Texting before a date a bit further ahead

[Damien]

Hey guys,

so I've been in this game for a while now, but Hector recently raised a point that got me thinking.

My usual process is sth like: meet girl at social event / bar, propose getting drinks sometime, take number, text her the next day like: "Hey xx, nice to meet you! How was the rest of the night/ how's your day /how's your weekend going? Damien", then she usally answers that and asks sth back as well, I comment on her stuff, share some of mine and then propose the date.

What do you guys do if let's say you meet a girl on wednesday evening, text her on thursday and propose a date. What do you do if she says she is busy until monday but afterwards she's free?

Do you text while she's busy to keep her warm? If so what's your threshold for this, 1 week ahead she's becoming free = one time texting in between? Hector used an example of a girl he set up a date with in 3 weeks, then no texting in between and the girl of course had forgotten about it a day before. I'm more thinking about the edge cases here, because if you only met for a short time, even if you made a strong impression, a week later that impression will be less present in her mind.

I feel like if it's just 5 days you can go no texting until she's free again but everything more you should text sth. But then what do you text? If you only had let's say 15 minutes of conversation before? "Hey XX, how's your week going? I've had a super long day today"

 

[Hue]

Damien,

This is a great skill to have if you know how to do it right. You can 100% lose dates simply because she went cold after too long. I've also noticed that the younger the girl, the faster they tend to go cold / go into autorejection because you haven't been keeping up with them and texting them.

As of now I don't have a specific threshold of how much to text her in between a date, but if you haven't actually gotten her on the date yet, 1 text for every 3-5 days is usually enough to keep her at bay, maybe longer depending on the girl. It mainly depends on how well you did during your first meet and ask, and how receptive she is to your texts in general (how excited she is to meet you).

If you've already been with her / fucked it's important to keep this up, but afterwards I've noticed that you can get away with more low effort shit like sending her a meme or some video that reminded you of her. It doesn't always have to be, "hey how's your week going? blah blah", and that will get repetitive. Remain creative.


It's like throwing some more dry leaves in the fire to keep it going, while the camp prepares for putting together a bigger fire. Just enough to keep the flame where you need it, until you can bring out the big guns for a memorable inferno (;

Hue

 

[Damien]

Hey Hue,

yeah totally makes sense, I never did this because I didn't emphasize enough mentally to think it could be necessary, because for me the girl is (usually) still hot after 3 weeks even without texting.

 

[lostnumber]

I can give a more detailed answer later on, but one thing I've really been trying to work into my system is warm phone calls. I'm finding if done right it makes a huge difference, so that would be one piece of advice to prevent girls from going cold. I haven't 100% cracked the optimal way to do it yet, but I'm working on it

 

[Damien]

Yeah that makes sense in my head. I think voice messages also work because they are more personal than texts, plus if a girl listens to them it's a bit more of an investment from her side than just reading a text.

 

[lostnumber]

Here are a few of my thoughts on this topic. Typically when you first start texting is when a girl is going to be the warmest and most responsive and the risk we are trying to mitigate is the girl going cold if texting drags out over 4,5,6+ days before you can get her out on a date.

I've tried different techniques with varying amounts of success, but I would say I'm definitely coming back to the "higher/more frequent contact" camp from a very minimalist style. Texting more doesn't necessarily correlate to better results, but I find that texting less, especially with a long period between getting the number and the date, definitely correlates with higher flake rates.

For example if you set up a date with a girl for 4 days out and don't text her until the day of the date I have found that flake rates absolutely skyrocket. Girls are very flighty, and can easily get nervous about meeting a man they barely know. I've played around with voicemails with girls who are starting to go cold and had poor results. Part of that is my technique I'm sure, which is still being refined, but I think part of it is once a girl is going cold and rejecting you a move like a voicemail can come off as aggressive and freak them out even more. "I'm not sure if I want to go on a date with this guy, and now he's CALLING me and has my number forever" is along the lines of what she might be thinking. Back in October when I decided to start trying to work phone game into my system I had four numbers/dates lined up, and all four of them flaked and bombed. Looking back on those examples, I can see that I didn't establish enough rapport early on, and by the time I was trying to call things were already headed the wrong direction and all my voicemail did was push them further away.

What I've been doing recently and am seeing improvement in results with is using the phone WHILE THE GIRL IS STILL WARM. So in your example where you meet on Wednesday and propose a date on Thursday, I'd find an excuse to call her Thursday/Friday while she is still being responsive. Something like "hey, you free for 10 minutes? I'm going to call you." You do this while a girl is being responsive to your texts because she is far more likely to see your message and also be free. Then you have a quick warm chat on the phone and end it on your terms due to time constraints, saying you have somewhere to be, something to do, etc. I'm doing this often while I'm driving somewhere, so I'll chat for 15 minutes and then when I get where I'm going say "alright, I gotta run now, but lets for sure set something up for next week" I'm finding that this gets girls feeling MUCH more connected to you and much more excited about meeting up.

I'm still working everything out regarding phones, so maybe some of this will change, but that's my current system. I had a pull last night using my standard Tinder date system and it was one of the easiest I've ever hard, I think in part because I went into the date with more rapport already established then I typically do.

 

[Damien]

Yeah I agree that a voicemessage can come off as aggressive, but only if your rapport levels with the girl are low (she's going cold) like you said. If the rapport is good voicemessage are sth I really like to use because they are a bit more real. But then when rapport is good, you will probably still be able to get the girl out anyway. But it's for sure also technique, I find that chippery, good mood longer voice messages usually are good to get better reactions from girls but then they are a bit hard to pull off if you don't know the girl too well.

I really like the calling idea, will look into some of Chase's articles on that topic. This could especially be good if your initial conversation was short.

 

[Hue]

Damien,

I never did this because I didn't emphasize enough mentally to think it could be necessary, because for me the girl is (usually) still hot after 3 weeks even without texting.

That's surprising to hear from a cold approach, so great job for getting that to work! I've only had that work a few times with a high effort, "hey my bad on not reaching out I've been busy saving the world blah blah blah", text. Like lost said I think most girls can be pretty flighty and get nervous without some sustained comfort.


lost,

Texting more doesn't necessarily correlate to better results, but I find that texting less, especially with a long period between getting the number and the date, definitely correlates with higher flake rates.

When girls flake for non-logistical reasons, I think it's mostly about attainability.

You can have too-low attainability issues because girls get the vibe you've left them in the cold and perhaps forgotten about them. By not giving her enough attention, she doesn't feel the goodies of you guys meeting.

At the same time, continually texting leading up to the date with long drawn out texting conversations can satisfy the attention / validation she wanted from you and make her less inclined to be dying to see you on the date.

So it's about that balancing act to keep her thinking about you and looking forward to coming face to face with you again, which is difficult to give a hard set of rules for. There's many uncontrollables and other surrounding factors surrounding leading into text conversations (unknown real life context, initial impressions, other men involved in her life that give her validation, etc.).

That's why I think 3-5 days is a "safe bet", depending on the most recent engagement you've had with her, how invested she was, and how happy you left her when it ended.

What I've been doing recently and am seeing improvement in results with is using the phone WHILE THE GIRL IS STILL WARM.

As you know, I love phone calls for girls who are down. When she is warm talking on the phone can be great because you bring out your vibe, your voice, and tonality (not to mention sarcasm ACTUALLY TRANSLATES lol) which can all remind her of the guy she met and excite her for the date.

One nice part about phone calls too is you get a much better metric of knowing when is and when isn't a good time to ask her out if you haven't asked her out yet. With texting you have a higher chance of shooting blanks since she could put her phone down or become distracted just as you're transitioning into the ask.

Though I speculate that the girls who are more into it are already comfortable with talking on the phone as a general "practice", since plenty of girls get nervous at the prospect. Or maybe they're not down with that much investment yet. Kind of like you said. It's a little silly though isn't it? Haha. They may think of it like, "a full on phonecall / voicemail? this is some guy I barely met and he's already acting like we know eachother". Well bitch, that's what the phonecall's for! Lol.

And lastly, if they've already for whatever reason decided that you're not their best sexual candidate, a phone call (after some not so engaged texting from their end) can put you in a chasing context.


A medium effort / investment in communication for a medium reward. Taking time away from whatever you're doing to have a full on conversation (effort) in order to accomplish more emotional investment or set up a date more decisively (reward). That time between the initial meet and the first real date is always potentially unpropitious, so cheers to playing the best with the hand you're dealt.

Hue

 

[lostnumber]

And lastly, if they've already for whatever reason decided that you're not their best sexual candidate, a phone call (after some not so engaged texting from their end) can put you in a chasing context.


A medium effort / investment in communication for a medium reward. Taking time away from whatever you're doing to have a full on conversation (effort) in order to accomplish more emotional investment or set up a date more decisively (reward). That time between the initial meet and the first real date is always potentially unpropitious, so cheers to playing the best with the hand you're dealt.

Hue

I think framing the phone call goes a long way to stop it from looking like Chasing. IE calling on your way to the gym, telling her you only have 10 minutes to talk, things like that. I generally do it at a time when I have a time constraint, but if I don't I'll make up a false one, since she won't ever know the difference.

Obviously if a girl is going non-responsive and you are continuing to reach out there is really no way to stop that from looking like Chasing, since you basically are at that point, but sometimes it can't be helped. You'll never get a response by NOT calling/texting.

By the way, congrats on promotion to Tribal Elder! I've checked out your journal every now and then and its really inspiring to see that amount of work and thought you put into the game. That kind of drive and accountability is going to take you far in life, no matter what you choose to do.

 

[foggy]

i like this thread, good points from everyone so far. except for neighborhood. wtf was that bro

absolutely, its important to stay in touch. i agree with hue - your job is made much easier if you had a good first interaction with her and she likes you.

i am happy with my current strategy and its really working for me. it revolves around dragging out one single conversation with the girl until she’s free to hang. to do it, you have to have an awareness of conversational tension, and you gotta know about attainability.

here’s what i do: i get a conversation going. when shes most receptive to me and theres tension in the conversation, i stop answering completely. keep in mind that leaving a girl on read can cause attainability issues.

for example, i was texting with one girl i met on a dating app. we had already agreed to meet in 2 days from then (not bad) but i hadn’t qualified her yet. after i qualified her, it was like a switch had been flipped. she became more flirty and started pelting me with questions. perfect time to stop answering.

the next evening she texted me. but not every girl will take initiative like that, so the next day in the evening, i always text the girl and keep the conversation going. I’m generally warm when reinitiating contact to ward off any attainability issues, but as a rule of thumb, i only send her 1-3 texts. considering i leave off at a high point, or close to a high point, i can keep the high point going and really make each of these texts count! if done correctly, there will still be tension. so after those texts, once again, i stop answering completely.

from that point, i intersperse my replies anywhere from 1-2, sometimes 3 days.

a place ive gotten tripped up before is making plans. fully making plans can suck all the tension out of the convo. so in the middle of a conversation topic, i ask her when she can hang out. lets say its monday, and she says the earliest she can hang is thursday. even though i know i can hang thursday, i tell her ill let her know for sure if thursday works for me, the next day…. just so i can drag it out even more, shorten any potential radio silence, and keep the tension in the conversation. the reason you want to do it in the middle of the conversation topic, and not at the end, is that so you can directly go back to that topic once you’ve finished making plans