FR+ FR+ : Lots of Sex Talk, Bad Pull

[johnydones]

Hey guys i will try to be brief on this one, but i doubt it will be
I met this girl on Saturday and we went out for a drink today. We actually kissed 6 months ago in a different venue (she remembered my name lol , i just dont know how i remember hers but i guessed it right )
When we met today, she told me i was weird to her for asking for her phone 5 min after meeting her (i reckon it's not weird but she was surprised).

Anyway, we went for a drink and about half an hour in we started talking about sex , the most unusual places we did it etc... i knew i will try to pull her or try to go to her place , so i said let's go and on our way to the car i said

ME: Hey, how about we go to your place, get some drinks and watch a movie
HER: I knew it , you guys just can't resist to ask for sex on a first date
ME: What are you talking about, i said we should just watch a movie
HER: Movie implies sex, drink implies sex, just because i said sex and penis doesnt mean i want sex NOW !
ME: Then i would have said , let's go have sex. But ok , we will not have sex if that's what you are thinking , not if you begged me
HER: *Laughs* Yea , you know , you were a bit more polite then other guys , at least you asked me to go out for a drink first, some just come and say "lets go to my place" But anyway, i will catch a buss here
ME: Why, my car is right here
HER: We will not go to my place
ME: Why not, i just said we will not have sex , why not get a drink and watch a movie
HER: No, i have to get up early
ME: Cmon, let me give you a ride home (she follows)

In front of her place: (first few lines repeated several times, that was me persisting )

ME: So , you are not going to invite me for 15 minutes at least
HER: Why is it so important to you to come up to my place?
ME: It's not , but i reckon since i told you we will not have sex, there is no other reason why not
HER: I do not invite guys to my place on first date, its my rule. Why you (meaning guys in general) can't wait for us to see each other few times before insisting so much. I slept with my first boyfriend after 3.5 months and with second one after 1.5 months (jeezus and i was busting my balls with "not boyfriend material" stories, guess that didnt work out well)
ME: Ok ,that sounds like your internal frame that you want to keep no matter what
HER: Exactly

I changed the subject briefly , she forgot about our previous subject then i asked her

ME: How good of a kisser you think you are , on a scale of 1-10
HER: a 10
ME: I want to test that , do you want to kiss me now ?
HER: Yes
We kissed briefly and she said:
HER: I dont think this will work out between us, i really like you but ... i dont know (this shit intrigued me and it still does, what do you think she meant ?)

We kissed once again then she said she really has to get up early , i said ok then cya, we kissed goodbye.

Conclusion:

Persisted like crazy , maybe went overboard a bit , but i would have killed myself if i went home without trying to pull. Maybe i should have tried to pull while still in the bar.
What do you think , did i botch it or im good to invite her for another date (if so , should i send a msg tomorrow or day after tomorrow?)

-JD

 

[Zoro]

Hey John,

This seems like it was a logical battle which is like summoning a drought on the fields of pootang. Logical battle as in you engaged the logical side of her instead of the emotional side.

Here's what might have been a little more exciting.

ME: Hey, how about we go to your place, get some drinks and watch a movie
HER: I knew it , you guys just can't resist to ask for sex on a first date
ME: Just ask? So simple, I like it. *chuckles*
HER: haha. Well, we are definitely not having sex...

(though because of the way you brought up going to her place she still ends up on guard)

I think the issue came before you brought up going to her place. To bring it up out of nowhere is a little jarring and unnatural to the flow of conversation. A better way to bring it up is when you have a good reason to or notice an escalation window. Perhaps if you were talking about movies, you mention a movie and she says she loves that movie AND owns it, theres your signal. Or she loves cooking and just stocked the place.

However, this specifically is not something I'm experienced in since I usually invite girls over my place unless they invite me to theirs.

 

[johnydones]

Hey J Wick , Thanks for your reply ,

Nice alternative to my logical take on this , i forget some stuff i read here until i fail one time, then its lesson learned. And yea , movie topic did come up, i should have said something like "I like movies too, if you want we can get out of here and go watch a movie instead" , something like that.

To update you on recent events, i texted her next day if she is up for a coffee and she apologized and said she already has plans with her friends. I don't know if she freaked out or something , did not seem that way when we parted but who knows.

 

[Grand Pooba]

ME: Hey, how about we go to your place, get some drinks and watch a movie
HER: I knew it , you guys just can't resist to ask for sex on a first date
ME: What are you talking about, i said we should just watch a movie
HER: Movie implies sex, drink implies sex, just because i said sex and penis doesnt mean i want sex NOW !
ME: Then i would have said , let's go have sex. But ok , we will not have sex if that's what you are thinking , not if you begged me
HER: *Laughs* Yea , you know , you were a bit more polite then other guys , at least you asked me to go out for a drink first, some just come and say "lets go to my place" But anyway, i will catch a buss here
ME: Why, my car is right here
HER: We will not go to my place
ME: Why not, i just said we will not have sex , why not get a drink and watch a movie
HER: No, i have to get up early
ME: Cmon, let me give you a ride home (she follows)

All sorts of things went wrong here. Your response to her first frame battle was what started it. She suggested that you but want to have sex, and you denied it. In this denial is like throwing your hands up and saying "oh just kidding," but she can see right through it because that's what most guys do. A better response is something that actually accuses HER of bringing up sex (which she did), like "I never said anything about sex. Is that what you've been thinking about this entire time, miss dirty mind? Because I am not THAT easy..."

You verified her frame with the second response - if I wanted it, I'd ask for it - validated her challenge. After this point it was GG for you. Additionally, by denying it you removed the sexy dominance of your masculinity. She definitely wanted sex, but you denied wanting it and came off unmasculine.

In front of her place: (first few lines repeated several times, that was me persisting )

ME: So , you are not going to invite me for 15 minutes at least
HER: Why is it so important to you to come up to my place?
ME: It's not , but i reckon since i told you we will not have sex, there is no other reason why not
HER: I do not invite guys to my place on first date, its my rule. Why you (meaning guys in general) can't wait for us to see each other few times before insisting so much. I slept with my first boyfriend after 3.5 months and with second one after 1.5 months (jeezus and i was busting my balls with "not boyfriend material" stories, guess that didnt work out well)
ME: Ok ,that sounds like your internal frame that you want to keep no matter what
HER: Exactly

This sounds desperate. She then added another rule for you to jump over. Your line at the very end again verifies her frame. I would suggest not doing that again in the future, it just further seeds the idea in her mind.

I changed the subject briefly , she forgot about our previous subject then i asked her

ME: How good of a kisser you think you are , on a scale of 1-10
HER: a 10
ME: I want to test that , do you want to kiss me now ?
HER: Yes
We kissed briefly and she said:
HER: I dont think this will work out between us, i really like you but ... i dont know (this shit intrigued me and it still does, what do you think she meant ?)

We kissed once again then she said she really has to get up early , i said ok then cya, we kissed goodbye.

You're pretty much in either boyfriend land or friend land at this point. My advice is to tell her that you had an amazing time with her and then stop contact for a month or two. Play it cool, dont chase unless she chases you, and then see where she is at at that time.

 

[johnydones]

Great answer ozzo ,

I learned my lesson without doubt, so i guess that's a win of some sort as well.

Actually we met last night in a club. I did not see her and i was with some of my girl friends, and few girls that i hooked up earlier in that club (preselection rules) . she approached me and said she can't get rid of some guy and asked if she can stay with me for a bit.

I think that seeing me with these girls she wanted a bit of preselection of her own. She said we can grab a coffee today so i will see how it goes. To be honest i do not think it will go anywhere, but i wont mind a bit more XP since im quite new. If it turns out she friend-zoned me i will cut contact and if we meet in a club again , i never mind having hot friends around.

-JD

 

[johnydones]

Just in case you are interested how this played out ,

we met today on a bench in a park , talked a bit and she started giving me compliments , i was like i know where this is going and i was right , she began a friend zone speech. So in order to at least gain some XP out of it and do not make the same mistake again , i listened what she had to say with a poker face.

She said :

"Few nights ago when we were together i realized that i am still deeply in love with another guy with who i broke up recently, so i can't start a new relationship now , if you want we can remain friends or we can fuck off altogether"

I was unmoved by it (i really am , i dont care if shit go wrong anymore, i just want to learn and not make the same mistake twice) and she was surprised.

ME: I am not a kind of guy that can be friends with girls i want to have sex with, and i am glad you are honest with me about this , i respect that.
HER: Really, i thought you will be angry with me
ME: Of course not , you can tell me everything you dont like about me , i can never be mad for being honest with me
HER: Omg really , so , what if we had sex and i told you there are some things i dont like and i would like to be done differently, would you change it ?
ME: Of course, every girl is different , some like it one way , some like it another way
HER: *Nodding in disbelief* You are so right *huge smile* So let me get this straight , i choose a young and inexperienced guy over you who is so mature and experienced. I am a lost cause.
ME: Do you generally know what you want in life ?
HER: Usually i do
ME: Let me tell you what we will do *i took her hand* . I had a really great time with you ,you are a really cool girl, but we will fuck off altogether as you said. *i stood up, leaned and cheek kissed her* Here's a goodbye kiss , you deserve it for being honest. When you figure out what you want, you have my number and if i am still available we can go for a drink again. Cya

I walked away and left her in disbelief .

Huge lesson learned here, and what i like the most is i don't really care it went south. It was a botch up on first date but i went on that date with intention to test some stuff out, a training ground if you want.
Please tell me what you think about my parting shot

-JD