Estimated fellow journeymen,
here's my second FR and while discussing the interesting turn things took on this date and hoping to get some feedback where I could tweak my strategy; I also want to put down some general thought about first-date strategies for beginners/intermediates and why splitting things in two dates could be more beneficial than following Chase's classic "first-date-pull" template. But without further ado, let's get to the core of things.
Background: party acquaintance, messed up pull
I met my girl last weekend out during a party. After having a rather unproductive night out in a club where I didn't muster up the balls to cold-approach a girl, we managed to sneak into a nice club on the way back home without paying. There, a girl was dancing close to me, suddenly yelling something into the room in the local language (which I'm not capable of yet), so I turned, smiled at her and asked her what the deal was. She seemed to like me so I flirted with her, moved her to the bar and had a flirty, touchy and light-hearted talk with her for about 10 minutes, trying to deep-dive while we were both legitimately a bit too drunk for that
Feeling a lot of attraction from her side, I tried to invite myself to her place, persisting 2 times but not getting her to go along with the frame. I'm pretty sure that with tighter game, I could have pulled her there, but I'm just not there yet.
Feeling that further standing around would only damage me, I took her phone, added myself on fb and agreed to have a beer in the next days. Went back to dance with my friends, while getting gazes from her and having her dance over to me two times. Soon, the club closed and she invited me to an after party with her friends. As my friends were already on the move (and thus the only way to get home cheaply), I figured that an after party with people I don't know at all far from my place would rather be an awkward place and not very conducive to a successful pull, so I told her to "move the after party to next week". She then messaged me later that night, reinforcing my perception that she' was very attracted to me. Some days later, I messaged her and we set up a date classic: going for a beer in the centre - which is unfortunately far from my place, logistics are shit for me right now in this town.
The Date: transition problems
Since I'm away on the weekend and she's got to work early (getting up at 6.45 AM) we set up date during the week rather early (7 PM), so I figured that we can talk for 1,5-2 hours and still go back to my/her place and have time. The date went pretty well, she welcomed me very warm and looked even way better than I remembered from the weekend. I deep dived her and she was happy to share a lot about her dreams/travels/future plans etc. Here I've got to say that I'm struggling to get that sexy vibe down and I absolutely feel awkward using chase frames, so that we connected very well but the flirtiness was not that well developed - although I employed knacks like occasional touch, corners-of-the-eyes gaze etc. However, after 1,5 hours we finished our first beers and I figured that after a second one it might be too late to sell her something to do at her/my place due to her having to get up early. I basically used Alek's "get food and eat at home" pull to invite myself over to her place (due to my faraway housing situation):
Thus, we went from the bar to a deli to grab something. I had her advise me on what to get and was bantering around a bit how she'd be held responsible if it wasn't good Then, I went for the pull:
She didn't really respond to that one and I had to get back into the queue to order. However, she seemed to get into her head and was wandering around the shop. I started to have the feeling that she became a bit uncomfortable, wasn't sure though. I then got my sandwich and packed it and we started walking toward the metro (our homes lie on the same line, although hers is closer to the centre). Since she didn't say anything about going home any more, I just followed Chase's advice to act as if she had agreed and lead her to the metro, getting on and riding back towards our homes. However, I felt that she was not as comfortable any more and the conversation had become a bit more bumpy. I tried to act just as before and reassure her by being warm and keeping the conversation up, but to be honest it deteriorated a bit into small talk. I personally hate riding home on the train during a pull as it kills a lot of the atmosphere. Thus, we arrived at her stop and this was the rather sudden and short conversation:
Of course, this happened within some seconds as the train was stopping and she had to get off quickly. So a very hard setting to react quickly and collect your thoughts, especially as a beginner. Off she was. Because this kind of ending obviously has a bit strange feeling to it, I thought it would be better to re-establish contact a bit rather soon and send her a message later in the evening:
Well, that seems pretty dead for now, but I'll still try to re-engage next week and set up a second date. By gut feeling, however, chances are low.
Analysis & General thoughts on the effects of Chase-style first-date pulls
So where did I slip here?
I think that my approach was maybe just too mechanically focused on "talk for x time, then invite her over". Because although we had a good vibe, it wasn't "that point with so much tension where you feel that things need to be pushed forward". One big flaw is definitely that I suck at chase framing and flirting/playfulness (at least when sober), although I think I often can compensate by tight fundamentals (looks, fashion, body, voice), social awareness and good conversation skills. I might also have slipped into the boyfriend category as I don't do much active dis-qualification here (wouldn't really know how to put it naturally into the conversation anyway), thinking that being in town for just some weeks, not bragging about status and moving fast would take care of that itself. Plus, the transition was definitely handled badly, but how would you do it differently? Just revert back to a bar after you sense she's getting more uncomfortable and attempting another pull later? But that would be massive frame-yielding. Any outside perspectives highly welcome here!
Now to a more general topic:
I am starting to question the suitability of Chase-style first-date pulls for beginners/intermediates like me, especially with bad logistics. I managed to lose two girls that were clearly liking me a lot with this in just 2 weeks (see here: https://boards.girlschase.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9776). Both times, I could have definitely kissed them at the date, but I avoided that and pushed, failed and lost them for good. By inviting myself over to their place, I ask for huge compliance that is maybe just not in line with my still lacking sexy vibe. Maybe something like another writer here in a similar position proposed would be better: go to the park with the girl, deep dive, kiss, establish comfort and connection. THEN invite her over for the second date directly to your place (which she should be more comfortable about given the history established at that point), avoiding all the transition shit were you have high chances of slipping and escalate things further there. It honestly seems more promising for me right now since it takes many potential points where I lost girls out of the equation. A buddy of mine here had also some successes with that strategy lately.
That's a very interesting subject to discuss so I'd be happy to hear your opinions about it - and of course comments about game tweaks for me in this particular interaction.
Best, pearce
here's my second FR and while discussing the interesting turn things took on this date and hoping to get some feedback where I could tweak my strategy; I also want to put down some general thought about first-date strategies for beginners/intermediates and why splitting things in two dates could be more beneficial than following Chase's classic "first-date-pull" template. But without further ado, let's get to the core of things.
Background: party acquaintance, messed up pull
I met my girl last weekend out during a party. After having a rather unproductive night out in a club where I didn't muster up the balls to cold-approach a girl, we managed to sneak into a nice club on the way back home without paying. There, a girl was dancing close to me, suddenly yelling something into the room in the local language (which I'm not capable of yet), so I turned, smiled at her and asked her what the deal was. She seemed to like me so I flirted with her, moved her to the bar and had a flirty, touchy and light-hearted talk with her for about 10 minutes, trying to deep-dive while we were both legitimately a bit too drunk for that
Feeling a lot of attraction from her side, I tried to invite myself to her place, persisting 2 times but not getting her to go along with the frame. I'm pretty sure that with tighter game, I could have pulled her there, but I'm just not there yet. Feeling that further standing around would only damage me, I took her phone, added myself on fb and agreed to have a beer in the next days. Went back to dance with my friends, while getting gazes from her and having her dance over to me two times. Soon, the club closed and she invited me to an after party with her friends. As my friends were already on the move (and thus the only way to get home cheaply), I figured that an after party with people I don't know at all far from my place would rather be an awkward place and not very conducive to a successful pull, so I told her to "move the after party to next week". She then messaged me later that night, reinforcing my perception that she' was very attracted to me. Some days later, I messaged her and we set up a date classic: going for a beer in the centre - which is unfortunately far from my place, logistics are shit for me right now in this town.
The Date: transition problems
Since I'm away on the weekend and she's got to work early (getting up at 6.45 AM) we set up date during the week rather early (7 PM), so I figured that we can talk for 1,5-2 hours and still go back to my/her place and have time. The date went pretty well, she welcomed me very warm and looked even way better than I remembered from the weekend. I deep dived her and she was happy to share a lot about her dreams/travels/future plans etc. Here I've got to say that I'm struggling to get that sexy vibe down and I absolutely feel awkward using chase frames, so that we connected very well but the flirtiness was not that well developed - although I employed knacks like occasional touch, corners-of-the-eyes gaze etc. However, after 1,5 hours we finished our first beers and I figured that after a second one it might be too late to sell her something to do at her/my place due to her having to get up early. I basically used Alek's "get food and eat at home" pull to invite myself over to her place (due to my faraway housing situation):
Me: Well, I gotta admit that I haven't had dinner yet, so I'm starving right now.
Her: Ooh, really?
Me: Yes, haven't gotten used to your early dining times here yet.
She: Well I had something before I came, but then we should get something for you!
Thus, we went from the bar to a deli to grab something. I had her advise me on what to get and was bantering around a bit how she'd be held responsible if it wasn't good
Then, I went for the pull:Me: You know, this deli is not very inviting, why don't we pack the sandwich up and head home to enjoy it in peace and watch a movie or something?
Her: Hmm.. I don't know, I have to get up really early.
Me: Haha, don't worry - it's still very early and you can always kick me out when it gets too late
She didn't really respond to that one and I had to get back into the queue to order. However, she seemed to get into her head and was wandering around the shop. I started to have the feeling that she became a bit uncomfortable, wasn't sure though. I then got my sandwich and packed it and we started walking toward the metro (our homes lie on the same line, although hers is closer to the centre). Since she didn't say anything about going home any more, I just followed Chase's advice to act as if she had agreed and lead her to the metro, getting on and riding back towards our homes. However, I felt that she was not as comfortable any more and the conversation had become a bit more bumpy. I tried to act just as before and reassure her by being warm and keeping the conversation up, but to be honest it deteriorated a bit into small talk. I personally hate riding home on the train during a pull as it kills a lot of the atmosphere. Thus, we arrived at her stop and this was the rather sudden and short conversation:
Her: That's my stop, I'm getting off here. (mental note: not "us" getting off)
Me: Really? Let's just go on a bit!
Her: I really have to get up early and plan some things for tomorrow's work.
Me (attempting the hard push): Are you sure? I'm not sure if we'll see each other again and it'd be nice to spend some more time together.
She: Well, let's just keep in touch then!
Me: (shortly playing with the thought of just stepping outside with her but then admitting defeat): Okay, see you around then!
Of course, this happened within some seconds as the train was stopping and she had to get off quickly. So a very hard setting to react quickly and collect your thoughts, especially as a beginner. Off she was. Because this kind of ending obviously has a bit strange feeling to it, I thought it would be better to re-establish contact a bit rather soon and send her a message later in the evening:
My text: The food was pretty good indeed, thanks for the tip. Was nice to meet you, albeit short
Her text: That's good! Likewise
Well, that seems pretty dead for now, but I'll still try to re-engage next week and set up a second date. By gut feeling, however, chances are low.
Analysis & General thoughts on the effects of Chase-style first-date pulls
So where did I slip here?
I think that my approach was maybe just too mechanically focused on "talk for x time, then invite her over". Because although we had a good vibe, it wasn't "that point with so much tension where you feel that things need to be pushed forward". One big flaw is definitely that I suck at chase framing and flirting/playfulness (at least when sober), although I think I often can compensate by tight fundamentals (looks, fashion, body, voice), social awareness and good conversation skills. I might also have slipped into the boyfriend category as I don't do much active dis-qualification here (wouldn't really know how to put it naturally into the conversation anyway), thinking that being in town for just some weeks, not bragging about status and moving fast would take care of that itself. Plus, the transition was definitely handled badly, but how would you do it differently? Just revert back to a bar after you sense she's getting more uncomfortable and attempting another pull later? But that would be massive frame-yielding. Any outside perspectives highly welcome here!
Now to a more general topic:
I am starting to question the suitability of Chase-style first-date pulls for beginners/intermediates like me, especially with bad logistics. I managed to lose two girls that were clearly liking me a lot with this in just 2 weeks (see here: https://boards.girlschase.com/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=9776). Both times, I could have definitely kissed them at the date, but I avoided that and pushed, failed and lost them for good. By inviting myself over to their place, I ask for huge compliance that is maybe just not in line with my still lacking sexy vibe. Maybe something like another writer here in a similar position proposed would be better: go to the park with the girl, deep dive, kiss, establish comfort and connection. THEN invite her over for the second date directly to your place (which she should be more comfortable about given the history established at that point), avoiding all the transition shit were you have high chances of slipping and escalate things further there. It honestly seems more promising for me right now since it takes many potential points where I lost girls out of the equation. A buddy of mine here had also some successes with that strategy lately.
That's a very interesting subject to discuss so I'd be happy to hear your opinions about it - and of course comments about game tweaks for me in this particular interaction.
Best, pearce
