Keeping in Touch Over Text? Refining Texting Game

[Frost]

There's a situation I've been running into many times recently, here's how it usually goes:

*Meet a girl, get her number*
*Icebreaker text*

(same day or a couple of days later)
Me: Hey [name], [filler phrase]. Let's get that drink, how's your schedule like?
Her: Hey, [blabla], can't make it this week because [out of town/busy/etc...]

(one week later for example)
Me: Hey, how was your trip? [date scheduling]
Her: Hey, [blabla], [another excuse]

(third round)

The problem is that, regardless of whether the excuses were genuine or made up, when I get to the third round of texting it feels weird to always repeat the same text template in a robotic way, and it makes the whole interaction feel more like a job application rather than an interaction with a girl I want to fuck. Let's say the girl she's gonna be out of town for the week (which is pretty common for students in Paris), would it be a good idea to check in with her while she's there, or keep in touch if I know we won't be able to see each other for a period that's longer than a week?

 

[Fuck This]

When to throw the ball in her court

When to call when Texts aren't working

Read these then come back and tell us what you did.

 

[Sandman]

For me it depends on whether I get the feeling she is blowing me off or she is genuinly busy (she is giving a valid excuse for example) I've gotten with girls who blew me of for 3 weeks (3 asks) and on the third we meet up. I've also asked some girls 5-6 times before finally giving up.

A good rule of thumb I think if you asked two times and feel like you are chasing / feel bad about it. Throw the ball in her court. Then delete her number. If You truly do not give a fuck you can ask her again when you remember "oh right there was this girl, let me shoot her a text".

If you feel like it's an interview cut contact. There's no need to spend an ounce of effort on a girl who's not interested when there are so many girls out there. It leads to ego depletion IMO.

And definetely read Chase's articles Fuck This shared. That stuff is golden.

This is just my 2 cents

 

[Frost]

Thanks guys. Your answer made me reconsider the whole question lol

 

[Big Daddy]

If You truly do not give a fuck you can ask her again when you remember "oh right there was this girl, let me shoot her a text".

This is something that I've been questioning recently. In the past I "did not give a fuck" way too early, and it cost me girls.

Then I saw how long it takes to get a deal (in sales) sometimes. If you ever worked in (non-commodity) sales, chances are you ping a potential client and he's not interested. You manager will have you contact him again after X weeks. Then after Y weeks. Then after Z weeks. You don't get a super high close rate from these but 5% for a lead you were going to throw away is a pretty good deal.

In that sense, I've been revisiting my strategies. If I insist ten times while going out with other girls, did I truly "gave a fuck"? Hm, not really, and I get more reps and reference points that way. If anything it tricks my brain into thinking that I have options and become less needy with the other girls I'm talking with.

Anyways this is not conclusive, just some food for thought.

 

[Sandman]

hmmm there might have been some miscommunication

I recommend texting sporadically the girls "you don't give a fuck about". Because basically there's no downside.

However for girls you are invested in, texting, not getting anything, texting, not getting anything becomes frustrating. And that is not worth it to me even if it costs me the girl. I know that you can wear girls down by it justs frustrates the fuck out of me and holds me back.

For example yesterday I went out with a super high quality girl. Model body (think kate upton) russian, singer/journalist/dancer... I basically salivated when I saw her. I fucked it up (was writing a FR, then lost it, didn't bother again). Now I'm gonna text her once again tomorrow for date 2. If she doesn't bite, I'll delete her every contact info. Because I know if I don't I'll text her again, and probably again. It will be a thorn at my side.

But of course that's just me, I have nothing but respect for brothers who don't give up

 

[Big Daddy]

Yeah, when it's a girl you like is extremely fucked up. Definitively makes you go crazy...!

What they do in sales with expensive software and I try to imitate is, I'll delete or archive the conversation and set a reminder to ping her in X days. Most of the times I'll completely forget. Just so I stay organized, especially with multiple girls, this can get quite complicated sometimes.

 

[Ambiance]

Throw it out of her court. Say you will be busy for awhile and can't keep chasing her. You're too busy to chase after her. Then text her when the time is right. That will be when you are half impartial to fucking her, and half excited to do so. You'll know.

Best of luck

Ambiance

 

[lostnumber]

Try to make your texts interesting so that she is compelled to respond and work on creating an interesting frame. That is my biggest advice, no matter what stage of texting you are at.

Creating frames is even more important in texting than it is in real life interaction because via text you have NOTHING other than your words.

It sounds like maybe your conversations are purely logistical without any flavor to them based on the examples you posted. This is better than asking lame questions and never moving forward towards a date, but there is still room for improvement. I'm traveling but I'll try to post some examples when I get back

 

[lostnumber]

Here is an example of a recent text exchange just to show you what I am talking about. I will admit this scenario is a bit different than yours because 1) This girl is wittier than most and can banter back to me better than you'll typically find. 2) We went on one date already and built quite a bit of rapport and some inside jokes, although we did not sleep together.

So for example, she calls me Elon because we have this inside joke that I am actually Elon Musk. I also reference her making me a breastplate because that was part of my frame on Tinder (Her profile said that she enjoyed jewerly metalsmithing as a hobby so I amped that up to 11 and pretended to be dragon-slayer needing a new suit of armor). Having callbacks and inside jokes is hugely impactful but can be difficult to do if you only talked to her very briefly


Her: Hey Elon. How was your day?

Me (The next day): Hey Alex. You know how it is, test driving futuristic cards, drawing up plans for a new spaceship, that kind of thing
Me: But actually wish me luck here. We are heading out to golf, and I think I left most of my cerebellum behind last night

Her: I understand, I've been working on my time travel machine and autocorrect golf clubs that ensure you hit the ball every-time. Sadly I didn't get the clubs done in time for you

Me: Damn, those would have come in hand. I'll have to pick them up later along with that breastplate you're making me ^_-
Me: We should probably find a time here for me to sweep you off your feet. What's next week look like for you?

Blah blah blah, more texts. Now we have a date for Wednesday

Again this isn't a perfect example, but hopefully you can read the above exchange and see how FUN it is. Compare that to this, which is how I've seen most people text:

Her: Hey, how was your day
Me: Good, I'm about to go golfing now though
Her: Oh, that sounds fun. Good luck
Me: Yeah, thanks
Me: Lets hang out next week?

If she really likes you already and you are sleeping together on the regular then the above can work fine, but its certainly not going to get her excited to meet you if she is on the fence. My advice for most guys on texting is to work on being a better and more interesting writer. There is something to be said for brevity, but if you aren't good at texting I'd work on stretching your boundaries. Be more verbose and colorful and descriptive in your texts, imply interesting things without saying them outright, ask questions in intriguing ways, etc. Once you figure out how to do that then dial it back if you need to so that you are more succinct

 

[Big Daddy]

OK, I've read the whole thread now and realized it was about something else. I had just read the last couple of posts or so. This is something that goes head on against the "not become text buddy mentality" but has plagued me for the loooongest.

@ lostnumber

Yeah but I think yours is an isolated situation. It happens with me from time to time when she plays along, but with the majority of girls they'll either ignore you or give infinite excuses.

This situation happens frequently, though I don't have hard data: ask a girl out -> date is maybe a week away -> radio silence until then -> she forgets, can't anymore, etc -> reschedule -> radio silence until date again -> no date

Though again, being text buddy doesn't work at all.

I think an ideal strategy here is ping her maybe once every three days to prevent these long periods without communication and only "touching bases" when you guys are supposed to go out. I had girls tell me "that I don't even talk" or "that I just want to go out," as if they'd expect a little bit more effort from my part before asking them out (in other words, they auto rejecting if they feel you're treating them as a giant piece of meat).

 

[lostnumber]

OK, I've read the whole thread now and realized it was about something else. I had just read the last couple of posts or so. This is something that goes head on against the "not become text buddy mentality" but has plagued me for the loooongest.

@ lostnumber

Yeah but I think yours is an isolated situation. It happens with me from time to time when she plays along, but with the majority of girls they'll either ignore you or give infinite excuses.

This situation happens frequently, though I don't have hard data: ask a girl out -> date is maybe a week away -> radio silence until then -> she forgets, can't anymore, etc -> reschedule -> radio silence until date again -> no date

Though again, being text buddy doesn't work at all.

I think an ideal strategy here is ping her maybe once every three days to prevent these long periods without communication and only "touching bases" when you guys are supposed to go out. I had girls tell me "that I don't even talk" or "that I just want to go out," as if they'd expect a little bit more effort from my part before asking them out (in other words, they auto rejecting if they feel you're treating them as a giant piece of meat).

This is something I am actually researching as well Big Daddy, and I dont have a definitive answer for you regarding preventing girls from flaking. I'm not sure that its possible to prevent completely. I date almost exclusively off Tinder and other apps, and my rule of thumb ratio is that 50% of dates will cancel. Of that 50% half will reschedule for a different date and happen, and half will never come to fruition. I'm sure you could get a much better ratio if you are appoaching in person because you can rely on fundamentals, build more rapport, etc but even there I suspect you will never be able to eliminatr flakiness 100%

Here are the general strategies I've found to be effective

1) Move as fast as possible to schedule a date, and schedule the date for as soon as possible (within reason of course, you dont want to seem desperate)

2) If the date is within a few days I will text her the morning of and say something like "Hey Sarah, looking forward to tonight! I should be free by 6" This reminds her of the date, makes sure she knows I haven't forgotten myself, and gives her a chance to respond if she needs to reschedule. I also prefer

3) If the date is for a week away I might text her a day or two beforehand to confirm that we are still on.

4) When appropriate, use any type of callbacks you might have created with her. IE if you talked about buying a pirate ship together as part of your original date frame you might make some type of joke about The ship you are going to pick out.

5) Spread your logistics out over time. This is a more advanced technique that can help maintain contact without forcing you to have some sort of long drawn out text conversation.For example if I get a girls number late at night I typically tell her I'll text her tomorrow to figure out the details. Then the next day we might confirm the date, then the day after that the time, etc. This can easily occur very naturally when two busy people are texting each other

Note that this applies to girls you've scheduled dates with. If you're getting numbers but girls aren't putting something on the calendar than that is a different problem.

Very interested in what feedback others have on this topic as I can't claim to have it 100% cracked yet

 

[Big Daddy]

Ah, I just reminded of another "rule" that is very interesting and we're supposed to be following but contributes for the "radio silence flake" phenomenon.

Hector talks about this in a couple of instances, where the girl ignore your request for a date or flakes and you try to reschedule right away. The recommendation is that you should not do it right away because that's over investing, beta, etc but just acknowledge it and try again later (I'm assuming???).

So yeah, main prob is scheduling a date with a girl in a neutral state towards you while you must kill some time until the date or even getting her to accept go out with you. And after the likely event she flakes, I always feel that there is a huge loss of momentum, and I can only think it feels 5x worse for the girl. Only girls that are in a hot state will help you.

We can probably assume this will happen with a healthy chunk of girls you meet, unless you have Brad Pitt facial aesthetics and Dan Bilzerian status, as basically any girl that doesn't click with you right away after a textbook approach will be susceptible for that.

This is what I've tried so far...

1.) If I'm going to be text buddies to buy me some time, I'll do it over the longest timespan possible, meaning, I'll always reply at least 12 hours after which will buy me a couple of days (spreading logistics would be better when applicable) with extremely superficial topics

2.) I rely a lot on callback humor and/or relevant memes (if she's busy about exams, I'll google exam memes and send one and ask her something about her exams, so it doesn't look like I'm thinking of her but rather I just saw that shit and reminded me of her), but you can't

3.) I literally don't recall calling a girl I hadn't already fucked, so this might have some testing ground potential

4.) I stopped almost completely trying to be witty and tease and what have you girls over text. It's just too easy for her to ignore you forever if you give a hint you're a weirdo. After you went out, then that's okay.

5.) If she flakes, I know that she went from a hot-ish to warm at most and the chances of getting her to a hotter state again are slim with my current methods. I've tried just proposing meets, texting back and forth, bantering, being witty but I can't seem to take girls that are "neutral" to hot. I can only reschedule with girls that are so hot that they're still down.

Number five is by far my #1 texting problem currently I'd say. I simply have no idea of what to do to take a girl from a neutral to excited state over text to get her out, where I have much more leverage.

 

[lostnumber]

I simply have no idea of what to do to take a girl from a neutral to excited state over text to get her out, where I have much more leverage.

I would say this is the problem right here, I don't think this can be done. Texting is very much a means to get someone out or to maintain a relationship that you've started -- very rarely if ever can you actually seduce someone over text

Lets say a girls interest is a scale of 1 through 10. At 6 and above she will go on a date with you, and at 4 and below she'll definitely flake. If the girl is sitting at a 5, great texting might bring her to a 6 and ensure a date, but it will never make her a 10. Similarly, it will never take someone who is at a 1 in terms of interest and bring them up to 6. Thats just not how it works

Now BAD texting on the other hand can make that 5 a 0 real quick

I don't see any glaring flaws in your description to your texting so I don't think you are shooting yourself in the foot. It could be the most productive thing for you would actually be to work on your approach and building rapport more quickly with these girls you are approaching in person

The only other thing I would suggest is try to be more interesting and descriptive in your texts and in particular your invitations. Very few guys do this and it will set you apart. So for example if the girl is studying for exams I might say something like "I know this amazing little bar not too far from us. Studies have shown that going out for drinks there with a male companion increases exam scores by 20%" Its ridiculous, its fun, and I guarantee she'll have a grin on her face when she reads something like that

 

[Richard]

Just a heads up for everyone - you should be sending 2-4 text messages to remind her of who you are before you set up a date. If you approach, close and grab her number, after a few hours she'll have forgotten the bulk of it and you'll have to give her an idea of who you are.

Texting as follows:
1pm <Icebreaker>
6pm or next day: "Hey Frost, <filler phrase>. Let's get that drink, how's your schedule like?"

This isn't very clear to her; are you the somewhat cute guy she was on the fence about she met at the aquarium, are you the edgy grad student she met at the book store? Then, because she's unsure of the details on who you are, it becomes safer to brush you off in most instances.

It's much better go as follows:
"Hey Frost, it's Richard, save my number! " (I send the icebreaker a few hours after I close or the next morning if I grab it at night)
"Hey Frost, I can't put down City of Bones, stellar book recommendation! How's the expedition into your novel going? "

Chances are you didn't meet me at the aquarium, the Indie-Rock concert or at Walmart.

As for the direct question you're asking; if she's busy and has plans then I wouldn't text her and check-in because she's not your girlfriend and she's not a girl you've slept with yet so showing that much interest puts you in an awkward position.

Anyway, I'd need to see how you approach, run game, and then close but my suspicion is that (with the exception of what I recommended above with texting) your shooting yourself in the foot before grabbing her number. Try out the memory refreshing texting first but if you're still hitting a brick wall then I'll confidently say that texting isn't the problem.

-Richard

Also, Big Daddy, the above applies to you as well. If you're not sending "memory refreshing" texts to a girl then she'll likely stay neutral, if she was excited by you in person (during the approach/interaction) then you'll want to give her a way to remember that. As I said, shortly after a woman gives her number out she forgets about the guy and those feelings/interest wane until you remind her of who you are among the crowd of other guys.

 

[Big Daddy]

@lostnumber

Yeah, we are on the same page. The thing is if you can only schedule a date, say, one week away, you can get a girl who was level 7 of excitement back to 5 or 4, in which she'll probably flake.

So while I have no expectations to get a girl who's a 5 up to ten, I wonder if it's possible to do it just enough that she tips over to "I'll go out" side.

@Richard

Hmm, I see your point. But the thing is, let's say you do everything correctly to remind her of your existence, but for one reason or another, will only be able to meet her 8 days from now. How do you ping her over longer periods of time to keep her excited?

Unless you guys clicked very, very well during the approach I think her excitement goes down as time passes. More so if she flakes, you reschedule and she flakes again.

Yesterday I fucked a girl on our second date, but the first date had to be rescheduled three times. The thing is, she was the one (more or less) actively trying to make it happen. The problem is doing that when the girl is neutral at most towards you.

 

[Richard]

@Richard

Hmm, I see your point. But the thing is, let's say you do everything correctly to remind her of your existence, but for one reason or another, will only be able to meet her 8 days from now. How do you ping her over longer periods of time to keep her excited?

Unless you guys clicked very, very well during the approach I think her excitement goes down as time passes. More so if she flakes, you reschedule and she flakes again.

Yesterday I fucked a girl on our second date, but the first date had to be rescheduled three times. The thing is, she was the one (more or less) actively trying to make it happen. The problem is doing that when the girl is neutral at most towards you.

The thing to keep in mind is that all you're trying to do is maximize your chances of getting what you want and there is no "Follow XYZ steps here" because that amount of time contains a lot of nuances - her initial attraction to you, her wants/personality, the approach itself, etc. come into play so it's going to be a bit more specific to the situation.

Generally, if a girl is going to be away for a little while she's aware of it and will say so when you close (assuming you're clear about going out soon) and that changes how you text her. If you pull her number and she's excited and then finds out a few days later then that changes things and so on and so forth. If the girl is neutral AND going away for 8 days then I'd probably shoot her a text to enjoy her trip and that we'd link up when our schedules work out and leave her be for a week and a half or so; the upside is, when she gets back from her trip (8 day hiatus) you can use that to set up a date.

However, IMO, it's better to not focus on outlier situations like that because it's not something you're going to run into all that often. It's easier to get girls out who are neutral about you if you suggest a date revolving around something that she likes/is interested in because it takes some pressure off of her.

-Richard

 

[Michal]

I will add to what lostnumber mentioned about spreading out logistics over time. Last couple of months, it took me about a month to get a girl out (probably because of the summer) and I mostly solidified day and hour and place couple days later.

Second thing - I dont text His and Byes which (as I hope) creates a feeling that whatever is being messaged is part of one continuous conversation and it seems to be working great.