- Joined
- Dec 6, 2012
- Messages
- 1,458
This encounter took place over three different days over the span of a week and a half. The write up is pretty long.
The girl is four years older than me, and is a hard working yet highly creative and eccentric type. It seems that she’s suffered quite a bit of trauma earlier in her life, which perhaps explains her behavior with me and her eccentricity.
I am also posting this because there are lots of things I did that I shouldn’t have done, mainly setting up frame encounters and compliance battles, especially via texting before our main meeting. It’s a good case of why not to do this. I was far too much of a “puppy dog” in this case, and my “nice guy” history really shone through in some situations by rewarding bad behavior. I’ve learned how this really conveys the importance of frames and expectation setting early on.
Comments would be helpful, I could have absolutely done a lot of things better, but it’s still progress.
Wednesday 11/6:
I approached and gave my number to at a Starbucks on Wednesday. Normally I do not give MY number to a girl, but in this case she was busy taking a timed assessment test she just started on her computer. I noticed her on the way to the bathroom sitting on a couch, and I approached her on the way back by commenting on how unique her purse was, which she accepted. I asked her if she’s a creative type, and she said she likes poetry. I sat down next to her on the couch and was about to start hooking and deep diving about her poetry, when she said she’s busy taking her test and can’t talk now. My phone was back at a different coffee table far away, and I simply told her that I understand she’s busy, but I’d like to get to know her better and that she should call me. I persisted a little, she didn’t immediately accept but I told her to hand me her phone, I put my number in and my name, then left.
I got a mysterious call from her later that night, and she left a message basically asking why I, a stranger, approached her at the starbucks and what I wanted from her (hahaha). So I called back three hours later and playfully told her that the reason I approached her was because I thought she was pretty cute and that I’d like to get to know her better, among other things like asking about her and about the poetry she writes, and what she was doing at Starbucks that night. We were deep diving on the phone call, but I kept it to about 13 minutes and we agree to meet at Starbucks again on Saturday at 7.
On Friday 11/8, I get this:
Her 1208: Hi stranger, does the idea of earning extra income as an insurance agent appeal to you?
Me 1220: Hey stranger, we’ve just met and you’re already interviewing me for work? Scorpio…inquisitive, probing, AND opportunistic ;-) <She told me she is a scorpio on the phone call>
Me 1313: So anyway, tomorrow at 7 still good?
Her 1313: I can’t swamped with work?
Me 1314: When would you like to reschedule? <Give her the benefit of the doubt that she’s not flaking outright>
Her 1317: I am in a relationship so just so you know. <Attempt to disqualify me>
Her 1317: I am also two decades your senior. <Another attempt to disqualify me>
Me 1319: Whoa missy, who said I was looking for a girlfriend? Where is your mind right now? <Asking where she got this idea from, and framing it as her thinking of me in this capacity>
Her 1320: Haha ok. I will touch base
Her 1320: My mind in the gutter.
Me 1321: So you’re a trouble maker, eh? <Trying to spin this as a sexual frame>
She didn’t respond, and I never attempted to reach out to her again. But then suddenly, I get this random phone call at 7:02pm on Saturday 11/9, a day later:
Her: “Hey, how’s it going stranger? I was just wondering what you’re doing right now, and if you’d like to grab coffee with me?”
Me: “Hey, nice to hear from you. I thought you were busy tonight…”
Her: “Haha, yeah, but I actually finished my work early and I was thinking you and I could go grab coffee and get to know each other for a little while. What are you up to?”
Me: “Oh, cool, well I was just about to nap, and I’m meeting up with a friend at 10, but we can go grab coffee for a little while…” <In retrospect, maybe should have made it slightly more challenging i.e. I’m busy right now but why don’t we try for tomorrow afternoon?>
We chatted a little more on the phone and agreed on a time, but either way it was set. I was about to take a nap before meeting my friends at 10, so I was literally doing nothing. And just like that, instead of having nothing to do I had an insta-date. I guess these things happen in this lifestyle, cool!
Coffee date:
She calls me at 7:38 and asks where I am (even though we agreed to 7:40) and I tell her I’ll be there in five minutes. When I show up, I find that she’s in the bathroom and now I’m waiting inside. When she comes out, I notice that she has a very vibrant and eccentric manner of presenting herself, very sexual and sensual and she gives me strong, exciting eye contact. When she walks out, I give her a small hug and introduce with a chase frame: “What sorts of trouble have you gotten into today?” to which she replies “lots of trouble as always” with a small laugh.
We were hanging out for about an hour, I bought her coffee (mistake in retrospect) and we deep dived a whole lot. I found out about her parents, her childhood, her deepest dreams and future goals, and shared mine. She is a pretty spiritual person, so we talked about spirituality (and other’s lack of spirituality) thoroughly that night. Overall her body language was also positive, I tapped her on the elbow when making points and once or twice on the leg near the knee, and also noticed that sometimes if I’d make fun of her or say something funny about her she’d hit me playfully.
Where I screwed it all up that night:
Out of the blue, she throws this out there:
Her: “I have an idea, let’s go do something crazy”
Me: “Oh?”
Her: “Yeah, let’s go have an adventure.”
Me: “Hmm, adventures are fun.” <she starts putting on her coat and I help her with it, and we walk out of starbucks. I lead her by the small of her back, and her body language still seems positive>
Her: “I have to go drop this off at my car, let’s see if there’s anything around here.”
She walks to her car to drop something off…I’m trying to think of what to do, and her responses so far have been warm, so I thought it would be a good time to go for the pull…
Me: “Hey, you said earlier you like drinks, right?”
Her: “Yeah, I do”
Me: “Well, why don’t we go get a nightcap?”
Her: “Sure, where would we do it?”
Me: “Hmm, maybe we could go to my place?” <Mistake 1, setting my place as THE place?>
Her: “Oh, I don’t think that’s a good idea. I don’t go to people’s places.”
Me: “Why is that?”
Her: “I just don’t do it with people that I’ve just met.”
Me: “What are you insinuating?”
…brief pause as we both stare blankly at each other…
Me: “Oh, right, didn’t you say earlier your mind was in the gutter?” <I was referring to her text before, but still…Huge mistake here, I must have said something that really freaked the shit out of her>
Her: “…So, I’ll be in touch. Thanks for coffee!” <Quick hug and she leaves quickly and starts walking to her car>
Me: “Oh, you’ll be in touch?”
Her: “Yeah, I’ll be in touch.” <As she is walking off>
When we parted ways it was about 8:35pm.
This text exchange happened later in the night:
Her 2200: “Hey, thanks for great beautiful night. I am not upset over your request. I am not comfortable with request but it’s nothing personal against you. You are great company. We can talk and be friends. If you have email I can exchange poetry and info on career etc.” <Blatantly trying to friend zone me, I’m not having it>
Me 2230: “I like the eloquence of your text, glad you had fun, and I enjoyed your company too. However, I don’t feel the same way, maybe something more or less. I don’t think I would be able to control myself.” <Trying to get out of the friend zone and giving her a choice of continuing to see me as not a friend, or not at all, this is my “all-in”>
Her 2231: “I completely understand! Good luck with your career outlook. It was great meeting you.” <Not what I wanted to hear back>
Me 2232: “Same to you, great outlook on life. By the way, if I may ask, what are you uncomfortable with?” <Said out of curiosity and in retrospect I should have said this first, but no matter….>
Her 2353: “I don’t feel great going over to strangers houses after the first meeting. Maybe after we have met at least multiple times. It’s just a boundary issues that is all. No personal indictment. I hand out at my friends houses all the time, but I already know them. But you are just a beautiful stranger to me who is just getting better acquainted with me.” <Hmm, it seems like there is still one out here, and frankly I have nothing left to lose at this point, so…>
Me (next day) 1134: “Haha, well stranger…I feel like you still owe me that crazy adventure you left me hanging on before you ran away! Glad you think I am beautiful though; I hope you’re not just saying that for other reasons…” <I was initially going to say “….saying that to get in my pants ;-),” don’t know why I changed this since honestly I don’t have anything left to lose with her at this point>
Her 1156: “Stranger epiphany”
Me 1204: “?”
I thought this was a lost cause, so I didn’t bother with anything else with her and moved on. Until a week later…
Saturday 11/16:
I was at the gym working out when I get this, and the corresponding text exchange:
Her 1615: Stranger, I am single again. Great feeling to be untied. In fact, broke up with my bf. And lets get together at my large empty house that I am no longer living in. Haha.
Me 1643: Hey stranger, sounds like quite the troublesome situation. What’s your schedule looking like?
Her 1647: I am in the house now studying laundry. There is still utilities and a full house free of use. Hahaha. I even have an air mattress stored in my trunk to get rid of. It’s cold here since the landlord is in China and the thermostat is inside his quarters. No one lives here the house is being foreclosed. Kitchen bathroom bedroom dining room all free and the house is empty
<…okay, is this a booty call? I start being a little more sexual…I decided to drop some of my plans that day to take advantage of the window of opportunity. In retrospect this was handled poorly, but anyway…>
Me 1654: Haha, I remember you said you like it cold…but I just might have to warm you up ;-). I’m in Virginia but finishing up at the gym. Where is your house?
Her 1656: [CITY]. It’s like I live in a FREE hotel!!!!! Haha. <Okay, she didn’t give me a specific address, so…>
Me 1657: You’ll have to tell me where it is if you want me to get there….
Her 1702: [Address]. I am going to my house later to gather my belongings shower return here night to study. Make shift office.
Me 1705: What kind of wine do you like. <I think I should bring something over. This is where my mistakes really got going because now she asks for tons of shit from me and I keep the convo going way too long>
Her 1706: Sweets arbo mist coolers we have the fridge
Her 1707: Tirimitsu
Her 1708: And pillows and a fluffy blanket I have an air mattress for my room but we will need to put it back in my trunk later <I look at this list and I think “what the hell?” And I mishandled my responses because at this point I’m thinking “sweet I’m getting laid!” so I should just change my plans and comply because I’m already victorious, but I think this way, way, way too early. Lesson for the future: you’re not in till you’re actually in, stick to the formula and don’t let her USE you.>
Her 1709: And bring a space heater if you have one.
Her 1709: Sorry I am high maintenance <….You don’t say….well shit, I’ve put myself in quite the pickle now, how can I get out of this>
Me 1711: What are arbo mist coolers? I’m heading back to [CITY], I can swing by now if you prefer. <Shit, should have just said “I’m on my way.”>
Her 1712: They are fluffy girly drinks ask the cashier.
Her 1712: It’s up to you but I am doing laundry and have pms so you best swing when I am nicer <Uhh….okay, so now you’re giving conflicting attitudes. I decide that all this sounds like too much damn work, why do this when instead…>
Me 1717: Why don’t you just come to me, I have a furnished apartment.
Her 1717: Roommates?
Me 1718: Nope. People live upstairs but it’s separate.
Her 1718: Address?
...Anyway, we agree on 10pm, and continuing on to other parts of this text exchange….
Her 1735: Perfect, 10:00 is good, I don’t have PMS just a bit depressed on my cycle and after my breakup…..
Me 1736: And I have just the thing to make you feel better. <I am reading over this and realizing now how pointless long text exchanges are. Seriously, this is just stupid>
Her 1737: No surprises what is it….no body parts for tonight
<She goes into a LONG list of everything she approves and doesn’t approve, I ignore this for the most part>
Me 1743: If you keep doing that, I don’t know if I’ll be able to control myself. You can bring whatever you like. I have some chocolate and a very comfortable bed. We can watch a movie. <Why did I bring up a bed? Dumb, dumb, dumb….>
Her 1744: No sex remember I am on my cycle. And please don’t turn into a hybrid alien. <Uhhh, what? Worried now that this might be a terrible idea. I ignored the first comment, I am also done with texting>
Me 1746: See you at 10.
I agreed to chocolate because I already had some in the house, so there was no extra effort on my part. The wine, on the other hand, I already brought up and I can’t go back on my word.
Me 1822: Can’t find wine coolers, what else do you like?
Me 1822: Smirnoff ice or a Riesling?
Her 1823: Bailey’s Irish Cream
Me 1823: Haha, honey, I am at a wine store. Lol. <I decide she has a minute to tell me or else I’m just going to get whatever I feel like>
Her 1824: Oh. Get whatever <I see this and went and paid for the one I already picked>
Her 1825: Wine
Her 1826: Zinfandel <At this point I was already in my car with the wine, and I’ve spent too much effort on this already>
Her 1827: Rose wine is ok too.
Me 1827: Too late, Riesling
Her 1828: Text me a picture of it honey
Me 1828: Driving
Her 1830: Ok once you get home I never had it
Me 1830: It’s good. <I never texted her a picture>
Fast forward to 10:00pm:
I went out for dinner, then came home and am chilling now. She calls me and tells me she’s outside, and asks me to go get her. Understandable, where I live its dark and it’s a little confusing to find the entry, so I go out and get her. Right off the bat I see that she’s at least somewhat flirtatious and sexually charged. I give her a hug and a kiss on the cheek and she immediately accepted. Her body language: she’s touching me actively, so I went for hand holding and she accepted.
As we get inside I have her follow me around as I show her the house. She is surprised at how nice it is, and that there are “no body parts” inside (Ok, weird thing to say) and I’m basically trying to convince her that I am a normal guy. Then I give her some wine, tell her we’re going to watch a movie, and we sit down on the couch to start picking a movie to watch. As we’re going this, we had a moment where our eyes met and we’re looking at each other, and SHE goes in for a kiss. Cool! We kiss each other, but then she starts saying that if I want to spend more time with her and do more with her that I need to play nice and go at her speed. She also says that if I’m good tonight and if we get to know each other she’ll be coming back for more, but if I’m not then she’s going to leave and I’ll never see her again. I tell her that we should go with a flow that’s comfortable for both of us, and while she initially objected to this later on in the night she said the exact same thing. I still messed up in the beginning.
Lesson: Learn to SEE her game.
I was never able to get her into the bed with me. Even after we were making out and she was getting very turned on, she would still refuse to go and sit on the bed. We even went into my room but she refused to sit on the bed and instead sat on the exercise unit. Ugh. These are times when her demeanor would suddenly get super serious; I responded by going and doing something physical with her (kissing or feeling her) after she finished. She would turn on again but still give tons of resistance.
Some notable exchanges:
<early in the night>
Her: Call me a princess?
Me: Does that mean you’re going to call me prince charming?
Her: Call me princess, please? If you like me, aren’t you okay with calling me a Princess? <I had no idea how to respond to these types of challenges>
Me: I do like you, but you are silly and cute.
Her: So you don’t like me? <About to get up to leave and kind of pissed off>
Me: I do like you, but like you by your real name. Are you going to call me Prince charming? <Not handled properly>
Moved onto a different subject altogether after this.
I think this kind of give and take went on pretty much throughout the whole night: she’s demanding of many things from me. Many, many times she asked ME compliance requests, like “can you go get me a glass of wine honey?” in a commanding voice as she's sitting next to me, and my response to all these was pretty much “okay, let’s go get it together. Come with me.” A lot of times she was absolutely dumbfounded when I told her that she should come with me, and that I wasn’t going to bring it to her while she sits there waiting. Was this the appropriate way to handle this, or should I have complied with her requests to get her wine out of being the host? In retrospect, I am not sure why I handled this in that manner, as I am normally fine with bringing things to people when they need it. On some level I had a deep impression that she was trying to use me to make herself feel better by how I could focus everything around her and how she could command me around. I don't know why. Accurate, or am I being a jerk?
Either way, some requests felt a little ridiculous like the princess frame. I think this stems partly from not setting the right frames at the outset. I had to sometimes insist that she comes with me and does things my way. I don’t think I provided the proper rewards after she followed nor gave her good reasons why she should, but this is something I am still learning.
Me: <On the couch making out heavily and clothes are coming off> “Let’s go to the bed, I promise I’ll be good ;-).”
Her: “I don’t think so.”
Me: “Okay, I promise I’ll be bad, let’s go anyway.”
Her: <Bursts out laughing, but I still cannot convince her>
I succeed in taking off everything above her waist, and she has me take off all my clothes and goes down on me. I couldn’t take off her pants, she kept resisting because “she’s on her cycle,” and even though I put my hands into her jeans to squeeze her ass I didn’t feel around for pads, etc. It’s definitely a common LMR excuse though =/. We didn’t have any penetrative sex, but we did fool around to third base. The whole situation was a bit uncomfortable because we’re on the couch still and I can’t get her to move with me to the bed. I should have just laid down a blanket on the floor and fooled around with her that way, but it didn’t cross my mind at the time. When I got up to move one last time she started to put on her clothes, and succeeded. I was exhausted at this whole process and a part of me just didn’t care anymore! Yikes, not a good attitude to have, but I will correct this in the future. She asks what time it is, and when I tell her it's almost 1 she says she HAS to go.
We made plans then, at her suggestion, to meet in the morning and shower together after having breakfast, so I let her go home at 1:00am. She wanted more wine and chocolate, I instead gave her more touching and physical contact to make her feel good, then let her walk out on her own.
Then as I’m lying in bed about to sleep, another text:
Her 0145: I am doing you a favor by letting you know I won’t be coming back to you in the morning or anytime thereafter. I made a mistake because I still love my bf. <I didn’t know whether to laugh at this or be confused. But don’t judge, I have to learn not to judge…>
Me 0150: It was wonderful to spend time and connect with you, I am glad you came to see me. <chase frame>
Her 0153:
Me 0154: Looking forward to our next crazy adventure ;-) <ignore her statements, she has done this before so she might call me again anyway>
Monday 11/18:
Surprise! I get a call from her while I’m at the gym, and she wants to hang out with me. She tried to convince me to meet her at a public place for food, I turn it around and tell her we should meet at her big empty house. This time, as I already had plans, I wasn’t so quick to see her as before. I make her wait, tell her I’m going to dinner with friends and will be free around 10. When I text her around 10 telling her I’m almost done:
Me 2142: How’s it looking? I can get there around 10:30-10:45
Her 2148: Hi, I am staying in tonight babe. It’s cold and windy and I don’t feel like going out.
Her 2149: And my bf and me just got back tonight
Her 2149: Looks as though we will remain penpals <Ah, I see you’re trying to friend zone me yet again…>
Me 2152: Haha, maybe more maybe less ;-)…our next crazy adventure will wait.
Her 2152: Right on honey!
That night really wasn’t a loss, I had something to do anyway and I think this has shown me the importance also of not being TOO available and letting a girl you’re with push you around.
The girl is four years older than me, and is a hard working yet highly creative and eccentric type. It seems that she’s suffered quite a bit of trauma earlier in her life, which perhaps explains her behavior with me and her eccentricity.
I am also posting this because there are lots of things I did that I shouldn’t have done, mainly setting up frame encounters and compliance battles, especially via texting before our main meeting. It’s a good case of why not to do this. I was far too much of a “puppy dog” in this case, and my “nice guy” history really shone through in some situations by rewarding bad behavior. I’ve learned how this really conveys the importance of frames and expectation setting early on.
Comments would be helpful, I could have absolutely done a lot of things better, but it’s still progress.
Wednesday 11/6:
I approached and gave my number to at a Starbucks on Wednesday. Normally I do not give MY number to a girl, but in this case she was busy taking a timed assessment test she just started on her computer. I noticed her on the way to the bathroom sitting on a couch, and I approached her on the way back by commenting on how unique her purse was, which she accepted. I asked her if she’s a creative type, and she said she likes poetry. I sat down next to her on the couch and was about to start hooking and deep diving about her poetry, when she said she’s busy taking her test and can’t talk now. My phone was back at a different coffee table far away, and I simply told her that I understand she’s busy, but I’d like to get to know her better and that she should call me. I persisted a little, she didn’t immediately accept but I told her to hand me her phone, I put my number in and my name, then left.
I got a mysterious call from her later that night, and she left a message basically asking why I, a stranger, approached her at the starbucks and what I wanted from her (hahaha). So I called back three hours later and playfully told her that the reason I approached her was because I thought she was pretty cute and that I’d like to get to know her better, among other things like asking about her and about the poetry she writes, and what she was doing at Starbucks that night. We were deep diving on the phone call, but I kept it to about 13 minutes and we agree to meet at Starbucks again on Saturday at 7.
On Friday 11/8, I get this:
Her 1208: Hi stranger, does the idea of earning extra income as an insurance agent appeal to you?
Me 1220: Hey stranger, we’ve just met and you’re already interviewing me for work? Scorpio…inquisitive, probing, AND opportunistic ;-) <She told me she is a scorpio on the phone call>
Me 1313: So anyway, tomorrow at 7 still good?
Her 1313: I can’t swamped with work?
Me 1314: When would you like to reschedule? <Give her the benefit of the doubt that she’s not flaking outright>
Her 1317: I am in a relationship so just so you know. <Attempt to disqualify me>
Her 1317: I am also two decades your senior. <Another attempt to disqualify me>
Me 1319: Whoa missy, who said I was looking for a girlfriend? Where is your mind right now? <Asking where she got this idea from, and framing it as her thinking of me in this capacity>
Her 1320: Haha ok. I will touch base
Her 1320: My mind in the gutter.
Me 1321: So you’re a trouble maker, eh? <Trying to spin this as a sexual frame>
She didn’t respond, and I never attempted to reach out to her again. But then suddenly, I get this random phone call at 7:02pm on Saturday 11/9, a day later:
Her: “Hey, how’s it going stranger? I was just wondering what you’re doing right now, and if you’d like to grab coffee with me?”
Me: “Hey, nice to hear from you. I thought you were busy tonight…”
Her: “Haha, yeah, but I actually finished my work early and I was thinking you and I could go grab coffee and get to know each other for a little while. What are you up to?”
Me: “Oh, cool, well I was just about to nap, and I’m meeting up with a friend at 10, but we can go grab coffee for a little while…” <In retrospect, maybe should have made it slightly more challenging i.e. I’m busy right now but why don’t we try for tomorrow afternoon?>
We chatted a little more on the phone and agreed on a time, but either way it was set. I was about to take a nap before meeting my friends at 10, so I was literally doing nothing. And just like that, instead of having nothing to do I had an insta-date. I guess these things happen in this lifestyle, cool!
Coffee date:
She calls me at 7:38 and asks where I am (even though we agreed to 7:40) and I tell her I’ll be there in five minutes. When I show up, I find that she’s in the bathroom and now I’m waiting inside. When she comes out, I notice that she has a very vibrant and eccentric manner of presenting herself, very sexual and sensual and she gives me strong, exciting eye contact. When she walks out, I give her a small hug and introduce with a chase frame: “What sorts of trouble have you gotten into today?” to which she replies “lots of trouble as always” with a small laugh.
We were hanging out for about an hour, I bought her coffee (mistake in retrospect) and we deep dived a whole lot. I found out about her parents, her childhood, her deepest dreams and future goals, and shared mine. She is a pretty spiritual person, so we talked about spirituality (and other’s lack of spirituality) thoroughly that night. Overall her body language was also positive, I tapped her on the elbow when making points and once or twice on the leg near the knee, and also noticed that sometimes if I’d make fun of her or say something funny about her she’d hit me playfully.
Where I screwed it all up that night:
Out of the blue, she throws this out there:
Her: “I have an idea, let’s go do something crazy”
Me: “Oh?”
Her: “Yeah, let’s go have an adventure.”
Me: “Hmm, adventures are fun.” <she starts putting on her coat and I help her with it, and we walk out of starbucks. I lead her by the small of her back, and her body language still seems positive>
Her: “I have to go drop this off at my car, let’s see if there’s anything around here.”
She walks to her car to drop something off…I’m trying to think of what to do, and her responses so far have been warm, so I thought it would be a good time to go for the pull…
Me: “Hey, you said earlier you like drinks, right?”
Her: “Yeah, I do”
Me: “Well, why don’t we go get a nightcap?”
Her: “Sure, where would we do it?”
Me: “Hmm, maybe we could go to my place?” <Mistake 1, setting my place as THE place?>
Her: “Oh, I don’t think that’s a good idea. I don’t go to people’s places.”
Me: “Why is that?”
Her: “I just don’t do it with people that I’ve just met.”
Me: “What are you insinuating?”
…brief pause as we both stare blankly at each other…
Me: “Oh, right, didn’t you say earlier your mind was in the gutter?” <I was referring to her text before, but still…Huge mistake here, I must have said something that really freaked the shit out of her>
Her: “…So, I’ll be in touch. Thanks for coffee!” <Quick hug and she leaves quickly and starts walking to her car>
Me: “Oh, you’ll be in touch?”
Her: “Yeah, I’ll be in touch.” <As she is walking off>
When we parted ways it was about 8:35pm.
This text exchange happened later in the night:
Her 2200: “Hey, thanks for great beautiful night. I am not upset over your request. I am not comfortable with request but it’s nothing personal against you. You are great company. We can talk and be friends. If you have email I can exchange poetry and info on career etc.” <Blatantly trying to friend zone me, I’m not having it>
Me 2230: “I like the eloquence of your text, glad you had fun, and I enjoyed your company too. However, I don’t feel the same way, maybe something more or less. I don’t think I would be able to control myself.” <Trying to get out of the friend zone and giving her a choice of continuing to see me as not a friend, or not at all, this is my “all-in”>
Her 2231: “I completely understand! Good luck with your career outlook. It was great meeting you.” <Not what I wanted to hear back>
Me 2232: “Same to you, great outlook on life. By the way, if I may ask, what are you uncomfortable with?” <Said out of curiosity and in retrospect I should have said this first, but no matter….>
Her 2353: “I don’t feel great going over to strangers houses after the first meeting. Maybe after we have met at least multiple times. It’s just a boundary issues that is all. No personal indictment. I hand out at my friends houses all the time, but I already know them. But you are just a beautiful stranger to me who is just getting better acquainted with me.” <Hmm, it seems like there is still one out here, and frankly I have nothing left to lose at this point, so…>
Me (next day) 1134: “Haha, well stranger…I feel like you still owe me that crazy adventure you left me hanging on before you ran away! Glad you think I am beautiful though; I hope you’re not just saying that for other reasons…” <I was initially going to say “….saying that to get in my pants ;-),” don’t know why I changed this since honestly I don’t have anything left to lose with her at this point>
Her 1156: “Stranger epiphany”
Me 1204: “?”
I thought this was a lost cause, so I didn’t bother with anything else with her and moved on. Until a week later…
Saturday 11/16:
I was at the gym working out when I get this, and the corresponding text exchange:
Her 1615: Stranger, I am single again. Great feeling to be untied. In fact, broke up with my bf. And lets get together at my large empty house that I am no longer living in. Haha.
Me 1643: Hey stranger, sounds like quite the troublesome situation. What’s your schedule looking like?
Her 1647: I am in the house now studying laundry. There is still utilities and a full house free of use. Hahaha. I even have an air mattress stored in my trunk to get rid of. It’s cold here since the landlord is in China and the thermostat is inside his quarters. No one lives here the house is being foreclosed. Kitchen bathroom bedroom dining room all free and the house is empty
<…okay, is this a booty call? I start being a little more sexual…I decided to drop some of my plans that day to take advantage of the window of opportunity. In retrospect this was handled poorly, but anyway…>
Me 1654: Haha, I remember you said you like it cold…but I just might have to warm you up ;-). I’m in Virginia but finishing up at the gym. Where is your house?
Her 1656: [CITY]. It’s like I live in a FREE hotel!!!!! Haha. <Okay, she didn’t give me a specific address, so…>
Me 1657: You’ll have to tell me where it is if you want me to get there….
Her 1702: [Address]. I am going to my house later to gather my belongings shower return here night to study. Make shift office.
Me 1705: What kind of wine do you like. <I think I should bring something over. This is where my mistakes really got going because now she asks for tons of shit from me and I keep the convo going way too long>
Her 1706: Sweets arbo mist coolers we have the fridge
Her 1707: Tirimitsu
Her 1708: And pillows and a fluffy blanket I have an air mattress for my room but we will need to put it back in my trunk later <I look at this list and I think “what the hell?” And I mishandled my responses because at this point I’m thinking “sweet I’m getting laid!” so I should just change my plans and comply because I’m already victorious, but I think this way, way, way too early. Lesson for the future: you’re not in till you’re actually in, stick to the formula and don’t let her USE you.>
Her 1709: And bring a space heater if you have one.
Her 1709: Sorry I am high maintenance <….You don’t say….well shit, I’ve put myself in quite the pickle now, how can I get out of this>
Me 1711: What are arbo mist coolers? I’m heading back to [CITY], I can swing by now if you prefer. <Shit, should have just said “I’m on my way.”>
Her 1712: They are fluffy girly drinks ask the cashier.
Her 1712: It’s up to you but I am doing laundry and have pms so you best swing when I am nicer <Uhh….okay, so now you’re giving conflicting attitudes. I decide that all this sounds like too much damn work, why do this when instead…>
Me 1717: Why don’t you just come to me, I have a furnished apartment.
Her 1717: Roommates?
Me 1718: Nope. People live upstairs but it’s separate.
Her 1718: Address?
...Anyway, we agree on 10pm, and continuing on to other parts of this text exchange….
Her 1735: Perfect, 10:00 is good, I don’t have PMS just a bit depressed on my cycle and after my breakup…..
Me 1736: And I have just the thing to make you feel better. <I am reading over this and realizing now how pointless long text exchanges are. Seriously, this is just stupid>
Her 1737: No surprises what is it….no body parts for tonight
<She goes into a LONG list of everything she approves and doesn’t approve, I ignore this for the most part>
Me 1743: If you keep doing that, I don’t know if I’ll be able to control myself. You can bring whatever you like. I have some chocolate and a very comfortable bed. We can watch a movie. <Why did I bring up a bed? Dumb, dumb, dumb….>
Her 1744: No sex remember I am on my cycle. And please don’t turn into a hybrid alien. <Uhhh, what? Worried now that this might be a terrible idea. I ignored the first comment, I am also done with texting>
Me 1746: See you at 10.
I agreed to chocolate because I already had some in the house, so there was no extra effort on my part. The wine, on the other hand, I already brought up and I can’t go back on my word.
Me 1822: Can’t find wine coolers, what else do you like?
Me 1822: Smirnoff ice or a Riesling?
Her 1823: Bailey’s Irish Cream
Me 1823: Haha, honey, I am at a wine store. Lol. <I decide she has a minute to tell me or else I’m just going to get whatever I feel like>
Her 1824: Oh. Get whatever <I see this and went and paid for the one I already picked>
Her 1825: Wine
Her 1826: Zinfandel <At this point I was already in my car with the wine, and I’ve spent too much effort on this already>
Her 1827: Rose wine is ok too.
Me 1827: Too late, Riesling
Her 1828: Text me a picture of it honey
Me 1828: Driving
Her 1830: Ok once you get home I never had it
Me 1830: It’s good. <I never texted her a picture>
Fast forward to 10:00pm:
I went out for dinner, then came home and am chilling now. She calls me and tells me she’s outside, and asks me to go get her. Understandable, where I live its dark and it’s a little confusing to find the entry, so I go out and get her. Right off the bat I see that she’s at least somewhat flirtatious and sexually charged. I give her a hug and a kiss on the cheek and she immediately accepted. Her body language: she’s touching me actively, so I went for hand holding and she accepted.
As we get inside I have her follow me around as I show her the house. She is surprised at how nice it is, and that there are “no body parts” inside (Ok, weird thing to say) and I’m basically trying to convince her that I am a normal guy. Then I give her some wine, tell her we’re going to watch a movie, and we sit down on the couch to start picking a movie to watch. As we’re going this, we had a moment where our eyes met and we’re looking at each other, and SHE goes in for a kiss. Cool! We kiss each other, but then she starts saying that if I want to spend more time with her and do more with her that I need to play nice and go at her speed. She also says that if I’m good tonight and if we get to know each other she’ll be coming back for more, but if I’m not then she’s going to leave and I’ll never see her again. I tell her that we should go with a flow that’s comfortable for both of us, and while she initially objected to this later on in the night she said the exact same thing. I still messed up in the beginning.
Lesson: Learn to SEE her game.
I was never able to get her into the bed with me. Even after we were making out and she was getting very turned on, she would still refuse to go and sit on the bed. We even went into my room but she refused to sit on the bed and instead sat on the exercise unit. Ugh. These are times when her demeanor would suddenly get super serious; I responded by going and doing something physical with her (kissing or feeling her) after she finished. She would turn on again but still give tons of resistance.
Some notable exchanges:
<early in the night>
Her: Call me a princess?
Me: Does that mean you’re going to call me prince charming?
Her: Call me princess, please? If you like me, aren’t you okay with calling me a Princess? <I had no idea how to respond to these types of challenges>
Me: I do like you, but you are silly and cute.
Her: So you don’t like me? <About to get up to leave and kind of pissed off>
Me: I do like you, but like you by your real name. Are you going to call me Prince charming? <Not handled properly>
Moved onto a different subject altogether after this.
I think this kind of give and take went on pretty much throughout the whole night: she’s demanding of many things from me. Many, many times she asked ME compliance requests, like “can you go get me a glass of wine honey?” in a commanding voice as she's sitting next to me, and my response to all these was pretty much “okay, let’s go get it together. Come with me.” A lot of times she was absolutely dumbfounded when I told her that she should come with me, and that I wasn’t going to bring it to her while she sits there waiting. Was this the appropriate way to handle this, or should I have complied with her requests to get her wine out of being the host? In retrospect, I am not sure why I handled this in that manner, as I am normally fine with bringing things to people when they need it. On some level I had a deep impression that she was trying to use me to make herself feel better by how I could focus everything around her and how she could command me around. I don't know why. Accurate, or am I being a jerk?
Either way, some requests felt a little ridiculous like the princess frame. I think this stems partly from not setting the right frames at the outset. I had to sometimes insist that she comes with me and does things my way. I don’t think I provided the proper rewards after she followed nor gave her good reasons why she should, but this is something I am still learning.
Me: <On the couch making out heavily and clothes are coming off> “Let’s go to the bed, I promise I’ll be good ;-).”
Her: “I don’t think so.”
Me: “Okay, I promise I’ll be bad, let’s go anyway.”
Her: <Bursts out laughing, but I still cannot convince her>
I succeed in taking off everything above her waist, and she has me take off all my clothes and goes down on me. I couldn’t take off her pants, she kept resisting because “she’s on her cycle,” and even though I put my hands into her jeans to squeeze her ass I didn’t feel around for pads, etc. It’s definitely a common LMR excuse though =/. We didn’t have any penetrative sex, but we did fool around to third base. The whole situation was a bit uncomfortable because we’re on the couch still and I can’t get her to move with me to the bed. I should have just laid down a blanket on the floor and fooled around with her that way, but it didn’t cross my mind at the time. When I got up to move one last time she started to put on her clothes, and succeeded. I was exhausted at this whole process and a part of me just didn’t care anymore! Yikes, not a good attitude to have, but I will correct this in the future. She asks what time it is, and when I tell her it's almost 1 she says she HAS to go.
We made plans then, at her suggestion, to meet in the morning and shower together after having breakfast, so I let her go home at 1:00am. She wanted more wine and chocolate, I instead gave her more touching and physical contact to make her feel good, then let her walk out on her own.
Then as I’m lying in bed about to sleep, another text:
Her 0145: I am doing you a favor by letting you know I won’t be coming back to you in the morning or anytime thereafter. I made a mistake because I still love my bf. <I didn’t know whether to laugh at this or be confused. But don’t judge, I have to learn not to judge…>
Me 0150: It was wonderful to spend time and connect with you, I am glad you came to see me. <chase frame>
Her 0153:
Me 0154: Looking forward to our next crazy adventure ;-) <ignore her statements, she has done this before so she might call me again anyway>
Monday 11/18:
Surprise! I get a call from her while I’m at the gym, and she wants to hang out with me. She tried to convince me to meet her at a public place for food, I turn it around and tell her we should meet at her big empty house. This time, as I already had plans, I wasn’t so quick to see her as before. I make her wait, tell her I’m going to dinner with friends and will be free around 10. When I text her around 10 telling her I’m almost done:
Me 2142: How’s it looking? I can get there around 10:30-10:45
Her 2148: Hi, I am staying in tonight babe. It’s cold and windy and I don’t feel like going out.
Her 2149: And my bf and me just got back tonight
Her 2149: Looks as though we will remain penpals <Ah, I see you’re trying to friend zone me yet again…>
Me 2152: Haha, maybe more maybe less ;-)…our next crazy adventure will wait.
Her 2152: Right on honey!
That night really wasn’t a loss, I had something to do anyway and I think this has shown me the importance also of not being TOO available and letting a girl you’re with push you around.
