Street harassment

[fsc]

Link

Is it just me, or are these "street harassment" bullshit popping up more frequently?

I'd say maybe 1/3 of the guys in the footage were harassing or being bothersome/creepy, but since when did "How are you?", "Have a good day", and "Have a nice evening" become harassment?

I REALLY REALLY want to say "lol...silly feminists" and chuckle this off, but this is starting to get pretty annoying. What the F is wrong with people? =/

 

[Rage]

Hey fsc, neat share

(Out of curiosity) have you seen other stories of this/videos of this (anything of that sort) recently besides this?

I haven’t, but then I don’t follow the news too much either and only see the occasional viral vid if someone mentions it somewhere…

I get the same reaction as you; wanna just kind of laugh and say ha silly…

Personally I think from a purely objective standpoint, if a woman was really that concerned about getting cat called and incidentally approached on the street couldn’t she just choose to dress in something a little more conservative (less form fitting etc.) to get less attention? Chase made this point in https://www.girlschase.com/content/youre ... lest-girls that many of the truly most beautiful girls hide their beauty so as not to attract the extra attention from it.

I sort of do the same thing; I’m actually buff as fucking shit (just kidding; but in pretty good shape) and will make sure not to dress showing too much muscle (not wear anything too excessively form fitting) to help my attainability and to make sure that I don’t get too many girls looking at me (and that if they look it’s because of good nonverbal fundamentals and posture and stuff primarily).

Would be funny to make a video trolling this with an attractive guy and seeing all the girls that go on to check him out as he walks down the street (albeit much more subtly than these dudes).

 

[fsc]

Gem,

Yeah, there was another thread here discussing this video.

The girl in the original video was already dressed pretty conservatively. If anything, I suppose that her attainability was high enough that men felt confident enough to catcall her and whatnot. I think a legitimately gorgeous woman would get the least amount "street harassment" due to low attainability, unless she's dressed like a hooker, and I'm thinking average-looking girls receive the most, whether they're dressed conservatively or a bit more provocative.

The troll video you're looking for.



I realized where my irritation was coming from.

I'm annoyed because idiot feminists and internet activists (or most people, rather) will see this and wrongfully get this negative view of men in their minds without even thinking about the actual issue. I think the main issue that the "street harassment" videos show is men's inability to socialize properly. Some of the guys shown in the video have terrible social calibration (or maybe they just don't give a shit), and as a result their behavior and the things they say are legit harassment. And people will take this footage, bundle up all the men into this group of oppressors, and whine about how women are victims and how this patriarchal society sucks and blah blah. I mean, yeah, women are victims, but they're victims of men who lack social skills--not of men who are sexist or objectifiers of women or whatever. So I think it's much more appropriate to blame whatever is causing our interpersonal skills to deteriorate rather than men in general as these sites and videos do. And I think the videos' titles should read "Look at all these idiots who do not know how to talk to women"

 

[Drck]

Yea, like guys should be sorry for her looking good. Just saw that article today, the real interesting thing is that she gets hit on 100x in 10 hours. That's every 6 minutes on average or so... Just imagine if you as a guy was 'hit on' by girl every 6 minutes. Heaven on Earth! He'd have to be fool not liking it!

 

[fsc]

I'm voting for Hilary. I hope to all gods of all religions that she wins, so that the next time I hear a feminazi complaining about gender issues, I can be like "bitch, our president is a female."

 

[Ross]

Saw this the other day.

All I can say is don't give obvious propaganda the light of day. Yes, actual street harassment is an issue. No, it's not only women that deal with it.

 

[Chase]

Was walking down a street in London earlier when a cute, slim blonde in fashionable but conservative attire walked briskly by. There were a pair of young African guys walking and joking with each other in front of me, and the one closer to her when she passed by reacted like a hawk with a, "Hey, how are you doing?" or something like that. She pretended like she never heard him and just kept walking.

This stuff's always happened, but it's getting reported / complained about more because of the Internet. Fact is, women don't really like getting hit on by guys who hit on them in lame ways, especially if those guys can potentially be threatening (tough rap for black dudes who are upstanding citizens, but the blacks who are criminals make people a bit more naturally jumpy about being approached in uncool ways - really though, any guy approaching a girl in an uncool way is a bother).

One of the BIGGEST problems of "street harassment" is that not that it's a man expressing interest. If the guy in front of me earlier today said, "Excuse me, but I just have to say your boots are absolutely stunning! Have a nice day!" the girl almost certainly would've left with a big grin on her face.

Instead, he asked her some kind of question that she doesn't want to answer, but that some part of her feels like it is obligated to answer, and it triggers this internal mental battle: "Oh, he asked me how I'm doing - should I answer that? Wait no, this is some loser stranger who doesn't even know how to talk to me in a half-decent way. Okay, I guess keep on walking then - but is that rude? Okay, just ignore it." It's distracting and forces her to spend mental resources on someone who is a.) not cool, and b.) not attractive. She may also need to do a threat assessment: "This guy is bigger and stronger than me - is he going to be pissed off if I don't give him any acknowledgement? Maybe I should give him a smile or a quick reply. But would that then encourage him to pursue me further?"

I also occasionally have randoms ask me how I'm doing for no apparent reason as I'm walking down the street, and it IS annoying; it forces me to ask myself things like, "Is this guy just super friendly? Should I respond? Is he sizing me up to try and pick my pockets or attack me with some group of guys? Is he trying to see if I'll slow down and feel obligated to respond to him, showing myself to be a good potential mark for a con or someone easily distracted while an accomplice empties my pockets? Is he some gay dude who's trying to get in my ass? Why is he even talking to me randomly?" I'm pretty good at ignoring people after years in third world countries where people line the streets trying to get your attention to get you to buy junk or let them pickpocket you, but even with years of experience ignoring these people it's still a bother. And if it's a big, aggressive-looking guy or a group of guys I may feel like I HAVE to say something back (and keep moving) just to not seem like I'm afraid of them and thus a potential mark, or intentionally snubbing them and thus someone disrespecting them who must be challenged and fought.

I'd argue the biggest problem with what's getting reported as street harassment isn't that women don't want attention (of course they do!), but that what uncalibrated guys making catcalls and using lame openers on girls are doing is cognitively costly to the girls - it forces them to quit devoting mental resources to whatever they were trying to devote it to (what they were thinking about before) and to devote it to assessing whether to respond back, what the threat level is, etc. with these guys instead.

I don't think there's anything really actionable you can do - you can't teach all the guys who catcall in the world to start doing proper street approaches, because it's too hard for most guys and heck, if everybody was doing day game effectively it wouldn't be so darn effective anymore.

Just be aware that if you're doing your street approaches in a cool, attractive, and NOT cognitively costly way, you'll be far away from anything that might be considered "street harassment". This is the domain of clueless dudes using lame openers.

Chase

 

[MelbourneBounce]

"I also occasionally have randoms ask me how I'm doing for no apparent reason as I'm walking down the street, and it IS annoying; it forces me to ask myself things like, "Is this guy just super friendly? Should I respond"

I feel what I'm going to add is different, but I'm still curious.

If someone's walking down the street and without breaking stride they ask "How's it going?" and continue to walk on, is that the type of thing that would be considered annoying?

I'm Irish and this is a pretty common occurence.

 

[fsc]

I'm voting for Hilary. I hope to all gods of all religions that she wins, so that the next time I hear a feminazi complaining about gender issues, I can be like "bitch, our president is a female."

So your solution to feminism is to make a lesbian feminist into the leader of the free world...how exactly does that make sense? Are things not bad enough already for men and the nuclear family? What we need is a strong leader who sees right through the progressive bullshit and restores some form of real order so that our society will cease to deteriorate, or at least slow down its decline...but unfortunately things are going to get a lot worse before they get better.

Yes. Before Obama got elected, I occasionally used to hear people pull the "race card" and say shit like "What? You think I'm stupid because I'm black?!" I haven't heard anything like that since 2008. Maaaybe it's because I moved to a more affluent area in 2012, but I don't know...Black people seem to be happier.

I'm not interested in politics or government, but how much can Hilary realistically accomplish in 4 years? All conservatives gotta do is make her presidency real tough, and hopefully feminazis will simply realize that gender and social issues aren't all that easy to change and go home shrugging, "Oh well, we've tried."

Let's say a strong leader who sees through progressive bullshit gets elected. Maybe he/she will come up with a creative and effective way to improve or society, but for sure feminazis will only get louder and more annoying.

I don't know. You seem to be more well-versed in politics. I'm just trying to make money and get laid.

 

[Mr.Rob]

D. Your question about how much a President can accomplish in 4 years makes me think that honestly dude you probably shouldn't be voting with that level of understanding of how the world works.

Drexel how and what do you suggest we do to get educated properly to vote?
There's so much information out there its difficult to get a real bead on what is what without spending hours upon hour taxing my brain on something I'm only halfway passionate about.

So what did you do/read/media consumption (not news media but info media) do you use to get your information and make a informed choice?

It is scary the amount of people that will probably vote without any inclination other than "the radio said not to vote for X because he's a liar".

Thanks,

Rob

 

[Rage]

They flipped this video and made it a guy walking down the street instead: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=75aX9mlipiY

Poor guy seems traumatized ... lol.

 

[fsc]

A. Black people have been treated horrible by the Obama administration, black wealth has dropped since his election
B. Obama has made extraordinarily poor decisions and deeply damaged America's reputation on the world stage
C. What A and B mean, is that the elected President has such a huge impact that we must take many things into consideration when choosing who to vote for. Their color or gender is the least important thing you can imagine.
D. Your question about how much a President can accomplish in 4 years makes me think that honestly dude you probably shouldn't be voting with that level of understanding of how the world works. I mean no offense, but you clearly have no skin in the game whatsoever.
E. A strong leader who sees through progressive bullshit would take feminazis out of the narrative, ideally, so nobody would be hearing anything from them ever again because they would not have a platform from which to shriek.

I'd like this thread to remain on the main topic of feminazis and not get blown up into a comprehensive discussion of government and politics because:
1. I do not care much about government or politics, which is why I haven't voted before. I don't even plan on voting unless I develop strong feelings for, and attain solid knowledge on, whatever it is that I'm trying to vote for or against.
2. I don't even know much about government or politics beyond what I learned in my general ed political science class in college, so the things I say are fallible.
3. Controversial shit always come up during discussions of government and politics like "your sources are crap", "Obama is a reptilian humanoid", and blah blah.
4. Political debates can go on and on and on and on...

Also, I'd like to differentiate feminists from feminazis. UrbanDictionary's first definition of feminazis capture my view quite well here. I support women's rights. I want to throw things at feminazis. The people behind the original street harassment video are feminazis.


A & B: Perhaps Hilary will turn out to be the same and end up not helping out women very much. Perhaps Hilary will damage America's reputation even more, and people will start thinking "Gee, we should've voted for a strong man who sees through progressive bullshit instead," or "Gee, gender roles are real". Hopefully women will be like "oh well, we've tried", and be more submissive afterwards.

C: Obviously color and gender are irrelevant...but how many Americans do you think will actually look through Hilary's credentials with a microscope? My guess is that peeps will vote for Hilary simply because #change and #equality and #NOmeansNO or whatever. I'm guessing her opposition will try to show flaws in Hilary's campaign, but all Hilary has to do is frame her opposition as "sexist pigs and proponents of rape who are simply trying to degrade Hilary as a woman", and people will buy it.

D: Like I said, feminazis are the main topic at hand, in my mind at least. So when I said "how much can Hilary realistically accomplish in 4 years?" I wasn't talking about how much a US president can accomplish in 4 years, in general. What I meant was more along the lines of, "what can Hilary realistically do in 4 years as it pertains to the feminazi cause?" Pretty big difference.

A strong leader who sees through progressive bullshit would take feminazis out of the narrative, ideally, so nobody would be hearing anything from them ever again because they would not have a platform from which to shriek.

I like how you put "ideally", because to me it sounds like something out of a movie. I mean...you have this strong leader character who rises to presidency and whoops the big bad feminazi's ass within two terms somehow. It's possible, but personally, I think trying to silence them directly is only gonna give them more teeth. Can you imagine the massive backlash from feminazis? Like I mentioned, I think the best way to destroy feminazis is to let Hilary be elected president. You know, sorta like a sugar-coated poison pill. The election alone should send home plenty of feminazis thinking that they've already won. The rest will be drowned out over the course of Hilary's term as they realize their goals aren't being accomplished--whether it be due to her opposition making her presidency hell, or due to the fact that social issues aren't gonna change overnight. I mean, look at how long it took women to win suffrage. If anything, I think all that will happen is a couple of good laws that promote women's rights will be passed, and maybe a few shitty feminazi laws will slip through...but those can be reversed right?

 

[MisterTaco]

Although I genuinely agree that street harassment is a legitimate issue that needs to be properly addressed, there are a few problems I found with this video however. For starters, its like the majority of people fail to realize that videos such as these are posted only after being HEAVILY edited in order to capture and display certain facets just to get their points across. It's similar to those viral prank videos nowadays that are concentrated into 2 minute compilations which are exclusively saturated with the most dramatic reactions. An example of this is these kids who post videos of them pulling off "pranks in the hood" where they approach groups of black men and purposely yell out slurs or make racist jokes directed at them while their buddy records it from a distance. They also go up to random people posted up on park benches asking them if they want to buy a gun. After doing God knows how many approaches they then put up an edited version which only shows black men punching these kids light out and a lot of people unfortunately see these videos and get visual representation of young black males as being violent but you don't see how many people actually walked away or ignored these "pranksters'" attempts, which could actually be higher in numbers than the amount who attacked or responded.

I saw one of the most eye-opening comments somewhere by a person in the comment section of an article posting the video of the woman getting harassed in the streets of NYC . I couldn't find it but it broke down the situation in numbers. This is the most that I could remember from it:

-" If Population density of NYC is 25,846 persons/km² (Google). Assuming 1/2 is male, 1/10 on her path she passed 64,615 males on her walk. That means 108 out of 64,615 is 0.0017%. Passing 1000 people, that's 2 would at least say 'hello" or "hey girl". This can be easily edited and shaped with such a volume of people."


On a side note, places like Cairo, Rome and New Delhi have some of the HIGHEST rate of harassment in the world..i've seen it in Egypt when walking with my sisters and the "harassment" in that video don't even COME close to what happens in these places, the difference is actually so mind boggling it will actually make you consider what is defined as harassment As a guy with a Mom and sisters I really am concerned when it comes to issues such as these but I do think people blow things WAY out of proportion before they can actually appropriately assess a situation for what it is and not what it APPEARS to be. This girl walked around NYC for 10 whole HOURS, and there's so much factors that play a role when walking around a city that big for that long.

Just my two cents.

Taco

 

[Franco]

Not comment on any of the side topics occurring in this thread, but as I would like to elaborate with MisterTaco's post, it's important to keep in mind that the girl in question here went out with an objective to make men approaching women in the street seem like a terrible thing.

What would have been interesting would have been to see, for example, Chase, myself, or another experienced, well-dressed individual opening her with a genuine direct compliment while she was making this film. While making the film, she has probably firmly instructed herself to keep walking to get "good footage" of the objective. But does that mean she would have had the same reaction to a genuinely sexy man paying her a sincere, direct compliment? Probably not.

When these videos are filmed, all of the "actors" are given a specific purpose in the film, and that purpose doesn't necessarily illustrate what would REALLY happen if it was just an everyday situation occurring with no cameras rolling or alternative motives in mind.

It wouldn't have really mattered WHO approached her in this video and with ANY opener because, in her mind, her job was to show "street harassment." So that's something to keep in mind.

- Franco

 

[fsc]

Not comment on any of the side topics occurring in this thread, but as I would like to elaborate with MisterTaco's post, it's important to keep in mind that the girl in question here went out with an objective to make men approaching women in the street seem like a terrible thing.

What would have been interesting would have been to see, for example, Chase, myself, or another experienced, well-dressed individual opening her with a genuine direct compliment while she was making this film. While making the film, she has probably firmly instructed herself to keep walking to get "good footage" of the objective. But does that mean she would have had the same reaction to a genuinely sexy man paying her a sincere, direct compliment? Probably not.

When these videos are filmed, all of the "actors" are given a specific purpose in the film, and that purpose doesn't necessarily illustrate what would REALLY happen if it was just an everyday situation occurring with no cameras rolling or alternative motives in mind.

It wouldn't have really mattered WHO approached her in this video and with ANY opener because, in her mind, her job was to show "street harassment." So that's something to keep in mind.

- Franco

To add to this, they really wanted to push their message.

At one point in the video, she passed by a Jimmy Jazz store. The store name caught my eyes because they were in huge green letters, so I looked up Jimmy Jazz locations in Manhattan. There are 3, and she isn't walking by any of them...I checked using the Google Maps street view. Most of the stores are located in Brooklyn, Queens, and the Bronx, so she is walking in front of one of those. Despite the video claiming that she walked all over Manhattan, she actually went to other boroughs of New York to film this.

Another thing to note is the environment and the other pedestrians. Throughout the video, you will see the same type of people and the same type of environment (minus the few seconds spent in Times Square). In the video, there are a bunch of stores with its windows covered up with paper or the metal plates thingy (some of which also have graffiti on them), and you never see an Asian or ANY men in suits or even a nice button-down shirt despite Manhattan being home to Chinatown and the Financial District.

So yeah, she chose the areas to walk around, because she knew she'd find what she wanted.

 

[Franco]

In the end all this video did was demonstrate how many black guys have terrible game when it comes to white chicks.

...And apparently have no idea about fashion as well.

Which is why it's good for other black guys to take note and stand out.

- Franco

 

[MisterTaco]

Quite honestly I've seen tons of guys of different races have shitty approaches but I feel that the image of black guys having shitty game is a product of media portrayal and reinforced stereotypes more than an actual occurrence. But then again that could be something that's more prone in the U.S since here in Canada, a lot more black guys tend to be more smooth or under the radar and dress impeccably. I'm biracial (my mom being black) but then again i'm aware of the pick up culture so I have a different perspective of things. That video just really rubs me the wrong way because ,like fsc mentioned earlier about the Jimmy Jazz store : "Most of the stores are located in Brooklyn, Queens, and the Bronx, so she is walking in front of one of those. Despite the video claiming that she walked all over Manhattan, she actually went to other boroughs of New York to film this."

So you don't really know what areas of NYC she walked around in (Manhattan supposedly). And if she walked in areas that are rougher and have a lot of black guys who grew up in the hood then OBVIOUSLY she won't get approached the same way another black guy would if she walked around a university campus instead.

 

[Mr.Rob]

I feel that the image of black guys having shitty game is a product of media portrayal and reinforced stereotypes more than an actual occurrence.

I think it's just that people that don't work on themselves at all probably all have shitty game. The difference is that black people are typically more aggressive and actually take some sort of action (even if it's just shitty half ass approaches).
Also poorer people are more aggressive (used to hustling to get a buck) in going after what they want, even if they suck at going about whatever it is their doing.

I'd wonder how the experiment would've gone if they walked through an upscale crowded street of a shopping district of something.

 

[Sub-Zero]

Was walking down a street in London earlier when a cute, slim blonde in fashionable but conservative attire walked briskly by. There were a pair of young African guys walking and joking with each other in front of me, and the one closer to her when she passed by reacted like a hawk with a, "Hey, how are you doing?" or something like that. She pretended like she never heard him and just kept walking.

This stuff's always happened, but it's getting reported / complained about more because of the Internet. Fact is, women don't really like getting hit on by guys who hit on them in lame ways, especially if those guys can potentially be threatening (tough rap for black dudes who are upstanding citizens, but the blacks who are criminals make people a bit more naturally jumpy about being approached in uncool ways - really though, any guy approaching a girl in an uncool way is a bother).

One of the BIGGEST problems of "street harassment" is that not that it's a man expressing interest. If the guy in front of me earlier today said, "Excuse me, but I just have to say your boots are absolutely stunning! Have a nice day!" the girl almost certainly would've left with a big grin on her face.

Instead, he asked her some kind of question that she doesn't want to answer, but that some part of her feels like it is obligated to answer, and it triggers this internal mental battle: "Oh, he asked me how I'm doing - should I answer that? Wait no, this is some loser stranger who doesn't even know how to talk to me in a half-decent way. Okay, I guess keep on walking then - but is that rude? Okay, just ignore it." It's distracting and forces her to spend mental resources on someone who is a.) not cool, and b.) not attractive. She may also need to do a threat assessment: "This guy is bigger and stronger than me - is he going to be pissed off if I don't give him any acknowledgement? Maybe I should give him a smile or a quick reply. But would that then encourage him to pursue me further?"

I also occasionally have randoms ask me how I'm doing for no apparent reason as I'm walking down the street, and it IS annoying; it forces me to ask myself things like, "Is this guy just super friendly? Should I respond? Is he sizing me up to try and pick my pockets or attack me with some group of guys? Is he trying to see if I'll slow down and feel obligated to respond to him, showing myself to be a good potential mark for a con or someone easily distracted while an accomplice empties my pockets? Is he some gay dude who's trying to get in my ass? Why is he even talking to me randomly?" I'm pretty good at ignoring people after years in third world countries where people line the streets trying to get your attention to get you to buy junk or let them pickpocket you, but even with years of experience ignoring these people it's still a bother. And if it's a big, aggressive-looking guy or a group of guys I may feel like I HAVE to say something back (and keep moving) just to not seem like I'm afraid of them and thus a potential mark, or intentionally snubbing them and thus someone disrespecting them who must be challenged and fought.

I'd argue the biggest problem with what's getting reported as street harassment isn't that women don't want attention (of course they do!), but that what uncalibrated guys making catcalls and using lame openers on girls are doing is cognitively costly to the girls - it forces them to quit devoting mental resources to whatever they were trying to devote it to (what they were thinking about before) and to devote it to assessing whether to respond back, what the threat level is, etc. with these guys instead.

I don't think there's anything really actionable you can do - you can't teach all the guys who catcall in the world to start doing proper street approaches, because it's too hard for most guys and heck, if everybody was doing day game effectively it wouldn't be so darn effective anymore.

Just be aware that if you're doing your street approaches in a cool, attractive, and NOT cognitively costly way, you'll be far away from anything that might be considered "street harassment". This is the domain of clueless dudes using lame openers.

Chase

Think you can make an article or post about lame openers?

 

[Anonymous]

Won't newbies be uncalibrated and have bad fundamentals. I got the idea that building fundamentals was a process. Maybe you think you don't look like or act like a creep while you actually are or everything falls apart once the adrenaline starts kicking in. It appears to be that if you get it right great but if you don't its sexual harassment depending on who you are talking to.

I have to admit I have done only 3 day game approaches and I was horrendous in 2 on a college campus. Nothing bad happened

ran with joggers asked if one of them could be my jogging buddy. '

Approached a girl from behind grabbed her shoulder commented on her hat.

These would probably be labeled as sexual harassment or at least creepy.

I have done numerous night game approaches while high on adrenaline that were also pretty creepy. I did not intend them to be but they were. TRying to run BMOC probably screaming at girls and guys. Probably doing BMOC all wrong but how i am supposed to know it was just one page of writing on the GC site

Alot of the above comments that are supposed to support street game scare me because I can sympathsize with the meth head maybe he was just trying to run day game because he thought it was going to be effective.

Should i get socially calibrated before I get out any tips on doing other than trying to be a conservationalist. From what I think if you need to get socially calibrated you really need to fail a hell of a lot first. How I make sure I push the limits but dont go over board.

I believe that if you ran that bump preopener that chase was talking about and it was some radical feminist she may very well pepper spray you and it would be justified by our society . While you think you are deflecting resistance and it is just an act it can be interpreted as sexual harassment and a beginner might never know especially if he is hyped on adrenaline. I'm really confused on how I should approach things anymore