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The everlasting friendzone

Gravedigger

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Oct 1, 2015
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Hello everyone.
I have been always reading about picking up and relationships (Mystery Method, Lovesystems, Neil Straus...), but in the past i have done it here and there and not really commited untill recently, because i realised i am somewhat incontent with my dating life.
One of the triggers (but not neccesarily the only one) was the situation with the girl from the colledge.
So we have been friends for a couple of years, and she was in a long term relationship at a time, with a guy who is also my very good friend. I have always had some positive vibe with her, but have never looked at her as something more then a friend.
However, everything changed once they have broken up. It was like someone changed the switch in my head :"She's single now", and started thinking about taking her to a date. We continued communicating a lot, although i know i have been too much of a good nice guy and made many mistakes (the result of which will be even more apparent later). I was also having some hesitations because of the friend and the situation because in my social environment dating your friend's ex is considered a sin.
Anyway, i finally managed to take her on a date, some two months after the break up (yes i know, terribly slow, but it was a 6 year relationship and everybody was telling me to give some time). And on the date, when i finally made the move, she said she thought it was just a friendly coffee.
And i thought that was it and thought i would easily move on, but we continued having normal relationship and communicate on a regular basis, and often about some more "controversial" subjects.
Anyway, after the summer we went out again, and she was the one who invited me and there again it was very similar situation as on the first coffee.
The thing that was most confusing and iritating is that she definitely gave me alot of signs of interest during the years, and also after i told her i like her (for instance she would often compliment me, or tell me i smell good, or send messages late in the night).
So the main problem is that i can't say what my goal with this girl is. From my side i am torn between being friends and wanting something more. And when i asked her about us, she would never give me definite answer and would always avoid it (although i have insisted). I would rather hear something as "You are not my type", "It will never work with us" ,but i guess she won't do that in order not to hurt my feelings.
And i know what the right thing probably is, and what most of you would recommend, and that is just to get her out of my life and move on. But the point is i don't want to lose her as a friend, if i just had some concrete reason i could easily remain at being just friends, but with these constant double signs i just have trouble doing so.
And okay, i am not that experienced with women, but i had some success, and i had some other girls in between, during the summer, but somehow these girls don't make me that happy at all, and i often keep coming back to this girl.
So, any opinion or advice would be great and i expect them to be harsh, because now that i have put everything here on paper, i see how juvenile and funny it all sounds :D
 
you miss 100% of the shots you don't take

ray_zorse

Modern Human
Modern Human
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
Messages
1,982
So, any opinion or advice would be great and i expect them to be harsh, because now that i have put everything here on paper, i see how juvenile and funny it all sounds :D
Well, you probably don't really need me to tell you this, since you already know what you have to do :)

she was the one who invited me and there again it was very similar situation as on the first coffee
She invited you to hang out, and you made a move during this hangout, but she refused you?

From my side i am torn between being friends and wanting something more.
Girls HATE indecision, with that attitude you may be assured that nothing will/would ever happen with this girl.

And when i asked her about us, she would never give me definite answer and would always avoid it (although i have insisted).
That's a big part of your problem right there. You're looking to her for guidance. If you ask a girl "do you like me romantically / sexually / whatever" the answer is always "no". Because if you have to ask, that automatically disqualifies you. It also looks quite needy and beta. What you're aiming for instead is to be the master and commander -- you let her know (or figure out) what's happening/going to happen, and she either gets on board with it or leaves you alone. Girls LIKE decisiveness.

I would rather hear something as "You are not my type", "It will never work with us" ,but i guess she won't do that in order not to hurt my feelings.
That's not the reason, the reason is that (consciously or unconsciously) she WANTS you in a state of indecision, so that you're always hoping that something might happen in the future, in the meantime you're investing your time and effort in her, meeting her for dates, telling her she's beautiful, fixing her car and so on. Overall this is going to hurt your feelings MORE, when you eventually realize you're wasting your life on her (this takes years for some guys, including me in the past).

And i know what the right thing probably is, and what most of you would recommend, and that is just to get her out of my life and move on.
Yup.

But the point is i don't want to lose her as a friend, if i just had some concrete reason i could easily remain at being just friends, but with these constant double signs i just have trouble doing so.
Yes, the double signs are deliberate (or unconscious, deeply ingrained behaviour, but deliberate to all intents and purposes), to keep you interested and investing.

And okay, i am not that experienced with women, but i had some success, and i had some other girls in between, during the summer, but somehow these girls don't make me that happy at all, and i often keep coming back to this girl.
That's because you're invested in this girl. That includes temporal investment (time you've spent on dates with her, text messaging her etc) and mental investment (time you've spent thinking about her, dreaming of your future together, wondering what her signs mean, wondering how to move forward, writing this post, etc). When you're invested in something it seems more valuable. An example would be if you buy a share on the sharemarket and the value drops. WRONG approach: "I'll wait for the value to come up and then I'll sell it again". RIGHT approach: "Would I buy this share now at the current price? No? Then SELL!". You can see how the WRONG decision is actually the decision that "feels right" emotionally. Same with this girl. The RIGHT decision is to ditch her, but the WRONG decision feels right.

Anyway, there are some positives here: You took her out on a date, and you escalated, and she refused your escalation. At that point you'd done everything right (except waiting too long, and unless there are extra steps you didn't mention, such as asking her her feelings about you, which would have looked needy and beta), and thereby screened her as not a romantic prospect, so you could've just cut off contact at that point (or continued to treat her politely but refuse to invest in her).

I hope that helps. As one final comment I want you to bear this in mind: A friendzone (which is what this is) is an abusive relationship. She's exploiting you.

Ray
 

Gravedigger

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Oct 1, 2015
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Thank you very much man, that was very useful and reassuring. I think every single one of your remarks hit the spot.
 
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