Franco's BRILLIANT Meta Frame concept Vs Her Internal Blueprint

[PaulieFlyn10]

So guys I'm back with a LONG & interesting one.. Ive been enjoying myself with a couple of women, practicing and digging into materials (especially the old ones)

Then i stumbled on Franco's concept of meta frame. You might have come acrosse it before. However, I think it's excellent. And something not discussed enough. According to him, the meta frame is like the King frame that tends to exist in a relationship. One that usually starts at the beginning.

He describes it as a girl creating swimming pool and making you swim in it. He further gave an example that reminded me of a girl in my class that has been tough to lay for A LOT of guys. So I'm wondering if she does this meta frame thing OR it's just her internal blueprint (I'll talk more about the situation after the example he gave)

So here's an example Franco used to explain the meta frame concept:

"The Meta Frame is a strong frame that she sets on you since the beginning.

It is “Meta” because it is on the mind level, at the level of a process of thinking, without you noticing that defines the interaction between you and her.

For example.. she may tell you her family story and go like this..

Her: “By the way my Dad is a priest..”

Her: “He taught me since childhood to believe in God”

Her: “He taught me the importance of the soul”

Her: “I believe souls have a special connection with each other”

Because of your testosterone and other damn hormones you focus on her gorgeous legs.

You forget to follow what happens on the mind level and let her set your identity in the relationship.

Then each time you will interact with her you will face the topic of the “soul” and “purity”

Then she will be the one to define how much the two of you are connecting.. or not.. and she will put a price to that!

With this Meta Frame of her “souls have a special connection with each other,” she begins to control you.

You “swim” in a swimming pool she has defined for you since the first moment.

She will do whatever she wants with you.

She will force you to marry because “souls connect in marriage.”

If you do not buy her the car that she likes she will feel that your souls are not connected enough.

At the end of the day, if you let her control you her primitive, feminine nature will come to the surface"


Now, back to the situation i talked about. I just joined this class 2 months ago. So far I've heard from 3 guys how they failed to lay this particular girl. She's really hot. Like a 9

All of them fingered her (not sure if they all got blow jobs). But they all complained about the same issue: it took them a loooong time (happened before i joined). They also mentioned how she values "emotional connection" , likes to play mind games(she also tells them this) and requires a ton of comfort building.

But one thing stood out as a common theme:
She said "sex is about being soul mates" that it's deep and should happen with someone you have soul ties. Something all of them went on with. She usually does this at the beginning and continues throughout.

So i was wondering... do you think this is a meta frame concept where she's setting this "no sex unless we're soulmates" frame like Franco talked about

OR

It's just her internal blueprint. That is, she values emotional connection, comfort etc as a prerequisite before sex

Also, what would be your strategy and techniques for gaming her to actually lay her and faster than others

 

[topcat]

Also, what would be your strategy and techniques for gaming her to actually lay her and faster than others

Get her alone/on a date. Deep dive her and make her feel like we’re “soul mates” within an hour and a half, while covertly turning her on and slowly introducing sexual topics that correlate with her “meta frame” but introduce new ways of framing it that gel well with the fact that she is turned on NOW. Pull. Lay.

 

[topcat]

Also i would not use the intel from the other boys to gauge my own approach to her. It sounds like they were going in like standard chumps and signalled they wanted the pussy and would wait around for it, before she signalled she wanted dick.

 

[Teevster]

Then i stumbled on Franco's concept of meta frame. You might have come acrosse it before. However, I think it's excellent. And something not discussed enough. According to him, the meta frame is like the King frame that tends to exist in a relationship. One that usually starts at the beginning.

The concept of meta-frame is a concept initially proposed (or at least, popularized) by Swinggcat (to my knowledge, although old school guys like MrSex4NYC may have discussed it before him) - but again, Franco (old Franco - as in Zarathustra_fi) posted on the forums around the same time as swinggcat (mASF-forums), so obviously they interacted. I also got inspired a lot by Swinggcat and it is still an essensial part of my game - in fact I wrote about my own take on meta-frames (although very close to Swinggcat's interpretation).
What Is the 'Meta Frame'?
How to Set a Meta-Frame for Successful Seductions

But yes, Franco is great.

Some clarifications are necessary though. Social frames according to Gunwitch define her social template ("or blueprint" - ie. the way she perceives and interacts with the social world). The meta-frame is on the other hand generally defined by "who is in control of the interaction", and "who gets to control the frames of and within the interaction" - who get to set the frames, and follows them.

Swinggcat claimed that this meta-frame can ultimately be reduced to the question of "who is chasing who" as whoever is chasing will naturally follow the frames set by the chased one, and the one being chased as the power of the interaction. Hence is obsession with "prizability" - who is the "prize" in the interaction.

The point here is not that her meta-frame is "all about connection" - as that would that would look more like a social frame to me. It becomes a meta-frame when that becomes a frame that she uses to control the interaction (like in the example above) - it is not (only) the content of the frame that matters (unlike in the case of pure social frames), but more the outcome, the instrumental purpose of the frame: to test you, and make you submit to the frame (the meta-frame is inherently linked to "testing"). Simply put: the meta-frame is defined by her being in power to enforce that social frame of hers on you ("connection is everything"), making you commit and submit to it.

The meta-frame is META for that reason. It is not necessarily a type of frame - as in, being defined by its content, but rather as a frame that is totally procedural. and instrumental. This is a nuance many fail to grasp.

--
Beware of a trap - namely being overly categorical when thinking about meta-frames. Many men who read this material end up going into the other extreme: being disagreeable and doing everything they can to NOT comply to anything she says. That is often a mistake. It is ok to submit to certain of her frames, in fact often it is necessary - as in, you have no choice (be overly disagreeable, and she says "fuck it" and you are out. Remember that, you gaining the control of the meta-frame requires compliance, and until you get enough compliance, you cannot always be too assertive. Gaining control of the meta-frame is a process, it is gradual. By default, unless you are dealing with a girl who is super-compliant from the get-go, girls will more or less control the meta-frame due to the social context (women are by default seen as "the prize" in almost all societies). The key is to not let her reinforce that frame, and gradually turn the tides and gradually, and covertly (preferably) make a coup and win back control of the meta-frame. That's an essensial part of what "game" is if you want to be overly theoretical.

At the end of the day, I think it is rather a of question of degree. Sometimes, lightly accepting some of her frames that do not go against the seduction process can be a smart thing in order to build rapport. But rapport in this case is a mean to an end - to be able to more easily get to set YOUR FRAMES or redefine (reframe) her FRAMES (or do both!) too to at least create somewhat of a balance, or better, set stronger frames than hers.

For example a frame of sexual freedom is one I won' oppose much, same with "trust" and even "connection" - however regarding the latter, I will accept the premise but eventually take part in changing the content of that frame by contributing to the definition of "connection" in a way that would redefine (or frame/reframe) "connection" as something involving frames that benefits me (freedom, non-judgemental, understanding, spontanous, adventurous.... you get it

Get her alone/on a date. Deep dive her and make her feel like we’re “soul mates” within an hour and a half, while covertly turning her on and slowly introducing sexual topics that correlate with her “meta frame” but introduce new ways of framing it that gel well with the fact that she is turned on NOW. Pull. Lay.

Basically this - accept some of her frames initially, but do so lightly in order to "lower her guard" and build rapport, and then use that as a leeway to gradually set your own frames.

The important takeaways are:
- Do not blindly follow or accept her frames and surely do not give her an easy time reinforcing frames that you do not agree with or that are not beneficial to the seduction process.
- Do not make it so that she is clearly in power - unlike most of her interactions with men. She may be in the beginning, but your role is to turn the tides. Oftentimes, this is a gradual process.
- Make sure you at least create a form of POWER-BALANCE - that is the minimal requirement, and sometimes, all that is necessary, although it depends on context.


---

Could you provide a link to the material?

-Teevster

 

[PaulieFlyn10]

The concept of meta-frame is a concept initially proposed (or at least, popularized) by Swinggcat (to my knowledge, although old school guys like MrSex4NYC may have discussed it before him) - but again, Franco (old Franco - as in Zarathustra_fi) posted on the forums around the same time as swinggcat (mASF-forums), so obviously they interacted. I also got inspired a lot by Swinggcat and it is still an essensial part of my game - in fact I wrote about my own take on meta-frames (although very close to Swinggcat's interpretation).
What Is the 'Meta Frame'?
How to Set a Meta-Frame for Successful Seductions

But yes, Franco is great.

Some clarifications are necessary though. Social frames according to Gunwitch define her social template ("or blueprint" - ie. the way she perceives and interacts with the social world). The meta-frame is on the other hand generally defined by "who is in control of the interaction", and "who gets to control the frames of and within the interaction" - who get to set the frames, and follows them.

Swinggcat claimed that this meta-frame can ultimately be reduced to the question of "who is chasing who" as whoever is chasing will naturally follow the frames set by the chased one, and the one being chased as the power of the interaction. Hence is obsession with "prizability" - who is the "prize" in the interaction.

The point here is not that her meta-frame is "all about connection" - as that would that would look more like a social frame to me. It becomes a meta-frame when that becomes a frame that she uses to control the interaction (like in the example above) - it is not (only) the content of the frame that matters (unlike in the case of pure social frames), but more the outcome, the instrumental purpose of the frame: to test you, and make you submit to the frame (the meta-frame is inherently linked to "testing"). Simply put: the meta-frame is defined by her being in power to enforce that social frame of hers on you ("connection is everything"), making you commit and submit to it.

The meta-frame is META for that reason. It is not necessarily a type of frame - as in, being defined by its content, but rather as a frame that is totally procedural. and instrumental. This is a nuance many fail to grasp.

--
Beware of a trap - namely being overly categorical when thinking about meta-frames. Many men who read this material end up going into the other extreme: being disagreeable and doing everything they can to NOT comply to anything she says. That is often a mistake. It is ok to submit to certain of her frames, in fact often it is necessary - as in, you have no choice (be overly disagreeable, and she says "fuck it" and you are out. Remember that, you gaining the control of the meta-frame requires compliance, and until you get enough compliance, you cannot always be too assertive. Gaining control of the meta-frame is a process, it is gradual. By default, unless you are dealing with a girl who is super-compliant from the get-go, girls will more or less control the meta-frame due to the social context (women are by default seen as "the prize" in almost all societies). The key is to not let her reinforce that frame, and gradually turn the tides and gradually, and covertly (preferably) make a coup and win back control of the meta-frame. That's an essensial part of what "game" is if you want to be overly theoretical.

At the end of the day, I think it is rather a of question of degree. Sometimes, lightly accepting some of her frames that does not go against the seduction process can be a smart thing in order to build rapport. But rapport in this case is a mean to an end - to be able to more easily get to set YOUR FRAMES or redefine (reframe) her FRAMES (or do both!) too to at least create somewhat of a balance, or better, set stronger frames than hers.

For example a frame of sexual freedom is one I won' oppose much, same with "trust" and even "connection" - however regarding the latter, I will accept the premise but eventually take part in changing the content of that frame by contributing to the definition of "connection" in a way that would redefine (or frame/reframe) "connection" as something involving frames that benefits me (freedom, non-judgemental, understanding, spontanous, adventurous.... you get it




Basically this - accept some of her frames initially, but do so lightly in order to "lower her guard" and build rapport, and then use that as a leeway to gradually set your own frames.

The important takeaways are:
- Do not blindly follow or accept her frames and surely do not give her an easy time reinforcing frames that you do not agree with or that are not beneficial to the seduction process.
- Do not make it so that she is clearly in power - unlike most of her interactions with men. She may be in the beginning, but your role is to turn the tides. Oftentimes, this is a gradual process.
- Make sure you at least create a form of POWER-BALANCE - that is the minimal requirement, and sometimes, all that is necessary, although it depends on context.


---

Could you provide a link to the material?

yeah, i see how a meta frame could be used as a test. Totally agree on entering her frame a bit to help steer things in the direction you like.

The material is from his blog:

How To Date A Girl The Meta Frame NLP And Seduction 4 – Franco Seduction

i've been reading his stuff on masf & his blog as well as 60 YOC