Is this relationship wrong for me?

[Bboy100]

Alright, so this post is partially a way of expressing myself, and part venting because I don't currently have anyone to talk to (as it is 2 am and I'm alone at home). As such, this post is basically going to be a bunch of information. Not all of it will be connected or related. Just specific things which have happened/are going on in my relationship right now. She is not currently my girlfriend, but I have told her I don't intend to sleep with other women. I now regret this. Mainly because as I got to know her better, I've started to question weather or not I want to continue pursuing this relationship.

HER ISSUES AND INSECURITIES WITHIN THE RELATIONSHIP:

I've been seeing this girl for about a month now. She's probably hands down the most amazing girl I've dated so far in many respects. In fact, when I first slept with her, I actually thought she was out of my league (I no longer feel this way).

Now...here's the thing. Despite everything she has going for her, she also has a lot of emotional baggage. Mainly due to the fact that the past few guys she dated basically dumped her after seeing her for a couple months without explanation. This has created some serious trust issues and insecurities for her. Also, she knows that I have a history of basically being a manwhore, so this makes it 10x worse for her. She's expressed to me multiple times that she's always afraid that I'm talking to some other girl or that I'm going to go hook up with someone else and leave her. In fact, there was even one instance wherein she admitted that she was considering cutting me off because she thinks "I'm just another girl to her". As a result of all this, I've made a point to demonstrate to her that I really am serious about her and that she actually means a lot to me. But I'm really not sure that this is enough. I think these other guys seriously damaged her psyche in a way which only time spent with me will heal. In the meantime, I feel that there is going to be some level of unwarranted distrust on her end (emotionally speaking. She's going out of her way to ignore her emotions and trust me anyway because she herself says I've done nothing to lose her trust in me. Regardless, the anxiety she feels around the situation is very real).

On a completely unrelated note...there's another behavior of hers which is even more concerning. When she drinks, she gets progressively more and more disrespectful. To the point where if she's blacked out, she'll basically become a different person.

When under the influence, she has said things like
"I haven't eaten all day. I know you've been trying to prevent me from eating cause you think I'm too fat" <---Never once have I mentioned her weight. She actually has a completely flat stomach. And I definitely wasn't preventing her from eating. Just so happened that she didn't get much to eat.

"Why do you always make fun of me? Actually, don't answer that. It's cause you want to feel better about yourself huh?" <-- I never actually make fun of her. I'll sometimes playfully tease her. And she usually perceives it as such, laughs along with it etc.

"If you don't take me home right now, I'm going to call an Uber and leave" <--I drove her home that night and she massaged my shoulders the entire car ride home than tried to have sex with me. I refused.

One time, when we were showering, she said "I'm gonna wash my makeup off now. So this pretty face is gonna be gone. You're gonna have to have sex with an ugly women after this".

"I have to ask you something. Are you seeing other girls?" When I told her I'm not, she basically accused me of lying and that I'm just playing her.

In general, her attitude becomes very hostile, aggressive and bitchy when she's drunk. But when she's sober, she's one of the sweetest, most caring, empathetic individuals you'll ever meet.

Mind you, this has only happened a few times. I always tell her the events of the previous night the next morning, and she's always thoroughly embarrassed and tells me she doesn't mean any of the things she said.

So, the next time we went out, a conversation around her drinking habits came up. She herself wants to cut down on her drinking as her parents were alcoholics and she fears becoming just like them. Also, she hates blacking out because she feels like she's lost control over her actions and she doesn't like that. Plus, she knows she can be kind of out of control when she's in that state. So I started telling her my opinion on how she should approach this problem and what I think might help her. She became pretty defensive. Then told me she doesn't want to talk about it anymore. At this point, I sensed that something's bothering her. She said that everything's fine. We were sitting on a couch cuddling in a lounge. Soon after she said this, she physically moved to the other couch across from me. Things got pretty awkward for 5-10 minutes after that. Then she said out of the blue "I feel like you judge me for my drinking!". I reassured her I don't. She seemed better off and the vibe returned to normal. Then I told her "okay, now come back to the couch where all the cool kids are at " and she came back and cuddled with me.

I thought this was the end of it. But 10-15 minutes later, she brought up that she still feels like I judge her for it. I tried to dive into that, but she told me "can we not talk about this right now?". I sensed that if I pressed, this would just make her evermore uncomfortable and make the night worse. So I moved on for the time being. The rest of the night was a lot of fun and we had a good time. However...this is obviously an issue that needs to be dealt with. Clearly, this is a very sensitive topic to her. Cause she's told me a LOT of things about herself. Some of which she hasn't told anyone about. And even though its difficult, she's always been open to talking with me about her trial and tribulations. This is the first time I've ever seen her get defensive about something. And I'm really not sure how to approach it. Cause its definitely something that needs to be dealt with. But if I bring it up, I feel like it will just make her uncomfortable and cause her to close up.

MY ISSUES AND INSECURITIES WITHIN THE RELATIONSHIP: This relationship has caused a lot of mixed feelings within me. When I first met her, I thought she was basically an angel. Like, I felt like it was too good to be true. And it was. As I got to know her better, I discovered all these problems which I wasn't necessarily aware of when I first met her. Now that I understand her better, I'm at a point where I'm not sure if I should continue this relationship with her.

Here's the thing though...I've had a history of being obsessed with finding the perfect women. Pretty much a girl who had it ALL. And while it is a noble goal to find someone of high quality to spend your time with, I think I set my standards to something that doesn't exist. Everyone has insecurities. Everyone has issues. So even if I dump her, the next girl is also going to have some problems. There is no such thing as a women (or man) without issues/baggage of some sort. Which is why I'm still giving her the benefit of the doubt. Because I'm not sure if looking for someone more emotionally secure than her (who also has all the other good qualities she has) would be unrealistic.

Moreover...because of my lack of experience in longer relationships, my problem is that I don't know if her issues are within what would be considered "normal" and manageable (i.e. asking for someone who doesn't have issues like hers or as serious as hers would be unrealistic) or if I should move on and try to find someone who's more emotionally in check.

Also, I have mixed feelings about relationships as a whole. On the one hand...I really do want someone to have a deep and meaningful connection with. Someone I might eventually love. But on the other hand, I still have an urge to continue hooking up with girls. Like, even I first met her and I thought she was perfect, I STILL wanted other women. Ofc, the logical thing to do here would be an open relationship right? Well...unfortunately, I can't do that because my jealousy would eventually get the best of me.

This leaves me in a place of always wanting more.

On a totally unrelated note, I'm also always hypersensitive to how she communicates with me. Does she send me as many snapchats as she used to? Does she use as many !! when she texts me as she did when I first met her? Right now, I feel like the answer to those questions is no. She used to send me a "good morning" snapchat every day. Now, she's stopped doing that. She used to text me with !!! to the point where it sounded fake (probably because it was).

Really, these aren't very big changes. She's still excited to text/talk to/snapchat/hang out with me. She's still responding positively to everything I do (for the most part). Those are very subtle little changes which frankly, could be meaningless. Just as they could mean she's lost interest or is pulling away, they could also mean that she feels comfortable enough with me to drop her social mask and only communicate with me as frequently and in such a way that she would with people she actually feels comfortable with.

...Regardless of the fact that this is objectively no big deal, my anxiety LEAPS. Like, I've been feeling anxious and somewhat depressed for the past few days because of it. If I had to guess why this is, its because my last GF disconnected with me and quit trying long before she dumped me. Because of that, I'm hypersensitive to any and all signs that the same thing might be happening.

Also, she's super insecure about her roommates hearing her have sex (even though she hears them all the time), so we always have to be super quiet during sex. Which kind of kill the vibe in some ways. Cause she makes no noise. I make no noise. I can't spank her, or push her against a wall or really do anything very dominant (which is a huge turnon for both of us). Plus, I can't teach her to give me a Bj the way I like it cause I don't understand what I like lol (I've had a few AMAZING blow jobs from girls, but I don't know how they did it). So the sex isn't perfect either. But its certainly not bad!

Annyways...this has been a long rant. If you read all this, kudos to you. Let me know what you think.

 

[Smurf]

Yo BBoy, glad someone else is on the relationship boards talking about some nuanced stuff.

Since you've only been dating her for a month, I'd let a little time pass and see if things get worse or better. One month isn't really enough to see the whole picture of someone.

Early in my relationship, we'd talk about sex related things and her past relationships (not supposed to do that, but don't really care haha). Of course me never having had a girlfriend, she called me out for being "like a manwhore", and she would get super self conscious about her sexual performance (which isn't bad, our sex together is pretty good honestly). It's kinda' a gift and a curse, she probably feels like YOU are out of her league sexually, but also has hang ups about how much you can commit to her emotionally. Gotta' take the good with the bad. I try to counter this by throwing in some emotional comfort in her, while seeming beta, it definitely helps. Something that's not usually talked about on the regular boards is the other half of what girls need from guys: emotions. I try and make her feel loved, and at the same time be myself - which is a dick sometimes. After reading this site since 2012, my natural inclination is to tease, test, basically use what girls use against them with some male energy thrown in there, but that's just to balance out what your single friends usually call "the gay conversations you have with your girlfriend".

Being drunk is definitely fun, but I do the exact same thing if I black out usually. I'm a complete dickhead, do whatever seems fun at the moment, and even if I'm trying to be nice, in my intoxicated state I can't calibrate shit and end up offending someone or making them cry. Blacking out is never a good thing usually, for anyone. The things she says when blacked out are probably based out of insecurity, and while it can sometimes make sense, it usually doesn't and I would try and ignore it. You did the right thing by getting to the root of the problem which is her drinking. For my girlfriend, it's just her insecurity in general.

"I haven't eaten all day. I know you've been trying to prevent me from eating cause you think I'm too fat"

Just something sort of out of context here, if you ever get into an argument with your girlfriend, or if she's in a bad mood, make sure she's eaten something. Girls get hangry QUICK. Around 50% of the time that my girlfriend is acting rude or being moody, it's because she hasn't eaten enough. Just something to think about.

Here's where I have issues to. If I try to get my girlfriend to do something or change for the better, she always questions it. If I make positive suggestions of change, she gets defensive and tells me I'm trying to "change who she is". I honestly haven't figured out how to phrase these things differently so that she doesn't react like that, and I also don't know if it's because I chose the wrong girl and she doesn't have enough self worth, or if it's just a normal girl thing to do. My girlfriend will literaelly do the exact same thing where if I press on a topic a little too much she'll say, "can we not talk about this?" I seriously have been brainstorming with my other friend in a relationship on how to deal with this sort of thing, so I'm all ears if you have ideas as well haha.

On finding the "perfect girl" and that thread, you have to critically think on if you could do better or not. As another guy that studies seduction, I can say that I as well have thoughts about other girls ON THE REGULAR. My other natural friend does to. I'm starting to think this is normal. Me and my friend usually just talk about other girl's bodies, nothing crazy like flirting or anything like that. I think it's inevitable to think about that sort of thing. The thing is, sex is usually better in a relationship, as well as the connection and emotions you get from it, in exchange for a little more work and management. That's my thoughts so far at least, this is my first relationship and we're only coming up on 6 months so I'm shooting from the hip here.

The open relationship thing, yeah, I can't either. My girlfriend is bi, and one time early when we weren't even dating yet, she made out with my friend's girlfriend and I got jealous of that. I think the issue is that if she hooks up with other girls, I get jealous if I also can't hook up with those same girls. And with guys, I don' t think I'd appreaciate it that much haha. I guess I'm not at that "level" yet?

I'm also in tune with how my girlfriend is corresponding with me. I notice whenever a girl loses interest in me she slowly cuts contact down and shows disinterest that I actively ignore. It's not wrong to look at those things, but if she's always happy to see you and has a good time with you in person, I wouldn't make a big deal of it. I'm not a big phone person so I try and use it only as much as I have to to let her know I still care when I'm not around her physically.

That roomate thing SUCKS. For some reason, my girl gives zero fucks whenever we fuck around other people that we know. Quiet sex is extremely hard to make feel good for anyone. The few times I've had slow, quiet sex with my girlfriend it was super boring and she voiced that it was weird and she didn't like it. Don't know exactly how to fix that, other than maybe rationalize that she hears her roommates all the time, so she shouldn't care what they hear.

Hate to be that guy, but it'd be dope if someone more experienced with relationships could chime in here. I feel the relationship boards definitely lacks in content compared to the other boards here, and while I can TRY and help, since I'm pretty inexperienced I'm more trying to make an educated guess based off what I know and have known to be true rather than having experienced exact things.

I hope this helps you in some way brotha, or at least gives you comfort that someone is going through something similar

Jake.

 

[Bboy100]

if I black out usually. I'm a complete dickhead, do whatever seems fun at the moment, and even if I'm trying to be nice, in my intoxicated state I can't calibrate shit and end up offending someone or making them cry.

Interesting. It would be very helpful for me to know- when you black out, do you mean the stuff you say to any degree. As in...I get that most of it is irrelevant to who you are. But is there a sliver of truth to it? Is it at all related to what you think/how you would behave sober? Or is it just complete nonsense that people should totally ignore? Cause as far as I know, alcohol merly lowers (or in the case of blacking out removes) inhibition. So I would imagine that the things you say are in some way authentic. Would you say that is your experience? Or am I completely wrong here?

That roomate thing SUCKS. For some reason, my girl gives zero fucks whenever we fuck around other people that we know. Quiet sex is extremely hard to make feel good for anyone. The few times I've had slow, quiet sex with my girlfriend it was super boring and she voiced that it was weird and she didn't like it. Don't know exactly how to fix that, other than maybe rationalize that she hears her roommates all the time, so she shouldn't care what they hear.

Yeah, I think this is something I will deal with as we get to know each other better. Because tbh, part of it is ASD. She says she never hooks up with guys on first dates like she did with me, and I can tell that some part of her feels a certain level of shame for doing it. So I think part of the deal is that she doesn't want her roommates to know that we're having sex, because she might see it a "dirty" or "she's a slut" (even though by her own account, her roommate has a FWB).

I brought it up once before that she should just talk to her roommates about it. She agreed that that's a good idea. But it looks like she never did it. But I think once she feels like our relationship is at point where it's acceptable for people to know that we're having sex, she might be more open to the idea. Cause when we first started, she was hesitant to even let me come over for fear that I'm just using her for sex.

If I make positive suggestions of change, she gets defensive and tells me I'm trying to "change who she is". I honestly haven't figured out how to phrase these things differently so that she doesn't react like that, and I also don't know if it's because I chose the wrong girl and she doesn't have enough self worth, or if it's just a normal girl thing to do

It's both. It's absolutely normal for girls (and most people to do this). But imo, I also think its wrong to choose someone who does it. Because if you run into an emotion based issue in the relationship, it becomes very difficult to solve for it. Cause she will always get defensive because she'll feel like she's being judged.

That's why I went out of my way to make sure she's open to criticism without getting her ego involved. And indeed she is for 90% of the things. It's only this one topic (drinking) which puts her on edge. Which I can understand. No one is going to be completely open to talking about absolutely everything without fear of judgement. So given that in general, she's okay with talking about stuff, I'll let this one slide. And I'll figure out a different way to address it.

I hope this helps you in some way brotha, or at least gives you comfort that someone is going through something similar

Yeah. I'm glad to know that I'm not the only one

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Bboy,

Your post is an interesting one. A long one yes, but well written and interesting. I cannot answer for you, however I can give you a feel of how I would approach some of the issues raised if it was me.

You are right, each new girlfriend will have issues of her own, as there is no one perfect. But it's up to you to decide for yourself what you think is acceptable, or what is not. Ask yourself: are you OK with her being drunk? Are you OK with her being disrespectful? Etc... You need to decide where you draw the line for yourself. Personally I would not have a girlfriend who regularly passes out from alcohol. I would have a rule like "You can't be drinking in my presence" - soft but firm. And on another note, you cannot solve her issues for her - it needs to be coming from her in the first place.

Many of the things she says appear to be about framing you for a particular answer. "I know you've been trying to prevent me from eating cause you think I'm too fat"."I feel like you judge me for my drinking!". "You're gonna have to have sex with an ugly women after this"... Etc... Things like this are asking for an answer such as "No, darling, you're not fat!", "No, I'm not judging you", "No, you're still pretty without makeup". You may not feel bad about these things, but she certainly does. Providing her with the answer she is framing you to provide, help her to absolve herself of her own bad feelings. Moreover, she made you responsible for feeling bad about these things. And again, she is having the higher frame, and gaining some ascendant over you. I would personally kill these things in the womb with an immediate "I'm not answering this!" and feigning to be (slightly) concerned. Another approach is a cocky neg answer - with a joking tone: "Yes, you're too fat! But I like fat girls!" or "Yes, very ugly I'm afraid, but what to do?.

On the same vein, her own mention of a past of abuses for her exes, is also (probably) a way to frame you in a "I'm not like this" mode, appealing to your protective male nature. It is not good to pile on her insecurities, of course. However it is not a good thing either to over provide her with security. If she was a normal girl, I would personally abstain myself to confirm, or infirm, her doubts about me. However in her case (emotional baggage) I would try to find a middle ground.

Questions such as "Are you seeing other girls?" or "I'm just another girl to you"... are very tricky. Saying "No" will not take you out of trouble - quite the opposite. Because now, you are suspected of lying. I must say this still regularly gives me some trouble. The way I approach this is adopting a serious face, frowning, then ask her back "Are you trying to make me justify myself? Because I won't" or similar. I close the topic right away. One big danger zone is to mention about a particular past girlfriend (or in my case about the ex-wife). That triggers some irrational jealousy reaction which no amount of logical argument can calm down - no matter the relationship finished for good 5 years ago.

As for your own insecurities... It is already a very good step that you are aware of them. It's up to you to work on them now. On the changes in her texting to you, "they could also mean that she feels comfortable enough with me to drop her social mask and only communicate with me as frequently and in such a way that she would with people she actually feels comfortable with." this is very likely what's happening.

Well, I hope the above is helpful.

Seppuku
PS. Congratulations for your new "CroMagnon" rank - it is well deserved and was overdue for some time.

 

[Bboy100]

Ask yourself: are you OK with her being drunk? Are you OK with her being disrespectful? Etc... You need to decide where you draw the line for yourself

Yeah, here's the thing with that...I'm fine with a girlfriend who gets drunk, as I do it all the time. I don't like that she blacks out from time to time. But neither does she. She actively tries to avoid it. So I just need to figure out a way to bring up the alcohol topic without her getting defensive so we can come up with a good plan for how to avoid it.

As for the disrespect...it really depends. If she actually means any of the stuff she says, than ofc I won't put up with that. But if she's just blabbering nonsense which I can go ahead and ignore, it's actually kinda funny lol. So I would have no problem getting my kicks out of it if I know not to take it to heart. Which is why I'm diving so deep into Jake's experience with being an asshole when he's drunk. Cause it's probably applicable to her as well.

Many of the things she says appear to be about framing you for a particular answer. "I know you've been trying to prevent me from eating cause you think I'm too fat"."I feel like you judge me for my drinking!". "You're gonna have to have sex with an ugly women after this"... Etc... Things like this are asking for an answer such as "No, darling, you're not fat!", "No, I'm not judging you", "No, you're still pretty without makeup". You may not feel bad about these things, but she certainly does. Providing her with the answer she is framing you to provide, help her to absolve herself of her own bad feelings. Moreover, she made you responsible for feeling bad about these things. And again, she is having the higher frame, and gaining some ascendant over you. I would personally kill these things in the womb with an immediate "I'm not answering this!" and feigning to be (slightly) concerned. Another approach is a cocky neg answer - with a joking tone: "Yes, you're too fat! But I like fat girls!" or "Yes, very ugly I'm afraid, but what to do?.

Yeah. She only says these things when she's drunk. Usually, in a very aggressive tone. One time in particular, she got all fessed up about why I Venmo her in private (instead of making it a public notification which anyone can see). She assumed it was so other girls don't see it. When I told her that's not the reason (and gave her the actual reasons for why I did do it), she basically accused me of lying. I let her know that she's accusing me of something on the basis of 0 evidence, its super disrespectful and she needs to knock it off. She profusely apologized. 5 minutes later, she informed me that she really liked it when I "put her in her place" when she overthinks things. LOL

I've never had to have a conversation like this when we were sober. We've had a few conversations about her insecurities, but there was good context to it. It's never been about her trying to force me to reassure her that that's not the case.

Questions such as "Are you seeing other girls?" or "I'm just another girl to you"... are very tricky. Saying "No" will not take you out of trouble - quite the opposite. Because now, you are suspected of lying. I must say this still regularly gives me some trouble. The way I approach this is adopting a serious face, frowning, then ask her back "Are you trying to make me justify myself? Because I won't" or similar. I close the topic right away.

How has this been working for you? Because I would imagine that if you close it off and never fully address it, she'll just assume her fears are true. Especially if this is an insecurity of hers. Her natural inclination will be to think "Welp, he always refuses to talk about it. That must mean he's seeing other girls!" I could be wrong though, as I've never dated a girl worried about this type of thing long enough for it to become an issue

PS. Congratulations for your new "CroMagnon" rank - it is well deserved and was overdue for some time

Thanks! I appreciate it

 

[Seppuku]

Hey BBoy,

Back to your original question:

Moreover...because of my lack of experience in longer relationships, my problem is that I don't know if her issues are within what would be considered "normal" and manageable (i.e. asking for someone who doesn't have issues like hers or as serious as hers would be unrealistic) or if I should move on and try to find someone who's more emotionally in check.

Like you said, no girl will be perfect. So, in order to decide whether to keep her ("normal and manageable") or move one to someone else, it is good to have a clear idea of what are the big "No No" for you. As an example, I have my own, clear red lines. A girl who demonstrates a strong sense of entitlement is an immediate bye bye. A girl who expresses excessive interest in material things, or who "demands gifts", is another big red flag (reminds me too much of my 15 years marriage with an ultra materialistic woman).

So... My point was that it will help you a great deal to think about what are your own red lines, what's OK and what's not, in order to decide between keeping the girl or moving on. Maybe you'll have a clearer idea of these after you have a little bit more experience in relationships.

Now back to this girl, it seems to me that you are OK with keeping her. Once in a while she seems to be crossing a line though. You had the correct reaction to "put her in her place". As you could see, she was even grateful that you did it. I would advice to stay vigilant about her crossing a line, and not hesitate to repeat the scenario. Sometimes, girls are like kids - they test the frame of authority and boundaries. If you fail to provide her the frame, she will become more daring the next time - and lose a little bit of respect in the process. Like kids, they need to feel there are boundaries.

How has this been working for you? Because I would imagine that if you close it off and never fully address it, she'll just assume her fears are true. Especially if this is an insecurity of hers. Her natural inclination will be to think "Welp, he always refuses to talk about it. That must mean he's seeing other girls!" I could be wrong though, as I've never dated a girl worried about this type of thing long enough for it to become an issue

Here we have a question of personal philosophy. I consider that demanding my commitment to exclusivity is a very big demand. So, I never explicitly commit to her, and I go to great lengths not to say things or to act in a way that imply I will commit (i.e. acting in an obvious "boyfriend" way). So when she's asking questions about other girls and I deflect, she normally gets the picture, *and* it's congruent to my behavior.

Most of the time it will be OK, and she will not ask questions again. Once in a while, I get a hint from her that she suspects that I'm seeing other girls (such as, in a joking tone "you have too much girlfriends ", or a mention "your girls" in passing). I pay a great care not to deny these "hints".

But sometimes, I get a girl who will not take my answer, and who will insist to know "how many girls". When it gets to this, I usually tell her. Never lying about it, when I really have to disclose. Very interestingly, to my own surprise, all the girls to whom I disclosed the truth were OK with it, and continued to fuck me afterwards.

Now not everyone will share my views on commitment, and that's fine. But it's never a good idea to deny on "are you seeing other girls". It is usually an inquisitive tone, and next step, she will call you liar - the discussion is now set for escalation. It is a much better idea to kill it off immediately. *If* you really need to address and calm down her insecurities, wait for a more peaceful moment, and open the subject by yourself - you lead the discussion at your convenience, on your own terms, instead of under her inquisition. It is more likely to be effective this way.

However, unless she feels really insecure (like your girl seems to be), it's usually better to keep her in doubt about other girls as long as possible. The pressure of potential competition will keep her on her toes, to your advantage. The moment she has insurance that you're not seeing other girls, you will notice big changes in her behavior with you.

Seppuku

 

[Yhaceed]

I figured I'd come to this section and maybe find someone with a similar experience. However mine is not exactly like yours and my relationship is probably over but we know girls can flip flop which I've seen again and again so I don't really know what I need to do or say. This topic though is not about me but the question remains is she wrong for you? So I'm chiming in based on what I'm dealing with and past relationships and experiences. As Sepuku mentioned it's about what you're okay with and what you're not. The thing is these issues that come up like thinking she's fat or ugly and the blackouts probably need to be dealt with light heartedly because I think what we do is get defensive and ready to get in a heated argument. My girl actually said the sex is wrong because we're not married and I haven't figured out how to reply to it. So in retrospect I'm always thinking I could have said this or done that. Actually though I think the better response is to say why are you mad or why are you getting so excited and then to reassure her how you feel about her after she answers because I don't feel like taking life too seriously anymore and that is always what it comes back to. If we can't laugh about it or discuss these things calmly then we've got even more problems. As an example I once said I'd gone to strip clubs and she wanted to know about it. I said "do you really wanna know". She said yes and no and that was the end of it and it hasn't come up since. So if your girl thinks she's fat you can say "do you really think I feel like that" or "do you really think I'd be with you if that was the case?" She probably doesn't want to give you up so she'll answer along those lines and possibly see she's being silly. However girls do tend to want reassurance so give her that do she knows you still notice good things about her or things she does for you. If a girl is acting one way and you want her to act another they don't always tend to acknowledge it but if they do without you having to make them do so then you appreciate it. And I think it's the same deal when they want to be reassured how you feel. Then maybe it'll help her with her insecurities. Anyway I was just wanted to emphasize to keep it fun if you can.

~Yhaceed

 

[Bboy100]

Here we have a question of personal philosophy. I consider that demanding my commitment to exclusivity is a very big demand. So, I never explicitly commit to her, and I go to great lengths not to say things or to act in a way that imply I will commit (i.e. acting in an obvious "boyfriend" way). So when she's asking questions about other girls and I deflect, she normally gets the picture, *and* it's congruent to my behavior.

Yep. I actually agree with you there. Although I wouldn't say I would NEVER imply exclusivity. Just would be something that takes a lot of time and effort on her end to earn (also I don't think we're technically exclusive rn anyways. But the frame we have rn is that sleeping with other people is frowned upon). Anyways...I made an exception with this girl due to a combination of two reasons:

1. The above mentioned insecurities. If she doesn't have some sense of security that I'm hers, she'll at best, close off emotionally and we'll have a very cold and/or turmoiled relationship and at worse, she'll just cut me off cause she can't handle the possibility that I would abandon her for someone else. In fact, even AFTER I let her know that I see this going somewhere, she STILL started distance herself from me for this very reason a few times. Luckily, I recognized it and nipped it in the bud.

2. I was already looking for a committed LTR type relationship. And I was very very sold on her the first time I met her. It wasn't till future dates that I found out she had all these issues. In hindsight, there were some signs that she possibly might have some issues (subtle signs which are easy to miss and rationalize away, but they were there nonetheless). But at the time, I didn't see it. Had I foreseen that she might have this much baggage early on, I would have been more hesitant to make any promises of exclusivity/imply in any way that I'm ready to be her boyfriend. <---That's not to say that I no longer want to move things in the direction of an LTR rn. I'm just more cautious and vigilant than I was before.

Very interestingly, to my own surprise, all the girls to whom I disclosed the truth were OK with it, and continued to fuck me afterwards.

Did this change your relationship with any of them in any way? Because I can imagine that even though they might be okay with this setup, they might also distance themselves from you emotionally. The thought process might be "Okay, fine I"ll just fuck this guy for a while until I find someone who's willing to have a committed relationship with me".

In other words...did they continue to open up to and become more intimate with you as you spent more time together? Or did your relationship just become a fuckbuddy/FWB type thing wherein its mostly centered around physically satisfying each other and casually hanging out?

 

[Seppuku]

Overall, I find that these last three years have been a very interesting discovery journey into the feminine psyche!

Did this change your relationship with any of them in any way? Because I can imagine that even though they might be okay with this setup, they might also distance themselves from you emotionally. The thought process might be "Okay, fine I"ll just fuck this guy for a while until I find someone who's willing to have a committed relationship with me".

As far as I remember there are exactly 6 instances where I told the girl explicitly - at her insisting request. All of them were surprisingly cool with knowing it (no upset reaction or drama or shouting). I think it's coming from overall congruence in behavior and language. All of them continued to see me for some time after I told them.

* Out of the 6, one (Jennifer in my Journal) eventually self ejected after a couple of month because I was not exactly the good sort of boyfriend that she had hoped.
* Another one (I called her my "Chinese Lily") continued to see me several months until we had a big fight (absolutely unrelated to my "other girls"), after which we stopped speaking.
* Another one (Olivia in my Journal) turned out to display some extremely possessive behavior (like video calling me two hours every day) so I had to let her go.
* The three others I'm still in contact with.
* To be completely fair, out of the 6, two had an open agenda to get pregnant from me - so that may be the motivation to stay around my non committing self.
* And this list doesn't include all the girls I had that suspected they were not alone, but simply didn't want to know for sure, so never really insisted on the "how many girls".

So there was one instance where the girl self ejected after a couple of month because she was not comfortable with this kind of relationship... Although she popped back on my Viber out of the blue about a year later, literally inviting herself for a dinner at my place on the occasion of her birthday. LOL. And two other girls disappeared for other reasons.

One of the three girls left, Jenna from Philippines, had disappeared from the radar for some time. She popped back on my Viber after eight months, and told me about the miseries she's been through with another guy. When I went to the Philippines last February she came to pick me at the airport. And drove me to my hotel room .

So, as far as I can tell, the "I"ll just fuck this guy for a while until I find someone who's willing to have a committed relationship with me" is overall correct. Except that when it finally doesn't work out with the committing guy, I see some girls coming back. A guy who doesn't commit, doesn't belong to any particular girl either... So no girl can steal him away! And he'll be always there. I suppose there is some safety in this. It is an interesting thought.

Cheers!
Seppuku

 

[OldGuy]

Alright, so this post is partially a way of expressing myself, and part venting because I don't currently have anyone to talk to (as it is 2 am and I'm alone at home). As such, this post is basically going to be a bunch of information. Not all of it will be connected or related. Just specific things which have happened/are going on in my relationship right now. She is not currently my girlfriend, but I have told her I don't intend to sleep with other women. I now regret this. Mainly because as I got to know her better, I've started to question weather or not I want to continue pursuing this relationship.

HER ISSUES AND INSECURITIES WITHIN THE RELATIONSHIP:

I've been seeing this girl for about a month now. She's probably hands down the most amazing girl I've dated so far in many respects. In fact, when I first slept with her, I actually thought she was out of my league (I no longer feel this way).

Now...here's the thing. Despite everything she has going for her, she also has a lot of emotional baggage. Mainly due to the fact that the past few guys she dated basically dumped her after seeing her for a couple months without explanation.

After one month, you are starting to wonder if she is right for you. After two months, how would you explain breaking up to her?
It sounds to me like she keeps repeating the same relationship over and over. You could try telling her what is pushing you away. She may be able to work on that.

 

[Bboy100]

Update: She broke up with me couple nights ago. I just got accepted to go do my Master's program in LA (which means I'll be moving away), and she decided it's not worth pursuing this anymore if I won't be around.

I had 3 anxiety attacks (during one of them, I literally collapsed in the middle of the street in Seattle), couldn't sleep for 36 hours and had to force feed myself. I didn't actually want to eat. Uuuuughh...I hate break ups.

On the bright side, this is still a lot more manageable than my last break up. In fact, I'm feeling comparably better today.

Onward and upward!

 

[Seppuku]

Hey BBoy,

As the man, you're the one building value around you. Although they would love to make you believe it's the other way around, women need you, more than you need them. So, no woman on earth is worth beating yourself. There are always hundreds of others, equally nice if not more, waiting around the corner.

And the positive news is your Masters program. Congratulations on that!

Seppuku

 

[Bboy100]

As the man, you're the one building value around you. Although they would love to make you believe it's the other way around, women need you, more than you need them. So, no woman on earth is worth beating yourself. There are always hundreds of others, equally nice if not more, waiting around the corner.

Yeah. As I've been saying this whole post. The more I got to know her, the more obvious it become that she isn't as great as I first believed. I'm very confident that I'll find someone better than her. If I'm being honest with myself, my problem is not finding another women. It's that once I get attached to one, I feel like I cannot end the relationship even if I want to. Because the pain of breaking up is too great for me to bear. Really, I think I just need to figure out why I attach to women so quickly and slow it down to appropriate levels (e.g. I was only seeing this women for 1.5 months. My response to the break up should have been some grief. But not panic attacks and inability to eat and sleep). That way if I find out new information which suggests the relationship should end, I want to feel confident that I can end it if need be.

To clarify, I'm not necessarily saying that I thought this relationship should end. I was still mulling over that. But even if I did, I would not have had the courage to actually pull the trigger.

And the positive news is your Masters program. Congratulations on that!

Thanks! I'm excited about this too. Its kinda crazy to think that after all this time, I'll finally be learning to do what I've been wanting to do since I was a teenager

 

[Yhaceed]

Now I'm wondering if she isn't so great would it feel better when things end? That way you don't expect her to behave in certain ways. It's just sort of a bonus if she does. Then you're not surprised when things you don't like happen. Maybe just to keep it in the back of your mind from the outset so those things aren't encouraged.

~Yhaceed

 

[Yhaceed]

Bboy I was just thinking my last comment isn't going to help your situation right now. I'm not trying kick you when you're down. Breakups are never cool. So hopefully you'll bounce back pretty quick.

~Yhaceed

 

[Bboy100]

Update: I'm actually feeling fine now. This past week has been full of reflection and trying to gain better self-understanding.

Before I begin, I want to emphasize that I'm not a bag of nerves who feels lonely, desperate or weak without a women. For the most part, I feel very confident, value myself and the things I do in my life, and I firmly believe I'm headed on the right path to greatness. Everything I'm about to say is only but one part of my identity. It does not reflect my psyche in its whole.

I've come to the conclusion that I don't actually miss her. I don't attach to women so quickly because I want that specific girl. Rather, its because I want A girl. Now, don't get me wrong. I'm not desperate for women. At this point, I've reached a level wherein I can sleep with 1-2 new girls per month no prob.

No...the issue runs MUCH deeper than that. Its an entire subconscious paradigm through which my mind processes my life. I won't explain how I got to this conclusion because it would be too much typing. But basically, I've realized that the fact that I didn't fit in throughout grade school (K-12), was bullied and got no girls still has a profound effect on how I interact with the world today. Even though I didn't know it till few days ago lol.

Basically, on a subconscious level, a part of me still feels like I'm a loser. And I'm doing everything I can to compensate. Namely, sleeping with an unusually high amount of women, and when I find one I actually like, attaching to her very quickly. Because if I have a really high quality women on my arm, by the standards of high school social circle, I'm doing well. This is why I can't bare to lose these women that I date. Because if I don't have a women like that, I automatically go back to feeling like I'm a loser (again, keep in mind that this is a little exaggerated. I mostly feel fine. It's only one part of me which feels this way!).

In fact, this paradigm plays itself out in many ways. Not just with women. Every time I'm continuously exposed to a new group of people, I always want to be a part of their social circle. Even if I don't even like them lol. I have a yearning to always be accepted. Always be "popular". For example, there's a bunch of catty bitches who do nothing but create drama at my work. But in the context of my work environment, they're popular. I DON'T EVEN LIKE THEM AS HUMAN BEINGS. But still, there's some anxiety around them because I want to fit in with them, which in the context of my work, would make me "popularl".

Moreover, every time I do meet such a group of people, I feel a huge surge of anxiety. Why? Because it was exactly this group of people who bullied me throughout elementary and middle school. So even though I want to be one of them, I also come off as closed off, or even hostile because of my anxiety, which inevitably pushes them away.

I did manage to become popular in college. But that was in part because a good chunk of socializing involved alcohol, which really helped bring my guard down and be more authentic. But in the real world, this strategy is obviously no longer viable. So now there's no way out but to face my emotions head on.

So what's my coping mechanism for this all this? Well it's simple...I've learned to sleep with women very very quickly. By making the relationship physical, it ensures me that they actually like an accept me, thereby negating the uncomfortable feeling of uncertainty and anxiety. Also, I don't talk about myself very much on dates. Instead, I let them do all the talking. This is a good strategy for getting girls to sleep with me. But the adverse side-effect of it is that it prevents me from having to be vulnerable and to share myself with women. So even though they might feel very connected to me, I feel almost nothing towards them (unless I'm really really into her for some reason).

So there we have it. This is the real reason I attach to women so quickly, and am willing to go through more trouble than its worth just to have sex with a new girl for the 1 billionth time (e.g. the time I almost got shot on a first date with a girl see: viewtopic.php?f=5&t=16391). In hindsight, this has actually been useful to me. Because without this pussy thirst, I would never have been motivated to become as good with women as I am today. But now that I feel competent enough to get what I want out of relationships and dating, I feel like this emotional issue is causing me more trouble than it is bringing me benefits. So I think its time for me to finally face it head on and resolve it.

I still have no way of dealing with the anxiety that comes with socializing in groups other than alcohol. It still cripples my ability to make friends to this day.

I'd also like to note that the source of the anxiety itself is still unknown. I've felt this way for as long as I can remember. MAAYBE there were some times in pre-school wherein I didn't feel like this. But by the time I was in Kindergarten, this was definitely a thing for me. I would suspect it has something to do with how my parents interacted with me. Maybe even one or two specific events. But I can't exactly put my finger on what they are. This is something which will require more reflection.

 

[Hector Papi Castillo]

If you're asking this question, it's probably wrong for you. Emotion tells you whether you should get into, strategy tells you how to get to that point and if she's a good candidate, and emotion tells you when to get out.

Hector

 

[Rain]

Hey Bboy,

Really, I think I just need to figure out why I attach to women so quickly and slow it down to appropriate levels (e.g. I was only seeing this women for 1.5 months. My response to the break up should have been some grief. But not panic attacks and inability to eat and sleep). That way if I find out new information which suggests the relationship should end, I want to feel confident that I can end it if need be.

I was seeing a woman in 2011 for only 2 weeks, alot shorter than 1.5months yet like you, I had well, when it brokeup I was still eating, sleeping, working but very sad. I was ruminating/thinking. Got oneitis/that special girl. Then a few months later, glandular fever, and that was stressful/panic attacks on its own but very soon while recovering from that, this 2011 woman became single and I was text'ing her and sometimes she would not respond and I sometimes became stressed/agitated in those moments. Not 100% sure its the type of panic attack I get today, but definitely a bit stressed over it, possible agitation. I remember thinking no more and putting the phone down and suddenly became way less stressed in that moment. I didn't stick to that though, even today she still pops into my mind sometimes, but its way better than when it first happened. Not saying we are exactly the same, ie mine was not monogamous, but certainly, getting somewhat attached in very short term relationships perhaps we have in common. Did you lose anyone close to you when you were little or in teenage years?

I am starting to think though that part of my panic attacks in the last few years, is more due to some sort of physiological problem that has never recovered since glandular fever, unless its just stress in general. So it doesn't sound like you have any irritable bowel syndrome, or general anxiety , or any health issues, you just get attached and get panic attacks without any health issues? It's all mental/emotional/grief that causes yours?