Not Texting Her - Why Does It Feel Like I'm Punishing Her?

[Big Daddy]

So ever since I started reading GC and got a grasp on investment I started to severely limit my texting to everyone in general. I disabled all notifications on my phone, so I genuinely just look at my phone when I feel like it. This gives a very natural response time and I'm not hostage of people messaging me and deliberately waiting to get back to them.

The only exception to this rule is when I'm texting a girl I'd like to fuck. Then I deliberately wait a little bit more to respond her every once in a while (sometimes hours). But the thing is: even if I set the right precedent -- "look, I'm not much of an texting guy, and you're feel free to hit me up when you feel like it; but please understand if I don't get to you right away. In fact, I only use text to arrange meetings, 'cause I prefer talking face-to-face. We should do that, by the way." -- I feel like I'm punishing the girl for her investment (texting, wanting to talk to me, etc) in me.

But I found that doing this has two problems, essentially: if the girl is OK with it, she rarely will be the first to hit me up again so I'll be the one initiating a conversation 90% of the time; if she's not, then she goes cold.

I've had girls go cold because they think "I just want to 'meet' (i.e. go out and fuck even if I suggest going for something like coffee) them" or that I don't care about them enough to have a conversation even when I explicitly said I'd love to do it face-to-face, which in my book is even better. I even had one girl tell me "whoa, sorry, I didn't know you were so busy" (we were in the middle of a text chat when I communicated that).

So I set bad precedents either way. If I text I'm setting the precedent that I like to text and if I don't, then I'll be the one initiating the conversation most of the time. And even I do it every couple of days to make sure she's not stepping in auto-rejection as I always feel like I punished her for texting and be interested in me.

How to deal with this?

 

[Smith]

BD,

I rarely do text conversation these days, unless I feel like the interaction was too short or it has been a while since we talked, and in that case, it's usually a couple of texts greeting her/bantering then ask her out. Otherwise I don't even bother have a text conversation just for the sake of it or to prevent her from going into auto-rejection. It's a waste of time. If you respond hours later, don't explain you're busy, just respond to the text accordingly. Either she'll reply or she'll drop you as her texting buddy. I feel like you don't need to explicitly say you'd rather meet her face to face, because why wouldn't she want to meet you

 

[Big Daddy]

@Radeng

Don't ever explain anything. If you meet and set up the date on the spot, what's the need for texting anymore than just figuring out a time?

This is exactly how my thought process works! It doesn't seem to work for them (18-22 girls), though.

I respond to most texts in 3o min to an hour, maybe a few hours if I'm really busy. I never get complaints.

Most of my responses are in that time frame as well, which is when I check my phone. Sometimes it's 2 minutes, sometimes it's 17 minutes and sometimes it's 1.5 hours. I don't sweat over it. I hardly look at my phone more than 1x per hour.

Do you have an example? What type of stuff are these girls trying to text you?

They are qualifying, wanting to keep the convo rolling and sometimes answering simple questions in a very detailed, deep divable fashion. Latest example:

How I got this girl's number is a somewhat long story, but it isn't relevant for this thread. What's important to know is that she gave me her number while framing it as "well, you seem like a decent guy so we might be good friends" or something to that extent.

Shes gorgeous, solid 9/10 so I just assumed she had a boyfriend. I mean, it's obvious that she has a boyfriend, she's pretty as fuck. I wasn't sure if she was DTF so I thought I'd screen right away before wasting time. So I waited a day and while I was waiting for a free spot in a restaurant, I texted her:

Me: Hey [name], it's Big Daddy. Save my number

Her: Hey, hi! Ok, done ^_^

Me: Haha, so, this isn't going to be a problem to your boyfriend?

Her: Oh, here it comes [she talked about how some guys are really weirdos the day she gave me her number. I thought it was it for me at this moment, but it was a very good move to screen this right away]
Her: He doesn't even exist

Me: Just to make sure there isn't going to be an jealousy freak coming after me
Me: Has happened in the past, but anyways haha
Me: So, tell me more about [trip she mentioned the day we met]

Her: Well, I didn't want to start talking about me like this but... don't need to worry about it. I never had a boyfriend.

I swear to motherfucking god, I almost had to hold my eyes in place otherwise they'd pop out of my face. As I had nothing to do at the time, I just kept chatting (mostly making short answers) with her over text and during the entire time she was giving me well thought, very long replies. I'd tell her to explain something, and here comes her 15-line text explanation.

After a while of extreme sweet, naive and invested behavior (aligned with the fact she never had a boyfriend and didn't go out that much) I realized that she must be a virgin and therefore isn't used to "the game". At some point she said:

I know so little about you. But it's okay, I won't make questions. I'll just present a little bit of myself so we can know each other better

Then sent 20-line text about her.

Regarding bolded: yeah, I know. She's not the type who will contact me first and put me again the wall with hard tests because she's just this (very good-looking) shy, career-focused girl who probably isn't used to a man (which she probably likes) being so open about being interested in her.

So I was afraid that stopping texting her would put her into auto-rejection after all the investment she made into keep things rolling thus far. I felt like I'd be punishing her for her investment. So I shared some bits about me as well (she never asked) to feed her enough that she'd continue talking.

I had a couple of dates scheduled to the following days, and I knew both of us wouldn't be able to go out on the weekend, so I'd have to keep chatting to her over text until we meet to prevent auto-rejection as it has happened in the past in a very similar scenario.

She continued with the same rhythm of texts the next day and I just thought I was setting a way too bad precedent if I happen to want to keep her around after I fuck her. So I just tried to communicate that I'm not much of a texting guy, bla bla bla. It did make her shit test me about me being "overbooked" but then we wen't to sleep and I didn't talk to her until she sent me an text 7:30 pm the next day:

Her: After tonight, I understand your vow of silence haha [which I tried to frame positively after a couple of minutes]

Me: Haha, I'm glad you understand
Me: Sometimes people make a lot of drama thinking that I do it on purpose
Me: Or that I'm ignoring them

Her: Nah, it's cool!
Her: We that are responsible for depleting all the words [meaning we talked a lot in the days before]

But she keeps qualifying to me and I don't want her to stop. I don't really mind it, and in fact I like this kind of auto-investment. Not long after this, she mentioned she was going to leave for a club because her friends dragged her over since they got a free-pass to a club because her birthday was in the following week.

But then she texted me like 3 am and I just got home myself and just happened to check my phone 3 minutes after she sent me texts saying that she was in the bathroom with her friend because she wasn't feeling very well, that she hated the place, wanted to go home, etc. almost as if she was saying "hey, I'm here, but please don't be mad at me, I don't really like it." and we just chat a little bit until she got home not long after that.

We just talked a little bit today and I initiated the conversation and got a feeling that she feels she's bothering me by texting or some shit. If I give more of a "conversation ending" answer, she stops texting (but if I ask something, she sends 15-lines answers again). And given her extremely sweet personality coupled with the fact that she's probably a virgin, I doubt she'll take the initiative to talk to me first. And I'd hate to make her stop investing.

I've been stretching the "ask her on a date" thing because you know how fucked up my logistics are and there's no way I'd pull a virgin (specially this one) to a motel, so I'm trying to find a way to pull her to my place at least this first time, but we'll probably do it in the middle of this week.

@Smith

That's exactly what I want to do. Strangely enough, I feel that when I don't text her enough, I got the feeling that she feels my attainability is too low and steps into auto-rejection mode. I think the above dives a little bit more into it.

If had the power to choose what works, I'd just shoot "hey, when you are free this week? Cool, what about coffee on Wednesday 4 pm then? Kay, see you there" and forget about it. But I had girls that I knew and already had gone out with tell me that I "don't even start a conversation" even though we had gone back-and-fourth for a couple of minutes before asking her out again.

 

[Smith]

That's exactly what I want to do. Strangely enough, I feel that when I don't text her enough, I got the feeling that she feels my attainability is too low and steps into auto-rejection mode. I think the above dives a little bit more into it.

If had the power to choose what works, I'd just shoot "hey, when you are free this week? Cool, what about coffee on Wednesday 4 pm then? Kay, see you there" and forget about it. But I had girls that I knew and already had gone out with tell me that I "don't even start a conversation" even though we had gone back-and-fourth for a couple of minutes before asking her out again.

Agree. In this case, ignoring her text after she send you a 15-line essay is kinda insulting. It doesn't sound like you have set up a date yet. From my experience, the longer the text conversation goes on without trying to set up a date, the more it feels like you're not leading. I just tried it out with a girl I met last week, and she stopped replying before I could even try to set up a date lol. I knew I could have asked her out in my second text, but I was trying to have more conversation before I asked her out and it didn't work haha. But look, try set up a date because no matter how much investment she gives you over text, it doesn't mean anything if she tells you her schedule is busy this week. It has happened to me before, and I found that a huge waste of time. Save the deep diving and qualifying when you meet her. Do it for a small amount over text if you have to. Deep diving/qualifying over text isn't the same as in person. You can't seduce her or tease her with your eye contact, touch and voice.

Most of my texts now look very straightforward. 3-4 texts setting up logistics and I'm done lol. Everytime I tried to start a conversation because I think it would be helpful, it rarely works, like 1 out of 10, and I would be investing too much time on it when I could be getting some work done.

Also, I think the reason girls give you "shit test" when you tell them you're not a texting person is because you can come across as slightly condescending (especially over text). They might not even think you're punishing them, but because you point it out, now they realize they're investing too much, so they start shit testing you or going cold to gain some power back. So it's best not to say anything unless they actually complain. It's not a problem if she doesn't mention it.

 

[ray_zorse]

I personally find texting really difficult, getting better, but ohh the progress is so incremental.

What I want to contribute here is ALWAYS REWARD CHASING. Yes, it's good to be a bit unavailable and so on, and you don't want to get into texting-buddy territory ESPECIALLY IF SHE'S DEFLECTED YOUR REQUEST FOR THE DATE, but the overriding factor here is if she invests, reward that investment. That's why I don't mind a little text chit-chat if she's a good girl. But keep in mind to save any real deep diving for the date. Sexy talk should only be as a reward if she initiates it, otherwise try to seem like a normal guy over text, until you get her out on the date, then you can ramp things up about. Yes, also try to set up the date early in the conversation.

Another thing people often forget is the voice call. If anything seems like it might be difficult or complicated to set up, a carefully timed voice call (based on what you know of her schedule) can be the go. It's quite ballsy. Chase reports having gotten very good at phone game first and this spilling over into his text game, in his ebook he recommends to approach it this way if you're new (but the ebook advice might be out of date however).

Ray

 

[Big Daddy]

So I just followed y'all advice and just set up a date with her on Wednesday afternoon. Hopefully I'll be able to bring her to my place and go from there. Texting has been a bitch for me, once I get the small commitment for them to go on a date I'm good.

Just something I think I should note, she's been less responsive than when we first texted. Probably has to to with what Smith mention plus my terrible suave on that frame-setting of "I'm not much of a texting guy". Still, despite giving sending more normal-length texts, she's been relatively warm and answer almost right after I send something to her.

Still, now that I established the "I just text to arrange meet ups" frame, I will maintain it and refrain from texting for today and tomorrow.

I wanted to see if can get her to auto-invest in me, but for now, as long as she doesn't flake (I doubt she will), I'm good.

@Smith

They might not even think you're punishing them, but because you point it out, now they realize they're investing too much, so they start shit testing you or going cold to gain some power back.

You're so right, I think this is exactly what happened. My bad doing this... but I have a hard time setting some frames over texts without being overly explicit.

So it's best not to say anything unless they actually complain. It's not a problem if she doesn't mention it.

Yep, I'll keep this in mind. Thanks dude.

@Ray

What I want to contribute here is ALWAYS REWARD CHASING.

Yeah, that's why I felt so awkward ignoring girls texts and cutting them off "hey, cool but let's talk about it on our date" -- I want to reward them so they keep investing more and more -- even if that's a "right" frame to set.

As for sex talk, you're right. I was shooting the shit with Radeng the other day and he brought my attention to the fact that it's really awkward do it over text, so I stopped doing it. (In retrospect, it looks awkward as fuck because it's hard to understand its nuances over text indeed.)

@Radeng

Thanks man! I'll be the first to admit that while I certainly made a good impression on this girl, I'll probably never see this kind of investment in my life anytime soon because it's very dependent on her personality, this girl is so caring and nurturing (which is funny, looking in retrospect, because I thought she was a "unforgivable, cold bitch" given her beauty. Couldn't be farther from the truth).

Regarding your 1st point: well, she doesn't text me if I don't text her first, which is kinda lame because I remember reading an article where Chase mentioned that you shouldn't accustom your girl with you being the sex seeker. Still, too much thought for now. I'm mainly focusing on being more polarizing and gathering reference points. I'll deal with this later if it becomes an issue (I haven't even fuck this girl yet!).

2nd point: yeah, the date wasn't brought up until today in fact. But I always ask girls if they like coffee on the first text so I can get back to it later "so hey, what about we go out and have that coffee?" which is exactly what I did here.

For sure man! I plan to write a report on this one specially if I fuck her, but I have a couple more reports waiting to be written...

 

[Franco]

Big Daddy,

I kind of skimmed through this one, but in general, you shouldn't be explaining this type of stuff to girls you haven't slept with yet. And in most cases, girls aren't going to bring it up to you. If they do, it means they are chasing you, which is a good sign. But if that's the case, you just want to play it off:

i.e.

Her: You're a really bad texter!
You (possibly hours later): Haha, I just don't check my phone that often! Are you saying I need to get one of those instagram or snapchat things so I can check it all day?
Her: Haha, no! It just feels like I'm talking to myself sometimes when I text you
You: I like reading your cute little conversations with yourself though

There are many ways you can handle it, but you should never be attempting to address why you don't text girls often, especially before you've slept with the girl. That's a good way to make her think oddly of you and not want to pursue.

- Franco

 

[Big Daddy]

Franco, thank you for pointing this out, I'll have it in mind in the future. It's that I really just wanted to reward her investment and keep her investing as much as I could and then step out before I set a really bad precedent without firing auto-rejection.

I got back yesterday from a date with the girl I mentioned here and put up a report about it. And it turned out completely different than I thought it would be. Thought you guys might wanna read.