Aggressiveness and lack of effort make the difference?

[Prehistoric]

Hello folks. I am back to "the game" after some weeks of rest.

I started where I left. Gradually reducing my super-nice/friendly/clownish/social buttefly side and developing a more aggressive/confident/manly/cockily-humorous/self-validated side.

By aggressive I don't mean jerk or violent. I mean tough and not to bullied around.

So I was at this social event organised by a friend's company where I know almost nobody. At one point I was sitting at the table between a quite nice blonde girl (ok face, top body) and this old guy. This girl was at the event with another man, which I doubt being her boyfriend. I have the impression he's one who's kinda chasing her.

I was very very very very pulled back, making very witty or humorously provocative remarks. Sometimes turning my attention to this girl but NEVER looking for reactions, often engaging in long conversations with this nice old fella. The man this girl was with, instead, was often trying to begin the conversation with her in a way that wasn't exactly needy but surely reaction-seeking. Most importantly he was trying to impress her, which I wasn't.

I wasn't actually putting many expectations in this evening but at one point I couldn't help notice:

1) the blonde girl sitting next to me was staring at me OFTEN when she thought I wasn't looking (I trained my peripheral view a lot)
2) an asian girl on the other side of the table was staring at me too.
3) a canadian girl on the other side of the table was lauhging at every thing that I said.

It was kinda strange, because I was doing LESS EFFORT than ever before in my life, but getting much more positive behaviour from women.

The dinner ended. we were all on our wait out of this sort of restaurant. The blonde girl goes out with "her date" (if that's how u wanna call him) and I start talking with the canadian girl in front of the door. She's very enthusiastic in her talking with me. The blonde girls comes back in and actively joins the conversation again. We talk again for some time and the canadian girl goes away. I make a remark about her ring which she particularly likes.

We are out now. I see this guy is still there waiting for the hot blonde to go with him. I realise it would be weird to make a move with him standing right there, so I say: "hey I am going to say bye to the canadian girl because we kinda interrupted her conversation before", I go back in, I hug her kinda naturally, she responds very warmly.

I go back out, and say bye to the blonde girl (who seems very sad to see me go) and her date.

The next day I add both the blonde and the canadian girl on FB, not really thinking of making a move on either of them (I would have on the canadian one if she hadn't been the event organiser, and I didn't wanna spoil the possibility of being invited to future events where I could meet more girls, was my move to go wrong) and then the most unexpected thing happen: this blonde girls writes me 1 hour after adding me, telling me she was very sad we couldn't talk more. she even gives me her number without me asking. I ask her out. She reacts very very warmly and enthusiastically, so I am going out with her probably later this week.

I have had already some success since I started pick up in November, but never a hot girl agreed to meet with me so easily and warmly.

Now this whole thing was unexpected, but it's allowing me to understand Chase's chapter on "the law of the least effort" more practically. I have the feeling that with good fundamentals you really don't have to do a lot of moves, if any.

 

[Drck]

I have the feeling that with good fundamentals you really don't have to do a lot of moves, if any

>>>>
Agreed, once a guy has good fundamentals and good frame, there is not much to do as far as seduction. All you have to do is to "be around" girls, show that you like girls, that you like sex and are not ashamed of it. Then push for sex, especially when the windows opens. It is actually very simple.

Of course it is impossible to do it for most guys who don't have much experience, at first even understanding the concept can be quite difficult. I think it is because most of us started in "chasing" mode - we put girls on pedestals, we tried to prove ourselves to them, we tried to understand how their mind works, we did everything possible so we can finally seduce them... In essence, all this is "trying hard" which has the exact opposite effect then all of us desire, at least at the beginning.

Chasing girls is simply in our blood, it is exciting, nobody told us any better. Everybody is chasing. Non-chasing is very difficult. You want to do stuff, you want to grab a phone and text her. You want to go see her again. You are built to do some actions but instead you only wait and wait. You wait one day, two days, three days you wait and nothing is happening. Blood in your body is boiling, some action is needed, but you don't chase. You can't. You feel miserable because you don't do anything. How boring is to do nothing? It is fucking boring. At least if you had Abundance Mentality so you don't have to think about her, but you don't. Only if you were lucky enough you would have that Abundance Mentality. But you are not lucky, just another reason why to think miserable about yourself. Will you ever see her again? Everything you did was just great, the vibes were great, there was a great connection - is it even possible that she doesn't care about such great guy like yourself? And you wait more, you feel miserable about yourself some more. Fucking slaves with chains around their legs feel more free than you. And then it comes, it comes but only if you are lucky enough: Hey, how have you been? Finally, she sends some text... Time for fucking actions!

It is like this: (1) You improve yourself as a man, you put your life in order, and you do manly things. You simply present yourself as a man who has a life and who is not dependent on women. Pedestal is removed, her value drops, your self esteem rises, and your value in her eyes raises way above hers. You da man! (2) You setup your dominant frame. You go for actions. You move her here and there, you suggest where to go and when. You keep deciding and you keep moving her closer and closer to your bed. You lead her to the bed with least possible effort. You move two steps forward, she pushes one step back. You move three steps forward, she pulls two steps back. Whatever, give her a break, let her relax. And now you do five steps forward. And you keep pushing forward and forward, there is simply no coming back. This puts you in charge and she will eventually start following your lead. Damn, your value rises even higher! (3) You show desire for sex, you get physical and you push for sex. Of course you capitalize on it when you get the opportunity. She sees you are exciting and sexy guy, and of course she also likes sex. Now you look like a man who desires sex but is perfectly ok if he doesn't get it with her. Now you look like sexy MF who will get laid - with or without her. Your value just tripled! (4) You don't chase. Never. Don't rely on luck, just don't chase. You simply show her great time and great sex when she is around, and she gets nothing when she's gone. Now she knows you are not needy and clingy, now she knows you are truly independent and mature guy who can walk away from her anytime he wants. Congratulations, your value just quadrupled.

 

[Prehistoric]

Tnx Drck, ur answers are always great.

I am starting to get the difference between chasing and leading, which is two entirely different ways of making moves. Leading happens when you have already established yourself as dominant, independent, non-needy, non-chasing man, which often involves an initial period of displaying value without making moves. Then you just propose and move things for your own entertainment and will and not for seeking reactions/approval from her. It's basically the position from which you move which is entirely different.

As you say it's kinda tough at the beginning. She's sending me some very warm, long texts and I have to make an effort to keep on answering like the evening we met (pulled back, relaxed, not in a hurry, positive but not overly enthusiastic like somebody who never gets laid and that's his only chance). It's tough because family and society train us to think to get more you have give more, while in reality attraction is generated by showing power but not giving it. U give her fun and sex, but not ur value and power, which are exclusively your own.

I'll try to maintain and strengthen this mindset on my date with this woman and with the women I'll keep on meeting.

 

[Drck]

See, there is a problem with being in "seduction" mode or mind set. Our mind is basically trying to seduce that girl (duh), it is trying to find out ways how to get her. Our mind is thinking about different possible ways how to get laid. Our mind is thinking about this possibility and that possibility. Our mind is thinking what to do and say now in order to move forward.

Because of being in that mode, we are kind of blinded at the same time. She may give us a window but we don't see it because we are busy thinking - well, how to recognize her window...

Example:
I contacted some girl on POF, simply telling her that she looks like an interesting person and I like her profile, and in stead of explaining myself on the web we can just meet for a couple of minutes. So I suggested action.

There was nothing on my profile btw, just a hint that in stead of reading my profile we should meet (meeting = action).

She replies back, asks me for pics and says that she will send more of her pics next time. So I wait couple of days and send her my pic, and I ask her for more of her pics. Then she waits some 2 weeks. Ok, she sends an email, explaining that she is a busy professional, working, blah blah, no big deal, who cares anyway. She doesn't send any of her pics in email as she promised, but she just says something in a sense that I could be a great person. Doesn't say anything about meeting me either, as I previously suggested (2x).

So my mind starts rolling, it starts thinking about how to cleverly ask for more of her pics, and how to ask her for date while not appearing needy. My mind is thinking how to suggest sexi-ness without talking about it. It thinks that I should write something intelligent since she is a professional thus most likely expect to meet intelligent people only. My mind is just rolling and rolling, coming up with different possibilities...

See, right there is the fucking problem of such thinking. The mind is in seduction mode, it tries to seduce, it tries to discover clever ways to get laid, it tries to mirror other people (that particular woman) thinking so it can understand them...

But I took my own advice: Screw such thinking. Screw her pictures, screw sexiness, and screw nice and intelligent texts. Screw how I look, screw how I approach, screw what I say and screw confidence. How about the action, I am thinking now, so I send her a text: How about I meet you at XYZ, is Tuesday good for you?

That is it. One simple sentence. Action and nothing else (action suggested 3x time)

I can't that day, she replies couple of days later, but I'm fine on Fr or Sa. Of course she doesn't want to give up her power. Not yet. She wants to keep her choices open, she wants to snow that she is still in charge by choosing another days...

And that is it. Now she is already in submissive mode. You go to meet her and your frame is already set. Now you appear like a man of actions (because you persistently pushed for actions), now she expects to meet a man who pushes things forward and fast (instead of focusing on sexy talking and acting sexy, trying to create impression of confidence or great communicator, and all the other crap associated with seduction). What will be next? she is asking herself. Next will be another action, I am answering. There is no stopping. Who cares if I look sexy? I'm just a simple man, all I want from that woman is to get laid, fast, quick and with no headache... How many more actions? she is asking herself again. As many as it takes to get her to the bed in the fastest way, is the answer...

Even fucking Caveman would be envious of such simple thinking!