Arguments Tactics

[Smurf]

One of the reasons I'm so conflicted in my views is because I suck at arguing. I can never find the reasons in my head to justify what I'm saying in the heat of the moment. So I was going to ask you guys (article worthy?),

Do you have any argument tactics or ways to win arguments?

Jake.

 

[Nuncle]

This is something I have been thinking about recently, in part assisted by some of the material on this site.

Here are my tips:

1) Be aware of the other person's frame control attempts and don't accept them (eg. "You can't argue with that, Jake" "I don't want to hear about x this time, Jake"). There is a post on this in the forum by Chase. https://boards.girlschase.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&t=60
2) When dealing with a forceful opponent visualise yourself as an army receiving a fierce charge. Previously it sounds as if you may have been the equivalent of an untrained local militia that breaks and runs as soon as things get scary. Instead visualise yourself as veteran professional troops that stand firm in all circumstances
3) If there is a gap in your opponent's logic that seems obvious to you don't assume your opponent is aware of it. It may not be obvious to him so point it out. It may floor him.
4) Force yourself to keep your head up.
5) Remain calm but stick to your guns.
6) If you are starting to win your opponent may temporarily become more friendly to disarm you. Watch out for this.
7) Don't retreat into a comical persona for the argument. Remain serious even if your opponent attempts to patronise you. You are under no obligation to play the role they assign to you.
8) Look up the article on Social Styles. If you fall into the "Amiable" category, such people have particular problems when it comes to arguing as they don't like displeasing people. This might help you understand yourself better (as it did for me).

 

[Smurf]

Thanks for the insight Nuncle!

I feel part of it is me not staying in the moment and feeling out whoever I'm arguing with.

Jake.

 

[Richard]

Simple,

Don't argue. Arguing just strengthens the resolve of both people, and no progress is made.

Instead, you have a few alternate options depending on the situation.

You can:

1. Agree with the Truth and restate your opinion, like so:

My dad: "Ricky, if you go out tonight and drink, there's gonna be Hell to pay tomorrow!"
Me: "Yeah, you're probably right dad. But I enjoy nights full of fun and excitement and I can't wait to get going."

You can also:

2. Agree with your argument-ers right to their opinion, like so:

My dad: "If you keep procrastinating your studies, you'll end up in a dead-end job."
Me: "I can understand why you might feel that way Padre, but I enjoy having some time to focus on my hobbies as well."

What happens when fire meets fire? The fire expands and grows more out of control.

What happens when you meet fire with fluid water? The fire is subdued, weakened, and eventually falls to the water.

 

[Smurf]

I understand what you're saying, Richard, but I'm talking about things like feminist arguments, classroom arguments (like "should someone do this or this" and "ideal relationships", we do that a lot in my class). I find at my school at least that the feminist girls are full of shit and aren't even feminist themselves. Unfortunately, these girls end up in my class a lot so I feel I must defend my own opinions.

Jake.

 

[Richard]

You are defending your own opinion, just not in a way that offends your opponent.

What happens when you disrespect someone, or offend someone? What do they do? They try as equally hard to disrespect or offend you, which causes you to try equally as hard... and so on and so forth.

The problem with arguing is that people's objective changes in the midst of arguing, it's no longer about getting your point across, it merely becomes about "winning."

However, by acknowledging your opponent's view you aren't being submissive in yours, you're simply acknowledging the fact that another view exists, then they'll reciprocate.

How about a more relatable example for ya

Feminist argument: "Macho-ism is so stupid, and degrading to women! We had to fight and protest for the right's that you men were naturally given! I'm so repulsed by how male chauvinistic pigs continue to treat us women like objects instead of equals! After all... (her argument continues)."

Me: "I can totally see why you would feel that way, and if you'd listen for a minute and allow me to explain my side, you might get a new perspective on things. (then continue to your view)"

An argument is no different than another no matter where it takes place.

-Richard

 

[Desert Eagle]

https://www.girlschase.com/content/brain ... -arguments
https://www.girlschase.com/content/refer ... worldviews

I'd definitely take Chase's advice over anyone's. Being the county champion in debating is a good credential for this sort of stuff.

 

[Nuncle]

One further thought:

Do you actually suck at arguing? Or have you taken one bad experience, correlated it with a few from your past and built up a falsely pessoimistic picture, maybe even editing out times where you have been unsuccessful?

In the example you mention with the feminists this can be a very easy situation in which to lose.

Feminists are often stereotyped as lunatics who just randomly hate men because they get a kick out of it. Obviously there is more to it than that. At the very least they by definition know a lot about their subject (which is feminism) and they also have at least some valid points and solid reasoning for thinking the way they do. The first time one comes up against it this can be a shock, therefore, if you were assuming them just to be a bunch of malevolent simpletons.

The same thing can happen with other groups where the reality is more complex than the stereotype - vegans, communists, religious people you name it.