Guidance Needed

[Mike1960]

Hi,

Folks , I need some guidance and basically want to check if my interpretation is right. Alright so here is this girl whom I have been texting for the past couple of days - not much just casual. After 2 days , I have asked her out for Lunch. Her response is not in complete denial but given that I am a little new to this game , I am a touch confused what she wants to convey. The conversation about Lunch went quite like this :

Me : Your cooking schedule for tomorrow needs a well deserved rest. How about a quick Lunch with me ?

( I gave her a couple of options for the hangout place but also did mention that I am open to what she prefers)

She: Sure , give me sometime and I will confirm with you.

Then I waited and gave her time. But , after about 5-6 hours I checked again because I had to be sure she was gonna come or not and i could adjust my office timings accordingly. So here is her reply.

She : hey sorry! Me was busy with some family time. I think its gonna be tuff for tomorrow as i have some plans and i get a max of 30 mins for lunch and it would be tuff to manage. We can catch up after office hours on some day.

Me: you know what? you have snatched the words from my mouth and put it there. I totally forgot i have signed up for a weekly once friday lunchtime volunteering thing. You have got your wish. After office hours it is then. I will check with you next week about the day

She: hehehe.. sure

Now interesting to note - she said a 'Sure- Let me confirm in sometime' and then totally changed her mind and acted as if she forgot it . In reality , I am sure she dint.

I need help from you guys to help understand if i am reading this right . Comments welcome.

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Mike,

In reality , I am sure she dint.

She's most likely setting you in the chasing position.

Me : Your cooking schedule for tomorrow needs a well deserved rest. How about a quick Lunch with me ?
She: Sure , give me sometime and I will confirm with you.

A girl telling you that she will confirm, it sounds so much like deja vu, again and again. 90 pct of the time she won't answer, and you will be obliged to chase her for an answer - sounds like exactly what you ended up doing. She gets leverage on you and sets you to chase her. You don't want to be in this position. You, chasing her, is the death of attraction. So if this happens, you're much better off by turning it down yourself:

She: Sure , give me sometime and I will confirm with you.
You: Hey if you're busy it's fine. Let's do it another day!"

You withdraw, and try again after a few days. Now, I find it usually better to float the idea with her and gauge her reaction, before getting to specific plans:

You: Hey we should meet some time!
Her: Sounds great!
You: How about tomorrow at lunch time?

This:

( I gave her a couple of options for the hangout place but also did mention that I am open to what she prefers)

is another (small) mistake. You are surrendering decision (leadership) to her, girls normally don't like it. You're the man, you lead, meaning you pick an option and let her know smoothly.

She : hey sorry! Me was busy with some family time. I think its gonna be tuff for tomorrow as i have some plans and i get a max of 30 mins for lunch and it would be tuff to manage. We can catch up after office hours on some day.
Me: you know what? you have snatched the words from my mouth and put it there. I totally forgot i have signed up for a weekly once friday lunchtime volunteering thing. You have got your wish. After office hours it is then. I will check with you next week about the day
She: hehehe.. sure

The scenario is now set for repetition. She set you in the chasing position. Next week, you're going to ask her what day she's available, and she will be in a comfortable position to repeat the same game.

Surprise her! Don't come back to her, leave her in silence. For now, and also next week. She will be growing the expectation of you coming back, so let her expect it, and surprise her by not doing it. The week *after that*, contact her again from scratch as if nothing happened. Something like this:

You: Hey! How about we meet some time?
Her: Sounds cool!
You: Well, they are cool happy hours at *XXX bar* right after office time. How about Wednesday 5:30pm?

This way, you're non chasey, mysterious, unpredictable. Plus, you lead her according to your goals. Much better than the opposite.

Cheers,
Seppuku

 

[Mike1960]

Thanks a lot, Seppuku. I have to admit my inexperience showing there. But , I am loving every bit of learning I am getting. Your explanation is so nicely worded with a touch of common sense. I will follow your advise and come back with the report.

Just a quick doubt : Having read the exchange of messages , what is your view on the 'interest' part. Do you think she is genuinely interested in the meet-up but wants to put me in the chasing role from the start?

Would love to hear your opinion on this.

 

[Seppuku]

Hard to say just from what you write.

I would say, she's testing you, so all is still possible. But remember that with the girls the windows don't remain open very long. Especially if you're chasing Don't let her put you in this position.

And you're absolutely welcome, I'm happy to help!

Seppuku

 

[Mike1960]

But Seppuku - I have a small confusion now. In your previous post you brought the 'surprise' element into the picture by skipping the next week and go for the week after. It is understandable - sort of an 'undo' to correct my earlier mistakes and put her in the position of chasing and me in not-needy/not-desperate bracket.

In this post though, you have said window isnt open for too long. Per your experiences, 2 weeks is fine for a window?

 

[Seppuku]

But Seppuku - I have a small confusion now. In your previous post you brought the 'surprise' element into the picture by skipping the next week and go for the week after. It is understandable - sort of an 'undo' to correct my earlier mistakes and put her in the position of chasing and me in not-needy/not-desperate bracket.

In this post though, you have said window isnt open for too long. Per your experiences, 2 weeks is fine for a window?

Hey Mike,

It's a very valid comment. I think that with a good non-needy text game, it is possible to "keep" her for a little while.

Once you hit the "I will let you know" response, you're in a difficult place anyway. If you come back to her with another date proposition just now, you've got to hope she'll not repeat the scenario again, because then it will be really in limbo. Plus, while doing so, you'll be behaving like the dozens of other guys chasing her ass. Just another one of them.

The alternative, leaving her in silence for a while, runs the risk of expiring window. But it also offers several advantages:

• * You're not behaving according to her script
  * You're high value, busy man, and not chasing her ass. Maybe because you have other options?
  * You're clearly not afraid of losing her

Also, if she likes you, you may have the pleasant surprise to see her coming back to you, before you do. If this happens, then you immediately suggest an after work date.

Now, if you don't want to be fully silent for two weeks (which I understand), here is a softer version of option two. Keep her in silence until next week, then fire off a ping text message like "Hey, how is it going?" with a little catch up conversation, but *no reference* to the expected second proposition - for now. She expects it, just surprise her, and only propose later.

Ideally you don't want to let yourself put in the "I will let you know" situation in the first place. Either way, you risk losing her anyway. Pick your option and make sure it's your decision. But if it was me, with the knowledge of seduction I have acquired now, I would go for the second option anytime.

Seppuku
PS. Is 1960 your birth year? I'm 1969

 

[Mike1960]

Update - all instructions followed as given.

Just one "hey!! How's it goin? " message on Wednesday from my end which she replied promptly. No other texts. Gone quiet from my end completely.

Today morning I receive a forwarded joke that I am reading more as an indirect way of throwing in a conversation starter to push for a meet up today as it's weekend. Just a 'Lol' from my end.

Seppuku - your inputs are welcome.

 

[Seppuku]

She was pinging you, likely testing your frame. This is a positive sign. Now just resume normal texting with her, little back and forth, then suggest an after-office date, just like nothing happened.

It's best to setup the date within 48 hours - to avoid any awkwardness, and any change in moods. If you get the date, that's when the escalation window really starts in my opinion! Make sure you have a date plan, i.e. an idea of your plan to take her to bed!

 

[Mike1960]

Update - did the back and forth thing and it worked like a charm. She agreed for the meet right away with no ifs and buts. Gonna meet this Thursday after office.

Now, I know the deep-dive and moving fast with women concepts pretty well. But, sometimes on a date, I do tend run into those famous painful silences. What's the best way to tackle that?

Thanks Seppuku!.

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Mike,

Glad it worked. She's used to naive needy guys baiting into her chase framing, and you behaved in a way she didn't expect you to do, bypassing her scripts, surprising her, non chasey, no insecurity. This is the frame you need to keep, always!

Now, I know the deep-dive and moving fast with women concepts pretty well. But, sometimes on a date, I do tend run into those famous painful silences. What's the best way to tackle that?

The content of what is said during the date does not matter. What matters is to set a good mood, good connection. Making her talk is a good way to achieve this. What's her work, how many brothers sisters, how long she's been in this city, what were her university years like, whatever crosses your mind. You don't have to be talking much. Listen to what she says, let her speak, interrupt her and jump in with questions, and control the flow of conversation.

If you run out of topics, here's a classic one to make her talk again and again: her ex boyfriend. How long together, how was it, how did she meet him, what went wrong, etc... If you feel it, try asking how was the sex.

Most important, as she speaks, touch her. Incidentally first. See her reaction to your touch. If she accepts your touch, just become bolder and bolder with your touch. Her hair, her face, her belly, her legs. Etc... (sometimes I even get to touch her boobs and ass. Everything goes with the right sexy mood). All this, in the background, as she keeps speaking.

Also, it's nice to have pictures to show on your phone, if there are blanks in conversation. You can improvise a selfie session with her, too, good chance to put your arm around her.

It's an after-work meeting, try to gauge her availability for the same evening. My favorite dating plan is to follow up with a dinner at home. She comes, helps with the cooking, you guys have dinner. Escalation for dessert ;-) Just an idea. If she's not available, propose her a dinner at your place for another time. Same story, you float the idea first, see how she reacts, then go for a specific time and setup logistics.

Hoping to read your news soon.

Cheers,
Seppuku

 

[Mike1960]

Interesting and very well-written thoughts there Seppuku. I am becoming your fan everyday.

I have a few questions about the female mindset.

1. What mindset do women come with usually in such meets?

2. Do they have expectations?

3. Does she understand by now that I am hitting on her because I have not said anything explicitly?

4. Some of the questions you have mentioned are interesting and force her to reveal her true personality. But wouldn't those 'bore' her ? Now, I am 100% percent sure those questions work which is why all the top seducers use them a lot. But I just want to understand your perspective on it I. E. Why it works?

 

[Seppuku]

Interesting and very well-written thoughts there Seppuku. I am becoming your fan everyday.

Thanks man

I have a few questions about the female mindset.

the most important is actually *your* mindset. Put this simple truth in your mind, and internalize it: "Girls just want to be fucked by you". I'm serious. That's all there is. She wants it, but just cannot make it too easy, because that would be slutty.

1. What mindset do women come with usually in such meets?
2. Do they have expectations?

They are just mirrors, and will just reflect whatever you bring with you to the date. You're the one that will shape her expectations. She will follow wherever you lead her. Make sure you lead her to the right place. Namely your bed ;-)

However it is every girl's secret dream to meet the Man that will swipe her on her feet. Be that man.

3. Does she understand by now that I am hitting on her because I have not said anything explicitly?

Of course. She is well aware that this is a date. No "hide the banana" strategy here. Your banana is already out there in the open. She knows your banana is here, so you best act like you know she knows, and acknowledge the banana. LOL. Absolutely serious. Now replace banana with "the possibility of sex".

4. Some of the questions you have mentioned are interesting and force her to reveal her true personality. But wouldn't those 'bore' her ? Now, I am 100% percent sure those questions work which is why all the top seducers use them a lot. But I just want to understand your perspective on it I. E. Why it works?

Again, what is actually discussed doesn't matter in itself. What matters is that she feels the bond with you, feels emotionally comfortable with you, feels physically comfortable with you (your touch). It's your goal tomorrow. No need to lose time interpreting the signs and deciding if she likes. Remember, she accepted the date, it means she already likes you.

Good luck tomorrow!
Seppuku

 

[Mike1960]

Guys quick inputs needed.

Girl texted morning to confirm if we are meeting as I had gone silent . I gave a firm yes but in a funny way.

Now a small change from her side - she will not be eating anything due to some fasting sort of thing. So , I have to eat alone and good thing is she is very keen on the meet from her tone.

 

[Seppuku]

She's sending the anti-flake text very good. She seems super excited.

Who cares if she eats or not. Make sure you have a date plan.

Enjoy!
Sepuku

 

[Mike1960]

Last minute changes from her end - " gonna be late by an hour due to unexpected work". I have agreed for now. What do I do if I don't get a positive response after 6 as well.

 

[Mike1960]

Update - date was excellent. Laughed and talked like craz for a couple of hours. She did most of the talking and I made sure I am a good listener. I did throw in a bit of flirty compliments here and there to which i got a very positive response.

Now, me being a beginner I want to focus on getting my fundamentals right for now. Another step in the positive direction after working on my walking style , clothes and etiquette.

Second date with a nother lady coming up in a couple of days. Keep you all posted. This will serve as a good reference to all newbies.

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Mike,

Glad to hear. Well done!

Laughed and talked like craz for a couple of hours. She did most of the talking and I made sure I am a good listener. I did throw in a bit of flirty compliments here and there to which i got a very positive response.

Good! My advice on date, touch, touch, touch. It works magic.

Second date with another lady coming up in a couple of days.

It's good to take as many dates as possible. Each date is a reference point. With many reference points you start to see patterns of behaviors. You start to see how much into you she is. You learn to calibrate your game accordingly.

Back to this particular girl, be aware that, from now on, your escalation window with this particular girl is ticking. She's excited about you, now she expects you (more or less consciously) to step things up - namely sexual stage. If you don't reach there soon enough, window closed. It's the hard reality of girls attraction mechanisms.

Keep in mind that your results will start to skyrocket when you gain the confidence to bring her to bed on first date. When you get this sort of confidence, consistently, you will observe a very different dynamics with the girls around you. From personal experience, it really works as advertised here!

So if you feel you're not there yet, make it a personal goal to get there.

OK Mike, good work!
Cheers,
Seppuku

 

[Mike1960]

You have an incredible foresight to things Seppuku.

Now , coming back to the first girl , I found her very talkative and comfortable in opening up to me about various things - her life, family , education, job and friends. And my undelrstanding is she is NOT a reserved or shy person but also NOT someone who can just walk up to people and make friends right away - something which I am good at.

A couple of good things I did and I found her show a positive reaction :

1. I flirted with the lady at the counter while doing the payment and that definitely impressed my date. This is how it went :

Me to the lady at payment counter : hey !! Meet my freind xxxxxx.
Lady at counter: Hi, you guys having fun I c.
My date: what? Do you guys know each other.
Me: yeah we do... v r long time friends ...we know each other since the last 10...( a pause)... seconds ... I did a little eyeblink to the lady at the counter while saying this.

Both burst out laughing.

Me. See there !! you guys have a new friend in your life from today. And I get 2 beautiful ladies forever.

Both burst out laughing.

2. While having food my date asked me how come you were so confident while talking to her? I smiled and said I was just natural.

3. Then again she asked - have you been here earlier? You ordered the food so confidently? I said this is first time I am coming here. I did my homework before coming. She was laughing.

I am a strong believer in the mantra "right process + strong fundamentals + skills = results" . Let me know if there are any mistakes I am making there.

Also, how do I go about fixing the second meet up?

Thanks for your inputs. I am excited like a small kid whenever I see your response. There is just so many good things to learn from you.

Regards,
Mike

PS: NO, I am a 92 born

 

[Mike1960]

Update - texted for a second meet. She responded she is busy with some events she had mentioned earlier and won't be possible. And , here comes the interesting part:

Me : I will check with you the week after.
Her: yup... I will try if possible for the next week.

Need inputs on how do I go about tackling this from here.

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Mike,

It seems you created the right flirty, sexy vibe. This, plus the conversation thing where she does most of the talking, are essential to make her feel connected. HOWEVER these nice feelings will be lost if you do not capitalize on them right away. And you do that by moving the interaction forward. Like Chase said, ultimately what this is, is a mating dance, and the ultimate goal is the bed. Make no mistake, she expects it, too. If you don't take things forward you will eventually lose her. This happens sometimes right after the first date, sometimes after the second, or more. Also, the better seducer you become, the shorter the time window. So if you were very good, your time window may be shorter than what you think.

The take away is never assume there will be a second date. Ideally, you conclude everything on the first date.

Your first date, you get the good vibe, she laughs at your joke, she's comfortable with your touch, she's super talkative. One or two hours of face time. You pick up the tab (or split it). You propose to move to your place under any excuse (have a dinner, or get drinks, or listen to some music, or show her your cat, or whatever). You take her home, make her comfortable again, get closer, escalate her. You two have a great fuck, she leaves your home with a huge smile on her face. That's how you capitalize on the good feelings you created on the date.

Now, to your text messages. It seems a little tricky. You text for a second meet, she says she's busy, alright so far. But this:

Me : I will check with you the week after.
Her: yup... I will try if possible for the next week.

doesn't help. Instead of being in doubt, she now expects you to be texting her. And you're again in position of chaser, which is no, no, no. Much better to leave her in doubt and not mention if you ever going to ask her again. Tension, always. So, same strategy, leave her in silence. Let her expect your text. Later into the next week, you come back by floating the idea "hey we should meet some time" and see her reaction.

This is trying to fix things, again. Better not to have to set a second date. Better not to set yourself in chasing position. It's going to be harder and harder to salvage.

But if you get the second date (it's not granted) you cannot count on the good feelings you created the first time (feelings come and go), so you will have to build the good vibe again. This time, be prepared to take her home.

Cheers,
Seppuku
PS. In the time this whole thread took place, I brought three new girls to bed, all on first date. It works, and it's incredibly easy.