me: Alright, lets do that. I'll be back in 1 or 2 weeks. I will let you know.
She likes this message.

---------------------------------------------------------
2 weeks later
---------------------------------------------------------

Monday:
Me: Hi Linda, how are you? I'll in be [our city] for a week starting from Wednesday. When are you available for our drink?
Her: Hi Winstin, this week there is a [big work convention] so I have plenty of friends that are coming from all over the country and we have restaurants planned everey evening. Maybe this weekend at the end of an atfernoon if you can.
Me: I'll be very likely available on Sunday. Otherwise I'll be here Monday and Tuesday too.

Friday:
Me: *send her a picture of something with her name in it*
She later liked this message
Me: Are we seeing each other on Sunday afternoon?
Her: I cannot promise I will be able to go outside on Sunday (meaning she plan to drink a lot the Saturday night) But on Monday or Tuesday yes.

Saturday:
Me: I have something that came up Monday. Let's say Tuesday then?
Her: I will not be able to, I have something planned and I work during the day. But maybe Monday during the day.

***End of the conversation***

At this point I am not planning to send her any other message to see her the Monday, because she is obviously flaky/not motivated enough/I don't want a short date during the day.

Rakehell · Nov 27, 2022

So I think what your friend meant by desire and persistence is, there’s no intent.

She reached out solely trying to get info for her boyfriend (vaguely disrespectful), and asked if he could call you (vaguely disrespectful), so that you could help him out.

You did a good job reframing it by telling her she could meet you over drinks, and SHE could ask you whatever she wanted to know.

But there still wasn’t anything communicated to suggest that you were interested in her in any way other than to discuss your job.

Desire meaning you solely want a sexual relationship with her, persistance meaning when she tries to make you do stuff you dont want you stand on the fact that you only want a sexual relationship.

Is that clearer?

Winston · Nov 28, 2022

Rakehell said:
So I think what your friend meant by desire and persistence is, there’s no intent.

She reached out solely trying to get info for her boyfriend (vaguely disrespectful), and asked if he could call you (vaguely disrespectful), so that you could help him out.

You did a good job reframing it by telling her she could meet you over drinks, and SHE could ask you whatever she wanted to know.

But there still wasn’t anything communicated to suggest that you were interested in her in any way other than to discuss your job.

Desire meaning you solely want a sexual relationship with her, persistance meaning when she tries to make you do stuff you dont want you stand on the fact that you only want a sexual relationship.

Is that clearer?

It's clearer because you have reworded my friend's terminology in the traditional and common game terminology, but I still don't understand how I should have better communicated my intent.

For me, the reframing "I prefer going for a drink or at a restaurant with you" when she asked me if her boyfriend could call me was already a sign of interest/communication of intent from me. But you and my friend agree this wasn't enough, so I guess I am overestimating the amount of intent I am conveying.

So how could I have communicated my intent better? By saying what specific things?

I think this answer will be helpful not only with this specific case but with my whole approach to game, because I think this is a general problem that I have, I tend to overestimate the amount of intent I convey when I am interacting with girls.

Rakehell · Nov 28, 2022

This is a girl who doesn’t view you very highly on the sexual option scale for whatever reason so pretty much anything’s on the table.

I don’t think she could’ve been gotten either way.
Personally I would’ve left her on read, but you could’ve said something like.

“Nope cant help ya , how are things with you?” and escalated that to getting her out on a better terms.

or “hahaha I see, maybe i’ll consider it if I can borrow you for the night, no questions asked”

Point is when she pushes for something weird like having u do stuff for her boyfriend, you shut it down fast, or reframe it with intent, and like ur calling the shots.

You show intent by ignoring the background noise, and going for what ya want. I.e by not being afraid to say no outright, flirting with her, making fun of the situation she tries to put you in, etc. Like it was silly of her to even ask something like that.

miker · Nov 28, 2022

Tell her to tell her boyfriend to msg you and then just ignore him if he does …this is a weird situation she is putting you in my friend ….she’s not committing to meet u she doesn’t seem interested in meeting you ….why would she even msg u for a favour for her boyfriend …honestly makes no sense man…lots of girls u can go out and meet out in the world ….get numbers …get rejected ….get laid ….that stuff is fun even the rejection part once u see some gains with momentum ….have fun man don’t waste time on these situations

Will_V · Nov 28, 2022

If a girl has a boyfriend, taking her on dates to restaurants is not going to work very well. You are not trying to take over her boyfriend's role, you're trying to give her excitement she doesn't get from him. Right now you're framing this as a regular Bob and Jane kind of date with you in the chasing role.

But a more important question though is why are you doing this stuff in your social circle? Could come back and bite you hard.

Calibration · Nov 28, 2022

She is the one needing help and you're the one chasing to help her.. doesn't make sense

Skills · Nov 28, 2022

Winston said:
I am trying to set up a date with a girl that I know from social circle and who is a legit 8,5. So kind of above my league. And she is flaky.

A friend of mine, a natural very good with women (lay count north of 300), looked into my texting and told me that the problem is that I don't make her feel wanted enough/I don't show my desire enough in my texting.

I have tried to ask him specific things to say but he answers me with no specific things. He just tells me that I am afraid to show my desire because I am afraid of rejection because I lack balls. And that she shows not much interest in meeting me because she doesn't see the point.

He also told me that he got plenty of girls above of his league by being very persistent, but it's a kind of persistence where he shows his desire at the same time.

So how we do that exactly? It's like this is the recipe of his game. He uses a mix of fearless persistence loaded with communication of his desire. But I am pretty sure if I try to do that with only these pointers and guidelines, I am going to come across as needy.

So how to be persistent, and convey desire, without being needy?

Your natural friend is talking about this:

Socializing - How to flirt mini guide for in person gaming and digital gaming (texting).....

Guys have been requesting for me to do a mini guide on this, so here we go: So what is flirting: "Flirting or coquetry is a social and sexual behavior involving spoken or written communication, as well as body language, by one person to another, either to suggest interest in a deeper...

www.skilledseducer.com

however i would find out were that girl is on the 3 i have a bf scenarios:

The 3 "I have a boyfriend" scenarios

1.- She really has a boyfriend and will not cheat.- This is a girl that has a boyfriend and is really happy and invested with the boyfriend, she is not really going to cheat on him ever or will not cheat (at least in this stage of a relationship, some women can cheat at final stages of a bad...

www.skilledseducer.com

Winston · Nov 28, 2022

Will_V said:
But a more important question though is why are you doing this stuff in your social circle? Could come back and bite you hard.

This an extended social circle, we mostly have only acquantainces in common, I don't know her boyfriend, for me the risks are the same as hitting on a girl from cold approach that has a boyfriend.
And reason number one, she is very hot and has a high social status (which is important for me). I should cold approach a shitload of girls before finding a girl of such caliber randomly.

I got my ex girlfriend in the same kind of situation. I knew her from a common friend, she had a boyfriend, she found an excuse to contact me, I took this opportunity to invite her to a restaurant, she accepted by recalibrating the date to a drink, and from there we made out...

Skills said:
however i would find out were that girl is on the 3 i have a bf

I talked about her here (2nd occurrence):

Girls downplaying boyfriends

Something happened to me recently on 2 occurrences and I am wondering if it has any meaning. I was talking with girls in a context of a loose social circle (meaning I am not friends with them but with have friends in common, so there is some implied expectations that we could see each other...

www.skilledseducer.com

You told me it's box number 2. But maybe things have improved between them since then!
_______

But yeah, I should learn to flirt. My friend is right that not making it man to woman comes from a fear of rejection/lack of confidence. I have to work on that. Because in order to flirt you have to assume attraction, which is not something I am able to do right now. I still need validation from the girls, I still need clear sign of interest from the girls before I can say to myself "Ok she is attracted, you can make some move now".

This is indeed something my friend is doing very well, with sexual innuendo everywhere in his conversations, but he is so good at it that it feels almost like an inborn ability and not something learnable. But I guess practice always make things better.

So I think there are 2 parts to learn that:
- inner game (ie. assuming attraction)
- practical know-how (ie. start doing it to get better at it)

Fuck This · Nov 28, 2022

You are going down a dead end.

Not only did she tell you she had a boyfriend, she is putting you in contact with him. You are not viewed as a sexual threat m'boy.

Quit wasting your time.

Try meeting women in places where Sexual intent is implied. In the evening, with alcohol. amke the most of your face to face meeting while you are still mysterious and exciting and she wants to find out about you...

Texting is for logistics and maybe innuendo. That's it.,

Rakehell · Nov 28, 2022

@Winston
So I missed the part where you mentioned this girl was social circle. That’s my bad, it doesn’t look as weird on her part with that context because she knows you.

That being said it was pointed out to me you probably interpreted her hitting you up for help, as some sort of plausible deniability to get her out.

Doubt that was the case on her end, because that type of behavior isn’t something you get when she considers you as a sexual option who’d phase her out for it.

Overall this was an issue of frame control earlier on. At some point she started viewing you as solely a friend she feels comfortable enough to ask advice from.

Which still in a way boils down to being persistent in your desire for the kind of relationship you want to have early on. Being consistent in what you want with her. And being willing to walk away if she doesn’t share that.

FunGuy · Nov 28, 2022

The thread title is misleading. Your friend gave you horrible advice because the girl is not interested in you at all. Interested women will not be flakey and they will not shut you down when you ask them out. It is a huge waste of time and energy chasing women with whom you have negative compliance with so my advice would be to pursue other women instead.

Winston · Nov 28, 2022

Thank you guys.

Just to clarify, my initial question was more related to a general approach on how to "game" girls over text before the date in order to reduce the flake rate, rather than how to get this specific girl.

My friend games/flirts a lot over text, and I have seen him turned disinterested girls into dates (and lays afterwards). I don't think he is giving me bad advice. He doesn't see seduction as screening for interested girls, but as trying everything he can to get the girls he wants. And I tend to agree with him on that.

I have got almost 2 lays this last week (one them I was too drunk to get it up under the condom, so I guess technically it doesn't count, but with the other one everything went smoothly). So that's not like this conversation is the only thing I have done recently. I was just asking for advice to improve my texting and my general attitude when interacting with women.

Rakehell · Dec 5, 2022

Winston said:
I was just asking for advice to improve my texting and my general attitude when interacting with women.

https://www.skilledseducer.com/thre...ard-close-set-up-logistics-for-meet-up.26653/

https://www.skilledseducer.com/thre...ft-close-and-some-mistakes-i-am-seeing.24657/

Can personally vouch for these two guides, plus the one on flirting linked to you earlier.

How to make a girl feel wanted without being needy?

Winston

Space Monkey

Rakehell

Tool-Bearing Hominid

Winston

Space Monkey

Rakehell

Tool-Bearing Hominid

Winston

Space Monkey

Rakehell

Tool-Bearing Hominid

miker

Space Monkey

Will_V

Chieftan

Calibration

Tool-Bearing Hominid

Skills

Tribal Elder

Socializing - How to flirt mini guide for in person gaming and digital gaming (texting).....

The 3 "I have a boyfriend" scenarios

Winston

Space Monkey

Girls downplaying boyfriends

Fuck This

Cro-Magnon Man

Rakehell

Tool-Bearing Hominid

FunGuy

Tool-Bearing Hominid

Winston

Space Monkey

Rakehell

Tool-Bearing Hominid