Options for Indirect Moving Day Game (Compliance Openers?)

[Francis]

Has anyone here ever had success opening moving girls indirectly in day game?

I absolutely love asking girls for the time. It has never once failed to open, gets immediate compliance especially if she has to go in her purse, and gives a decent read on her general friendliness level while easing you into a natural conversation. I've done it a decent amount on sidewalks as stutter desensitization. I don't think asking for directions is ideal since it's fake.

The problem with it is there's no way to doggedly follow up after giving a girl my number. Whether she's not too nervous to reach out or not even interested, it seems low odds, which is a shame. I can go more for asking for her phone to send a message myself, but don't want to necessarily rely on it. Maybe I'm wrong she could find it invasive in case notifications pop up, etc. or odd if she's ready to type.

Here's an 18 year old (she was seated and I conceivably could have gone situationally relevant, but it's an example). First approach today:

Spoiler: Rush

Walked in building and past lone blonde sitting on her phone in the lobby. Used the washroom and walked past her again. Walked a little past and over the shoulder slowly asked "Hi, can I ask you a favor... Could you tell me what the time is... I don't have my phone on me". Asked if she was doing homework. Took her hand, which she pulled away, though not snap immediately. Not sure if indicative of interest level or nerves in this case.


She was 18 year old, rushing sororities, had done one already that morning, and was waiting for the next. She said it would be going all day until late evening, with the same over the next couple days. I teased her about looking exasperated. Asked about the motivation making friends, where she's from, what she's studying and wants to do after (law school). Should have teased and flirted more.


She was seated and I was standing in front of her, always facing away, but turned in over time as she told me about herself. I was a little transfixed with how good her eye contact was and kept it too friendly. Need to remember to always find a way to add some sort of dating frame, like meeting guys in frats, etc. I asked how much time she had and it was only a few minutes until the next event. I said I was going to get a coffee and was going to see if she wanted to join me. She said she would have and seemed genuine. I proposed getting together another time and gave her my number. I told her to text me and she said "of course".

Lack of teasing/flirting is a separate issue!

Approach 2 of 2 today was a hired gun. Botched this for sure, but including since it seems like a cool strategy to ramp up compliance to insane levels with a girl who is working. I've done a little of this getting her working in clothing stores getting items, etc. Not something I should bother with much as a beginner, but here it is for good measure cause it was fun.

Spoiler: Work

---

Walked in grocery store and asked a girl stocking shelves where the washrooms were. She pointed over in a direction and then asked if I would like her to show me where. She was blonde in her 20's with a septum ring. I said something about her needing a break and she said it's a whole shift of stocking so she likes taking walks around. This seemed true, but I sensed a high level of interest from her while accompanying me, I think through voice tone, facial expression, eyes, etc. Hard to pinpoint but it felt high. I asked how her day was going so far and she said she was one hour into the eight hour shift. She turned it back to me and asked if I was doing a grocery run and asked what else I was up to for the day.


We were nearing the washrooms, so I asked if she would like to see me later. She giggled and said I'm a customer. I told her to come into the hallway for a second (two or three feet), and then locked in against the wall with her facing me. I proposed exchanging numbers and she was hesitant. I said she doesn't have to commit to meeting but we can at least keep in touch and decide. She counter proposed for me to come back and find her where she was stocking after. We exchanged names and I went in the washroom. On the way out she was engaged with a customer so I exited. Could always return. It was an extremely quick interaction - way too fast for that level of compliance despite sensing strong initial interest.

I was just passing through this place... Unfortunately there are no sororities in my immediate area lol

But is this something people do? Or anyone on mASF? Please just tell me straight up if there's no actual alternative to genuine compliment openers. I have to say though, I really like the idea of not having to lead with a ton of interest. Maybe this is avoidance, but it's interesting. Like @James D asked a girl to take his picture I think? Awesome opener. I'd love something with no prop though. @Karea Ricardus D. mentioned instead of "compliment direct" he switched to "compliance direct" but then he disappeared after Christmas like Santa Clause.

Thoughts?

Article (no sidewalk examples):

Tactics Tuesdays: Compliance Openers

Start a new conversation with a woman by asking her to do something. Compliance openers kick off interactions with you taking the lead right from the beginning. For intermediates and up. Imagine if you could start off an interaction with a woman by having her follow your instructions...

www.girlschase.com

 

[alexlaguma]

I don't think asking for directions is ideal since it's fake.

I tried this once, and as soon as I tried to pivot into a man to woman conversation she rolled her eyes and walked away. I swore then I'd never do it again. I go direct every time now, with the genuine compliment being the best approach.

 

[Higher]

Has anyone here ever had success opening moving girls indirectly in day game?

Yes multiple times, tho i generally prefer direct.

Here my indirect openers + transitions:

1) [handing her my phone] "are you good with pictures?" (High compliance + qualification right off the bat, best initial frame and best transition potential). Usual transition: "hey btw i love your style". Alternative: "btw you don't look like you're from here... something in your vibe...". Both of these usually followed by "i live nearby but i feel like a tourist today, I'm exploring the city very randomly and very spontaneously, i love to go with the flow and to discover... hidden treasures..." (Strong EC).

2) "I'm looking for a GOOD coffee place, please SAVE ME cause I'm DYING right now!" (Said in a very over-the-top playful way but with bedroom voice, hands ; often she'll smile). Qualification: "is it THAT good? I'm gonna trust you eh?". Usual transition: "hey btw i love your style". Alternative: "wait, are you from here? You don't seem from here..." followed by a cold-read.

3) [standing right next to XYZ] "hey do you know where XYZ is?" (Good EC, clearly messing around with her). Usual transition: "yeah actually i just wanted to meet you, i saw you and i absolutely love your style". This is what's called "indirect-direct" here on the forum/GC.

(Sorry, it's a bit messy, I'm typing from my phone.)

The problem with it is there's no way to doggedly follow up after giving a girl my number.

Why would you give her your number?

 

[Francis]

I tried this once, and as soon as I tried to pivot into a man to woman conversation she rolled her eyes and walked away. I swore then I'd never do it again. I go direct every time now, with the genuine compliment being the best approach.

Lol pretty funny... Yeah the authenticity of showing interest is respected, and hiding it isn't... Kind of like physical game being based on "escalation itself is attractive"... Going direct without emanating any neediness does sound powerful.

I think it trips me up because it kind of conflicts with Swinggcat's fourfold meta frame, which essentially is you're the prize and she's working to win you over. Instead of man to woman it is woman to man... Indirect game 101... Female to male interest before male to female

Yes multiple times, tho i generally prefer direct.

Here my indirect openers + transitions:

1) [handing her my phone] "are you good with pictures?" (High compliance + qualification right off the bat, best initial frame and best transition potential). Usual transition: "hey btw i love your style". Alternative: "btw you don't look like you're from here... something in your vibe...". Both of these usually followed by "i live nearby but i feel like a tourist today, I'm exploring the city very randomly and very spontaneously, i love to go with the flow and to discover... hidden treasures..." (Strong EC).

2) "I'm looking for a GOOD coffee place, please SAVE ME cause I'm DYING right now!" (Said in a very over-the-top playful way but with bedroom voice, hands ; often she'll smile). Qualification: "is it THAT good? I'm gonna trust you eh?". Usual transition: "hey btw i love your style". Alternative: "wait, are you from here? You don't seem from here..." followed by a cold-read.

3) [standing right next to XYZ] "hey do you know where XYZ is?" (Good EC, clearly messing around with her). Usual transition: "yeah actually i just wanted to meet you, i saw you and i absolutely love your style". This is what's called "indirect-direct" here on the forum/GC.

(Sorry, it's a bit messy, I'm typing from my phone.)



Why would you give her your number?

Good stuff, thanks man! I think this is a good way to go... Basically deliver a genuine compliment immediately after her compliance. Then at least you're rewarding her and not leading with subtext of opening to say "I like you... Do you like me too...? No..? Ok bye..."

Though it's still showing interest before she does, since the compliance is purely social.

If sidewalk stops are the closest thing to numbers game, I like the idea of increasing the odds for situations where you're approaching the hottest girl you've ever seen who has absolute abundance. Different than a girl going nuts with overextensions and obvious approach invitations.

I guess the confident approach signals you are not intimidated and don't view her as above you.

I should probably just approach way more before starting threads like this lol. My ideal is to do like "covert seduction"... Including implications of sexual frames so the entire game is plausibly deniable. Like I want to be able to do really quick pulls by using pure sub communication so she knows it's a sexual adventure but this is not stated... So there is nothing on the social surface level for her to resist.

I do enjoy laughing and teasing and such... But I also want to be able to use massive amounts of sexual tension where it is kind of like a movie meet cute. Not romantic comedy... More like "erotic thriller" genre. Plus similar to "The Saint"... Also very efficiently setting chase frames and dropping hints. Using lots of pausing, eye contact, subtle touch, seduction oriented topics with arousing language...

I think I am going to try instead of a single hand palm up holding hers, I'll try my two hands sandwiching hers. This alone should clearly signal romantic interest without an excess of power transfer.

And I gave her my number because I didn't have my phone on me. I considered carrying a pen but I really do not want a default process that relies on any external tools or props.

@Chase if you see this can you ban me from all forums except field reports please...

 

[Francis]

Ok I realize I am trying to learn alchemy before chemistry... But if your intent and focus is correct from the start, then the journey should proceed in the right direction toward an ultimate goal?

Here is @West_Indian_Archie on indirect game:

Proper indirect game is interacting with a chick, pushing her buttons, and she starts to wonder WHY IS THIS COOL GUY NOT HITTING ON ME? You close this chick by putting her in a situation where she’s seeking your validation, and you’re giving her compliance hoops to jump through. You are the one that decides, not her. That’s the whole point of what Style and Mystery were doing. Mystery in particular can tell you a banal story in a compelling way, and that only invites more chat, more energy. At which point, he can withhold that emotional joy/zeal/interest for a price.

Moving street stops are by far the most target rich daytime opportunities in my environment. Given that reality, how can this process be devised?

It's 100% an A2 question. DHV options:

- Preselection: impossible without lying that she looks like your ex?

- Leader: impossible besides leading the interaction?

- Protector: impossible besides protective touch later in the interaction?

- Emoting: general seductive energy

- Risk taker: let's work with this

***

So the idea would be use the SAC model in reverse order. We're talking like 1 minute of A2 here... No long stories. Once she touches her hair or shows interest in her eyes, we're on to qualifying. Hopefully no similarity needed until A3 eliciting values.

So we have Compliance (risk taker) and Arousal (risk taker, emoting).

Now the kicker is how do you do that in a replicable way without telegraphing interest and violating the principle of indirect game. Also without simply skipping from social to qualifying. Again the goal is A2 female to male interest. Even in 30 seconds.

Now doesn't that sound like a @Chase frame?

So the question becomes how do you set chase frames while slightly delaying "flirting" (telegraphing interest) until you detect the slightest indicator of interest?

Initial process thoughts:

- Ask for the time opener

- Genuine compliment reward, offhand like you would a coworker

- Tease her for trying to attract male attention via her fashion/hair/walk/energy (risk taker DHV? F-to-M interest since it's a chase frame, not "best I've seen all day"?)

- Ideally receive IOI here or after next step. Only then start dialing in the seductive eye contact, touch, and proximity as a reward. Probably insert introductions and hand clasp compliance test here.

- Lock in. Cold read based on student, work, or shopping. Pace her availability based on what time it is.

- Qualify starting based on qualities relating to above, such as studious, dedicated worker rushing back, etc. Ideally casual stroller drinking in the moment.

- Bait her qualifications while framing for adventurousness, needing to find relief/release from studying, etc.

- Lead her with seductive emotions into moving and rapport.

***

Any thoughts on how else to accomplish A2 on the street while delaying interest?

Definitely going for the most minimal, bare bones framework possible. Efficient and flexible.

 

[West_Indian_Archie]

Moving street stops are by far the most target rich daytime opportunities in my environment. Given that reality, how can this process be devised?

If you watch old VH-1 The Pick Up Artist - they do street game during the day.

Anything I've ever pulled during day game has been more of a "fool's mate"'/"choosing signals"/"Don't mess it up" scenario.

Enough game to recognize the social scenario and the signs that she's open to chat, but it's why I don't recommend day game on the street to most guys in most situations.

But there are specialists out there

There's another one about a Indonesian Surf Instructor in Bali that is a fellow traveler of this stuff...

 

[ChrisXKiss]

I think the main issue with going the MM way in a daygame cold approach is that in most situations you telegraph interest by default when opening.

It’s not a social environment where you could just be socialising, but it’s mostly obvious that you came up to talk to a woman because you want something.

Here I am talking about pure out in the streets daygame, not being in a daygame venue.

There can be some situations where it could make sense to chat someone up, if you are sitting closeby waiting for a train for example and it seems like it is getting late.

The second issue with this kind of daygame though is that the girl has no reason to stay around. It’s not like you can do a passing opener, check the responsiveness, go mingle and circle back. She is gone.

All this leads to the fact that everything comes down to the open. If you do it and she doesn’t want you there for any reason, then I have not figured out a way to continue the interaction without frustrating her and looking like I am pushing hard for something.

If she does look like she entertains the approach, then you can start working with it and based on the girl and the situation more or less direct may make more sense.

I mean if a very elegantly dressed girl is walking confidently in a fairly fast pace down a crowded street, going up to her to stop her for the time feels just weird.

For me if it is extremely obvious that I approached her when there was no particular reason to approach her and not anyone else, I go direct.

If the vibe is more chill, she is walking more slowly or sitting/standing I may try to engineer different kind of approaches, like asking for something, or using a situational opener about the environment.

The trap with this is that you can end up suddenly changing from social to communicating interest in a way that screams: I wanted you from the beginning, but tried to trick you into it.

Now if you know you have time there together, for example the train is late 20 minutes and you will both be waiting, and she is willing to be social, you could go the more indirect route and try to flip the script and have her chasing you.

In my experience though, for the vast majority of cases of this type of daygame you are way more tight time wise. The train is coming in few minutes or the girl is going somewhere and can’t fully commit to the interaction.

In such a situation I would say that expressing some form of interest soon enough makes sense. Because you will eventually have to close, and there has to be a man to woman reason for closing, unless you go for pure social invites with the plan to game them later in an environment you can generate social proof.

In general though, just the fact that this girl stops and gives you some time of her day most probably means she finds you at least a bit attractive, so showing some interest back can help things progress.

I personally like going fully direct, but if there is an opportunity I may start more indirectly. When she is responsive though, I will try to qualify her on something, telling her she looks really classy like I just realised it when we ended up close, and eventually on something less superficial she lets me know about her like a particular passion she has.

To summarise, I do like the idea you are going for, I’ve been thinking a lot about how to do daygame approaches more effective in that way. Practically though I experience that the largest amount of approaches fall under either girls that are uninterested and won’t even stay there for you to run your game, or girls that are somehow interested and you just have to adjust your interest and game to theirs.

This last group of interactions are the ones I would go about optimising. Basically starting from the basis that if she engages when she has no reason, there is at least some interest, and figuring out the steps from there to an instant date or a number close.

I am pretty sure this is how the Greek guys in this video did it. They went around a lot, approached everyone and at the first sign of interest they were ready to move the interaction forward aggressively while remaining calibrated to the girl.

They also had the huge advantage of the girls being tourists both due to the numbers they could put every day, and because of the summer vacation vibe that led the girls be way more open to new experiences.

I can’t imagine realistically pulling something of this scale in a different environment, but the facts that you have to approach a lot, not care about the instant rejections and move forward decisively when an girl hooks, would still apply.

 

[Francis]

VH-1 The Pick Up Artist - they do street game during the day

Really... Ok I'll look, thanks... Curious about openers and first minute or so...

choosing signals

social scenario and the signs that she's open to chat

Challenge accepted lol if I can just delay her snap judgment and give her one minute to settle and increase the likelihood of these...

 

[Francis]

I mean if a very elegantly dressed girl is walking confidently in a fairly fast pace down a crowded street, going up to her to stop her for the time feels just weird.

I thought it would be met with tons of skepticism!! It's actually been so surprising. I went from never being able to do a street stop, like ever... To immediately doing about 35 over a weekend or so. Every single one was under 25 years old. And every single one was happy to comply, save for one or two who weren't really attractive that probably auto rejected, and one scared Asian girl.

It was wild! You know how beautiful girls are often the most friendly? It's like instantly skipping to that point without any pressure on her of that surprise romantic interest. It's very human like a "how's your day going" in an elevator.

The trap with this is that you can end up suddenly changing from social to communicating interest in a way that screams: I wanted you from the beginning, but tried to trick you into it.

Great point here... I think I'm going to play it like I opened for the time but then immediately "noticed" her as a woman... But like not won over at all, just slight curiosity starting with her now stationary. The idea is if she's a real stunner, you're just normal social on her level like she's any old lady. Then her guard is down and you can start up the tension.

you are way more tight time wise. The train is coming in few minutes or the girl is going somewhere and can’t fully commit to the interaction.

In such a situation I would say that expressing some form of interest soon enough makes sense

Yeah maybe true indirect is a pipe dream. Again yes we are talking sidewalk game here. So indirect-direct is probably more realistic ... Just slightly more delayed than normal beyond the first bit of chatter. Definitely not "just kidding... I actually just thought you were cute" and more... "Cool outfit btw... What do you call that kind of dress" [...] "Do you find it gets you more guys coming up to you when you're feeling your best in an outfit like this?... Oh you don't get approached much in public?"

One hair flip or deep eye contact and cue start flirting...

Practically though I experience that the largest amount of approaches fall under either girls that are uninterested and won’t even stay there for you to run your game

Yeah I think the idea is increasing the odds for this group. Eliminating snap judgment.

It's like a cheat code to turn the moving set to a stationary one. Slight delay. Added bonus compliance +1 from the get go.

I really want to field test. Don't smoke weed. Just don't.

 

[Chase]

@KJ Francis,

I will do indirect street stops, especially when traveling.

Rather than research where everything is, you just go around street stopping hot girls and ask them to direct you there.

Good excuse to meet girls and you're not faking it; you really do not know where anything is!

e.g.,

• "Excuse me... hi. Hello there. Do you have any idea where I can get a SIM card around here? My phone plan isn't global and I forgot to pick one up at the airport."
  
  
• "Excuse me... hey. Hi. You look knowledgeable. Any good coffee shop recommendations around here? I'm looking for somewhere chill with a good atmosphere that's good to work at. Ideally one serving hot chocolate and not just coffee."
  
  
• "Hi there! Are you from around here? Know this area pretty well? I'm trying to figure out where good spots are here to sit and work outside. Maybe like a good park, nice scenery, etc. Any recommendations for me?"
  
  
• [at night] "Excuse me... hey, you're all dressed up. Let me ask: are there any good bars around here? Any you'd recommend that are chill and not overly loud? I'm just getting acquainted with the area and could use some recommendations."

Etc. Whatever you want suggestions for. Restaurants, beaches, tourist sites, whatever.

Once she's talking, you then INTERRUPT her answer to compliment her on something.

Can be hair, style, etc. If she's smiling you can tell her "You have a really nice smile" (following up an indirect opener is the one time I think it's okay to use a generic looks-based compliment).

Then you just keep interrupting the conversation, asking her things, observing things about her, opening up repeated loops, until you have a bunch of open loops all at once and she's sucked into this conversation with all these different things going on.

Here are some examples of how the conversation flows when you're doing an indirect moving stop:

Tactics Tuesdays: Opener Cycling

If at first your opener doesn’t hook, try, try again. That’s the basis of opener cycling: using more than one opener on one girl. Don’t just open weak then plow. Not every time you open a girl will she open with gusto. Sometimes all you get is a blasé response. She doesn't reject you, per se...

www.girlschase.com

Chase

 

[Francis]

@KJ Francis,

I will do indirect street stops, especially when traveling.

Rather than research where everything is, you just go around street stopping hot girls and ask them to direct you there.

Good excuse to meet girls and you're not faking it; you really do not know where anything is!

e.g.,

• "Excuse me... hi. Hello there. Do you have any idea where I can get a SIM card around here? My phone plan isn't global and I forgot to pick one up at the airport."
  
  
• "Excuse me... hey. Hi. You look knowledgeable. Any good coffee shop recommendations around here? I'm looking for somewhere chill with a good atmosphere that's good to work at. Ideally one serving hot chocolate and not just coffee."
  
  
• "Hi there! Are you from around here? Know this area pretty well? I'm trying to figure out where good spots are here to sit and work outside. Maybe like a good park, nice scenery, etc. Any recommendations for me?"
  
  
• [at night] "Excuse me... hey, you're all dressed up. Let me ask: are there any good bars around here? Any you'd recommend that are chill and not overly loud? I'm just getting acquainted with the area and could use some recommendations."

Etc. Whatever you want suggestions for. Restaurants, beaches, tourist sites, whatever.

Once she's talking, you then INTERRUPT her answer to compliment her on something.

Can be hair, style, etc. If she's smiling you can tell her "You have a really nice smile" (following up an indirect opener is the one time I think it's okay to use a generic looks-based compliment).

Then you just keep interrupting the conversation, asking her things, observing things about her, opening up repeated loops, until you have a bunch of open loops all at once and she's sucked into this conversation with all these different things going on.

Here are some examples of how the conversation flows when you're doing an indirect moving stop:

Tactics Tuesdays: Opener Cycling

If at first your opener doesn’t hook, try, try again. That’s the basis of opener cycling: using more than one opener on one girl. Don’t just open weak then plow. Not every time you open a girl will she open with gusto. Sometimes all you get is a blasé response. She doesn't reject you, per se...

www.girlschase.com

Chase

Ahh and of course you sent me this already here... So interupts, stacking openers. Thanks Chase. I like that you can kind of pump her brakes and ease her down into situational relevance.

Also 'noticing her' post compliance with the little compliment inserts seems like it would feel more like fate and you falling from heaven for her vs. you stopping her cause you're so impressed.

What is your cold approach banter process?

Hi guys, I just did my first ever coffee shop line approach and got a number from a beautiful Latina architect with a slim waist. She seems maybe a few years older than me, which dampens the dynamic a bit. So my question is what is your process for banter, like do you have a high level mental...

www.skilledseducer.com

Unfortunately I'm far too well acquainted with the two or three areas I'm typically in to ask for directions. One spot is out for a walk in the neighborhood.

I will have to give this a shot off of telling the time. Pretty sure it could also work fine indoors in any hallway like a mall, school, work lobby, etc.