Can you win her over with your words?

[Estate]

Hey guys...

So maybe a little follow on from my texting thread but I am talking about in person here too or communicating over any medium...

Sometimes you just meet those girls who you know are into you. Let's be honest, unless you are a complete jerk and mess it up, she's coming home with you that night. It feels like game is flowing out of every pore.
Then there are other girls... she's listening, she's talking but she's not initially giving you all those vibes...

What do people feel on this? In general PUA circles, guys act like you can bed any girl at any time and if you don't you are a failure of a man. I just don't subscribe to that. There's always got to be SOME element of raw attraction. I mean, I know men and women differ on this but we've all met girls who liked us, even if they were cute, but they just weren't our type or something... it just wasn't there.

Surely there is SOME element of that with girls too... I'm not talking about looks but there has to be SOME raw attraction from the beginning. I guess my question is how far to invest when a girl seems lukewarm? Is it likely she is just waiting to be "won over" by your wonderful personality or would it be time better spent looking for another girl?
Sometimes I just find it hit and miss... sometimes I can end up having a wonderful conversation with a girl like this, next time she just wants to go dance with her friends or something but nothing in the interaction was really different from my point of view... girl 1 was happy sitting and talking, girl 2 wanted to dance... but nothing was really different up to that point. It confuses me a little.

 

[Marty]

Estate:

Is it likely she is just waiting to be "won over" by your wonderful personality or would it be time better spent looking for another girl?

I am still making up lost ground on field experience, but I've read Chase's articles so many times now (every time I have a problem in the field, i.e. all the time!) that I'm like a living index of what's available where. Found this one right away:

How to Attract Women: The Guide

This part stuck in my mind:

Cut the cute stuff and get to the point. I can't tell you how often I've seen friends who were routine guys walk up to a girl, start talking to her, and then right away I'm pulling my hair out going, "Eeeugggghhh, stop trying to attract her, she's already attracted! Just move her and get her out of there while she still wants you!"

You won't attract women by talking to them. You won't. You really won't, I promise. The women who seemed attracted by your talking to them were probably attracted the moment you walked up, and had you done things smoothly and properly from the beginning you almost certainly could've moved them and gotten them to go with you right away.

Even when I was new to meeting girls, I operated this way, and it worked. I didn't know what I was doing, but I knew that the cute stuff was a waste of my time and I didn't spend any time on it. I'd go, talk to girls, and if they seemed interested I'd move them as fast as I could. And they'd usually say "yes."

I'll leave it to the members with vast practical experience to answer your question directly, but I know what conclusions I'd draw from the above. He even says "You won't" three times, for emphasis.

-Marty

 

[Richard]

This one is a lot of fun, and right up my alley

Okay so, when a girl is giving off an "uninterested" vibe, or doesn't seem all that soulful about what the two of you are talking about, you can do a few things:
1- Change the topic, and see how she responds
2- Go direct, and move fast!
3- Walk away

#1 - If she starts off very receptive of you, and suddenly changes her mood, or her tone, or her body language. Ask yourself what changed, did you transition conversation topics without really knowing it? If so, change the topic back to the positive with something like:

"So, earlier you were talking about (insert positive topic)... (insert question here)"

#2 - Chase also mentioned this somewhere. Girls can act like this because they are experienced, they're not interested in building a connection, they want you to move them fast, and bed them! If a woman doesn't want to talk to you, she'll find a way not to, but, if she's standing around talking despite her seemingly uninterested persona, then move her fast, and bed her quickly.

#3 - I recommend the 2 above first, but, if she's just trying to be nice and deal with the conversation until one of you walks away, then let it be you who walks away! You can exit a bad conversation in a number of ways, with an excuse, with a goodbye, just so many different things.

It all depends on the situation you are in, be sure to keep that in mind, and remain calm. That reminds me, it could also be a test!

#4 - She's testing you, or trying to get you to chase her. She may be acting aloof to get you to reengage her, in which case you simply act more aloof than her, she's interested in you, she's just trying to get you more invested in her. Don't give in. If you feel like she's testing you, shoot the breeze for a minute or two, and if she persists in acting aloof, walk away, and watch her reengage you

-Richard

 

[NarrowJ]

Estate,

Chase's recent article Things That Show Women You're Chasing Them would be the perfect read for this topic.

You have to show the same level of investment, and hopefully less (Law of Least Effort). So if she's not investing much into the interaction, you shouldn't be either. Use pregnant pauses to get her to contribute some effort, and definitely don't keep plowing through and talking non-stop if she isn't giving much to the way of the conversation. That's chasing.

Here's an excerpt from Chase's article on using Pregnant Pause:

I was guilty of this plenty of times in the past. I can remember many, many conversations where I was panicking internally, scrambling around trying to find something -- anything -- that a girl would connect with me on. Not wanting to let the conversation go until I'd found it. Not wanting to let her go until I'd found it.

But conversation should never, ever be about you trying to get her interested in topics.

Why? Because:

* You don't want women interested in your choice of topics; rather

* You want women interested in you

So, as you can see there, just plowing on and talking about a ton of different things until you hit something doesn't work.

I have unconsciously stopped doing many of the things that Chase mentions, from just having abundance and mastering all of the other skills. It no longer effects me at all if a girl says she has to go, starts paying me less attention, etcetera. I just drop her and it's on to the next one. Often times (especially younger girls), they will actually freak out a little when I back off, and start scrambling to get my attention again, which of course just ends up making it ten times easier for me...


NJ

 

[Marty]

Often times (especially younger girls), they will actually freak out a little when I back off, and start scrambling to get my attention again, which of course just ends up making it ten times easier for me...

NJ: it would be fantastic if you could describe one of those interactions, just to give an idea of what it looks like. I've been reading your J's Journal (LOVE the one about the tanning salon, what a great way to show genuine interest after you came back for your keys!) and I find your writing very easy to follow and imitate in the field, as well as your comeback last year being inspirational.

She may be acting aloof to get you to reengage her, in which case you simply act more aloof than her, she's interested in you, she's just trying to get you more invested in her. Don't give in. If you feel like she's testing you, shoot the breeze for a minute or two, and if she persists in acting aloof, walk away, and watch her reengage you

Zphix: when I was at a VERY inexperienced stage (as opposed to just plain inexperienced right now), on my 11th daytime approach, a very nice blond girl told me she had a boyfriend and declined my date proposal, and I was just saying goodbye and about to walk off when she started asking me all sorts of questions about myself. Previously I had maintained the emphasis on her, of course. Is this the sort of thing you're referring to: can that sometimes be turned around?

 

[Richard]

As a matter of fact yes, girls may throw you a test by mentioning a boyfriend who they may or may not have. In this case, I don't think she really had one, and was only trying to get you to pursue her.

Or! She was trying to get enough info about you to describe you to her boyfriend so he could take care of you later JK

-Richard

 

[NarrowJ]

Marty,

NJ: it would be fantastic if you could describe one of those interactions, just to give an idea of what it looks like. I've been reading your J's Journal (LOVE the one about the tanning salon, what a great way to show genuine interest after you came back for your keys!) and I find your writing very easy to follow and imitate in the field, as well as your comeback last year being inspirational.

Thanks! I just added a whole bunch of field reports to that journal yesterday. I hadn't been too good at keeping up with it. You'll notice I don't bother writing about failed interactions anymore. Focusing on the positive these days

A good way to find out what her level of interest in continuing the interaction is, is by using pregnant pauses as I mentioned (read that article I linked too, if you haven't). If she feels the social pressure and fills in the silence, she is probably good to go

A quick example of a girl over-stepping her boundary, then subsequently realizing her mistake and trying to win my attention back: I was out one night and got into a conversation with this brunette. At some point during the interaction, she mistakingly thought she "had me" and says she's going to "go over there to talk to some friends, but it was super nice meeting you though!" because she thought I would say "No, stay!" or maybe even chase after her and follow her over there or something. But, I didn't. I went about my business and got into a conversation with another cute girl, and the brunette became jealous and throughout the rest of the night her goal was to win me back from the other girl. I could have taken either of them home, the brunette would have been especially easy to pull since she was working so hard to regain my interest.


Hope that helps, man!
NJ