Is this girl just a player, or...?

Hey guys,

So, I met a girl about two months back. In fact, I posted a thread about it awhile back too, but that's irrelevant. Anyway, here's what's happened:

I'll try to keep this brief, but it is a weird scenario. I met her at the gym, started a conversation (which went fairly well) and we exchanged numbers. I texted her about getting coffee sometime, and she accepted. We went out, talked for about an hour--hour and a half maybe--and things were looking pretty good. After that we were texting constantly, joking, talking about personal stuff, and the usual. This goes on for about two weeks. Haven't gone out again at this point, but she had legitimate reasons for being busy. Then... ... nothing. No response for--get this--THREE WEEKS. I was a little bit worried that I had maybe offended her or something, but reviewing what I said, it didn't seem that way. I try texting her again about two weeks into the silence, just a usual, "Hey, how's it going. Haven't heard from you in awhile, you alright?"

Anyway, she finally texts back. She apologizes saying that her phone contract expired and she was changing carriers and that was a big hassle. To this day, I don't know whether that was true. But, I say, "No worries. How've you been?" We continue chatting for say, another couple of days. Smash cut to: the night of the huge fight between us. I'll try and reproduce what happened: we're texting, and as a normal conversation starter I asked, "Hey, where do you see yourself in ten years?" She replies, "Married to an Italian guy, living in NYC. Why? You?" I thought she was kind of just joking around at the Italian comment thing so I say, "Italian? What's wrong with us hearty American guys? lol"

Here's where my heart sinks: "Well I met this guy this summer who's Italian who I think I'm in love with." WHAT!? There's a guy she's in love with, she wants to marry someday, and yet she led me along for MONTHS, thinking we were together. I don't explode at first; in fact, I try to joke it off. "I guess I'll just have to break off the wedding then. When the priest says, 'Does anyone object?' I'll be all dramatic and say 'I object!' Then his mafioso buddies will beat me up, and you'll be in my hospital room saying, 'Oh, I knew I should've been with you!' and then BAM! I walk in, it was my stunt double that actually got killed. And we live happily ever after." She doesn't think this is funny. "Trust me, you wouldn't be invited." I joke again, "I'll take that as a maybe."

This is where things really go downhill. She says, "You seriously don't know any other girls?" I reply, "What do you mean?" She says, "Why are you so fixated on me? It's pathetic. You need to meet a larger quantity of people before you go glom onto one." Oh, did I mention: SHE'S SIXTEEN YEARS OLD. (I'm sixteen, it's not a pedophiliac thing) Seem hypocritical to you? Well it sure as hell does to me. She's only known the other guy for six months, they don't even live in the same state, and she's accusing ME of fixating on someone. So, I stop joking. "You know what? You've treated me completely unfairly. You've led me on for nearly two months, some of that period of time you didn't let me know what was happening with you at all, and then when you finally let me know about this, you make patronizing comments to me like you have some superiority over me. Enough is enough. I'm done talking to you."

On top of all this, she tries to make this out to be my fault. "Fine, don't. I have so much crap and personal problems going on in my life that I'm not even going to tell you about, I'm so sorry you weren't the first thing on my mind. Think about it from my perspective. How would you have told you? I shouldn't have mistook you as a friend. Go to hell."

So, what happened? What even made her think I was "glomming onto her?" Was she just manipulating me for attention, or what? I know this is almost like a rant, and I know that's not what these forums are about, but please: I need some help understanding what happened here. Was I in any way at fault?

Hi Luke Baker

I break this story a bit so you will know where it is you can understand where it has gone wrong. She's player you can say,, she's got some game from dating several men. She can be seen here a strong women, who knows she got options also, but she can also be a women who is not really a good quality women. So any of those, but it doesn't matter here now. You are suppose to lead and close the deal with her.

Luke Baker said:

I'll try to keep this brief, but it is a weird scenario. I met her at the gym, started a conversation (which went fairly well) and we exchanged numbers. I texted her about getting coffee sometime, and she accepted. We went out, talked for about an hour--hour and a half maybe--and things were looking pretty good. After that we were texting constantly, joking, talking about personal stuff, and the usual. This goes on for about two weeks. Haven't gone out again at this point, but she had legitimate reasons for being busy. Then... ... nothing. No response for--get this--THREE WEEKS. I was a little bit worried that I had maybe offended her or something, but reviewing what I said, it didn't seem that way. I try texting her again about two weeks into the silence, just a usual, "Hey, how's it going. Haven't heard from you in awhile, you alright?"

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She actually met you and accept to go out and get coffee. I don't know if you actually have physical intimacy with her, but going on here for about two weeks of texting constantly, joking and all that's written. It is very platonic and i don't think it is something you do actually want.

Luke Baker said:

Here's where my heart sinks: "Well I met this guy this summer who's Italian who I think I'm in love with." WHAT!? There's a guy she's in love with, she wants to marry someday, and yet she led me along for MONTHS, thinking we were together. I don't explode at first; in fact, I try to joke it off. "I guess I'll just have to break off the wedding then. When the priest says, 'Does anyone object?' I'll be all dramatic and say 'I object!' Then his mafioso buddies will beat me up, and you'll be in my hospital room saying, 'Oh, I knew I should've been with you!' and then BAM! I walk in, it was my stunt double that actually got killed. And we live happily ever after." She doesn't think this is funny. "Trust me, you wouldn't be invited." I joke again, "I'll take that as a maybe."

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She completely put you off by disrespecting you, "Trust me, you wouldn't be invited".

Luke Baker said:

This is where things really go downhill. She says, "You seriously don't know any other girls?" I reply, "What do you mean?" She says, "Why are you so fixated on me? It's pathetic. You need to meet a larger quantity of people before you go glom onto one." Oh, did I mention: SHE'S SIXTEEN YEARS OLD. (I'm sixteen, it's not a pedophiliac thing) Seem hypocritical to you? Well it sure as hell does to me. She's only known the other guy for six months, they don't even live in the same state, and she's accusing ME of fixating on someone. So, I stop joking. "You know what? You've treated me completely unfairly. You've led me on for nearly two months, some of that period of time you didn't let me know what was happening with you at all, and then when you finally let me know about this, you make patronizing comments to me like you have some superiority over me. Enough is enough. I'm done talking to you."

On top of all this, she tries to make this out to be my fault. "Fine, don't. I have so much crap and personal problems going on in my life that I'm not even going to tell you about, I'm so sorry you weren't the first thing on my mind. Think about it from my perspective. How would you have told you? I shouldn't have mistook you as a friend. Go to hell."

So, what happened? What even made her think I was "glomming onto her?" Was she just manipulating me for attention, or what? I know this is almost like a rant, and I know that's not what these forums are about, but please: I need some help understanding what happened here. Was I in any way at fault?

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The matter is, that she likes you, and go out with you for coffee. But i guess you didn't close the deal, i mean f**k her. But she still thinks, "Hey, this guy still messaging me, let's see where this can go" and she did try to give you chances. This is what happen. You then ask her what she will be in ten years. And when she mentions you won't be invited. It's a like a done deal to her. Mainly because a part of her really likes you and wanted you to close the deal with her, but you went in your platonic ways, and wants to get to know her, and i note here, if that's what you wanted to do, that's fine, but i don't think you have write here because you want her as a platonic friend, and this is where it all gone wrong.

She isn't that great chick you thought she is, even if you did get her somehow(as what i assumed her to be by what you have written).

Zac

Hey Zac,

Thanks for the reply. I'm having a bit of a hard time understanding your english, but I think I understand most of it. I'm going to try and put what you have said into my own words to understand the theory a bit better.

So, you're basically saying that although she had a boyfriend, she was considering branching out to meet different guys. But, by being too platonic with her I may have led her back to her boyfriend because she didn't really see my relationship with her going anywhere. Is that right? If so, I appreciate the thoughts, I just honestly don't see that theory holding up. I mean, she said she was "in love" with this other guy. If she was so "in love", why would she be pursuing other relationships? Not only that, I made my interest in her very clear. Getting to know her, I thought, was just part of deep diving.

Anyway, I really appreciate your reply Zac. I'm just not sure that's what actually happened.

Luke

Luke Baker said:

Thanks for the reply. I'm having a bit of a hard time understanding your english, but I think I understand most of it. I'm going to try and put what you have said into my own words to understand the theory a bit better.

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I try to improve my writing skills, especially relating the information part. (i will work on that)

Luke Baker said:

So, you're basically saying that although she had a boyfriend, she was considering branching out to meet different guys. But, by being too platonic with her I may have led her back to her boyfriend because she didn't really see my relationship with her going anywhere. Is that right? If so, I appreciate the thoughts, I just honestly don't see that theory holding up. I mean, she said she was "in love" with this other guy. If she was so "in love", why would she be pursuing other relationships? Not only that, I made my interest in her very clear. Getting to know her, I thought, was just part of deep diving.

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Actually, there's a lot going on here than just she branching out to meet different guys. She decided you, could be in the orbiter's role, the backup role, the cute guys where girls will usually put as backups or friends to supplicate her. and when you ask her deep questions to get to know her, she gets defensive, mainly because you suppose to be that guy. You not suppose to get to know her deeply, rather just enough to get you coming back, which is what she did and you did came after her. Point here is, she like you and she did go out with you the first time, but you didn't do anything with her except what i feel was platonic things friends do. But she thinks you cute, and she keeps you in the backup role after that. and it's not that she has a boyfriend or she text you back and forth. It's because there was a lot of things you didn't do that this forum advices you to do, and this is where things gone wrong.

but she's mess up anyway. I have dated this kind of girls, and i got those kind of messages.

Zac

Hey Luke,

Zac definitely hit some key points here, but there were also a few big mistakes that I will point out for you so you can have a better understanding of why things went downhill.

We continue chatting for say, another couple of days. Smash cut to: the night of the huge fight between us. I'll try and reproduce what happened: we're texting, and as a normal conversation starter I asked, "Hey, where do you see yourself in ten years?"

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Lots of bad news in these few sentences here. You are definitely forcing yourself to text this girl without the focus of getting her out with you again. As Zac mentioned, this already sets you on the railroad tracks toward the friend/boyfriend zone.

Next, you mention a "huge fight between you two." If you haven't even slept with this girl yet, a "fight" should set off MAJOR red flags. And unfortunately, the fault would be on your end. Under no circumstances should you ever be in an argument with a woman before you have slept with her (unless of course it's just some deep-diving, philosophical argument). It comes across as extremely weak and needy, and in all honesty, her reactions toward you afterward shouldn't have surprised you all that much.

You also asked the question, "Hey, where do you see yourself in ten years?" This is a deep-diving question, and these should be asked in-person rather than over text. You can't build an emotional connection with a girl over text unless you've already built an emotional connection with her in person. I don't think you ever made it to that point with this girl.

This is where things really go downhill. She says, "You seriously don't know any other girls?" I reply, "What do you mean?" She says, "Why are you so fixated on me? It's pathetic. You need to meet a larger quantity of people before you go glom onto one."

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You were already at the bottom of the hill by this point, but since you continued pressing, she eventually just had to REMIND you that you were at the bottom of the hill. Again, avoid any pre-sex arguments. It's a game-killer for attraction. You lost her long before this, but it ended up exploding because you pushed it until the very end.

In summary, you started out very well by getting her out and not texting her too much, and the fact that she even responded after not talking to her for three weeks was actually a very good sign. I think she was still interested at this point, but you didn't quickly get her out for another date, so things went south after that.

Focus on getting girls out and getting them to get physical with you as quickly as possible. Ignore any attempts on their part to aggravate you as this is just to test to see what type of man you are. If you end up getting angry or whiny, then you've essentially failed that test.

I hope some of this insight helps!

- Franco

Luke,

Franco and Zac have some solid points. Now, this is how I view what happened...

Basically, you met the girl at the gym, and she was definitely into you. You texted her too much, and you didn't escalate to physical intimacy. So then she started testing you to spark a reaction in you in order to see how interested you were in her, because she's assuming that if you were interested, you would have escalated with her so she wants to see where your head is at. So she's confused as to why you haven't done anything to move things forward, and she's disappointed, probably on the verge of auto-rejection because you came up short.

Don't blame her, she's not a player. I think you'd be willing to take responsibility if you knew where you went wrong. I once went through this, except for the fact that the girl in my case was a lot less forgiving. After 1 date with her, she auto-rejected me, mainly because we weren't social circle (I met her online). It crushed me and I started blaming her, mainly because I didn't see how it could have been my fault. It was my fault though, and I moved too slowly and texted her too much, just like what you're doing. If I were you, I suggest you get her out soon, and have sex with her that same outing. It'll really rile up her emotions for you, and you'll probably be able to get her as a girlfriend. If you keep doing what you're doing, the girl will go cold on you and stop replying to your texts altogether. You clearly don't want that, so you need to stop texting her, so she feels that you have more options/aren't needy, plus it'll up your attraction as a lover as opposed to a platonic friend, and then you need to take her to bed next time you're with her. Try to meet other girls in the mean time, otherwise you may end up getting really nervous during your date, and you don't want that. Just talk to other girls and hangout/date some, and then get her out after some time (I'd say a month). If she does text you, respond warmly, but tell her you're busy and don't have time for text conversations anymore.

Best of luck man, let us know how it goes!
Garrett

Hey guys,

Thanks for the responses. I have a couple of questions for you guys, though.

You texted her too much, and you didn't escalate to physical intimacy.

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Under no circumstances should you ever be in an argument with a woman before you have slept with her

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You guys keep mentioning physical intimacy, which is alright, but I have to ask: what about age-of-consent laws? Where I live, the age of consent is 18, not 16. I'm not really comfortable breaking the law. I know this is in general, not pertaining to this specific situation, but I'm just curious. Besides, where exactly do you "get physical" if not in your apartment/house? I mean, I still live with my parents. They wouldn't even be comfortable with me bringing someone home, much less having sex.

If you keep doing what you're doing, the girl will go cold on you and stop replying to your texts altogether. You clearly don't want that, so you need to stop texting her, so she feels that you have more options/aren't needy, plus it'll up your attraction as a lover as opposed to a platonic friend, and then you need to take her to bed next time you're with her.

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This sort of pertains to my last question again. But also, how do I contact her and try to get her to see me again? I mean, she already told me to go to hell, I don't think she'd even respond to a text. Do you mean this in general, or about this specific situation?

It comes across as extremely weak and needy, and in all honesty, her reactions toward you afterward shouldn't have surprised you all that much.

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I think you're right Franco, I just kind of lost control. I tried to joke it off to the best of my ability, but after awhile, I just couldn't handle it.

You also asked the question, "Hey, where do you see yourself in ten years?" This is a deep-diving question, and these should be asked in-person rather than over text. You can't build an emotional connection with a girl over text unless you've already built an emotional connection with her in person. I don't think you ever made it to that point with this girl.

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I do agree again. What worries me was that every time I tried to get together with her, she would say she was "busy." I know that's a red flag already, but she did seem to have legitimate reasons. Hell, I even looked up the event she was talking about that she was busy about, (a dance competition) and it was going on then. I guess I just felt desperate to try and make an emotional connection.

But, do you guys have any thoughts on what she said, that she already had someone she was in love with? Was that really just a test for ME, not an honest let-down?

Alright, I officially am bad at this. I'm going to buy Chase's book, give it a read, and just see what I can figure out. I feel deeply incompetent. I've read many of Chase's blog posts, but nothing seems to sink in. This relationship has just been a terrible experience for me, and I want to do my best to make sure it doesn't happen this way again with any other girl. So Chase, if you're reading this, you've got my business.

Luke Baker said:

the age of consent is 18, not 16. I'm not really comfortable breaking the law. I know this is in general, not pertaining to this specific situation, but I'm just curious. Besides, where exactly do you "get physical" if not in your apartment/house? I mean, I still live with my parents. They wouldn't even be comfortable with me bringing someone home, much less having sex.

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Actually we would not want you to break the law either. Find a girl who's 18, but cut to the chase, i see a lot of younger people, even 15 had sex in the parents house and post on twitter. This one is a decision you need to decide on your own. Maybe sex isn't something you would want to go all out yet, i suggest kissing and touching here there and everywhere with a girl who's 16, that's what other couples do, or maybe more. At least that likely will not get you in trouble with the law and you don't need a house to do that. Park is always an option. But just find a girl who's above 18!!!

Luke Baker said:

This sort of pertains to my last question again. But also, how do I contact her and try to get her to see me again? I mean, she already told me to go to hell, I don't think she'd even respond to a text. Do you mean this in general, or about this specific situation?

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Better not contact her at all.

Luke Baker said:

But, do you guys have any thoughts on what she said, that she already had someone she was in love with? Was that really just a test for ME, not an honest let-down?

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maybe she has, maybe she was trying to test you but for her to put that kind of statement to you, that's pure disrespectul, especially when you made a clear interest, although you did mess up too everywhere.

Zac