Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be working

[NarrowJ]

Hey guys, I've been trying to tighten up my text game. I thought I was doing pretty good (law of least effort, non-lengthy texts that get to the point, always having an objective, etc). But, now it seems I'm getting girls that don't respond after they were warm and excited before. Maybe I am taking some of this advice too far?

(FYI- something that I feel like has improved my texting a bunch, is varying response times. I think I'm good at this, and its working well for me.)


Ok, so first of all- my text convos, I try to keep them under about 8-10 messages total. My initial text is usually something like:

"Hey [name], was happy to meet a [insert common interest or witty remark about something we talked about] -NJ"

I usually ALWAYS get some kind of response to the above message.

My typical text convo that I'd have with a girl goes like this:

Me: "Hey [name], was happy to meet a [insert common interest or witty remark about something we talked about] -NJ"
Her: "Oh hey, [response to common interest or witty remark]"
[insert 2-4 messages about same subject]
Me: "Well hey- Lets grab a drink or a bite to eat this week? When are you free?"

Lately, this isn't working out so well for me. I'm getting girls talking- but a lot of times not ending up with any sort of plans for a date. Do I need to build more rapport here? Maybe instead of 2-4 messages, should I increase this to 4-6 or even 6-8 messages for rapport-building? The advice I've seen suggests what I'm doing is correct, but maybe on a cold approach where I don't spend a ton of time talking to a girl- I need to warm them up more before trying to solidify plans to meet?

Something else that is NOT working for me at all- when I do get a date scheduled, and I don't text them until the day of the date or before they seem to flake often. Or, if I don't get a date scheduled immediately and have to check back after a few days it seems they go cold. For some reason, I have much better luck getting the date to actually happen when I at least keep in some sort of contact with them. What could be the reason for this? Maybe I have a "player vibe" that I need to shake? Like they are weary of me, and then when I give them the no-contact they start to think this even more?

Bottom line here- it seems like in my case, less texting is actually bad. I seem to be doing much better when I have more lengthy conversations and keep in touch on an almost daily basis. This is really opposite of the advice I'm getting here and in other places.

Any input is very much appreciated! Thanks fellas.

 

[Franco]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

NJ,

There are two things that seemed to help this situation for me, and neither one of them had to do with increasing or decreasing my amount of texting. It had to do with my interaction with the girl when I gave her my number.

The most obvious thing was making sure I tried to set up the date during the actual interaction. This usually help solidified the idea that you were interested in seeing her again, and it also shows that you were man enough to ask her out in person rather than over the phone. While asking her out over the phone can still work, it is also a bit more random as to whether or not she will accept the invite.

The second thing (which I have mentioned on this board before, but it was awhile ago, so it is worth re-mentioning) is that it helps immensely if you get numbers and dates of girls that you got to move with you before asking them for the number or date.

Probably the most common mistake I see with most guys who approach women (both naturals and beginners on this website), is that they spend too much time talking to the girl instead of attempting to get her to move with them. When a girl follows your lead and actually moves somewhere with you, it gets her seeing you as something more than just a flirt or acquaintance. You're actually a man who takes charge and gets what he wants. For this reason, it seems to build extra attraction and will likely get you less flakier interactions over text.

The best way to figure out if this is your issue is to think back to your last 5-10 girls that you got dates from over text -- are these mostly women that moved with you somewhere during your interaction with them before getting their number?

Anyway, these are the two usual subjects I bring up when someone is having issues with flaky texters!

- Franco

 

[trashKENNUT]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

NarrowJ,

The most obvious thing was making sure I tried to set up the date during the actual interaction. This usually help solidified the idea that you were interested in seeing her again, and it also shows that you were man enough to ask her out in person rather than over the phone. While asking her out over the phone can still work, it is also a bit more random as to whether or not she will accept the invite.

I would like to add that sometimes girls get back to you another day. Don't worry about it, too. You can text again the next few days.

Zac

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Thanks Franco!
I need to make the most of the initial interaction. I guess that's why they say what they do about "You never get a second chance to make a first impression"

And Zac:
Yeah I have that happen at times, too. Plus, I've really been out approaching and getting regular lays. It helps a ton when I have to mark a girl off!


-NJ

 

[PinotNoir]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Hmmm, this makes sense. Most answers aren't black&white, so you have to know that even the best texting advice isn't going to work with all women in all situations.

Because it sounds like you're not building enough connection when meeting them, texting a little more is actually helping. I don't think most girls would want little initial conversation followed by a short text asking for a date. Most have a lot of guys already pining for them.

So, in my opinion, if you make a good initial conversation with a reasonable connection, then keep the texts short and focused.

However, if you got her # after 2 sentences and then ended the conversation (you can keep conversing even after getting her #), then you're still in "stranger danger" territory. Therefore, chat her up a little bit via text or even on phone, and when you feel that the connection has gotten warmer, then dive into the date. But! After the first date, then go back to keeping the texts for meetups -- short and to the point.

The only thing you have to be cautious of is being slotted into a texting body or some non-sexual friend. If after chatting (and persisting), she keeps gracefully avoiding the date or avoids talking about dating or giving excuses, forget it. Drop it. I think this is why everyone advices short texts because a lot of new guys let this happen to them.

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

PN,

That definitely makes a lot of sense to me. The last several women I've taken to bed are (for the most part, anyway) girls I've been texting on a nearly daily basis up until that first date. Although, granted they're initiating 80-90 percent of the texting.

Franco's post there is great advice for a beginner like me, as well. So it leaves me wondering if I should risk damaging or stunting my growth in the art of seduction by reverting back to "texting more" to meet short-term goals (just having sex with women)?

Something else in play here, is that as far as looks- I'm probably in the top 5-10 percentile of men. I mean that not as a brag, but I'm trying to rationalize. Perhaps my attainability is also just automatically seen as low, before I even speak to them?

Oh- and something I didn't make clear here: I do ALWAYS offer a date before I get a girl's number.

 

[Franco]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

NJ,

Something else in play here, is that as far as looks- I'm probably in the top 5-10 percentile of men. I mean that not as a brag, but I'm trying to rationalize. Perhaps my attainability is also just automatically seen as low, before I even speak to them?

You'll have to gauge your success rate here. If you feel like you are having more success texting some of these women frequently, then feel free to experiment pressing forward with that (especially with higher tier women; if you're getting results there, then by all means, continue along with it). It's possible that you might have to lower your attainability with some women in order for them to feel like you actually appreciate them.

Generally, another good reason that it is recommended to not continually text women is to prevent yourself from becoming too attached, having her take control, and let her lead you on as another guy "in her orbit." However, I've seen a lot of your recent LRs, and I think you are working nicely toward an abundance mentality, so getting too attached might not be an issue for you.

When it comes to texting, there's really no exact "science" behind it -- Chase's recommendation on texting is simply a system you can follow that provides the essentials necessary to setting up and achieving dates with women. There's plenty of wiggle room to add your own style to it; even I generally throw in plenty of wit and humor these days in my texts, but I still text sparingly because that is what gets me the best results. It is also congruent with the way I am in person, so that's another important factor. If you are witty in person, then being witty over text is congruent with who you are. If you aren't witty in person and then try to use wit over texting, she's going to think you're trying to impress her over text somehow and it will come across as incongruent.

Anyway, as you can see, there are lots of little nuances to texting. One thing to keep in mind is that even the most advanced of seduction artists don't expect dates from every girl they talk to. Even Ricardus mentions that he would sometimes come home with 10-20 phone numbers and only end up on 2-3 dates. But all you need is one girl to take home for the night!

- Franco

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Franco, thanks a ton for expanding on this.

And, your comment regarding gauging my success rate: I think I need to start keeping a spreadsheet as many have recommended, anyway. But! I could get pretty complex with that too, and start keeping track of amount of texting as it pertains to date / lay percentage etcetera.



Thanks once again!
NJ

 

[ProblemSolving]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

I don't think texting is the problem. Whether a girl agrees to see you again is almost entirely based on your initial interaction with her. When you get a quick number close the odds of flaking go way up simply because you haven't got rid of the "Stranger Danger" PN was talking about. A girl may think you're super sexy and mysterious and really want to see you, but if she thinks seeing you again could potentially be awkward, she'll bail. I know sometimes a quick close is your only option, in which case you can try to make up for the lack of rapport by texting, but it's uphill battle in my opinion. You might as well be using Facebook to get dates then. Whenever possible, do the heavy lifting in person.

I usually shoot for a 5-10 minute conversation on the girls I number close and the flake rates go WAY down. This initial conversation lets a girl know that you won't be awkward on the date, so she can relax and enjoy your sexiness.

 

[Flames]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Try it slightly different.

You: "anyway I was wondering if your free in the next few days?"

Her: "not really, I'm going to be really busy forthr next few weeks actually."
You: "oh that's a shame, there a really cool/great/funny - club/restaurant/movie I was going to and wondered if you'd like to join me"

Then just leave it, make an excuse that you have to go and don't bring it up.

Or

Her:"yeah I am, why?"
You: "there a really cool/great/funny - club/restaurant/movie I was going to and wondered if you'd like to join me"

See how that works, if she says no that creates a void, if she is interested she'll almost certainly want to do something about it also your avoiding long drawn out days before you go out.

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

I don't think texting is the problem. Whether a girl agrees to see you again is almost entirely based on your initial interaction with her. When you get a quick number close the odds of flaking go way up simply because you haven't got rid of the "Stranger Danger" PN was talking about. A girl may think you're super sexy and mysterious and really want to see you, but if she thinks seeing you again could potentially be awkward, she'll bail. I know sometimes a quick close is your only option, in which case you can try to make up for the lack of rapport by texting, but it's uphill battle in my opinion. You might as well be using Facebook to get dates then. Whenever possible, do the heavy lifting in person.

I usually shoot for a 5-10 minute conversation on the girls I number close and the flake rates go WAY down. This initial conversation lets a girl know that you won't be awkward on the date, so she can relax and enjoy your sexiness.

Right, I think this is my issue. But, like Franco said- you have to do the math. Even the best seduction artists are working off a fraction of the numbers they close for dates & lays. So, maybe I'm not doing that bad after all? I don't know. But, what I do know, is that I still struggle with day game. I get nervous. I have to stop that, and get more comfortable approaching / moving / them etcetera.

 

[Flames]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

I don't think texting is the problem. Whether a girl agrees to see you again is almost entirely based on your initial interaction with her. When you get a quick number close the odds of flaking go way up simply because you haven't got rid of the "Stranger Danger" PN was talking about. A girl may think you're super sexy and mysterious and really want to see you, but if she thinks seeing you again could potentially be awkward, she'll bail. I know sometimes a quick close is your only option, in which case you can try to make up for the lack of rapport by texting, but it's uphill battle in my opinion. You might as well be using Facebook to get dates then. Whenever possible, do the heavy lifting in person.

I usually shoot for a 5-10 minute conversation on the girls I number close and the flake rates go WAY down. This initial conversation lets a girl know that you won't be awkward on the date, so she can relax and enjoy your sexiness.

Right, I think this is my issue. But, like Franco said- you have to do the math. Even the best seduction artists are working off a fraction of the numbers they close for dates & lays. So, maybe I'm not doing that bad after all? I don't know. But, what I do know, is that I still struggle with day game. I get nervous. I have to stop that, and get more comfortable approaching / moving / them etcetera.

PUA misconception... You dont have to ask hundreds of women out, or get hundreds of phone no.s that's a day game thing, in fact it's more like street game. If that was what everyone did we'd have died off a long time ago. Think about it....

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Hundreds? No... I am pretty consistent at securing at least one date if I go out and get 3 or 4 numbers, though.

 

[Flames]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Hundreds? No... I am pretty consistent at securing at least one date if I go out and get 3 or 4 numbers, though.

What I'm saying is Maths doesn't come into it Numbers give you experience but that doesn't neccerserily give you better results forget that line of thinking.

 

[NarrowJ]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Hundreds? No... I am pretty consistent at securing at least one date if I go out and get 3 or 4 numbers, though.

What I'm saying is Maths doesn't come into it Numbers give you experience but that doesn't neccerserily give you better results forget that line of thinking.

Right, I agree with you! I think Franco's original comment regarding number close to date ratio was just more of a "morale builder"

 

[Flames]

Re: Confused... texting advice that doesn't seem to be worki

Hundreds? No... I am pretty consistent at securing at least one date if I go out and get 3 or 4 numbers, though.

What I'm saying is Maths doesn't come into it Numbers give you experience but that doesn't neccerserily give you better results forget that line of thinking.

Right, I agree with you! I think Franco's original comment regarding number close to date ratio was just more of a "morale builder"

Yeah, now that you mention it..