Guidance Needed! - Moving Out of Platonic Conversations with Girls

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
space monkey
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Dec 7, 2021
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Hi everyone!

I am quite new here compared to a lot of the masters here in this forum. I have read Chase's eBook "How to Make Girls Chase" and have been reading on the forum for the last year or so, but this is my first time posting. A little bit of background about myself:
  • I am 21M, living in New Zealand. I have just moved to the biggest city in NZ from a small town.
  • I did Engineering at university (just finished) so meeting hot girls in classes were non-existent.
  • In terms of fundamentals, I would say:
    • Body: Posture is good when walking. Eye contact is good. Walk is good. Mannerisms need work. Teeth needs whitening. Hair is okay. Weight is okay. Muscle is not good. Small-to-medium build. Have not been a "sporty" person.
    • Vocal: Okay, but nothing special. I would like to improve and have more control. I'm thinking of taking singing/voice coaching classes.
    • Social: No idea where I stand with Social Power, probably not high. Conversing is not a problem, but this is the main point so I will elaborate further below.
    • Fashion: Needs work. Need to get more pieces in small sizes so they fit me better. Although I do feel like I'm reaching the limit with this because of my lack of muscles.

Okay, so moving on to the main point of this thread. According to classmates, I am a very good presenter and speaker, and I can randomly strike up a conversation with people that I have just met which is apparently horrifying thing for engineers. (Although I do take this with a grain of salt because I have seen amazing speakers before, so feedback from engineers on social fundamentals does not seem like the most accurate source for me).

When I meet a girl, I usually don't have a problem conversing with her. Sometimes I feel like I am getting too much into the conversation and things are just flowing and I am not really controlling it. All the girls that I have met, even after we have good conversations, just ended up being platonic. In all of the conversations, I was the only one initiating touch and while there was no negative reactions, the touching is not reciprocated. I do admit that the conversations that I usually have are not on sexually charged topics. And I do understand that you have to move to sexual topics to get her in the mood, but how can you do that when compliments and touch are not reciprocated? I feel like it is really weird to ask a question (to open a new conversation thread) on a sexual topic just because I never had that feeling that the girl is primed and ready to move on?

So, at this stage, I'm just a bit confused. Am I not getting girls physically attracted because my body fundamentals are too low? Or is it because I'm doing something wrong in my conversations - maybe giving off too much off a "nice guy" vibe and not a "cool sexy man"?

Looking forward to hearing your wisdoms! Thanks! :)
 

Will_V

Chieftan
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She must respect you as well as like you.
 

topcat

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It’s ideal to set a sexual frame as early as possible. This is done with eye contact, vocal tonality, proximity and touch. Introduce these from the word ‘hello’ and slowly ramp up the intensity based on her compliance and your setting (less obvious in public, more overt when isolated).

In terms of introducing sexuality into conversation, this is something i’m still working on, but what helps is to lean into topics surrounding relationships, good sex vs bad sex, dancing, nakedness, freedom, pleasure.
Basically anything that suits the conversation topics and suggests intimacy and pleasure at the same time. My go-tos are usually anything involving the five senses especially those relating to touch and the pleasurable bodily sensations they evoke - easily spun into decent sex talk.

Good luck
 

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
space monkey
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Dec 7, 2021
Messages
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It’s ideal to set a sexual frame as early as possible. This is done with eye contact, vocal tonality, proximity and touch. Introduce these from the word ‘hello’ and slowly ramp up the intensity based on her compliance and your setting (less obvious in public, more overt when isolated).

In terms of introducing sexuality into conversation, this is something i’m still working on, but what helps is to lean into topics surrounding relationships, good sex vs bad sex, dancing, nakedness, freedom, pleasure.
Basically anything that suits the conversation topics and suggests intimacy and pleasure at the same time. My go-tos are usually anything involving the five senses especially those relating to touch and the pleasurable bodily sensations they evoke - easily spun into decent sex talk.

Good luck
Thank you @topcat! Would you be able to give me some examples of how you would introduce sexuality into conversations? Or maybe point me to some articles?

I'm trying to work on touch at the moment. The furthest I have gotten on touch is to the lower back, but much more commonly shoulders and hands. Proximity is not the easiest at the moment because NZ govt is still taking a hard stance against the virus, so everyone wears masks, limited indoors gathering, no nightclubs, and seated table service at bars and restaurants only.

I'm not sure how to work on my vocal yet. I feel like it is so raw and unrefined, especially with tone. I can adjust the volume, but the tone doesn't seem to want to move that much. I don't feel like it has a lot of power and if I talk for awhile, my throat starts to become irritated and sore. So my vocal techniques are probably very poor at the moment.
 

topcat

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699
Thank you @topcat! Would you be able to give me some examples of how you would introduce sexuality into conversations? Or maybe point me to some articles?

I'm trying to work on touch at the moment. The furthest I have gotten on touch is to the lower back, but much more commonly shoulders and hands. Proximity is not the easiest at the moment because NZ govt is still taking a hard stance against the virus, so everyone wears masks, limited indoors gathering, no nightclubs, and seated table service at bars and restaurants only.

I'm not sure how to work on my vocal yet. I feel like it is so raw and unrefined, especially with tone. I can adjust the volume, but the tone doesn't seem to want to move that much. I don't feel like it has a lot of power and if I talk for awhile, my throat starts to become irritated and sore. So my vocal techniques are probably very poor at the moment.
1 thing at a time. Don’t worry about your vocal tonality for now, you can tune that later, just make sure your voice isn’t squeaky ;) .

For physical touch, and honestly anything regarding sexuality you ramp things up very slowly. It’s like you’re boiling a frog (look up the analogy if you’re not familiar with it). So make sure when you are sat beside her your knee is incidentally touching her (she shouldn’t notice) or your thighs are touching, or your elbows etc.
Tap her arm to make a statement. You’ll notice when girls like you they’ll touch your hand when they’re making a point. Steal this tech and do it too. It works. Ask to see her nails. Comment on the softness of her palms and touch them while you do. We call these “microescalations” around here.

Read this article for the specifics of micro escalation.

If things are going well you might leave your hand on her thigh, or leave your arm around her back, holding her into you.

Verbally, as I said it gets a little more technical and is something i’m working on.

Bacchus, Lofty and Teevster are masters at this, so I’d advise looking into their reports and posts.

Bacchus’ post on Seduction Oriented Topics is great, though pretty advanced.

Teevster’s sexual gambits are brilliant.

Also run a search on the forum and the main blog for “sexual prizing”. Powerful tech.

What I do atm, is introduce sexuality by talking about art or aesthetic experiences. This has it’s limitations as it falls flat on girls who aren’t very intelligent, reflective or inclined towards aesthetics. I’ll be trialling ways to find out what type of personality a girl has before I seduce so I can create new seduction pathways for these other girls. Anyway.. i talk about aesthetic experiences, and how they feel and the sensations that create in the body which is an easy way towards talking about sex and the aesthetic experiences of sex and the bodily sensations good sex provides.
Find what works for you.
Maybe you aren’t an artist but more emotional.. or perhaps you’re into sports and thrills. These can all be turned sexual, just use your imagination.

Hope that helps..

Best
 

Derek da man

Cro-Magnon Man
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Messages
285
I second Topcat's recommendation for Teevester's Sexual Gambits as they a simple and straight forward and pretty much anyone can use them. I would always try and tailor how you link into them from your own personal experiences, although that can be difficult from an engineers perspective - being an engineer myself I know this only too well. In recent years I've taken up dancing (Salsa, Bachata, Kizomba, etc) which gives me access to lots of sexy confident women but more importantly it gives me numerous ways into a sexual conversations. You need to find something that works for you and you are confident and comfortable with.
 

ElderPrice

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Messages
568
This is exactly the issue I was having for a long time that I’m just finally getting over! I have a question: What is the context of most of your conversations? Are these when you’re out on a date or when you’re approaching new women and starting conversations with them?
 

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Dec 7, 2021
Messages
12
1 thing at a time. Don’t worry about your vocal tonality for now, you can tune that later, just make sure your voice isn’t squeaky ;) .

For physical touch, and honestly anything regarding sexuality you ramp things up very slowly. It’s like you’re boiling a frog (look up the analogy if you’re not familiar with it). So make sure when you are sat beside her your knee is incidentally touching her (she shouldn’t notice) or your thighs are touching, or your elbows etc.
Tap her arm to make a statement. You’ll notice when girls like you they’ll touch your hand when they’re making a point. Steal this tech and do it too. It works. Ask to see her nails. Comment on the softness of her palms and touch them while you do. We call these “microescalations” around here.

Read this article for the specifics of micro escalation.

If things are going well you might leave your hand on her thigh, or leave your arm around her back, holding her into you.

Verbally, as I said it gets a little more technical and is something i’m working on.

Bacchus, Lofty and Teevster are masters at this, so I’d advise looking into their reports and posts.

Bacchus’ post on Seduction Oriented Topics is great, though pretty advanced.

Teevster’s sexual gambits are brilliant.

Also run a search on the forum and the main blog for “sexual prizing”. Powerful tech.

What I do atm, is introduce sexuality by talking about art or aesthetic experiences. This has it’s limitations as it falls flat on girls who aren’t very intelligent, reflective or inclined towards aesthetics. I’ll be trialling ways to find out what type of personality a girl has before I seduce so I can create new seduction pathways for these other girls. Anyway.. i talk about aesthetic experiences, and how they feel and the sensations that create in the body which is an easy way towards talking about sex and the aesthetic experiences of sex and the bodily sensations good sex provides.
Find what works for you.
Maybe you aren’t an artist but more emotional.. or perhaps you’re into sports and thrills. These can all be turned sexual, just use your imagination.

Hope that helps..

Best
Awesome, thank you @topcat!

Yeah, I would say my voice is not squeaky haha so hopefully I can leave that to work on a bit later.

Let me read the links you send through to me and start to try and apply it. And, nice use of the analogy!

I second Topcat's recommendation for Teevester's Sexual Gambits as they a simple and straight forward and pretty much anyone can use them. I would always try and tailor how you link into them from your own personal experiences, although that can be difficult from an engineers perspective - being an engineer myself I know this only too well. In recent years I've taken up dancing (Salsa, Bachata, Kizomba, etc) which gives me access to lots of sexy confident women but more importantly it gives me numerous ways into a sexual conversations. You need to find something that works for you and you are confident and comfortable with.
@Derek da man, well hello to a fellow engineer! Although I literally just finished my degree 1 month ago so you are much more useful than I am. :p

But yes, you are correct. Engineering trains us to spit hard dry boring facts and being able to invoke emotions is really not anywhere near the Engineering realm. God, when I was watching my classmates deliver presentations, I wanted to sleep. So yeah, I think it would be highly challenging to turn any engineering matter into sexual topics. I'll try to look into doing other activities like you have. Any other suggestions that you have rather than dancing? Also, what else have you found in terms of pros and cons of being an engineer but also doing practicing social arts?

This is exactly the issue I was having for a long time that I’m just finally getting over! I have a question: What is the context of most of your conversations? Are these when you’re out on a date or when you’re approaching new women and starting conversations with them?
@ElderPrice Hi! Nice to meet you. Full disclaimer: I have not been on a proper date in the last 4 years. I mean, most of the time, I didn't even try because the girls that I could bumped into did not raised any interest in me at all. There were 2 times that I set up a meal with a girl, but I wouldn't call them dates, especially since they didn't go anywhere.

I also haven't approach that many women in the past. The reasons would be because: I was not confident, I didn't have time, they were preoccupied (working out in the gym, etc.), girls walking in big groups and talking, etc. I would like to try and approach more in the next 3 months if I can.

So, I guess if we cross all of that out, then my conversations usually revolve around social talks (talking to someone at reception, other members in uni sport clubs, etc.), networking events, classmates complaining about assignments, etc. Man, now that I list them out, they all seem counterproductive, hmm... :(
 

Derek da man

Cro-Magnon Man
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Messages
285
@Derek da man, well hello to a fellow engineer! Although I literally just finished my degree 1 month ago so you are much more useful than I am. :p

But yes, you are correct. Engineering trains us to spit hard dry boring facts and being able to invoke emotions is really not anywhere near the Engineering realm. God, when I was watching my classmates deliver presentations, I wanted to sleep. So yeah, I think it would be highly challenging to turn any engineering matter into sexual topics. I'll try to look into doing other activities like you have. Any other suggestions that you have rather than dancing? Also, what else have you found in terms of pros and cons of being an engineer but also doing practicing social arts?
Unlike you I don't have a degree, my engineering background is from doing an apprenticeship and then learning some more everyday but it does mean I've very good at hand on things (said with a cheeky smile) - As you can see from my statement I've just turned being a dull engineer into a sexually leading conversation - you just need to think about the things that you already do or have done and how you can use them to have a double meaning and imply something more sexual - she will totally get it.

. There were 2 times that I set up a meal with a girl, but I wouldn't call them dates, especially since they didn't go anywhere.
I think she would have seen them that way, as if they were dates, you just didn't see them that way. Why didn't they go anywhere? Probably you didn't see them that way so didn't lead a sexual conversation and excite her. If she's agreed to spend time with you then you are half way there and you MUST see it as a date, or at least an opportunity. Change the way you look at things.

my conversations usually revolve around social talks (talking to someone at reception, other members in uni sport clubs, etc.), networking events, classmates complaining about assignments, etc. Man, now that I list them out, they all seem counterproductive, hmm...
As I was reading this you sounded interesting and show that you have other activities to talk about, you meet people at uni sports clubs, etc so you have access to women and talk to them, then you say they are counterproductive - that tells me you are looking at it from the wrong perspective, try and see yourself from other peoples perspective which isn't the way you see yourself.


I don't know what events etc are available in your area, have a look around and see what there is that might have lots of women attending, music gigs, party's, evening classes, the list goes on. In the UK there are loads of organized "Park Runs" held on a Saturday or Sunday morning. They have become quite a social event especially with lock down limiting a lot of indoor gatherings. A friend of mine goes regularly as there are loads of girls in pairs and small groups and when you're out running you can say hi and open them easily and then just move on if they aren't responsive. He's not particularly into running or fitness but these are very low level easy fun runs so it doesn't matter.
 

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
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Unlike you I don't have a degree, my engineering background is from doing an apprenticeship and then learning some more everyday but it does mean I've very good at hand on things (said with a cheeky smile) - As you can see from my statement I've just turned being a dull engineer into a sexually leading conversation - you just need to think about the things that you already do or have done and how you can use them to have a double meaning and imply something more sexual - she will totally get it.
@Derek da man Ah, I see! So you are doing the real kind of engineering haha! Unlike us uni-heads who just do some calculations and then say: "Yes, in theory, it should work" before everything goes horribly wrong lol :p

And thanks for providing that quick example. Let me try and get more creative to slide more innuendos into my conversations.

I think she would have seen them that way, as if they were dates, you just didn't see them that way. Why didn't they go anywhere? Probably you didn't see them that way so didn't lead a sexual conversation and excite her. If she's agreed to spend time with you then you are half way there and you MUST see it as a date, or at least an opportunity. Change the way you look at things.
About these "dates", one of them, the girl kind of already said that she doesn't want to lead me on. I chose to ignore it and push on anyway, hoping that I could turn the tables during the "date", but it didn't happen. She actually wanted to flake last minute, but I came and picked her up anyway and then she happily went to dinner with me, so I thought I was doing a good job with being assertive there. I had a good time with the meal, then we went home, drank some wine but she did not reciprocate any of my escalation on touching at all. I couldn't get close to her and we finished up with a kiss and that's it. Next week, I asked if she wanted to go see the fireworks and she very sternly responded that she was not interested and that we will not go anywhere. Clearly fucked up bad from my side somewhere.

The other one was just at the uni's cafeteria. I met her through a uni club and thought she looked attractive so we agreed to lunch. We met, had food and talked but my interest sort of decline through the date so the conversations turned into more awkwardness towards the end. Then her friends came and I definitely overstayed my time, so we said goodbye and never saw each other again after that.

As I was reading this you sounded interesting and show that you have other activities to talk about, you meet people at uni sports clubs, etc so you have access to women and talk to them, then you say they are counterproductive - that tells me you are looking at it from the wrong perspective, try and see yourself from other peoples perspective which isn't the way you see yourself.


I don't know what events etc are available in your area, have a look around and see what there is that might have lots of women attending, music gigs, party's, evening classes, the list goes on. In the UK there are loads of organized "Park Runs" held on a Saturday or Sunday morning. They have become quite a social event especially with lock down limiting a lot of indoor gatherings. A friend of mine goes regularly as there are loads of girls in pairs and small groups and when you're out running you can say hi and open them easily and then just move on if they aren't responsive. He's not particularly into running or fitness but these are very low level easy fun runs so it doesn't matter.
Hmm, I see what you are trying to say, and you are probably right. I should try to look at things in a different way. I thought that the activities I listed out were counterproductive because:
  • The people at reception was working there.
  • 2 sports clubs (HIIT and rock climbing) that I went to were small (5-10 members). All 3 are male-dominant. The few females that were there were not attractive to me and/or came with their boyfriends.
  • And the networking events are for career-related stuff so it was very business-oriented. A lot of older (age gap is around 10+ years) females and males, and I wasn't sure if it was an appropriate place for seduction.
But anyway, all of this was happening in the small town that I was in (85,000 people). Now I'm in the biggest city in New Zealand (1 million people), so let me try again and see what's around. Thanks for all the ideas on the events that might have a lot of females attending! And let me see if there are those "Park Runs" around here. If there are nice girls that I can chat up, then it will be good. Otherwise, I get a good exercise which will help build my fundamentals. So win-win ;)
 

Derek da man

Cro-Magnon Man
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285
I don't disagree with your perspective at the time, but I'm going to give some alternative perspectives:
About these "dates", one of them, the girl kind of already said that she doesn't want to lead me on.
This means she isn't looking for a boyfriend - it doesn't mean she wouldn't be open to hooking up - it could well be a test of you confidence and frame which you appear to have held and persisted with to get her out.
I chose to ignore it and push on anyway, hoping that I could turn the tables during the "date", but it didn't happen. She actually wanted to flake last minute, but I came and picked her up anyway and then she happily went to dinner with me, so I thought I was doing a good job with being assertive there. I had a good time with the meal, then we went home, drank some wine
Well done for pushing on and for getting her home - in my view it is unlikely she would of gone with you if she had already closed the door on hooking up.
she did not reciprocate any of my escalation on touching at all. I couldn't get close to her and we finished up with a kiss and that's it.
I would suspect your frame was off, either not strong enough or you hadn't set a frame where she could let herself go therefore her compliance wasn't high enough and hence the escalation failed. You can look at these in more detail on the GC articles already listed in this post above. Maybe you had her on a pedistal, or possibly your attainability was above what she thought she could get - this can get quite complex.
Next week, I asked if she wanted to go see the fireworks and she very sternly responded that she was not interested
Reminds me of how many of my early attempts ended up like this - escalation windows are very limited in terms of time and opportunity and she has now closed the door. When she said "she didn't want to lead you on" at the beginning she could easily have sternly replied no at this point if there wasn't some interest - hence my conclusion that there was still an opportunity for you.


People like to talk to people who share their interests/passions - I've seen guys go and get a dog (or borrow a friends dog) so they can go and chat to women who are out walking their dogs. A dog walker always says hello with a comment to another dog walker - it's very natural in just the same way as a runner says hello to another runner in passing - as previous "Park Runs" thing - you just need to find equivalents - or a friend with a dog you can borrow for a morning ;)
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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@ElderPrice Hi! Nice to meet you. Full disclaimer: I have not been on a proper date in the last 4 years. I mean, most of the time, I didn't even try because the girls that I could bumped into did not raised any interest in me at all. There were 2 times that I set up a meal with a girl, but I wouldn't call them dates, especially since they didn't go anywhere.

I also haven't approach that many women in the past. The reasons would be because: I was not confident, I didn't have time, they were preoccupied (working out in the gym, etc.), girls walking in big groups and talking, etc. I would like to try and approach more in the next 3 months if I can.

So, I guess if we cross all of that out, then my conversations usually revolve around social talks (talking to someone at reception, other members in uni sport clubs, etc.), networking events, classmates complaining about assignments, etc. Man, now that I list them out, they all seem counterproductive, hmm... :(
This is helpful, thank you.

Okay, with everything you've said, here's my guess:

For all intents and purposes, there is nothing wrong with you. There is no special thing you have to say that will make women want to fuck you.

Instead, do two things:

1. Assume they are attracted to you. This should have the effect of moving things along ie. Asking for a number, asking them out to grab a drink, inviting them home once you are both out getting that drink... Stop worrying about if they like you or if they're reciprocating touch. Talk to them, then lead the interaction along. If they like you, they'll follow. If not, then move on.

2. Very important: Get out there and meet more women. Not women you see every week in class or at the uni sports club. Strangers. Women who if you don't grab their contact info, you're probably never going to see again. Go practice actual cold approach. If you have anxiety about it, overcome that anxiety. Once you do and you're meeting dozens of new women each week, let us know so we can recommend the best practices for living with such enormous balls in your pants.

In all seriousness, the reason you're struggling to find women who do things like reciprocate touch... is because you're not meeting enough women! Play the numbers game and you'll eventually meet women who want to put their hands on you! You don't need a special thing to say. Just meet more women, lead the interaction, and see who follows along.
 

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
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I don't disagree with your perspective at the time, but I'm going to give some alternative perspectives:

This means she isn't looking for a boyfriend - it doesn't mean she wouldn't be open to hooking up - it could well be a test of you confidence and frame which you appear to have held and persisted with to get her out.

Well done for pushing on and for getting her home - in my view it is unlikely she would of gone with you if she had already closed the door on hooking up.

I would suspect your frame was off, either not strong enough or you hadn't set a frame where she could let herself go therefore her compliance wasn't high enough and hence the escalation failed. You can look at these in more detail on the GC articles already listed in this post above. Maybe you had her on a pedistal, or possibly your attainability was above what she thought she could get - this can get quite complex.

Reminds me of how many of my early attempts ended up like this - escalation windows are very limited in terms of time and opportunity and she has now closed the door. When she said "she didn't want to lead you on" at the beginning she could easily have sternly replied no at this point if there wasn't some interest - hence my conclusion that there was still an opportunity for you.


People like to talk to people who share their interests/passions - I've seen guys go and get a dog (or borrow a friends dog) so they can go and chat to women who are out walking their dogs. A dog walker always says hello with a comment to another dog walker - it's very natural in just the same way as a runner says hello to another runner in passing - as previous "Park Runs" thing - you just need to find equivalents - or a friend with a dog you can borrow for a morning ;)
Hey @Derek da man, sorry for the super delayed response. Had a busy week. I started going to a self-defense course after work in the past week to build up strength and confidence so I was pretty knackered when I get home. No training today so I can actually get on to this forum to reply on things :p

Thanks heaps for providing me with an alternative perspective! I actually really love it when people provide alternative views on things, so I really appreciate it! Thinking about it now, I believe your analysis is accurate with the framing, pedestal, etc. I can't call myself experience with women and I definitely still don't have a good grasp with framing. These would have affect my behaviour during this particular "date": she was a hot fit blonde, I was nervous, I don't know how to frame, the pedestal thing would have come through my subconsciousness and translate into actions.

Attainability is another topic. I honestly have zero idea on where I stand with attainability right now. I would suspect that it is too low for the women I met because most women I met act neutral or friendly towards me. From Chase's book, if your attainability is too high, then women would get pissed off or bitter at you. That has never happened to me. My further self-assessment is that my physical fundamentals are not that good compared to other guys: not enough strength, skinny-fat, underdeveloped shoulders, too many loose-fitting clothes, etc. So, yeah, I would think my attainability is more likely under rather than over.

Your comments on escalation windows is another useful reminder for me: until she gives you a hard 'no', opportunity still exists. I got a subscriber email from Chase recently too, reminding people to not bail out too early, especially with day game.

And yes, more creativity! Let me go and observe to see which type of women I would like to approach and then find equivalents to your "park run" and "friend with a dog" ideas ;)
 

WorldlyGoldenViper

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Dec 7, 2021
Messages
12
This is helpful, thank you.

Okay, with everything you've said, here's my guess:

For all intents and purposes, there is nothing wrong with you. There is no special thing you have to say that will make women want to fuck you.

Instead, do two things:

1. Assume they are attracted to you. This should have the effect of moving things along ie. Asking for a number, asking them out to grab a drink, inviting them home once you are both out getting that drink... Stop worrying about if they like you or if they're reciprocating touch. Talk to them, then lead the interaction along. If they like you, they'll follow. If not, then move on.

2. Very important: Get out there and meet more women. Not women you see every week in class or at the uni sports club. Strangers. Women who if you don't grab their contact info, you're probably never going to see again. Go practice actual cold approach. If you have anxiety about it, overcome that anxiety. Once you do and you're meeting dozens of new women each week, let us know so we can recommend the best practices for living with such enormous balls in your pants.

In all seriousness, the reason you're struggling to find women who do things like reciprocate touch... is because you're not meeting enough women! Play the numbers game and you'll eventually meet women who want to put their hands on you! You don't need a special thing to say. Just meet more women, lead the interaction, and see who follows along.
@ElderPrice Also my apologies for the super slow response!

Okay, thank you for saying this. That all makes sense to me and I agree with you about not meeting enough women. At the moment, I am meeting 1 or 2 random women at most in one week, which I 100% accept is nowhere close to a good number. I have also been advised on another thread to start a journal and record down my approach attempts. I saw a cute girl in my self-defense class on Monday but did not have the guts to actually execute the approach (which I now regret because I may never see her again). I actually did a cold approach today in the mall, it didn't go anywhere, but like you said, numbers game, right?

I will come back and inform you guys when I have got my numbers up to around 10 women a week. I will do that and on the side, continue to improve my fundamentals, which I understand will make things easier in the long run. Go lift weights, build up my shoulders, swap out my clothes as I slowly make money, etc. Thank you again for your analysis! :)
 

ElderPrice

Tool-Bearing Hominid
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568
@ElderPrice Also my apologies for the super slow response!

Okay, thank you for saying this. That all makes sense to me and I agree with you about not meeting enough women. At the moment, I am meeting 1 or 2 random women at most in one week, which I 100% accept is nowhere close to a good number. I have also been advised on another thread to start a journal and record down my approach attempts. I saw a cute girl in my self-defense class on Monday but did not have the guts to actually execute the approach (which I now regret because I may never see her again). I actually did a cold approach today in the mall, it didn't go anywhere, but like you said, numbers game, right?

I will come back and inform you guys when I have got my numbers up to around 10 women a week. I will do that and on the side, continue to improve my fundamentals, which I understand will make things easier in the long run. Go lift weights, build up my shoulders, swap out my clothes as I slowly make money, etc. Thank you again for your analysis! :)
Excellent! We're rooting for you!

Try to aim for more approaches. I think Chase has an article about shooting for 4 approaches per day, on average. That would come out to ~30 approaches per week! If the things you're doing day in and day out don't put you around that many women to approach each week, it may be time to make some changes to your life/schedule so that you do have the opportunities to hit that number.
 
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