Hitting a woman

[Drck]

You have to have some boundaries, but be careful to be too uncompromising especially with new girl. What Ray described might work well with established relationship or more submissive girls, but it won't work that well with a new and more independent girl, she may easily perceive you as too structured, too stubborn, too uncompromising, and thus less attractive...

Zac is right, let's compare it to politics. Ted Cruz is too uncompromising, too structured. He might have huge respect but at the same time not many people really like him just because of that. He has no friends in senate, he doesn't make any compromises, it's "My way or highway". He says "I'll be there at 5 and I'm leaving exactly at 5", and he does exactly just that. He knows that women are late and he wants to change it: he asks for 100% and expects exactly 100%. Not so many people want to deal with him because they can never win...

Trump s different, smarter. He leaves some space for compromise because he knows that he is dealing with people and not with machines. He knows that most women are chronically late, he knows he can't really change it that much, but he can influence it - so he asks for 95% while expecting 85%. "Hey I'll be there at 4:50, be ready or I'm leaving". It's 4:50, she is still not there. So he calls her one more time, "Hey, I got to go, I really need to leave at 4:55, I have to be on time". Then he leaves at 4:55, regardless whether she's there or not. She feels the pressure, she feels some compromise, he gave her second chance, and he keeps all the respect. She has 'extra' 5 minutes for her crap, and he still have some spare time because it is not 5 yet... Good deal, Trump wins, again and again, because he pre-thinks things and because he leaves some choices to other people... He makes some compromises, he makes good deals... With Trump, it is "My way, but we can share highway". Some people don't like him because they can't win, they don't want to compromise, but more people like him because they can also win, at least something...

Obama is also different, he has no back bone. "Hey, I'll be there at 5 and then we are leaving", he says. He arrives at 5:10 because he is smart and already knows she will not be there. Indeed, she is not there. He waits to show patience, then he calls her at 5:20, then at 5:30 again. Finally she shows up at 5:45. She yells at him why is he so impatient, why can't he wait little bit, she throws a fit - and he has to apologize to her, feel sorry for her for the rest of the evening... perhaps he even buys her free dinner so she feels little bit better about him being so pushy and impatient... He asks for 70% and he gets 50%, but only on lucky days... On bad days he gets nothing, she lets him wait two hours and then she won't show up anyway... No good deals, no compromises, no wins, no respect... But he is very popular - he loses and appologizes, while the others win... Who wouldn't like guy like that..?

So a good way is to offer some compromise, while being more assertive in pursuing what you want...

 

[pks391]

You have to have some boundaries, but be careful to be too uncompromising especially with new girl. What Ray described might work well with established relationship or more submissive girls, but it won't work that well with a new and more independent girl, she may easily perceive you as too structured, too stubborn, too uncompromising, and thus less attractive...

Zac is right, let's compare it to politics. Ted Cruz is too uncompromising, too structured. He might have huge respect but at the same time not many people really like him just because of that. He has no friends in senate, he doesn't make any compromises, it's "My way or highway". He says "I'll be there at 5 and I'm leaving exactly at 5", and he does exactly just that. He knows that women are late and he wants to change it: he asks for 100% and expects exactly 100%. Not so many people want to deal with him because they can never win...

Trump s different, smarter. He leaves some space for compromise because he knows that he is dealing with people and not with machines. He knows that most women are chronically late, he knows he can't really change it that much, but he can influence it - so he asks for 95% while expecting 85%. "Hey I'll be there at 4:50, be ready or I'm leaving". It's 4:50, she is still not there. So he calls her one more time, "Hey, I got to go, I really need to leave at 4:55, I have to be on time". Then he leaves at 4:55, regardless whether she's there or not. She feels the pressure, she feels some compromise, he gave her second chance, and he keeps all the respect. She has 'extra' 5 minutes for her crap, and he still have some spare time because it is not 5 yet... Good deal, Trump wins, again and again, because he pre-thinks things and because he leaves some choices to other people... He makes some compromises, he makes good deals... With Trump, it is "My way, but we can share highway". Some people don't like him because they can't win, they don't want to compromise, but more people like him because they can also win, at least something...

Obama is also different, he has no back bone. "Hey, I'll be there at 5 and then we are leaving", he says. He arrives at 5:10 because he is smart and already knows she will not be there. Indeed, she is not there. He waits to show patience, then he calls her at 5:20, then at 5:30 again. Finally she shows up at 5:45. She yells at him why is he so impatient, why can't he wait little bit, she throws a fit - and he has to apologize to her, feel sorry for her for the rest of the evening... perhaps he even buys her free dinner so she feels little bit better about him being so pushy and impatient... He asks for 70% and he gets 50%, but only on lucky days... On bad days he gets nothing, she lets him wait two hours and then she won't show up anyway... No good deals, no compromises, no wins, no respect... But he is very popular - he loses and apologizes, while the others win... Who wouldn't like guy like that..?

So a good way is to offer some compromise, while being more assertive in pursuing what you want...

Interesting to see how the dynamic of the relationship changes once a guy gets married. I mean, once married, how can a guy keep his balance of power in the relationship even after compromising? Does marriage involve compromise on the guy's part as well?

 

[Drck]

Depending on personality, long term relationship might be little bit different than quick lays. The style here on GC is more focused on fast seduction, have some fun, get the girl to the bed, then usually move on on another one (although lots of guys are seeking relationships anyway).

For good relationships you should develop good frame. It is essentially the same thing over and over - less dependence on that girl, more leading, more decisions making, stronger frame,... Personally I believe that every man should make the major decisions in that relationship, while leaving the less important decisions to her. For example, you should decide where to move, rent or buy, what car,... Let her decide where to go for dinner or what color to paint the room. I also believe that man should be in charge of finances, especially when you have joint accounts. Women can count and can be good in math, but as far as finances they are usually clueless. They just have no clue or they don't care, who knows. I believe that guy should be able to make most, if not all decisions on his own, but this depend on what kind of girl you are with. If she is more submissive and passive, it is easy. If she is more independent and financially self-sufficient, she will need to have more 'space' and she will make more of her decisions, otherwise it will not work out...

A guy should also develop good boundaries. If you go to fitness Mo-We-Fr, keep doing the same regardless of what she says or does. If you see your friends twice a month, keep doing the same. Adjust your life to her, but don't necessary change your lifestyle...

Seek girls with similar interests, this is important but many times ignored because she is just so sweet. E.g. seek girl of the same religion, if religion is important to you or to her. Seek a girl who has similar interests like you - if you are a health freak, look for girls in fitness, not in the bar. If education is important to you, seek educated girl. You may not feel the difference first couple of years because you are blinded with love, but then the differences will bother you more and more...

Also, always monitor what she brings to the table vs what you bring. You don't want to end up paying for everything and working 60 hours a week, while she is staying home playing full time "housewife". Right...

 

[pks391]

Depending on personality, long term relationship might be little bit different than quick lays. The style here on GC is more focused on fast seduction, have some fun, get the girl to the bed, then usually move on on another one (although lots of guys are seeking relationships anyway).

For good relationships you should develop good frame. It is essentially the same thing over and over - less dependence on that girl, more leading, more decisions making, stronger frame,... Personally I believe that every man should make the major decisions in that relationship, while leaving the less important decisions to her. For example, you should decide where to move, rent or buy, what car,... Let her decide where to go for dinner or what color to paint the room. I also believe that man should be in charge of finances, especially when you have joint accounts. Women can count and can be good in math, but as far as finances they are usually clueless. They just have no clue or they don't care, who knows. I believe that guy should be able to make most, if not all decisions on his own, but this depend on what kind of girl you are with. If she is more submissive and passive, it is easy. If she is more independent and financially self-sufficient, she will need to have more 'space' and she will make more of her decisions, otherwise it will not work out...

A guy should also develop good boundaries. If you go to fitness Mo-We-Fr, keep doing the same regardless of what she says or does. If you see your friends twice a month, keep doing the same. Adjust your life to her, but don't necessary change your lifestyle...

Seek girls with similar interests, this is important but many times ignored because she is just so sweet. E.g. seek girl of the same religion, if religion is important to you or to her. Seek a girl who has similar interests like you - if you are a health freak, look for girls in fitness, not in the bar. If education is important to you, seek educated girl. You may not feel the difference first couple of years because you are blinded with love, but then the differences will bother you more and more...

Also, always monitor what she brings to the table vs what you bring. You don't want to end up paying for everything and working 60 hours a week, while she is staying home playing full time "housewife". Right...

Yes, in fact this is exactly what i think should be done. Seeking a girl with similar passions so that once the 2 year/7 year drop starts, there is still something worth keeping the relationship for.

 

[lux7]

When an argument is pointless, staying calm and stopping the argument with the threat of:

• 1. You leaving (her place / the place she's at) ;
  2. The two of you not spending more time together;
  3. She leaving (your place / the place you're at), possibly the best of all the 3

is THE most powerful thing you can do.
It reasserts your dominance and, even more important, how you hold sway over her (ie.: you're showing her that, at the end of the day, she WANTS to be with you).

PROVIDED you've got that much power on the relationship and you hold that much sway on the relationship and on her feelings.

It's not always that easy and not always possible.
While it's an ideal one should strive to move towards, I'd say most relationships for most guys, it's actually not even realistic.

Real life example when it was possible:

I had my ex (whom I really liked) being as angry as I'd ever seen her at me with passive aggressive behaviour. She still didn't dare lashing out.
As soon as I saw she wasn't willing to explain/talk rationally, I didn't try again to talk to her at all on the way home.
Then, surprise surprise, rather than taking the turn home, I turned for the bus stop for her to go home on her own.

You should have seen the look on her face.

And I told her "I'd rather you stay, BUT you have to change your mood and TALK to me. Normally and politely".

Her reply, in a downtrodden, feeble voice "but I can't change now all of a sudden". I pressed on, and as the bus approached and she stayed, I was now dealing with an utterly dominated woman. Broken, I would say (she said that so herself).
No amount of slapping could have pulled that off because I didn't need any physical power (which on the other hand would have made me look much much weaker).

So much so, that I thought it might have been way too big a display of power which might have created a chasm between us (she'd later spit out some of the anger again in the house once away from the immediate threat of being sent packing and I mucked it up, that's another story though).
Because the way I see, a great relationship is a team of two with you as the leader: you gotta be the leader, but not the owner of a puppet on a string (what I should have done basically after that was dealing with underlying causes, building her up and making her feel good).

NOTE: it was possible because:
1. We weren't in a fully committed relationship already and her fear of losing me was HIGH;
2. I was fully independent and able to move on

You can still do it in a relationship, but it gets harder if children and/or mutual goods are involved.
Read below for such a scenario.

Real life example when it was not possible:

Exactly the same girl!
We were now in a committed relationship. I was living in her place, I had no other place to go, all of my stuff was at her place, I was also dealing with A LOT in my life and was stressed and that would have made a break up or me walking away sooo much harder to pull off.

Now she accuses me of not doing much in her place (and she was probably right), a possible subconscious ploy to have me really committed in the long term.

Now I didn't have the same power and even more importantly I didn't have the same level of independence!
So remaining calm without the trump card of walking away or, even better, making her walk away, was not an option.
This is a case where you need to escalate or you're just taking a beating.
I attacked back by telling her she was the one not caring for me instead and brought some good arguments.

Since I was still a very powerful figure in her life, with a strong pull over her emotions, and still charming and able to win her over to my arguments and make her happy, guess what?
She went in a eyebeat from attacking to defensive ("oh, so you're saying I'm bad").

Again, even here, as long as you hold emotional power and you're the leader, then physical confrontation is for the weak and for those who have a problem themselves at controlling themselves.

NOTE: remember, all this power in confrontational situation is possible BECAUSE you can give her so much positive feelings in the good times and because you're able to make her happy at will -or close-.
"dark" power without good power dooms a relationship very quickly.
And physical beating is dark power overload.

 

[JaegerBeta92]

most will say this is Beta, Chode behavior

 

[pks391]

When an argument is pointless, staying calm and stopping the argument with the threat of:

• 1. You leaving (her place / the place she's at) ;
  2. The two of you not spending more time together;
  3. She leaving (your place / the place you're at), possibly the best of all the 3

is THE most powerful thing you can do.
It reasserts your dominance and, even more important, how you hold sway over her (ie.: you're showing her that, at the end of the day, she WANTS to be with you).

PROVIDED you've got that much power on the relationship and you hold that much sway on the relationship and on her feelings.

It's not always that easy and not always possible.
While it's an ideal one should strive to move towards, I'd say most relationships for most guys, it's actually not even realistic.

Real life example when it was possible:

I had my ex (whom I really liked) being as angry as I'd ever seen her at me with passive aggressive behaviour. She still didn't dare lashing out.
As soon as I saw she wasn't willing to explain/talk rationally, I didn't try again to talk to her at all on the way home.
Then, surprise surprise, rather than taking the turn home, I turned for the bus stop for her to go home on her own.

You should have seen the look on her face.

And I told her "I'd rather you stay, BUT you have to change your mood and TALK to me. Normally and politely".

Her reply, in a downtrodden, feeble voice "but I can't change now all of a sudden". I pressed on, and as the bus approached and she stayed, I was now dealing with an utterly dominated woman. Broken, I would say (she said that so herself).
No amount of slapping could have pulled that off because I didn't need any physical power (which on the other hand would have made me look much much weaker).

So much so, that I thought it might have been way too big a display of power which might have created a chasm between us (she'd later spit out some of the anger again in the house once away from the immediate threat of being sent packing and I mucked it up, that's another story though).
Because the way I see, a great relationship is a team of two with you as the leader: you gotta be the leader, but not the owner of a puppet on a string (what I should have done basically after that was dealing with underlying causes, building her up and making her feel good).

NOTE: it was possible because:
1. We weren't in a fully committed relationship already and her fear of losing me was HIGH;
2. I was fully independent and able to move on

You can still do it in a relationship, but it gets harder if children and/or mutual goods are involved.
Read below for such a scenario.

Real life example when it was not possible:

Exactly the same girl!
We were now in a committed relationship. I was living in her place, I had no other place to go, all of my stuff was at her place, I was also dealing with A LOT in my life and was stressed and that would have made a break up or me walking away sooo much harder to pull off.

Now she accuses me of not doing much in her place (and she was probably right), a possible subconscious ploy to have me really committed in the long term.

Now I didn't have the same power and even more importantly I didn't have the same level of independence!
So remaining calm without the trump card of walking away or, even better, making her walk away, was not an option.
This is a case where you need to escalate or you're just taking a beating.
I attacked back by telling her she was the one not caring for me instead and brought some good arguments.

Since I was still a very powerful figure in her life, with a strong pull over her emotions, and still charming and able to win her over to my arguments and make her happy, guess what?
She went in a eyebeat from attacking to defensive ("oh, so you're saying I'm bad").

Again, even here, as long as you hold emotional power and you're the leader, then physical confrontation is for the weak and for those who have a problem themselves at controlling themselves.

NOTE: remember, all this power in confrontational situation is possible BECAUSE you can give her so much positive feelings in the good times and because you're able to make her happy at will -or close-.
"dark" power without good power dooms a relationship very quickly.
And physical beating is dark power overload.

lux,
You really have stated some good points with your real life examples. I will take heed to those.

 

[lux7]

[
lux,
You really have stated some good points with your real life examples. I will take heed to those.

Thanks man, yeah, I think Chase talks about it a bit in the "steps" a relationship goes through.

Yet it's a major topic which might need its own article.
Your level of financial / living arrangement / future generations commitment in the relationship makes for a huge change on the dynamics and if we're talking about cool guys who could find other women, it usually moves on the woman's favour.

She'll have you tied down much harder now and in very practical ways, much much stronger than the simple "BF/GF" thing, which is only a verbal commitment after all. "verba volant" said the Latins, ie.: it flies away, it's worth for little, but your ass with all your loved shirts in the street or your house taken away if you wanna divorce... Boy, that does count .

 

[Dylweed]

When i was probably around 12 i had a 10 year old step sister and she was hanging out with her 11 year old female friend in her room. I was in a different room playing a computer game, and my sisters friend kept coming up to me while i was playing my game and she was messing with me. It started to piss me off. I told her to back off, and i made it very clear i was pissed and not having fun with her shit. She continued though, and suddenly she snuck up from behind me and stuck a dirty sock in my mouth. I got so pissed and stoop up and turned around and i punched her right in the shoulder. I was kind of surprised right after i did it that i did it. But she definitely stopped and never messed with me again haha I guess it was a good move. I was definitely not attracted to her either. However my dad definitely didn't seem happy with it and made me feel kinda guilty because he said i almost punched her in the breast.

 

[pks391]

When i was probably around 12 i had a 10 year old step sister and she was hanging out with her 11 year old female friend in her room. I was in a different room playing a computer game, and my sisters friend kept coming up to me while i was playing my game and she was messing with me. It started to piss me off. I told her to back off, and i made it very clear i was pissed and not having fun with her shit. She continued though, and suddenly she snuck up from behind me and stuck a dirty sock in my mouth. I got so pissed and stoop up and turned around and i punched her right in the shoulder. I was kind of surprised right after i did it that i did it. But she definitely stopped and never messed with me again haha I guess it was a good move. I was definitely not attracted to her either. However my dad definitely didn't seem happy with it and made me feel kinda guilty because he said i almost punched her in the breast.

Hahahaha funny....

 

[Dylweed]

Another quick story, i was hanging out with my ex gf for the first time in 4 months on the weekend. I was sitting next to her on a bench at a crowded zoo when i teased her about her nose hairs. I said, i gotta tell you something really serious. She was like okay. I said you should really trim your nose hairs (I could see them and i also found this hilarious). She was like "thats so mean, you know im self conscious" I kept finding it funny and said, "what? i mean it would only take you two seconds to trim them," i think that was when she slapped me on the face. I reacted instantly by yelling "HOLY SHIT!" I wasn't even mad, just very surprised. A family walking near by all turned and looked at me, I'm a very loud guy. The mom looked mad that i swore so loudly. I said to her"She slapped me!" They kind of started laughing, it was actually pretty funny.

 

[pks391]

Another quick story, i was hanging out with my ex gf for the first time in 4 months on the weekend. I was sitting next to her on a bench at a crowded zoo when i teased her about her nose hairs. I said, i gotta tell you something really serious. She was like okay. I said you should really trim your nose hairs (I could see them and i also found this hilarious). She was like "thats so mean, you know im self conscious" I kept finding it funny and said, "what? i mean it would only take you two seconds to trim them," i think that was when she slapped me on the face. I reacted instantly by yelling "HOLY SHIT!" I wasn't even mad, just very surprised. A family walking near by all turned and looked at me, I'm a very loud guy. The mom looked mad that i swore so loudly. I said to her"She slapped me!" They kind of started laughing, it was actually pretty funny.

Yeah, no girl has slapped me across the face yet....

 

[JaegerBeta92]

although i never would and never have, the times i have felt like hitting a woman is due to how confident and dominant, assertive they expect us guys to be, because of how they always expect us guys to take the lead and be the initiator.