FU Hostel social circle game. Help with sticking points!

[karanova]

TL;DR
1. How do I be more chill and less “gamey”
2. Handling a certain shit test (pronounce my name)?
3. Handling logistical options
4. Talking slower (doesn’t come up here, just something in general I need to work on)

background on me: 25, been studying game theory a long time but little real experience w girls


Quick summary. Met a group of girls (about 5) at a hostel. They are exchange students in uni.

I start by gaming the group and just teasing all of them. It’s a bit bumpy at first bc I have trouble figuring out which one I like best. It changes a few times and that creates some issues (e.g. girl A getting pissed when you are not as man to woman with her anymore).

I settle on this cute Finnish girl bc she is the most down to earth and intelligent seeming. I use a combo of light teasing negs etc to build attraction in group convo.

We go to a techno club and I decide I want to try and pull her. So I take her hand and lead her away off the dance floor. I lean up against a wall so she has to appear like she’s chasing me. She maybe realizes this and stands more to her side.

I like to use super standard old school routines like qualifiers (can you cook? I need a girl who cooks) and I hate you/love you emotional spikes. I then move into a bit of rapport. What does she study, what are her dreams etc. I build comfort with statements like I like you because you’re down to earth.

Unfortunately, her friend finds us, and takes a frame that I am hitting on this Finnish girl. I try to deflect with a Frame of I’m shy, she’s picking me up, they are bullying me, etc.

They laugh but Friend drags her away eventually.

I should add a complicating factor, there is a super hot Spanish girl who doesn’t know them well and is joining us tonight. So I am gaming her a bit as well. Which kind of hurts comfort a bit and makes me look like a player in a bad way to the Finnish girl. (This is not the purpose of the FR but I am a bit needy, physically and verbally w the Spanish girl so that’s what hampers that “set.”)

OK. So the night goes on. logistically, I don’t see anything super easy either way, since she’s with her friends so I leave a bit early after saying bye, giving her a hug and telling her I’ll miss her.

The next day, we all grab breakfast and things are bit more awkward with the Finnish girl. I can tell she’s still interested (she gets really jealous when the Spanish girl comes up and is trying to make conversation a bit) but not sure how to get back to where we were rapport-wise without isolating.

During this time she hits me with a really interesting shit test. She says, if you can pronounce my last name, I’ll buy you a drink. And she pushes her ID in front of me Now obviously trying to impress a girl is a terrible frame to be in. But I don’t know a way out of this in the moment that is calibrated (keep in mind we are back in daygame mode so crazy night game antics will not fly here). So I just accept the frame, figure out her name and pronounce it decently well. She is like that’s not bad, but I don’t like the frame and it’s kind of a missed moment.

Maybe a better way to handle it would be refusing, disqualify and saying sorry I don’t like girls with hard to pronounce last names. And once the pressure is off then make a goofy attempt if you want.

So in summary, how would you have handled logistics?
How would you handle the shit test?

for logistics: I think at the club should have tried to isolate again. Have her tell her friends, hey we’re gonna head out to x venue change (.eg food cause it’s late) take her on a walk, rapport, comfort, pull to hostel (before her friends arrive so there’s privacy)

I think I didn’t do this cause I psyched myself out. BUT still really proud of my progress bc taking a girls hand and leading her off the floor was something I could never do.

 

[Railer]

It’s a bit bumpy at first bc I have trouble figuring out which one I like best.

Maybe take your time to figure it out, then put more attention on the one and switch once certain. That can actually be exciting for the one you select in the end. Would switch once max though.

Frame of I’m shy

Maybe: "I’m totally innocent. Don’t even remember how we ended up here in the first place. Do you? [directed at Finnish girl]" Then launch into a we-bubble of "us having to be more careful. Next thing we know we end up prime suspects in something naughty".

there is a super hot Spanish girl who doesn’t know them well and is joining us tonight.

Easy. Even if super-hot, it’s probably not the hottest girl in the world. So, unless your dream girl comes along, consider sticking to your initial selection.

Reminds me of a similar situation in a hostel where the "super-hot" turned out to be great for generating some jealously … and then turned out to have a boyfriend anyway … and then turned out to be a stupid bitch I rather not court. So while the guy totally in love with that one went on a hike with her, I fucked the one who stayed at the hostel with me for the day. That would be the Finnish girl in your example

she gets really jealous when the Spanish girl comes up and is trying to make conversation

Maybe: Get up saying "Look how beautiful it’s outside. How about we finish our sandwiches at that bench on the porch?", isolating the Finnish girl.

if you can pronounce my last name, I’ll buy you a drink.

No big deal and actually a good sign. Just challenge back first: "A drink of my choosing, right? You know I like Hendrick’s …" Then launch into the attempt taking it as a fun game between the two of you. Ending with playfully-exhausted breath: "… damn, that was. Actually. Really. Hard."

still really proud of my progress bc taking a girls hand and leading her off the floor was something I could never do.

Props for the progress!

 

[karanova]

Thanks for the feedback. Makes sense.

I have no clue if I’ll ever see her again, but I wanted to text her something to stay in touch.

I sent her:

My philosopher
Hope you’re not too lost in thought

It’s a reference to something we talked about that she’s a very philosophical girl. no reply. My sense is it was a bit too needy/clingy.

Maybe something less interested and easier to respond to would be better.

Just some more lessons from this set.

 

[TheEcho]

Balancing intrigue and interest in text is driving me crazy lol. My thought here is "my" jumps the gun quite a bit, as for what to do? I'm not getting enough results to make recs yet.

 

[Will_V]

TL;DR
1. How do I be more chill and less “gamey”
2. Handling a certain shit test (pronounce my name)?
3. Handling logistical options
4. Talking slower (doesn’t come up here, just something in general I need to work on)

background on me: 25, been studying game theory a long time but little real experience w girls


Quick summary. Met a group of girls (about 5) at a hostel. They are exchange students in uni.

I start by gaming the group and just teasing all of them. It’s a bit bumpy at first bc I have trouble figuring out which one I like best. It changes a few times and that creates some issues (e.g. girl A getting pissed when you are not as man to woman with her anymore).

I settle on this cute Finnish girl bc she is the most down to earth and intelligent seeming. I use a combo of light teasing negs etc to build attraction in group convo.

We go to a techno club and I decide I want to try and pull her. So I take her hand and lead her away off the dance floor. I lean up against a wall so she has to appear like she’s chasing me. She maybe realizes this and stands more to her side.

I like to use super standard old school routines like qualifiers (can you cook? I need a girl who cooks) and I hate you/love you emotional spikes. I then move into a bit of rapport. What does she study, what are her dreams etc. I build comfort with statements like I like you because you’re down to earth.

Unfortunately, her friend finds us, and takes a frame that I am hitting on this Finnish girl. I try to deflect with a Frame of I’m shy, she’s picking me up, they are bullying me, etc.

They laugh but Friend drags her away eventually.

I should add a complicating factor, there is a super hot Spanish girl who doesn’t know them well and is joining us tonight. So I am gaming her a bit as well. Which kind of hurts comfort a bit and makes me look like a player in a bad way to the Finnish girl. (This is not the purpose of the FR but I am a bit needy, physically and verbally w the Spanish girl so that’s what hampers that “set.”)

OK. So the night goes on. logistically, I don’t see anything super easy either way, since she’s with her friends so I leave a bit early after saying bye, giving her a hug and telling her I’ll miss her.

The next day, we all grab breakfast and things are bit more awkward with the Finnish girl. I can tell she’s still interested (she gets really jealous when the Spanish girl comes up and is trying to make conversation a bit) but not sure how to get back to where we were rapport-wise without isolating.

During this time she hits me with a really interesting shit test. She says, if you can pronounce my last name, I’ll buy you a drink. And she pushes her ID in front of me Now obviously trying to impress a girl is a terrible frame to be in. But I don’t know a way out of this in the moment that is calibrated (keep in mind we are back in daygame mode so crazy night game antics will not fly here). So I just accept the frame, figure out her name and pronounce it decently well. She is like that’s not bad, but I don’t like the frame and it’s kind of a missed moment.

Maybe a better way to handle it would be refusing, disqualify and saying sorry I don’t like girls with hard to pronounce last names. And once the pressure is off then make a goofy attempt if you want.

So in summary, how would you have handled logistics?
How would you handle the shit test?

for logistics: I think at the club should have tried to isolate again. Have her tell her friends, hey we’re gonna head out to x venue change (.eg food cause it’s late) take her on a walk, rapport, comfort, pull to hostel (before her friends arrive so there’s privacy)

I think I didn’t do this cause I psyched myself out. BUT still really proud of my progress bc taking a girls hand and leading her off the floor was something I could never do.

For logistics, sounds like you need to simply have a plan and act on it. I didn't really see any obstacle or failed attempt to pull, more like you just felt hesitant because of the group aspect. You should always assume everyone is on your side and only needs to see that you're a cool dude to give their support.

The 'shit test' is not really a shit test imo but an awkward attempt on her part to get investment from you. Maybe she wanted you but thought you were being too cagey or something, so it's perhaps an assertive way of saying 'hey I'm here you know'. Some girls get competitive with you when they want attention. In these cases I think it's always good to tease a little to make it clear that you don't take her frame seriously, and then offer some investment in your own way. Like say something funny about her last name, give it an offhand (but warm) attempt like you don't really care, and then change the subject and build a new frame based on what you know is the underlying issue.

Saying something like 'I don't like girls with complicated last names' even if it's clear is a joke can be very hard for a girl to deal with when she already feels like your attainability is low, and maybe she'll just give up.

 

[karanova]

For logistics, sounds like you need to simply have a plan and act on it. I didn't really see any obstacle or failed attempt to pull, more like you just felt hesitant because of the group aspect. You should always assume everyone is on your side and only needs to see that you're a cool dude to give their support.

The 'shit test' is not really a shit test imo but an awkward attempt on her part to get investment from you. Maybe she wanted you but thought you were being too cagey or something, so it's perhaps an assertive way of saying 'hey I'm here you know'. Some girls get competitive with you when they want attention. In these cases I think it's always good to tease a little to make it clear that you don't take her frame seriously, and then offer some investment in your own way. Like say something funny about her last name, give it an offhand attempt like you don't really care, and then change the subject and build a new frame based on what you know is the underlying issue.

Saying something like 'I don't like girls with complicated last names' even if it's clear is a joke can be very hard for a girl to deal with when she already feels like your attainability is low, and maybe she'll just give up.

wow thanks a ton!
Maybe like “you are so eager for me to say your name, I love it. Umm ok but seriously, *try name* that’s my guess (flat tonality, stare, wait for her to fill silence qualify etc). ” then change topic.

makes sense. My follow up question is what new frame would you pursue that addresses the underlying issue? Maybe, A very high comfort frame. “You know what we have in common? We’re both very curious people. I feel like people aren’t curious anymore.” In a very sincere and warm tone. Eye contact would be very important as well to this frame!

As far as the text, I think it set off congruence issues. Like this guy is such a player why didn’t he just isolate me and have this convo in person. Or why is he going from I don’t care to my xyz super committed frame.

re logistics — yes, exactly! I never made an attempt because 1. Group 2. I was tired (had to leave town the next morning) 3. My younger brother is there with me and I’m afraid of him judging me, plus I can’t abandon him.

excuses? perhaps. Because at the end of the day if I could have spent the night w this chick I’d have traded off those other things (prooobably haha… I was pretty tired)

 

[Will_V]

Maybe like “you are so eager for me to say your name, I love it. Umm ok but seriously, *try name* that’s my guess (flat tonality, stare, wait for her to fill silence qualify etc) change topic”

Could be, still sounds a bit too much feeding into the combative frame, like you're trying to one-up her. I probably would have made some light hearted tease about her ID picture or something, squinted at it and murmured the name curiously, and then just handed it back and brought up a new thread that had potential for long term rapport.

edit: for a new frame it's hard to say what topic exactly, but overall I would give her a bit more straightforward attention and date-type interaction, so maybe a bit of deep diving mixed with playing around. The idea is to get her to chill out a bit and take the edge off her combativeness.

re logistics — yes, exactly! I never made an attempt because 1. Group 2. I was tired (had to leave town the next morning) 3. My younger brother is there with me and I’m afraid of him judging me, plus I can’t abandon him.

This probably worked in your favor and made you less needy, but you still need to have a plan to suggest that she leaves with you as there's not much point to the whole thing if you never actually do that, and she won't do it for you. But I'm sure you know this and you'll get more consistent with experience.