"attraction expiration" vs being too quick & needy

[mkivtt]

I ran into a HB9 at her place of work over a month ago, flirted/talked for 30 mins and left. Later, I decided she was nice to pass up and returned for a #. I got it and we went for a same day quickie 30 min coffee "date."

That was 4 weeks ago. Since then we've been mailing and texting, and last weekend I called her. She's not able to meet until next week, but seems engaged and interested (she proposed the coffee). Technically, she's muslim, although she's 95% similar to any American girl. Those 4 weeks she's been observing Ramadan which ended today.

Here's my question.

She was really into me, but I'm worried about maintaining the attraction. I know Chase has an article on "attraction has an expiration date" where he writes to strike while the iron is hot, don't wait, ask her out on a high, etc. I fully agree with that and, despite her still responding to every txt after 4 wks, can feel the interest fading for both of us. However, the other concern is "needy."

Do I text or call immediately tomorrow, or call Sunday? I don't want to appear needy by calling/texting immediately, but also don't want to play it too casual and risk losing more interest by only calling Sunday and maybe risk her already having plans for next weekend too.

Here's the last 2 weeks:

last week Tue: nice text exchange.
Last week Fri: nice text exchange.
Last week Sun: spoke on the phone.
This Tue: 2-3 texts, nothing worth mentioning.
Today: 1 quick text to congratulate her on completing Ramadan.

It's been "low volume" as I dread being seen as needy. However, I do want to set up something for next week, or it'll be waaay too long since we met.

So - when would you text or call - Fri, or Sun? It might not even really matter which, but I'm just looking for opinions.

 

[Marty]

Hey mkivtt, this article by Ricardus covers quite a lot of material that overlaps with your questions, though it obviously doesn't address exactly the same issue directly:

https://www.girlschase.com/content/how-long-wait-calling-or-texting-her

There's another one somewhere also by Ricardus, which states that attraction will start to expire after a certain number of hours of cumulative face-time, I think it was 3 or 4, unfortunately you can't seem to search by article author, and I can't find it.

 

[Estate]

Here is all I can sum this up with.

There is a myth in PUA circles that with "game" a guy can get ANY girl he wants. It's simply not true. Life happens and people have different circumstances. With good game you boost your chances exponentially but there will be some girls you get and some you don't. Chase even mentions it in a few articles how as you gain more experience you begin to read women and can tell which ones are open to approaching or taking home, thus you approach and get these girls and are rejected less.

Now, with that in mind... lets look at quick escalation vs. being needy.
It all boils down to... DOES SHE WANT IT???

Look at it this way... you've been chatting to a girl at the bar for 5 minutes... You put your hand on her arm. What is her reaction?
She can smile and keep chatting and be open to the touch or she can look at your hand and tighten up.
In the first case, she is into you, in the second she is not.

Could you have changed the bad reaction into a good one with better game? Yes, there's every likelihood that you could have but these are the signs you have to learn to read. When you escalate quickly, you do it because you KNOW the girl infront of you is open to it. If you escalate quickly and she is not comfortable with it, then it is too quick and comes off needy.

It comes with experience, you learn to read the signs.

 

[Marty]

PS: my mistake, you can search by author. I didn't find what I was looking for, but here are a couple more very useful ones by Ricardus on the same subject:

https://www.girlschase.com/content/text-girls-success-phone-secrets-part-i
https://www.girlschase.com/content/what-text-girls-get-dates

 

[mountaingoat]

To be honest, I do not really believe that attraction has an expiration date. If that were true, marriage would not be possible. Long term relationships would never occur. And yet both do. I know plenty of women who have chased for years. I know men who have women still texting them years later. Attraction may have an expiration date for hookups and sex-centric relationships, but I find that the theory is patently absurd in a broad context. One of my friends has been escalating interest in a guy for months and is so upset that they live far apart. According to the theory presented on this site, that would not occur.

Now, on the other hand, dont give yourself too much hope. Sometimes, people do lose interest, or decide that its not worth the effort, even if they are still attracted.

 

[mkivtt]

Follow up question.... this girl is driving me crazy. After 4 weeks not being able meet "because of Ramadan," I texted her Saturday and she readily agreed to a lunch date this week. Today she texts me she's probably in training all week in another town. WTF? She must've known that Saturday.

I feel this whole thing falling apart. The attraction we felt in person is no longer present; it's been over 4 weeks since we last met. Heck I can't even be bothered to text her flirty stuff anymore every few days (we had some awesome cocky/funny flirty texting up to early last week). I want to set up a date this week or feel it's over.

When she texted today, she said she'd confirm once she got to work at 1pm. The afternoon comes and goes with no message. Then I get this weird message at 7pm from a strange number "this is my new number. <her name>." Nothing more. Nothing to work with, no confirmation whether she is or isn't going to training. Some weird ass number too, with an area code 1400 miles away. Maybe it's some google voice or something that she can easily monitor and bar. However why would she even bother? Ignoring me a few times would do the trick and I would stop contacting her. And she's always responded to everything I've sent up to this point. I haven't been needy, haven't sent her shitty "what's up" AFC stuff, kept it low volume instead of flooding her daily with stupid messages.

I feel like a freaking chump if I have to text her again to once again come up with something interesting and then yet again ask what her schedule is. I just don't want to do it again. However, she is really attractive and when we met in person before, had mad chemistry. So I don't want to just next her. If I call, I lose value, but I also feel like if I don't, it'll be over again this week anyway.

I think I'll call her tomorrow or Wednesday (this whole texting thing just hasn't been working for setting up dates with her). If she doesn't answer, or comes up with some other excuse, I'll move on.

Suggestions on how to better handle this?

 

[mkivtt]

Brainstorming needy/taking action vs casual/waiting too long options...

A) Pretend nothing happened, text her today what her schedule's like (even though she said she'd get back to me). E.g. "Hi <name>, so what did your secretary say your calendar's like? Have her get with my secretary and let's do lunch or dinner "
B) Pretend nothing happened, call her tonight to talk in person instead of maybe getting another text message that doesn't directly answer my request to met up. It'll be much easier to see if she is lying or BSing me.
C) Don't call or text, see if she reaches out to me at all this week. If not, text or call next week as if nothing happened and if she flakes again just move on.

 

[Marty]

Hey Mkivtt, have you read NarrowJ's post on a girl who was driving him texting-crazy? If not, you can find it here:

viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2725

He has a great tip on how to get off of "go-nowhere" texting conversations and move the interaction assertively forward toward an in-person meet-up.

 

[NarrowJ]

Marty,

I've started writing an "informative" post (using a combination of my own experiences, Chase's advice, and other research I've done) about passive-agressive / difficult women, and how to deal with them, weed them out, or avoid the situation altogether.

I'll link it in here, if I get it done soon enough.

NJ

 

[mkivtt]

Just got another text. It just says "hello?" Is this a sh!t test? I ask her out Sat, she says yes, then yesterday she says she probably can't make it, but she'll get back to me to confirm. She never does, just texts me a new cell # at night, to which I didn't respond, and "hello?" now. I'm happy at least I'm not being ignored, but it's not what I expected. It looks fishy. If I respond will it be too eager and fail the sh!t test? Or is it genuine and is she just disorganized/flaky and should I respond with e.g. "hey, it's my 2nd favorite banker. So what did your secretary say? " (I've teased her about liking her Persian colleage more than her) to try to set up the date again ?

I'm so confused now. I thought I had this one in the bag. I'm not supplicating her, am not holding her bag while she shops, created attraction. What does she want if he's not directly responding to my requests to go out?

Edit: Thanks Marty, that thread is excellent. Exactly the case I'm facing. I will try the line above to give her one more try without "negging" or "scolding," but will change it so it reads ""hey, it's my 2nd favorite banker. So when did your secretary say your agenda's open this week? " so it's more concrete. If she flakes out again, I'll respond with either of the two lines from the other thread (Chase's or the one J ended up using).

 

[Marty]

NJ, sounds tremendous, looking forward to drawing on that resource... good call.

Mkivtt, that sounds exsctly like what you're gonna need here!

 

[NarrowJ]

I decided to go ahead and just finish it up this afternoon: viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2784

 

[mkivtt]

Well, as it turns out I used the one "normal" message I had planned before using either Chase's or J's lines, and she replied saying she's feeling pretty low and bad, and didn't want to see me when she felt like that. I threw in some rapport stuff about feeling better blabla, and she asked if I'm free Sat. I used an awesome line I found on the practicalhappiness website (also highly recommended) "well I'm seeing Christine at 2, then Ramya at 4, but I could fit you in at 3..." and she was laughing after that.

So dinner, this Sat.

The cultural differences are huge though. She wouldn't come to my place for dinner, and didn't want me to pick her up. There's no way I'm bedding this girl anytime soon. Best-case scenario right now is a simple, short kiss on the lips but I think it will more than likely just be a hug and MAYBE a peck on the cheek. Will see how her body language and kino is during dinner.

Whew. On to the next step... one step at a time.

Thanks again for the link to that other thread, it's got awesome advice.