Breaking Out of a Loser Mentality

[NewBeeWinner]

Hey guys,

Recently, I've just been feeling down. Im able to approach women and most of the time get their number. I've also gotten better at texting to get dates and have been going on a few (a couple a week). But I just can't seem to get laid. I make one mistake or fail to look past a girls BS ("I have work early" or "I have homework I need to do") or I mess up the pacing a bit or whatever. I don't get second dates and the girl always disappears after the first date because I failed to bed her.

I just feel lost. Like why does it have to be so difficult to date? You would think girls might be a bit more forgiving and at least let a second date happen. But I have had only one girl I've had a second (and third) date with.

It sucks and I've been trying to learn from each failure. I just can't seem to pull a successful lay and I think its messing with me. I'm losing confidence in my ability to feel like I can pull a successful first date lay.

Any advice?

 

[Sub-Zero]

I'm sorry bro, bitches just ain't shit, remember that. Only thing I can recommend is to keep pushing and don't give up because if you give up time will fly by.

 

[quiteastory]

I don't get second dates and the girl always disappears after the first date because I failed to bed her.

Maybe you're trying too hard to bed on the 1st date, and that's why they disappear Try to take it chill, and arrange, let's say 3 dates, and see where that takes you. You'll at least have some new data

 

[NewBeeWinner]

Thanks Sub-Zero - I definitely won't be giving up!

quiteastory, let's say I change to this method of aiming for the lay on a second/third date. What should my goals be for the first/second dates? Should I kiss at the end and call that good for the first date? Then on the second/third go a bit further each time? How slow is too slow in that case?

Thanks for the help guys. I'll keep learning and return with lay reports that I'll be proud of

 

[Michal]

I was stuck at this point too. What got me through somewhat was that I stopped teasing girls that much (like only one tease in the beginning and maybe second one later on if it got too heavy). And I started to touch the girls a bit more and talked more about relationships and sex. Or twisted the conversation in that direction in a smoother way. Overall the dates had to have that nice and chill atmosphere with some good tension that makes you feel somewhat excited.

 

[quiteastory]

I was stuck at this point too. What got me through somewhat was that I stopped teasing girls that much (like only one tease in the beginning and maybe second one later on if it got too heavy). And I started to touch the girls a bit more and talked more about relationships and sex. Or twisted the conversation in that direction in a smoother way. Overall the dates had to have that nice and chill atmosphere with some good tension that makes you feel somewhat excited.

NewBeeWinner - there's your answer. I do that a lot too. At some point of my life I ended up flirting too much and pushing too hard for it. My game felt "shallow" (no deep diving, no real connection). I've learned that flirting is one of many things you need to do, others are: escalation, deep diving, building real connection, kissing, etc. What works smoothly for me is talking about relationships, what we like in men & woman, sex, romantic stuff.

I always try to kiss the girl on the first date at least few times (it works if that girl is open and fun). I aim for having sex at 3rd date, it just feels natural for me.

If you can't lay on 3 dates, you won't lay on the 1st one Make sure to get through all milestones - meeting, deep diving, touching, kissing, more touching, inviting her home (find some excuse, e.g. watching movie together). It'll work eventually.

 

[NewBeeWinner]

Hmm. I'll have to really let this sink in and rethink my strategy.

Some immediate takeaways are I need to drive the conversation more towards relationships, sex, romantic topics, etc. I'll also still go for kissing on the first date. I'll also start at 3 dates and go from there.

A part of me feels uneasy because I feel like I won't get a second shot after the first date. But maybe that's my limiting mindset and its causing me to rush things too fast, causing girls to autoreject? It's also probably putting unnecessary pressure on myself and that is probably causing my seduction to be "shallow", like quiteastory was saying. I'll give it a shot - I have a date on Wednesday (today being Monday), so I'll post a report on that date trying this new method. Here's to breaking past the sticking point!

 

[ElderPrice]

Duuuuuude I am 100% you. I could have written your post. I am stuck at the exact same spot! A couple months ago I wrote a thread trying to guess what my problem was. You can check it out here if you're interested -> https://boards.girlschase.com/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=19274

Anyway, I don't have much progress to report myself. Been really slammed with work so girls took a back seat for a while just because of time. But here's some of the approaches I'll take when I get some new dates lined up:

- Try and make a better connection. Almost all the girls I've dated I haven't really had a lot in common with. No problem for me, but most likely a problem for them. I'm going to try and relate to them better. I'm also going to try to avoid disqualifying myself. For this I recommend Chase's article What Does She Want? The 8 Things You Must Ask Her (https://www.girlschase.com/content/what-does-she-want-8-things-you-must-ask-her). I'm working on memorizing these 8 questions. The idea here is to ask her simple-sounding questions that actually reveal a lot about her character. For instance, if in her free time she reads, you probably don't want to talk about all the sports you play in your spare time. Relating to this point is...
- Making a better attempt to signal appreciation when she says she has something in common with you. If you're religious and she reveals she's religious, it's probably a good idea to signal how much that means to you and how much you appreciate that about her and to keep talking about it. It's probably not a good idea to be like "that's cool. so what do you do in your spare time?" Also, I'm going to try and genuinely compliment more. If I really like her hair, her dress, her job, what she does for fun, whatever, I'm going to make a better effort to signal a genuine compliment.
- Don't smile the whole time. A possible problem for me is I may have a slight 'nice guy' tendency to always be polite and smile and look like I'm having a good time while on the date. From now on if a girl is boring me and if she's not receptive to basic flirting/touching, I'm going to try taking a step back and see if that gets her contributing. The "bored face." Some articles on this subject talk about the idea of 'rewarding' her with attention when she comes along with where you want to move the interaction, while 'punishing' her when she doesn't come along. Not the best words, but I think you know what I'm getting at here.
- Try different date ideas. The vast majority of my dates have been the recommended simple coffee/drinks date. No results. No increase in arousal/attraction. No second dates. So I'm going to try planning slightly more elaborate dates. Instead of just grabbing drinks, I'll try and plan for a number of mini dates, so maybe the night will look like coffee/drinks -> arcade -> park. Or drinks -> park -> ice cream. There's an article on this. I think it's called date compression. This is also a good idea to try because it builds compliance. The more she follows your lead the more receptive she'll be to your idea of kicking back and putting on a movie at the end of the night.
- Try to meet different kinds of women. If you're only getting numbers in coffee shops, it's possible 'coffee shop girls' just aren't going to be your best type no matter how many times you try. For all you know, latinas might be dying to meet a guy like you. So make sure you're not sticking with one kind of woman.

That's all I can think of for now. Hope that helps!

 

[foggy]

you need a system that every date you have follows! its as simple as that.

this november, ive had 9 dates so far. thats like, 1 every 3 days. prior to november, i wasnt getting many dates. because i didnt have a reliable system for getting them.

ive had good dates, bad dates, and okay dates, but im working on developing a reliable system that ensures there's a happy ending at each and every one of them. its okay that my date-to-lay rate isnt the best right now, because it takes time to get good at this part.

if you run your date a certain way each time, you will begin to notice patterns in the way girls react. for example, a GC article suggests your date be 60-75 minutes long. I tried that, but I found the girl's emotions would fizzle out right around the 45 minute mark if I didn't move anywhere with them by then. Literally every single time. So now I have a rule. Move locations or end the date after 45 minutes.

I notice girls would ask if I have a roommate after I ask them home. So now I tell them we're gonna go chill with my roommate at my place.

I noticed I get out-of-the-blue objections when leaving the date location to go to my place. So you best believe A) that I have a gameplan for that and B) im noticing patterns in the objections like "oh it's getting late balblal" and then understanding how i could have prevented that in the first place. I got the "its getting late" objection last week. Well, that was because i neglected to find out logistics at the start of the date. If I had done that, the way I gamed the girl would have been totally different.

So, to recap, set up a system and make hard rules for yourself so you can notice patterns and tweak your system for success:

- My dates last X amount of time
- I will ask the girl home after X amount of time in the date
- I will frame our interaction as X
- I will find out logistics in the first X minutes of the date. Depending on her logistics, I will do X or Y.

 

[NewBeeWinner]

Ok guys,

After reviewing the comments from you all, here's the conclusion I've come to:

1) I have the following date system in mind for my dates (here on):

- Meet at Starbucks (near campus, my house I can't take girls to due to parents) at 7 PM (I've found from the last 3 dates I've had that if I do 6 or 6:30, girls always have other plans made for later in the night - which has been a pain to deal with)
- Conversation: "The 8 things you must ask her" to include deep-diving and relating by stories. Be sure to qualify her "good" qualities (adventurous, open-minded, a "rebel", etc.) for 30 - 40 minutes (roughly 5+ minutes a question, plenty to talk about)
- Move her (5-10 min) either to:
a) nearby pet store
b) to play billiards on campus (works well if she lives in the dorms)
c) holiday/christmas section at store (if she doesn't like the pet store, yes I've had girls say this)
- Talk more (I'm thinking about including sexual prizing at this point, more on that in a bit)
- Take her to my car (which has my phone in it so I can show her pictures of my pets, whatever)
- More sexual prizing, with the purpose of helping her feel open to sex with me and/or to get her horny
- Kissing her within 3 minutes of being alone (man-handle kiss, she should melt into me)
- Keep kissing until she uses tongue (if she doesn't, I'll stop kissing and resume talking a bit, with more physical escalation)
- Once she uses tongue, say "Let's move to the back because its crowded up here" or whatever excuse
- Immediately move to back of car, have her follow (I've had this work twice so far)
- Resume kissing and physical escalation (shoulders -> down chest -> stomach -> shoulders -> stomach -> outer thigh -> inner thigh -> stomach -> etc etc)
- Eventually say "its getting hot in here" as I unbutton my shirt or whatever (I'll turn on the heat when we get in the car - its winter)
- Put her hands on me and pull down pants, show my main man, put her hand on it
- Go from there, ensuring proper condom usage

I'll ensure at the start of the date her plans/logistics for that night. I also plan the whole process to take about an hour and a half to two hours, so "it being too late" shouldn't be an issue I can't out-frame.

2) I'll use sex talk/sexual prizing more. I will use stories to show my openness to sex, to "not kiss and tell", etc. I can use a primer, as recommended, when I move her to the pet store or whatever (such as, "You know, I read recently in a scientific article this great thing about orgasms... (orgasm bit here)"

3) I understand the idea of 3 dates. But, from my experience so far, and from the past 3 dates I've had where I didn't take it as far as I could on the first date (and usually ended with a kiss), I haven't been able to get a second date from the girl. It's especially difficult now with finals (I mostly get girls from my college, an abundance of girls there) to plan further dates. I think sex talk and sexual prizing will paint me less of a boyfriend candidate. So, I'm going back to one date shots.

What do you all think? Thanks for solidifying my process! I hope this can begin to work and I can post some awesome LRs!

 

[DarkKnight]

I really like reading the points you guys struggle about because sometimes it also shows a flaw in my own game.

Honestly I would not know what the best solution to your problem is, but if you feel that lack of deep diving/ connection is an issue it probably is. I notice with myself that I rather interact with a girl who tries to have a real connection with me instead of a girl who I know is interested/attracted but fails to get to know me. But that's just me.