Break Ups Got suddenly dumped by an one year LTR girl with depression

[Will_V]

Do you specifically mean not talking about what happened at all, but only if she brings it up?

Yes.

Further going by your suggestion to spend time together without expectations, do you reckon contacting her in next few coming weeks and asking her directly to meet up and spend time together is likely to work?

What I would do is take some time off from the whole thing, spend a couple weeks totally focused on other things, let the emotions settle and your perspective on the whole situation resolve and clarify. And then if/when she's in the area (and if you're still open to something) tell her you'd like to meet up and have a coffee or something. And just meet up and basically re-seduce her. If she's interested she'll bring up any obstacles/issues herself.

Everything begins with desire on her part, if there is none then there's nothing at all. But if it's there, you want to stimulate it until she becomes frustrated with whatever obstacles exist and starts to bring them up and resolve them with you.

It's the same with any seduction, women start bringing up obstacles when they are feeling the desire to go home with you, in the hope that you will do away with them. But you can't just convince a woman who's not keen to go home with you to do so on the basis of obstacles not existing, if that makes sense.

 

[mirror]

8 years? Why so long? You haven't given any info, so I assume it, whatever it is, never worked out despite your attempts?

I was very busy so i didnt see through the fake frames and deception she sent my way even though i was convinced she was the closest i had ever gotten to a soulmate. Insanely good chemistry, great personality match, great vibe. Similar / compatible energy, compatible temperament, good depth of emotion and some right basic attitudes.

I was still badly in love, when I decided to let it come to me instead of chasing.
A year passed but i got no initiative from her to meet again real life and make something real out of it. I started hooking up with other girls, to make a LTR out of one that distracted me from the limerance a bit. Used the NRE to hide not being in love with her. Got married. Got a kid. Limerance did not go away.
Am in a divorce now, because the LTR hasnt been working for years.

So even after moving on still was limerant on this chick. She did a good number on me.

Hence my advise to try. Best case it works. Worst case: When you have given it your all and it hasnt worked, it's easier to break and move on. But if you have not given it your all. Then sometimes (not always) it gets harder to move on.

 

[HeartOfChaos]

What I would do is take some time off from the whole thing, spend a couple weeks totally focused on other things, let the emotions settle and your perspective on the whole situation resolve and clarify. And then if/when she's in the area (and if you're still open to something) tell her you'd like to meet up and have a coffee or something. And just meet up and basically re-seduce her. If she's interested she'll bring up any obstacles/issues herself.

Everything begins with desire on her part, if there is none then there's nothing at all. But if it's there, you want to stimulate it until she becomes frustrated with whatever obstacles exist and starts to bring them up and resolve them with you.

It's the same with any seduction, women start bringing up obstacles when they are feeling the desire to go home with you, in the hope that you will do away with them. But you can't just convince a woman who's not keen to go home with you to do so on the basis of obstacles not existing, if that makes sense.

Oh, I am taking off a couple of weeks anyway now, so no intention to see her till like mid September.

Of course back in May I ignored her break up attempt then and continued almost like nothing happened with communication and sex in a few days. This time it's gonna be exponentially harder, I reckon, as I basically fell into her frame by accepting her latest break up.

S0 carrying on as if nothing happened may just feel very unnatural.

So what you propose seems like it's hard to achieve - not sure how open she is to meet and be re-seduced after all this. But could be worth a shot.

Interesting how you don't think no-contact is best option.

If she's interested she'll bring up any obstacles/issues herself.

Why do you think she would bring up obstacles if interested?

 

[HeartOfChaos]

I was very busy so i didnt see through the fake frames and deception she sent my way even though i was convinced she was the closest i had ever gotten to a soulmate. Insanely good chemistry, great personality match, great vibe. Similar / compatible energy, compatible temperament, good depth of emotion and some right basic attitudes.

I was still badly in love, when I decided to let it come to me instead of chasing.

Why do you think they were fake frames and deception?

I met two girls before (also LTR) who sounded similar - chemistry, personality, etc. But alas age difference with one (7 years older) and religion / background (with the other) were blockers.

 

[Will_V]

Oh, I am taking off a couple of weeks anyway now, so no intention to see her till like mid September.

Of course back in May I ignored her break up attempt then and continued almost like nothing happened with communication and sex in a few days. This time it's gonna be exponentially harder, I reckon, as I basically fell into her frame by accepting her latest break up.

Yeah that's the real problem with breakups, the emotions are so strong that it's very very hard to do things correctly, especially immediately after it hits.

In my last relationship, once it became clear that things were at an impasse (she wanted relationship advancement and I wasn't interested in doing that just yet), I told her that I needed a week to clear my head and only responded minimally to her in that time. It's amazing how things look differently once the raging emotions die down. (I did make some reactive mistakes before that, heated arguments, reactive/indecisive communication, etc, but fortunately got myself under control).

It's a very strong negotiating move to request a timeout, it communicates a lot of good things. It's a dominant move in the sense that you are setting the course of things, even if that course is to wait. You care about things enough to have an emotional reaction, but you've got the self awareness and control to hold yourself back from doing anything stupid until you know what's the right move - this combination of emotional availability and self control is the fundamental attribute of a good leader and women respond very strongly to it. Also, it puts her in a much more receptive state as she wonders what your move will be.

So what you propose seems like it's hard to achieve - not sure how open she is to meet and be re-seduced after all this. But could be worth a shot.

If she's not open to meet, as hard as it is to accept, the relationship is over and you'll need to move on.

Interesting how you don't think no-contact is best option.

It's partly because I don't think it's the best option and partly just my preference. I know that pretty women have guys circling around and I'm not going to let a bunch of them enjoy themselves while she figures out that she really wants me after all. I know how emotionally vulnerable women are post breakup - probably the best sex I've ever had was after a breakup too. The emotions and need for intimacy is super strong.

Also, I like to retain control of the situation. When you have a short timeout, you're still actively working to resolve things, it's just a breather. But if you just go no contact you are basically letting her decide when the deal is going to be made. I can't let important aspects of my life be determined at the whim of someone else. And I have a strong aversion toward wishy washy, unenthusiastic behavior in people - I like to see courage, forthrightness, and decisiveness.

The post Chase wrote on it is great and pretty much all the points ring true for me.

Why do you think she would bring up obstacles if interested?

Because that's what women do when they are open to something and you are leading them somewhere, they are either following your lead or verbalizing obstacles in some way.

Women are creatures of compulsion, they are compelled by a lot of different things that sometimes oppose eachother, and they prefer not to have the responsibility of figuring out what to do, as long as their needs are met. So they just let the obstacles bubble up and see if you can fix them.

 

[HeartOfChaos]

Yeah that's the real problem with breakups, the emotions are so strong that it's very very hard to do things correctly, especially immediately after it hits.

It's more that this one was so unexpected for me, days before our anniversary, just when next day we were planning to do some activities. It was really out of the blue how she came out with it all of sudden.

In my last relationship, once it became clear that things were at an impasse (she wanted relationship advancement and I wasn't interested in doing that just yet)

This reminds me of an LTR I had 12 years ago, when she also wanted relationship advancement and gave me an ultimatum suddenly (and as usual, I did not heed the warning signals she gave a few weeks prior): I was also not interested in doing that, and told her I was happy with the way things are. She broke up, I really missed her, got her to meet me a few days later, acted all needy, and pushed her further away. I contacted her 9 months later but she was in a relationship already then.

What happened with your LTR? Did you advance the relationship after week off?

It's a very strong negotiating move to request a timeout, it communicates a lot of good things. It's a dominant move in the sense that you are setting the course of things, even if that course is to wait. .... When you have a short timeout, you're still actively working to resolve things, it's just a breather. But if you just go no contact you are basically letting her decide when the deal is going to be made

Ok, but of course in my current case it's not a "timeout", especially since I literally left the ball in her court via my last message to her. So asking her to meet, even in several weeks, would seem weak and contradictory. But maybe that's the only real option left.

My hope is that these 3-4 weeks of no contact would let things reset naturally a little bit. But judging from one of her last messages "we said our last words already, I don't want to continue the conversation about the romantic relationship", it's gonna be hard.

 

[mirror]

It's more that this one was so unexpected for me, days before our anniversary, just when next day we were planning to do some activities.

Lack of communication
Actually, from my outside point of view, these things happen when she hasnt said things that are bothering her, or she mentioned those and you did not take action. That does not mean it's over, but from a healthy viewpoint if you dont want things to crash, you need to address the worries or concerns of the other. Get them on the table. Talk about them, let her see you paid attention. Nothing is as charming as someone that actually has seen your concerns and addressed them as if it is a breeze to do so.
That's a relationship management advice from my side. The kind of advice that allows for long term deep love and also commitment from.the other.

My hope is that these 3-4 weeks of no contact would let things reset naturally a little bit. But judging from one of her last messages "we said our last words already, I don't want to continue the conversation about the romantic relationship", it's gonna be hard.

Look they say all is fair in love and war,

The reason is you simply cant let things up in another persons court if YOU want something. You have to speak up.

No contact is more effective in closeddoor situations.
I think you are in the relationship management phase. That means reconciliation techniques and emotional switches. Dont know whether there are resources on it, but it's heavy mental work if you want to do it the seduction style, alright. The direct honest path is way easier and more effective and healthy probably.

 

[Skills]

It's more that this one was so unexpected for me, days before our anniversary, just when next day we were planning to do some activities. It was really out of the blue how she came out with it all of sudden.




This reminds me of an LTR I had 12 years ago, when she also wanted relationship advancement and gave me an ultimatum suddenly (and as usual, I did not heed the warning signals she gave a few weeks prior): I was also not interested in doing that, and told her I was happy with the way things are. She broke up, I really missed her, got her to meet me a few days later, acted all needy, and pushed her further away. I contacted her 9 months later but she was in a relationship already then.

What happened with your LTR? Did you advance the relationship after week off?



Ok, but of course in my current case it's not a "timeout", especially since I literally left the ball in her court via my last message to her. So asking her to meet, even in several weeks, would seem weak and contradictory. But maybe that's the only real option left.

My hope is that these 3-4 weeks of no contact would let things reset naturally a little bit. But judging from one of her last messages "we said our last words already, I don't want to continue the conversation about the romantic relationship", it's gonna be hard.

Brother stick to no contact, if you keep doing stuff like suggested in the forum:

- is not going to work
- you will waste your time and start re-living the whole paint again...

you are going to go in circles....

 

[Will_V]

It's more that this one was so unexpected for me, days before our anniversary, just when next day we were planning to do some activities. It was really out of the blue how she came out with it all of sudden.

Yeah, it's harsh but that's also when she's going to be giving the relationship the most attention.

This reminds me of an LTR I had 12 years ago, when she also wanted relationship advancement and gave me an ultimatum suddenly (and as usual, I did not heed the warning signals she gave a few weeks prior): I was also not interested in doing that, and told her I was happy with the way things are. She broke up, I really missed her, got her to meet me a few days later, acted all needy, and pushed her further away. I contacted her 9 months later but she was in a relationship already then.

What happened with your LTR? Did you advance the relationship after week off?

It was a bit of a mess, my fault really. I kept things going for a while, we'd meet up and have sex every now and then, but she was really suffering in the hope that I was going to change my mind, and I realized I had to decide for us both that it wasn't going to work.

Ok, but of course in my current case it's not a "timeout", especially since I literally left the ball in her court via my last message to her. So asking her to meet, even in several weeks, would seem weak and contradictory. But maybe that's the only real option left.

In my opinion the best thing you can do, regardless of what you end up doing later, is to just give the whole thing (and especially your own mind) a break. If you just keep fixating on fixing it you'll never process the whole thing and you'll be stuck in a desperate cycle.

My hope is that these 3-4 weeks of no contact would let things reset naturally a little bit. But judging from one of her last messages "we said our last words already, I don't want to continue the conversation about the romantic relationship", it's gonna be hard.

Yeah, there's been a lot of you wanting and her refusing so far, that it'll be hard for the frame to recover.

The best thing you can do, as I mentioned earlier, is (as she said herself in her comment there) to not continue trying to talk about the relationship at all. The relationship as it was is dead. If there is to be a new one it will have to develop on the basis of her seeing something new for long enough to believe it, not on the basis of discussing the problems of the past.

She simply doesn't trust you at this point, your actions and behavior did not provide security for her for a long time. No immediate excuses or promises will make her think differently. And I'm not sure you trust yourself at this point either not to make the same mistakes again, which is much worse of a problem. So it's really up to you to learn your own lessons and develop the capacities you need, for your own sake and for the sake of your future relationships (which may or may not include her).

 

[HeartOfChaos]

In my opinion the best thing you can do, regardless of what you end up doing later, is to just give the whole thing (and especially your own mind) a break. If you just keep fixating on fixing it you'll never process the whole thing and you'll be stuck in a desperate cycle.

I understand. It's just hard. It's not the outcome nor the summer I was expecting with her. All the things I was hoping to invite her to do with me in coming months have collapsed and all the intimacy we've been building up.

But even before the break up, the anticipated summer with her was kinda screwed up as she was away for over a month. Her frequent coming and going for weeks at a time impeded me from gathering real momentum in terms of relationship progress right from day one.

She simply doesn't trust you at this point, your actions and behavior did not provide security for her for a long time. No immediate excuses or promises will make her think differently.

She knows very well I was always there for her and tried to assist her as much as I could, and invested in her much more than any other girls I've dated. Perhaps if she wasn't so passive and LSE, I would never have invested so much. And that's why it hurts the most. I dropped all fuckbuddies and a few potential new ones I had at the time to be with her.

So I did all this effort for "commitment" from day one, and she was still under the impression months later that I might be on dating apps to meet someone else.

Seems for her the "social activity and clear defined terms of relationship" factor that was missing, and that has over ridden everything else despite all the other things I did with her. She had this misguided idea that I valued other previous LTR girls more than her. Although maybe it's all just a pretext, as others (Teevster) suggested.

 

[HeartOfChaos]

Brother stick to no contact, if you keep doing stuff like suggested in the forum:

- is not going to work
- you will waste your time and start re-living the whole paint again...

you are going to go in circles....

You are really adamant that no contact is always best option?

Because I do hear (and know) guys where they continued hanging out with their exes sometimes, even still hooked up with them... Two of my fuckbuddies actually told me this, they split up with her long term boyfriend, but they still talked and met up and had sex a few times afterwards... One other girl I fucked told me she split up from her boyfriend...Then I messaged her a month later for another hook up and turns out she and her boyfriend got back together...

But of course it depends on the relationship dynamic...

 

[HeartOfChaos]

Actually, from my outside point of view, these things happen when she hasnt said things that are bothering her, or she mentioned those and you did not take action. That does not mean it's over, but from a healthy viewpoint if you dont want things to crash, you need to address the worries or concerns of the other.

No contact is more effective in closeddoor situations.
I think you are in the relationship management phase.

Is it really relationship management stage? Because it seems to me, and what others here are saying, that it's way past that. As Will_ said, her trust in me (that I will give security in the way she needs) is low at the moment and giving sudden explanations or actions may just make her more suspicious.

But then again, she is LSE, so maybe not...

Maybe your definition of "closed door situation" is different?

 

[topcat]

 

[gameboy]

dude at some point you have to accept it's over. i know how hard it is, have been there myself multiple times.

but let me tell you from experience that the closer you get to that stage of acceptance, the less pain you feel. it becomes more and more intermittent, and one day you wake up and barely even remember that you used to be sad once

you probably aren't there yet, but it would be best to try and focus on something else. other women, for example. or anything else really that gets your mind of your ex

 

[Chase]

I understand. It's just hard. It's not the outcome nor the summer I was expecting with her. All the things I was hoping to invite her to do with me in coming months have collapsed and all the intimacy we've been building up.

But even before the break up, the anticipated summer with her was kinda screwed up as she was away for over a month. Her frequent coming and going for weeks at a time impeded me from gathering real momentum in terms of relationship progress right from day one.

Seems like you are focused on the plans you had, and how her behavior has disrupted those plans.

But this is the role of women: "plan disruptors"!

The cool thing is, she is gone now... so you are free to make new plans she cannot disrupt (unless she comes back or something).

She knows very well I was always there for her and tried to assist her as much as I could, and invested in her much more than any other girls I've dated. Perhaps if she wasn't so passive and LSE, I would never have invested so much. And that's why it hurts the most. I dropped all fuckbuddies and a few potential new ones I had at the time to be with her.

So I did all this effort for "commitment" from day one, and she was still under the impression months later that I might be on dating apps to meet someone else.

Seems for her the "social activity and clear defined terms of relationship" factor that was missing, and that has over ridden everything else despite all the other things I did with her. She had this misguided idea that I valued other previous LTR girls more than her. Although maybe it's all just a pretext, as others (Teevster) suggested.

This is one of the reasons I said you couldn't get this girl back. You still don't understand what she needs.

You could've started hanging out with her friends 7 nights a week and typed up an entire manifesto to define the relationship's terms in the most unambiguous terms; it still would've ended the same way at the same time. The things she was telling you about were the symptoms. You are trying to treat the symptoms without addressing the underlying disorder.

This girl needed progress and certainty. You could not give her that. You are not even certain yourself about your future position, wants, etc. Instability is fun to a certain point; at first, it's exciting, intriguing, makes her wonder "Ooh, what might happen?!" Beyond that point, though, it just gives her a dimmer and dimmer vision of the relationship's future -- until that vision dims completely.

Token gestures and clear definitions are not enough to mend a relationship that is collapsing due to instability and lack of progress.

Right now, you are not prepared to offer this girl what she would need to come back.

She made the correct call (at least for herself) to end things with you.

Only when you can understand and accept that will you be able to think about what you might need to do to recover with her (and do so lastingly, without it falling apart again 3 months after getting back together).

Chase

 

[HeartOfChaos]

You still don't understand what she needs.

You are trying to treat the symptoms without addressing the underlying disorder.

This girl needed progress and certainty.

Only when you can understand and accept that will you be able to think about what you might need to do to recover with her (and do so lastingly, without it falling apart again 3 months after getting back together).

Chase

I understand what you mean. But I think I did not explain well.

I aimed for progress from day one. Just my idea of progress was not right, I guess.

I placed emphasis on mutual personal progress. I wanted to evolve and grow with her internally, so to speak, as well as on the material, outwardly side. Hence me doing a lot for her in terms of trying to help and comfort her with her personal and mental issues, to help her progress and grow with me together and for our bond to strengthen. And I did my best to motivate her to try to pick herself up.

The issue is that she needed so much prompting and hand holding. For example: I teach her yoga, I leave her to repeat a couple of poses 5 times...She does them twice and then simply gives up. So I put in initiative but return on investment is very low from her.

I wrote about the social side here because that's what I completely ignored, as I am a social retard and also due to my upbringing (I come from a single parent background, was pretty much on my own without peer social interaction till I was 10, underwent 2 emigrations as a child, no real close friends ever, etc etc which means socially I was isolated basically all my life. So things like going for dinner with friends or family is an extremely rare event for me, given that I basically have no family...or friends).

As for outward progress, as I said, the idea of long term commitment and marriage was in my head for a while. I was thinking to move towards cohabitation. But I wanted to do it more slowly: to gauge her more at first, meet her parents, all other stuff.

Given that she tried to hide me from her parents for months and her parents still don't know the extend of our intimacy, and that she was away a lot, didn't help things to progress! And of course as I mentioned, lack of return on my investment meant that naturally I wanted to slow down.

In fact, immediately night after break up (before I posted my thread here) I wrote to her that if we want to try again, we need to ensure we put in equal work into the relationship and clearly discuss any misunderstandings. Because from day one, she was so passive that I was not certain whether she is just like that due to her health issues, or is it because she is not into me to that extent. It's still unclear. I guess years of anti depressant and other pills numbed her for sure.

Some other girls I've been with were very positive, go getter personalities and made it very clear that they want me, love me, before I said this to them. She is not like that, she is very timid, and I was not used to it, but I liked her on a deep level that I wanted to stick with her.

And quite frankly, the idea of cohabitation leading to potential marriage required a leap of faith from me. I was mulling over it. I think with the break up she forced my hand - maybe this leap of faith is just something I should go for.

I would like to directly talk to her about this, if I do meet her again - this is what progress I can "offer" her pretty much immediately. It would be quite a change, but I can manage it, if she reciprocates. The question is, would she be even open to such a discussion and would it even be appropriate to talk about this directly given the circumstances?

 

[mirror]

I understand what you mean. But I think I did not explain well.

I aimed for progress from day one. Just my idea of progress was not right, I guess.

I placed emphasis on mutual personal progress. I wanted to evolve and grow with her internally, so to speak, as well as on the material, outwardly side. Hence me doing a lot for her in terms of trying to help and comfort her with her personal and mental issues, to help her progress and grow with me together and for our bond to strengthen. And I did my best to motivate her to try to pick herself up.

This is a tough one, because it is a very good goal. it's tough because i think you have decided it for her and yourself, without talking it over with her. Get her on board with the idea and it progresses easier.

The issue is that she needed so much prompting and hand holding. For example: I teach her yoga, I leave her to repeat a couple of poses 5 times...She does them twice and then simply gives up. So I put in initiative but return on investment is very low from her.

Hmm i once had a class on health coaching and behaviour change. It can go suddenly, but more often than not, it can take up to 20-30 times for people to truly learn and change behaviour. Some are quick learners though, at some things. I think if you invest in someone, it's not smart to like, keep track of how much you invest and how much not and just focus on what's reasonable from your side and whether the others position is acceptable for you

I wrote about the social side here because that's what I completely ignored, as I am a social retard and also due to my upbringing (I come from a single parent background, was pretty much on my own without peer social interaction till I was 10, underwent 2 emigrations as a child, no real close friends ever, etc etc which means socially I was isolated basically all my life. So things like going for dinner with friends or family is an extremely rare event for me, given that I basically have no family...or friends).

This sounds really tough to me! Maybe try to take it in small steps. Step one is open communication about wants and needs though, i think.

As for outward progress, as I said, the idea of long term commitment and marriage was in my head for a while. I was thinking to move towards cohabitation. But I wanted to do it more slowly: to gauge her more at first, meet her parents, all other stuff.

That makes sense no?
Stabilize things a bit. Again: aim for communication on wants and needs. Usually things and speed are an outcome of a mix of the pace of both of you. Like if you say 1 year and she thinks 6 months, it makes sense it would be somewhere in between of those 2 that it will happen.
(9 months? Before after around, depends all on the both of you)

Given that she tried to hide me from her parents for months and her parents still don't know the extend of our intimacy, and that she was away a lot, didn't help things to progress! And of course as I mentioned, lack of return on my investment meant that naturally I wanted to slow down.

Did you ask her what she needs to be able to tell her parents about your intimacy? Is that what's bothering you?

In fact, immediately night after break up (before I posted my thread here) I wrote to her that if we want to try again, we need to ensure we put in equal work into the relationship and clearly discuss any misunderstandings.

that sounds very fair. Equal work is a weird term however, because usually people in relationships always think they put in most work (research says each spouse on average believes to have put in more than 70% of the work, 70+70 makes 140% ). I would aim for both investing as much as possible or a reasonable amount. Try to always see your investments as additions to a relarionship, from both of you.

Because from day one, she was so passive that I was not certain whether she is just like that due to her health issues, or is it because she is not into me to that extent. It's still unclear. I guess years of anti depressant and other pills numbed her for sure.

Hmm maybe you had other expectations of what was needed as a prerequisite to truly get things going compared to you. But mental health is definitely a thing too i imagine.

Some other girls I've been with were very positive, go getter personalities and made it very clear that they want me, love me, before I said this to them. She is not like that, she is very timid, and I was not used to it, but I liked her on a deep level that I wanted to stick with her.

Yeah, so comparing is not going to help you at this point buddy. I am not going to compare here, just focus on this relationship you are looking at.

And quite frankly, the idea of cohabitation leading to potential marriage required a leap of faith from me. I was mulling over it. I think with the break up she forced my hand - maybe this leap of faith is just something I should go for.

Try to go in small steps, instead of big jumps, i would think. So first stay over a day, maybe 2. Then increase frequency extended stays. Things like that.

I would like to directly talk to her about this, if I do meet her again - this is what progress I can "offer" her pretty much immediately. It would be quite a change, but I can manage it, if she reciprocates. The question is, would she be even open to such a discussion and would it even be appropriate to talk about this directly given the circumstances?

Why not? You can try. Just try to manage your expectations as well as she will have to do.

 

[mirror]

So i mean, progress is progress.
You dont need to make meters immediately. Go inch by inch. Rome wasnt built in one day. And you will learn from the experience anyway/regardless.

 

[HeartOfChaos]

This sounds really tough to me! Maybe try to take it in small steps. Step one is open communication about wants and needs though, i think.

The thing is, this was meant to be done months ago. Now the ship has sailed, surely given the developments over last few weeks.

 

[Will_V]

I would like to directly talk to her about this, if I do meet her again - this is what progress I can "offer" her pretty much immediately. It would be quite a change, but I can manage it, if she reciprocates. The question is, would she be even open to such a discussion and would it even be appropriate to talk about this directly given the circumstances?

Dude, you are ready to throw everything into the deal despite (according to your own view of things) having done a fairly good job of managing the relationship, and her being ready to throw that all away (as well as not having done a great job of following your lead before that).

This on its own should be enough to tell you that your mind is nowhere near the right spot.

I have no doubt if she opened up the smallest possibility of getting back together, you'd do just about anything to make that happen. And the chances of her respect for you surviving that would be super low.

Learn to survive and get on with life without this woman, otherwise you'll never get perspective on things. Stop excusing her for everything on the basis of her being 'lse'. To be blunt, you seem to have a lower self esteem than she does. It should be your priority to correct this, to strengthen your mind, get back in the saddle of your life and learn how to not let any woman or anything else throw you off it. You made mistakes (as everyone does in relationships) but that doesn't mean she's blameless or worth throwing your whole lot in for for a slim chance at success.

There are 4 billion women in this world of all shapes and sizes. The idea that you can't find another one as good (or better) than this one is a desperate illusion. Are we not all here to try our hand at being the best and having the best? Have you already given up on your own possibilities? If you got this far this time, you can do a bit better next time.