Telling (or not telling) women about your past?

[Blush]

I looked through The rational male recently, and found one of the ”Iron rules of Tomassi” a bit off:

”The single most disastrous AFC move a man can make is to overtly describe past sexual experiences and/or give a number (accurate or not) to how many women he’s been with prior to the one he’s with”.

I’m sure most of you have read it, he suggests being non-negotiable when women ask you about your previous experiences. Just simply refuse (”I don’t tell that”). Like this refusal to be open about your past life, your struggles, your dreams and failures somehow would create an air of mystery around you that would keep you in some iron clad ”frame control”. I think the book contains some interesting thoughts and viewpoints, but I really can’t take this seriously. In my experience, refusing to talk about intimate subjects just comes off as being insecure, having unresolved traumas you haven’t come to terms with, or simply just being ashamed of your past self. Every single time I’ve been confronted with a piercing or cheeky question (”do you watch porn?”, ”how many women have you been with?”, ”when did you lose your virginity?”, ”why did you break up with your ex”? etc) and then tried do postpone the answer, or make jokes to signal I’m not going to tell any of that stuff, I have always just felt like a goofy, insecure person who don’t want to own their past. To me it feels much better to admit to your past struggles and flaws. Otherwise you just risk coming off as someone with lots go emotional bagage, or just very pretentious, like your RPGing that you are some lone mysterious cowboy, a man of constant sorrow, but you’re not, you’re just a normal person.

What do you guys think of this whole overt vs covert battle?

Do you agree with ”IRON RULE II” (cue Hans Zimmer music)

 

[ulrich]

There is a certain truth to it but the way it is written seems to suggest that you should go for the extreme position of telling absolutely nothing about your sexual past which is just too much.

Telling too little hurts you and telling too much hurts you too.
As with many things in seduction, you need to find a balance.

I assume the rule tries to prevent the quite common scenario where a guy shares every single detail of his life with his girlfriend as a token of commitment ( “these are my weaknesses”).
It can be quite cathartic but you definitely don’t want to do that.

Don't Tell Women Your Weaknesses

Sometimes you want to open up to a girl and tell her your fears and weaknesses. But this behavior itself is a weakness – and you should not indulge it. I have seen a certain behavior since I got into the seduction community that seems to be fairly common. It is a behavior of men seeking to bond...

www.girlschase.com

 

[West_Indian_Archie]

I looked through The rational male recently, and found one of the ”Iron rules of Tomassi” a bit off:

”The single most disastrous AFC move a man can make is to overtly describe past sexual experiences and/or give a number (accurate or not) to how many women he’s been with prior to the one he’s with”.

You're focusing on "overtly describe past sexual experiences" when you should be looking at "AFC move". *it's so weird to see AFC being used - average frustrated chump is so 1998, lol.

The AFC part is really the most important part of the sentence.

"Iron Clad" Rules change as your skills change, as well as your scenarios.

As a budding pua/veteran player, is there a time and place to talk about your personal sexual experience? Of course.

Obviously it's better to show a woman, rather than tell her, but I digress. Back in the day, it was not uncommon to be at a party in real life, and the topic of sex comes up. A few juicy details mentioned offhand can get a girl scribbling some mental notes.

But for a guy that's entirely clueless and finds women mystifying (AFC)- a personal sexual experience discussion rarely go well (especially before the act with a girl that the guy is interested).

 

[TheEcho]

Want to know what happens when a sweet, (previously) innocent girl finds your LR's? Her sweetness is crushed. That's pretty far along "revealing" your past (it was an accident she found them), but it can really mess an innocent girl up. I'm pretty sure Global Rule #9 is referring to me.

Disclaimer: she knew I was somewhat of a player from the start, but reading the nitty gritty (I get super detailed with reports) permanently messed things up for the last 2 years.

 

[sunnygirl]

Eventually the truth will catch up to you, karma is a bitch, every time I lied, I ended up getting caught up in an even worse fate than if I were to be truthful from the start (even if it hurts a little). If the girl is just someone you are seeing casually, sure why not, people lie about age, body count, etc. all the time with their hookups. But just keep in mind that if this is a girl you can see yourself in a LTR with (or if she has LTR qualities), then either come clean or be truthful with her from the start, it can really mess up a girl's heart especially an inexperienced one if she finds this out, no matter how trivial it seems, and give her trust issues.

 

[HoofHearted]

How is that the 'worst mistake' you can make?

Some thoughts.

1. Nah, don't give a body count. Let her wonder, the female imagination needs room to play.

2. It's totally okay to talk about previous sexual experiences. It just depends on how you do it. For just one example, anything that frames her as 'special' in some emotional way ('can't get off this way with other girls,' 'this position has never felt good before, only with you') since emotions are all she's interested in anyways. Classic blunders: anything said that invites insecurity or comparisons to other girls.

Sex, though desirable, is cheap to women, because it's perpetually available. Emotional context is usually what's at stake, and where trouble is possible.

So I'm not wholly onboard with this. But i'll google it now, since people keep talking about it


edit have googled. I caution that these 'iron rules' seem to lack perspective, in the sense they only address a sliver of perspective to the exclusion or misperception of the rest of the matter at hand. And for my taste, they don't lean enough toward personal responsibility.

 

[rr2021 aka DEVENCI]

The rational male recently, and found one of the ”Iron rules of Tomassi”

Rolo Tomassi like almost all redpill gurus are complete morons who hate women and never actually go out in field.

have you seen what Rollo Tomassi looks like?

do you really think that guy has any significant in field experience?

the ONLY redpill guy who is legit and actually i can tell he has real in filed experience is Alpha Male Strategies (AMS).

i think even AMS is wrong about a lot of things but compared to redpill clowns like Tomassi he is a pro.

 

[Will_V]

The idea is to seem like you don't care about it. You don't have to go into all the gory detail, I usually just act a bit impatient and don't give a lot of information. I've found that if I take the girl at her word that it's going to be OK to tell her everything, inevitably she just ends up getting upset.

This idea of just acting all secretive like 'I don't talk about that' makes it sound like you got PTSD.

 

[Skills]

You're focusing on "overtly describe past sexual experiences" when you should be looking at "AFC move". *it's so weird to see AFC being used - average frustrated chump is so 1998, lol.

The AFC part is really the most important part of the sentence.

"Iron Clad" Rules change as your skills change, as well as your scenarios.

As a budding pua/veteran player, is there a time and place to talk about your personal sexual experience? Of course.

Obviously it's better to show a woman, rather than tell her, but I digress. Back in the day, it was not uncommon to be at a party in real life, and the topic of sex comes up. A few juicy details mentioned offhand can get a girl scribbling some mental notes.

But for a guy that's entirely clueless and finds women mystifying (AFC)- a personal sexual experience discussion rarely go well (especially before the act with a girl that the guy is interested).

^ yea! along this lines, it seems back in the days some afcs used to use lay count and talk about it as a way to impress women.... or guys that were trying to find out women lay count when she was not invested...

Keep away from red pill content and hypergamy stuff to op.... This is such a silly rule women don't usually ask you about lay count etc... they will assume it...

 

[Glow]

Past sexual experiences is a free-bee to get into sex talk, sexual frames, good sexual mindsets you hold etc. Aka use it.
I steer it into things like "i like xxx".... and with xxx introduce good, compelling angle on sex (appealing prizing or sexual frames) or togetherness or whatever... works magic.

Inspired by Teevs btw.