Make out only in location where you can escalate to sex? If cannot sex, peck?

[The Byronic Man]

Can I please get some clarification of the below from a veteran of the seduction arts? It's still not clear for me. Thanks!

1. If you can't bed her on a date, but you think she's ready for a make-out, do you make out with her...or do you give her a peck on the mouth...or do you give her a peck on the cheek? I keep reading about how you should never make out until you're in a location where you're able to escalate all the way to sex. And what if SHE "breaks this rule" by initiating the make-out despite not being able to escalate to sex?

2. If you try to bring her to your home, but fail to get her to agree, how do you recover? Just continue to chat her up without getting upset? Also track to create high point again so you can make out with her (or give her a peck on the mouth or cheek)?

 

[Estate]

Re: Make out only in location where you can escalate to sex? If cannot sex, peck

I know Chase advocates not kissing the girl until you are back to your place.

In practice, I'm split on this... I absolutely see the value in Chase's idea. The trouble is you need to get her to a point where she is absolutely gagging for you which requires incredibly tight game. If you can do this, she'll follow you home like a puppy.

I saw I'm split though because personally I find it situational.
Sometimes if she is like that little puppy, you can bring her back to your place and build huge suspense. She'll want to kiss the second you are alone.
Sometimes I might be with a girl or in a place where it's just not the "done thing" to start making out wildly in public... so lead her somewhere more private. Some girls will be a little conservative about public makeouts.

On the flip side. If I know a girl likes me but I need to escalate to get to the point of her wanting to come home then I personally do kiss her. But an important detail is make sure it's a GOOD and PASSIONATE kiss.
In settings like bars or clubs, people are drinking, they DO make out. It happens... so if she wants you to kiss her, I don't see a negative in this. But when you kiss her it has to be the thing that brings her to the point of wanting to follow you home. A sloppy, weak or unconfident kiss will have the opposite effect.

On question 2, I'll leave the top guys take that one but I can give my opinion.
I see guys push so hard to escalate in any way and if it doesn't work they act all pissy and look defeated. The idea is not to see it as a defeat. If she is coming to your place it shouldn't be this whole big production. You are having a great time together, you both just "end up" at your place. If somewhere along the line, she protests and you feel it's better to not push it further then be sweet yet casual about it. If you want to see her again, then you were just leading the date towards your place, if that was interrupted, then it's no big deal, you make sure it doesn't appear like a big deal to you, and you make sure she gets a cab home safely. If it comes off like you are pushing for sex or nothing then you are essentially going for broke... either she comes back with you, or she's gone.
If going to you place "just kinda happened" then also, if it doesn't happen somewhere along the way... then it also "just happened" that she went home. So if she's the type of girl who's going to be skeptical about you "only wanting 1 thing" then not acting pissy when you don't get that one thing goes a long way to seeing her again, IMO.

 

[Ross]

Re: Make out only in location where you can escalate to sex? If cannot sex, peck

Don't go on a date if you can't isolate her. Simple way to solve the problem of logistics.

The good news is, 99.9% of the time you can isolate her. Go in a public bathroom, in a park at night, or in a sparsely populated area. All points of isolation, all areas you can have sex. Or, you could be daring and go for public sex *Spring Break 2013 flashback* - but that one's liable to too much LMR and cock-blocking from others .

The key is to stop yourself from making out with them, and then leaving. Sure, people have made out with someone and then eventually escalated, but the escalation is way more wide open when you make out with them and sleep with them in the same series of events, rather than splitting it up. If she is willing to make out with you, she is willing to sleep with you (doesn't mean she won't throw out LMR on the sleeping part).

The trouble is you need to get her to a point where she is absolutely gagging for you which requires incredibly tight game.

Get this frame out of your head. It is not ridiculously hard to bring women home, and they don't need to be gushing over you in order to sleep with you. Most times, you can simply be an attractive guy, get a girl to a point of escalation, and sleep with her.

If you try to bring her to your home, but fail to get her to agree, how do you recover?

Really can't recover, unless you completely re-do the series of events and manage to reinforce the frame that you are going to bring her home. She also doesn't need to physically agree. Most times (99.9% of the time), when you blurt out, "Want to go home with me and sleep with me?" Women are going to say no. "We should grab a bite to eat at my place" is much better. They wonder, "Are we really going to eat, or is he going to make a move?" Most times, I suggest getting to business, and then eating .

 

[PinotNoir]

Re: Make out only in location where you can escalate to sex? If cannot sex, peck

I tend to agree with Estate here.

At least for beginners and intermediates, it's pretty hard to get another date, especially if she wanted to kiss you and you did not. For advanced guys who exude sexuality, then it probably counters it.

I think a good rule of thumb is how your value compares with hers. If you're much higher value (i.e., she's pretty much in love with you and compliments you on your looks, etc.), then do not make out if it will not lead to sex. If you're lower value and kissing will not lead to sex, making out is fine to bring your value a little higher and give you a better shot for a 2nd date and sex. This is just my opinion.

I've had amazing 1st dates with girls (or at least I thought they were amazing, and the girl kept saying "I loved it! I can't wait for the next date!") where I did not kiss, and then they completely dropped contact for the 2nd date. Then, I've had mediocre dates with girls that I got the kiss in, and we went on several dates after that. Therefore, I advocate if you're a beginner, go for the kiss, simply because usually your value will be equal or lower than hers (or very close) -- unless she's very low on your scale of hotness.

The 2nd question is much harder, as I'm also having trouble with that one. I think you'll want to lessen contact responsiveness, but nothing indicating that you're upset. It is just to make her think that you may be with other girls, and maybe she misjudged your value and should have slept with you in order to hook a good guy. Just say, "sorry, been busy. what's new?" Nothing that seems suspicious. Also, you need to be actively figuring out why she didn't. Were there any problems in the date? Or too conservative?