Tornado's journal

[Ratata]

If I can remember correctly. This is where the interaction started losing its life. Her arms crossed etc after I lend my hand and she refused by saying I am just collecting my thoughts.


@Ratata Please bless me with your wise words

I have good news and I have bad news.

Let's start with the bad news. The first 1000 approaches do not count. I mean, they do, but not like you think. You should not mass approach, in my opinion, unless you're trying to build social momentum (and I'm not saying that you do). You should journal, and think that each one counts, although it really doesn't (this is what it seems like you are doing - and that is good! If you learn from it...).

You'll ask yourself questions, and men will try to answer them, and you still won't understand. For at least 1000 more approaches...

That... is your hero's journey.

But!

Congratulations on going out there and braving reality!

Some men are climbing mountains. Some try to go barefoot to the North Pole.

You... You approach hot girls on the street, to prove that you can defeat yourself in battle.

A toast! For thy bravery, good Sir! You are facing a challenge worthy of Odysseus (go see it, it's good - I mean, imagine being such a chad that a woman would wait 20 years only for you!)

Once you have 1000 approaches under your belt - 1000 approaches that never counted - you will (hopefully) have learned some patterns that you easily recognized. (Fair warning, you may also have learned some bad habits that you need to unlearn however, so it doesn't really stop at 1000...) But that's when approaches start to count. Normally. For some it's 10000 sigh... But I hope for you, it's 1000 or less.

What I'm saying here, is that you've intentionally made this very hard for yourself. There may be easier ways.

From my vantage point, it looks like you're begging on the street. If you're well dressed, and charming, it might stop a girl, and make her interested for a moment. But the second she sees that you're actually insecure, that you're actually there to sell something, and it's not mutual, then she will dismiss you. Then you are trash. Then you are a tryhard. A beggar. And someone she needs to reject.

A small test you can make for yourself:

Next time a beggar comes up to you, and asks you for something: What do you feel? Note it down.
Next time someone approaches you and wants to sell you some trash: What do you feel? What do you want to do to that person? Note it down. And learn from it.

Don't be a beggar. Be the one who just wears a Rolex, while driving a Ferrari. Not literally, but figuratively. You have something they want. You don't even need to flaunt it. You can just associate with it. And they want it. So you no longer need to try.

But keep approaching. Keep learning. And keep putting yourself out there.

All the best!

 

[Francis]

I have good news and I have bad news.

Let's start with the bad news. The first 1000 approaches do not count. I mean, they do, but not like you think. You should not mass approach, in my opinion, unless you're trying to build social momentum (and I'm not saying that you do). You should journal, and think that each one counts, although it really doesn't (this is what it seems like you are doing - and that is good! If you learn from it...).

You'll ask yourself questions, and men will try to answer them, and you still won't understand. For at least 1000 more approaches...

That... is your hero's journey.

But!

Congratulations on going out there and braving reality!

Some men are climbing mountains. Some try to go barefoot to the North Pole.

You... You approach hot girls on the street, to prove that you can defeat yourself in battle.

A toast! For thy bravery, good Sir! You are facing a challenge worthy of Odysseus (go see it, it's good - I mean, imagine being such a chad that a woman would wait 20 years only for you!)

Once you have 1000 approaches under your belt - 1000 approaches that never counted - you will (hopefully) have learned some patterns that you easily recognized. (Fair warning, you may also have learned some bad habits that you need to unlearn however, so it doesn't really stop at 1000...) But that's when approaches start to count. Normally. For some it's 10000 sigh... But I hope for you, it's 1000 or less.

What I'm saying here, is that you've intentionally made this very hard for yourself. There may be easier ways.

From my vantage point, it looks like you're begging on the street. If you're well dressed, and charming, it might stop a girl, and make her interested for a moment. But the second she sees that you're actually insecure, that you're actually there to sell something, and it's not mutual, then she will dismiss you. Then you are trash. Then you are a tryhard. A beggar. And someone she needs to reject.

A small test you can make for yourself:

Next time a beggar comes up to you, and asks you for something: What do you feel? Note it down.
Next time someone approaches you and wants to sell you some trash: What do you feel? What do you want to do to that person? Note it down. And learn from it.

Don't be a beggar. Be the one who just wears a Rolex, while driving a Ferrari. Not literally, but figuratively. You have something they want. You don't even need to flaunt it. You can just associate with it. And they want it. So you no longer need to try.

But keep approaching. Keep learning. And keep putting yourself out there.

All the best!

«Tenk bare på all gjestfriheten vi opplevde fra andre menn før vi kom hjem, og Gud bevare oss fra slike harde reiser i årene som kommer.»

-King Menelaus

Calibration and Internalization

After the first week or two in the field, approaches start to become a blur.
Patterns emerge over time. Formerly puzzling social behavior comes clearly into
focus. Situations and reactions can be easily predicted before they occur. This
powerful social intuition, derived from time in the field, is known as calibration.

A skilled venusian artist will anticipate, and have a prepared response for, nearly
any common social challenge. He has already encountered this particular
challenge before. He has experimented with a variety of different responses, and
he has compared notes with all of his friends on the subject as well. He has found
an effective answer, and he has already field-tested it and practiced it to mastery.

So when the challenge arises, the answer comes forth — automatically delivered
into action by his unconscious mind. In the same way that all practiced behaviors
become automatic, so does the skill set of the Mystery Method. This process is
known as internalization.

@tornado, meet @Arnav

Brahmaspeed

 

[Arnav]

«Tenk bare på all gjestfriheten vi opplevde fra andre menn før vi kom hjem, og Gud bevare oss fra slike harde reiser i årene som kommer.»

-King Menelaus



@tornado, meet @Arnav

Brahmaspeed

Yeah i kind of had a similar experence the initial approaches were so anciety ridden and fear based, niw looking back i can see how much juat repetions expoaure and some good experince calm you down and unlock some of your natural conv abilities in a set.

 

[tornado]

Couldn't go out because of work. Lost my momentum and I will have to build it from scratch. Will be going out tomorrow.

Ratata said:
What I'm saying here, is that you've intentionally made this very hard for yourself. There may be easier ways.

What did Ratata mean by this line? What does he mean by easier ways?

 

[tornado]

Went out today. not much happened. a bad day. went to one location. Couldn't see any sets Did one approach where girl was looking everywhere else but me, because she was worried that this was a prank and she was being recorded. And I said I promise you nobody is recording you. Tried some small talk but then "she asked why are you asking me all this are you going to ask me out? I am kind of seeing someone right now" I said ok it was nice meeting you and I went off. I did see some sets which were a group of 2 girls. But something in me just doesn't want to approach groups. so changed the location. This place had tons of volume, but again it was overcrowded. No place to lock in because it was too over crowded. Did two sets here though. Opened them correctly. One girl was talking politely but I kicked myself in the foot reminding her that she has to go meet her friend and then she went off. This second girl was also very hot. She was smiling very much when I opened because I use many pauses in my opener for sexual tension. But in general she wasn't giving me much eye contact. I asked her what she did. Then I told her to guess what I did. She gave me a shit test saying "I guess talking to random strangers", now this came out of nowhere and I haven't gotten shit tests like this in months so I kind off fumbled here and just told her it was nice to meet you and said good bye. One thing I did today was matching her body language which helped. Went back to the previous location. This location was still dead. But I did see a few sets, one single set I approached was smiling and saying thank you but she said she wasn't interested. But I still kept talking to her and even she stood and talked to me. We talked a little bit then I wanted to ask her some compliance but didn't know what to. But then she told me she was a data analyst I asked her what kind of data did she analyse. She asked me if I wanted to know technical details or other details. Saw an opportunity to compliance so replied "everything". Now she thought for a second and said Sorry I have a boyfriend. I then said good to meet you and bye.

 

[tornado]

Today I had an opportunity to try indirect game. But I didn't do it. I saw this girl in grocery store. I thought of opening her with "Do you know where is X(some grocery name)" But how could I stack forward from this? An observational transition like "Your glasses look real nerdy. Are you into science or something?" ?? Would it work?

I have also used opinion openers mid conversation during day game before. And they worked. But then felt that these were made for night game so I stopped using them even though they worked. Maybe I should start implementing them once again. But I need some transition to ask her the opinion. For example what if we are talking about groceries, her glasses and her shirt because of some observation I made then how do I transition to my opinion opener? In the past I have done it with simple "Can I get your opinion on something? (She replies yes). If a guy is dating a girl and then a girl goes out and makes out with another guy, is it cheating?". It has worked in the past but do I need a smooth transition to run this opener?

 

[OldGuy]

If something works, use it. It does not matter if it was designed for another style of game.

 

[Ratata]

Couldn't go out because of work. Lost my momentum and I will have to build it from scratch. Will be going out tomorrow.


What did Ratata mean by this line? What does he mean by easier ways?

What I mean, is that there may be more natural ways of meeting women, more chill ways of doing things, that require far less energy and determination; where you do not have to go out of your way to learn how to do it, where you do no have to pump yourself into state before doing it, or motivate yourself to go out there, and where the let-down is far more forgiving, and far less brutal. (With that said, part of avoiding hard rejections anywhere is in learning how to behave, particularly in terms of outcome independence, since all dumb behaviour will be punished hard by women, and rightfully so IMHO.)

"Daygame" - at least the version where guys try to pick up girls on the highs-treet - is seduction on hard mode. Yes, you can "meet more women" this way, but can you bag them? Can you woo them? What I'm saying is that you need to learn a very specific set of skills, as any street hustler or salesman knows, in order to master such a stressful environment. And by stressful I mean that most people there are going from A to B trying to reach something, so you pestering them will not help that situation. But sure, if you master this, you can do it anywhere, amirite?

Just by modifying some small things for that one scenario, you can get into way more relaxed situations. Just be simply removing yourself from the high-street, and into a more relaxed scene, say a park or a beach or a bookstore, you've now change the variables in your favour way more than by trying to stop a busy hottie trying to get to her next photoshoot without getting hassled on the way there. Just that one small change of scenario changes the pace and the vibe of the whole ordeal. But guys wanna be guys, and only the cool kids bag girls on the highstreet? I mean, if that'1s what you really want to be, then go do it, but... Just know that you don't have to.