Deep diving issues…

[diegoC]

I know I'm just starting and I haven't approach a lot (few girls really) to get enough experience in my conversations skills. Nonetheless, I guess you guys could help me if you can relate to my experience when you started out.

When I approach or start talking to a girl next to me (I still have to struggle with AA quite a bit. Working hard on that to start approaching like a mad man), after the opening (direct if I approach or situational if she's next to me), I usually say some small talk, maybe a little tease (need to work on this a lot as well as chase and sexual frames), and then I start with topics like "What do you do?" to start deep diving.

I don't think the deep dive goes so well yet. Sometimes a topic like work is a bad one. Today, for example, I stayed on that topic and she clearly didn't want to talk about that. I took a little to long to change it and is was a killer for the interaction.

In other approach, when I was deep diving, a girl told me if I was a psychologist. Although, the interaction wasn't bad. I got her number but it was no way perfect (almost no tease, neither chase nor sexual frames. Man, need to improve). Anyway, she kinda has a good point. I'm asking lots of why's and if she told me that it may be that I'm not doing it very well, dont know. May have been some shit test just because it's unusual for someone to ask this kind of questions (my response was something like "I'm just curious").

Well, any pointers about deep diving (I've already read every post related to the topic, that's why I'm making this thread)?

Cheers!

PS: My fundamentals, at least before the interaction, are good. I can see that I get attention from girls. So, that is not an issue.

 

[trashKENNUT]

diegoC,

In other approach, when I was deep diving, a girl told me if I was a psychologist. Although, the interaction wasn't bad. I got her number but it was no way perfect (almost no tease, neither chase nor sexual frames. Man, need to improve). Anyway, she kinda has a good point. I'm asking lots of why's and if she told me that it may be that I'm not doing it very well, dont know. May have been some shit test just because it's unusual for someone to ask this kind of questions (my response was something like "I'm just curious").

Have some breaks from questions like why's after you deep dive, Have some light conversation. It is like diving into a deep ocean and never try to get some air. She asking, might be a shit test, but also it boils down to not having light conversation in between.

Zac

 

[Chase]

Diego-

Check this article out on getting stuck on topics you'd do better moving off of: Don't Get Hung Up on Topics.

To expand on what Zac mentioned about throwing some "light conversation" in between questions, be aware of how many questions you're asking and try to insert statements instead if you aren't getting her asking things back. For an example of this, see Conversation Example.

Basically, if you ask more than 3 or 4 questions in a row, it starts feeling like an interrogation, and you'll want to take some of the pressure off by talking a little about yourself (or, alternately, if you can pull it off right, by putting a little social pressure on her by letting the conversation die down after she answers, and just you being very comfortable and smiling a little and looking around and waiting for her to reinitiate - though this one may be a bit harder to pull off consistently when you're just starting out).

Chase

 

[diegoC]

Check this article out on getting stuck on topics you'd do better moving off of: Don't Get Hung Up on Topics.

To expand on what Zac mentioned about throwing some "light conversation" in between questions, be aware of how many questions you're asking and try to insert statements instead if you aren't getting her asking things back. For an example of this, see Conversation Example.

Yeah, I've actually read both (remember Chase, I'm a theory-guy who is just gonna start practicing like crazy jeje). That's why I felt stupid not getting off of the topic, I knew better.

The conversation example is great but, unlike the post of getting hung up on topics, you just need to practice a lot more to get good at it. Aiming for that, for sure.

Cheers!

 

[Tyme2k]

You'll hear me say this a ton, theory is useless. We can give advice to you until our faces turn blue and your ears bleed. Still you will get AA and conversations will not flow the way you like.

Keep immersing yourself. Why don't you try becoming a better conversationalist in every aspect of life? You must know that game is not only about women... You should be talking to everyone, learning how to create connections. This makes it less daunting and becomes more natural. Try it out.

 

[The Tool]

I have a very specific post coming up on this topic soon. Its a big one, hopeing for it to be in tactics by the end of the week. Its pretty long so ive been writing it out on paper first.

 

[diegoC]

You'll hear me say this a ton, theory is useless. We can give advice to you until our faces turn blue and your ears bleed. Still you will get AA and conversations will not flow the way you like.

I understand your point Tyme but you can't say it's useless. I'm sure (I hope) you are referring that if you don't go out there and approach/talk to people then it won't make you better. That's for sure. If one only reads, at best, he will be able to give advice based on theory, not on experience.

You must know that game is not only about women... You should be talking to everyone, learning how to create connections.

Actually, as I've stated before, I was trying to get better with girls before I found this place. One of the many things I discovered for myself is that in fact you have to be a social person. Before, I never talked to the taxi drivers so I started doing it, and stuff like that.

Although, I must say, lately I've not been doing it quite as often as I should.

I have a very specific post coming up on this topic soon. Its a big one, hopeing for it to be in tactics by the end of the week. Its pretty long so ive been writing it out on paper first.

Nice Tool! I already want to see it in the Girlschase's home and read it to get some insights.

Cheers!

 

[Tyme2k]

Useless is a bit extreme, agreed. The point I'm trying to make is guys tend to get overly caught up on theory. Theory itself when not being applied is what's useless.

You must be in field applying what you learned and learning on your own. Create your own theories and learn from experience.

I for one, have shattered PUA community beliefs and what theory states as not possible, I did this by being in field and releasing theory. If I was living based on what I read from Chase and other pro's, I would have said it wasn't possible, and stopped before actually gaining the experience myself in order to not waste precious time. Instead I strived to learn on my own and was happily rewarded.

I also notice that guys try to justify their learning especially when pro's like Tyler and Chase say it's essential to study and GO OUT. Justify it all day, but it wont make you any better.

To actually see and feel results you should game first theory/study second. Break down what you did in a journal and apply what you know to learn YOUR lessons.

I am a firm believer that we all will have different lessons and learn in our own ways, but eventually we all come to the same conclusion as long as we continue to improve.

So don't get me wrong, I have probably studied more theory than most guys here and definitely know it's value, however I know from experience what is the best path to take. If I could go back I would not have learned any theory and just gamed as hard as I could writing a journal as I went examining my mistakes and wins. I feel I am held back from theory, there are situations where I'm like oh this is bad I have no reference and this article told me x, now I cant do x because that wont work or maybe I could try x like this article... Oops too long girl is gone missed opportunity and loss of experience.

 

[diegoC]

Theory itself when not being applied is what's useless.

True true.

If I was living based on what I read from Chase and other pro's, I would have said it wasn't possible, and stopped before actually gaining the experience myself in order to not waste precious time. Instead I strived to learn on my own and was happily rewarded.

It's funny because when I first heard about PUA was when I read The Game (as many, I'm sure). A friend recommended it to me. I believe what I read, I really did, but I thought that all that facade/act was not something I liked.

Years later when I decided I wanted to improve because I knew I could be with really hot girls I just went out and started discovering things by my own. Although I almost never approached (AA), I found things like fundamentals (posture, walk, elite eye contact, using peripherals, etc) and other stuff.

That's why, when I found this forum, I was delighted. There was a game that rely in being yourself, not some kind of performing act. I related to so many post because they were conclusion I had already arrived by myself.

To actually see and feel results you should game first theory/study second. Break down what you did in a journal and apply what you know to learn YOUR lessons.

If you MUST do one first: go out. Having the time to do both, do it. But practice is what makes you better, sure. No discussion.

Cheers!