Clubs/Bars: Do You Go Away After Failed Isolation Attempt?

[Ronnie]

Don't do much clubs these days (even though it's the thing I have most experience on) but my friends drag me there from time to time.

Gamed around 5 hours last Friday night. I am much more effective at opening and engaging compared to day game, however there was an episode that made me think.

I opened two girls, with a clear idea of which one of the two was gonna be my target (although the other was pretty too). My target was very open from the start, even restarting the conversation once I went silent for a bit. I currently game with Todd’s process in mind (Open->Premise(Making it Man-to-Woman)->Evaluation->Narrative->Close) because I find it very easy to understand at which point I am in the process at any given time.

When I am talking with two or more girls and I want to isolate one, I usually do it either in the evaluation or narrative stage (I found that building a narrative of “us” works better once you’re already alone with her).

So after making it man-to-woman and evaluating her (the main thread of the conversation was basically: “you’re exactly my type… but you also look like you may be trouble”) I ask her: “So, I need to get some air because it’s hot as hell in here… wanna keep me company outside?.

I could see she considered this for 3 seconds but then said: “No, we just arrived to the club, we wanna stay here”.


Because I had already said I was gonna get some air, it felt needy and clingy to stay there and change my decision. So I went out. Then I came back in, chatted with some other girls and guys and by the time I went back to the girl I originally gamed, there was another guy talking to her and she looked quite invested so I just let that set go.

What do you usually do when an isolation attempt doesn’t work in a bar or club?

Thanks.

 

[Will_V]

The problem with what you said is that you didn't include her in the reason for going out. If you said 'let's go outside to get some fresh air' the point of the suggestion is still to talk to her, so it's not weird if she says 'nah' and you stay and change topics/tease her a bit. But you framed it as 'I'm going regardless'.

Regardless, you should have simply ignored the fumble and changed topics, what have you got to lose? You didn't sign a contract to go outside so you aren't going to get sued or anything. Just smile and joke and say whatever, don't take it seriously.

Remember seduction is like a stage performance, nobody really cares if you fumble something, but they do care if the fumble sends you on a tilt. A good performer just carries on as if nothing happened so that everyone can pretend that it was all part of the show.

 

[DarkJedi]

Regardless, you should have simply ignored the fumble and changed topics, what have you got to lose? You didn't sign a contract to go outside so you aren't going to get sued or anything. Just smile and joke and say whatever, don't take it seriously.

Interesting. Will that not show that you're way more invested in her compared to how much she is?

This reminds me of a daygame scneario: you ask her to move with you somewhere after talking to her for a few minutes. 9 times out of 10, you won't get her even if you keep talking to her after that. At least that has been my experience.

Interested to know how to handle these.

 

[Will_V]

Interesting. Will that not show that you're way more invested in her compared to how much she is?

Maybe, but it's better than ejecting isn't it. Reengaging later only works if she really wanted you to stay but you couldn't, it's not an opportunity for a second shot at a fumbled opportunity because by then she'll have solidified in her mind what happened or just signed it off as awkward. Game is not about avoiding rejection but pursuing success.

I'm not the most prolific night game guy by any stretch of the imagination, but my experience has been that in the night emotions trump rules. It's very competitive and you don't get any points for being that guy who did a fine job of ejecting.

This reminds me of a daygame scneario: you ask her to move with you somewhere after talking to her for a few minutes. 9 times out of 10, you won't get her even if you keep talking to her after that. At least that has been my experience.

This is true, and it's a huge blunder to ask for the wrong amount of compliance at the wrong time. But it really depends on why she refused. If she's not interested it's basically finished, and you'll probably know when that happens because you will feel all the tension go out of the conversation. But maybe she's just flighty or got a lot on her mind or can't comply for some reason and you just need to stay in there and chill with her and sort it out. Usually if there's still tension there after a refusal she's still open to something, it means that emotionally she doesn't want to let you go.

When you don't get compliance, it's always good to have an attitude of 'I understand how you feel, let's figure it out together' without indicting yourself or herself for making some terminal mistake.

Attraction is what you're working with, not contracts. Women have never cared about contracts, they care about desire and whether you are going to sort out all the obstacles on the road to fulfilling it. If there's enough attraction and sexual tension you have room to blow some momentum and still carry it all the way through. If there's not enough attraction it's not going to work anyway.

 

[DarkJedi]

Maybe, but it's better than ejecting isn't it. Reengaging later only works if she really wanted you to stay but you couldn't, it's not an opportunity for a second shot at a fumbled opportunity because by then she'll have solidified in her mind what happened or just signed it off as awkward. Game is not about avoiding rejection but pursuing success.

Fair point

This is true, and it's a huge blunder to ask for the wrong amount of compliance at the wrong time. But it really depends on why she refused. If she's not interested it's basically finished, and you'll probably know when that happens because you will feel all the tension go out of the conversation. But maybe she's just flighty or got a lot on her mind or can't comply for some reason and you just need to stay in there and chill with her and sort it out. Usually if there's still tension there after a refusal she's still open to something, it means that emotionally she doesn't want to let you go.

Thanks man, I'll keep the tension aspect in mind. I can see it now, looking back at a few past interactions.

I tend to sometimes use the compliance as a test too, when I'm not sure where the interaction is going. Especially to weed out the friendly and chatty girls who have no intention beyond just being chatty.

 

[Skills]

Don't do much clubs these days (even though it's the thing I have most experience on) but my friends drag me there from time to time.

Gamed around 5 hours last Friday night. I am much more effective at opening and engaging compared to day game, however there was an episode that made me think.

I opened two girls, with a clear idea of which one of the two was gonna be my target (although the other was pretty too). My target was very open from the start, even restarting the conversation once I went silent for a bit. I currently game with Todd’s process in mind (Open->Premise(Making it Man-to-Woman)->Evaluation->Narrative->Close) because I find it very easy to understand at which point I am in the process at any given time.

When I am talking with two or more girls and I want to isolate one, I usually do it either in the evaluation or narrative stage (I found that building a narrative of “us” works better once you’re already alone with her).

So after making it man-to-woman and evaluating her (the main thread of the conversation was basically: “you’re exactly my type… but you also look like you may be trouble”) I ask her: “So, I need to get some air because it’s hot as hell in here… wanna keep me company outside?.

I could see she considered this for 3 seconds but then said: “No, we just arrived to the club, we wanna stay here”.


Because I had already said I was gonna get some air, it felt needy and clingy to stay there and change my decision. So I went out. Then I came back in, chatted with some other girls and guys and by the time I went back to the girl I originally gamed, there was another guy talking to her and she looked quite invested so I just let that set go.

What do you usually do when an isolation attempt doesn’t work in a bar or club?

Thanks.

don't focus so much on isolation, stay more in set till eventually the set will organically naturally break and you will gain isolation.... Guys focus to much on "isolation" is flawed... Then timing was off, she just got to the club and you isolating, was wrong timing...

Also this is too direct without having gain any compliance is like "wanna fuck":

So after making it man-to-woman and evaluating her (the main thread of the conversation was basically: “you’re exactly my type… but you also look like you may be trouble”) I ask her: “So, I need to get some air because it’s hot as hell in here… wanna keep me company outside?.

You want to lead after getting some compliance, after she is into "come with me" "let me borrow your friend for a second i promise i will bring her right back, will be over there/or we are going to grab a drink real quick" and have her follow you, or grab her hand and lead... But again you can just stay in set till you organically isolate (this is kind of my favorite way now a days)... Obviously don't waste time in dead set, but your approach a bit poor tbh.