FR Closing out a friendly interaction

[ray_zorse]

Did a date-compression date with [L] and couple of approaches today. By far the weirdest was a Vietnamese chick who converted to Islam. I have been meaning to open more girls in headscarves since I don't like having any mental blocks at all. But when I guessed she was Malaysian she said Vietnamese. Hmm I somehow seem to specialize in Vietnamese so this was interesting. She was off to the campus Islamic Society meeting. I told her to follow her dream and left her to get on with it.

The topic here though is [H] who recently graduated the uni but is a film-maker with a group of other students, they've made various short films & are working part time (or studying) while putting together funding for their next short. Very interesting, I opened her after I'd walked a few blocks from the date with [L], I was totally full of yummy fish+hot chili soup, so I was walking back to the office to let my stomach settle, [H] was going the same way and this gave us probably 20min to talk & get to know each other. Thing was I wasn't totally attracted, I only opened her because she was walking right beside me and it was the polite thing to do.

So she told me a fair bit about the different things she does, e.g. assistant-directorship, writing, acting and so on, and about her course (also she asked me a bit about myself which was good of her), and I learned a fair bit. Problem is I've found in these situations you build up a rapport and a closeness, and then they're actually pretty disappointed when you don't make a move, you look like a lame-ass just saying bye after all that. So I figured I had to make a move, it was just the polite thing to do. After about 15min I said this...

Ray "this has been a very interesting and instructive walk, I have enjoyed talking to you..." walked a moment more "are you also enjoying the conversation?"
[H] "yes!"
Ray "and you would like to continue talking when you're not on the way to a meeting?"
[H] "what are you suggesting exactly?"
Ray "oh, well i have just been standing here debating with myself whether to ask you out" she thinks about this
[H] "well I have a boyfriend so it's probably not the best idea"
Ray "okay, that's cool" I say in a friendly slow deep voice with a grin. Face saved all around, I made a move, then I resume the conversation just as before
Ray "oh, well you could have told me more about the costume side of things, I like op shopping, do you go there for costumes?"

she starts explaining how she makes the constumes and the period pieces and so on, more interesting stuff. We get to her building (I've previously explained I'm going to walk her over to let my food settle and then return to my office after I drop her off), then I give her a big smile and say again that it's been a most interesting talk, and come here. She complies so I give her a big hug and a kiss on the cheek. Magic!

This is the kind of interaction that makes me really happy I've improved my people skills since finding GC, as well as pickup skills specifically. But I'd still like to find a better way of handling this "disappointed you didn't make a move" scenario so I can close things out on my terms leaving her happy and satisfied, without feeling like I have to force it. Mind you my "debating" line served this purpose pretty well, haha.

cheers, Ray

 

[Chase]

Ray-

Good show on giving it the old college try. A few critiques on the actual ask:

Ray "this has been a very interesting and instructive walk, I have enjoyed talking to you..." walked a moment more "are you also enjoying the conversation?"
[H] "yes!"
Ray "and you would like to continue talking when you're not on the way to a meeting?"
[H] "what are you suggesting exactly?"
Ray "oh, well i have just been standing here debating with myself whether to ask you out" she thinks about this

Can you make this simpler and smoother? The "debating with myself" part seems designed to protect you from any blowback if there's a rejection, but it's either a value hit for her or one for you depending on how she takes it (whether she reads it as: "I was debating about asking you out because I'm not that interested in you" or "I was debating about asking you out because I'm nervous and unsure of myself").

That she had to stop and think about it, and that she apparently gave you an approach invitation in the first place, leads me to think you may have gotten a different response with a more confident / forward / leading ask than the one you used.

There was also the framing of "asking her out", which is a clear "dating" move, and closes off a number of possibilities for you (e.g., you taking the lover role in the event she already has a stable partner) - guys she just hooks up with don't date her, and don't outright ask her out. They just "hang out" with her and then "it just happens."

Additionally, the vagueness of the request forced her to ask you to be clearer about what you were suggesting, and it's pretty hard to handle a clarification statement like this in an attractive way.

To get away from:

• 
  1. The value hit to you or her of the "debating" couching
  2. The boxing yourself in boyfriend self-categorization of "asking her out"
  3. The request for clarification from her in response to an unclear proposition by you

... something more like this might've been more effective:

• Ray: You know, I've really liked walking and talking with you.
  
  Her: Me too!
  
  Ray: Shall we pick this up another time, grab a bite or a drink later this week or next?

But I'd still like to find a better way of handling this "disappointed you didn't make a move" scenario so I can close things out on my terms leaving her happy and satisfied, without feeling like I have to force it. Mind you my "debating" line served this purpose pretty well, haha.

I think you were on the fence about whether you wanted to really ask this girl out or not, so you almost tried to ask her out in a way she'd reject you?

Here's an alternate idea: if you don't like her enough to follow up with her, but you want to see how far you can get, rather than propose a date, why not push your boundaries and propose doing something right now? See what you can pull off. e.g.:

• Ray: You know, I've really liked walking and talking with you.
  
  Her: Me too!
  
  Ray: Hey, you know what, let's be crazy; let's skip our next class (or whatever you and her have next) and keep walking. Let's just keep walking together, you and I.

Then see how she responds and try to convince her. She'll resist; the purpose of the exercise is not to necessarily close her, but to see what you can pull off.

Since you're never going to see her again (because you won't follow up)... and you don't really care for this girl that much... why not push your limits?

It's free training, and if you do it enough times that you get your process down and get good at reading your options in a situation like this and knowing how to deal with whatever kinds of responses you get, you'll realize one day that now you know how to do this with girls you DO like - and then you're really playing with fire.

Chase