FU A rather strange learning experience

[Smith]

Hey guys,

I don't usually post FR, but I can't figure out what the hell went wrong on this one, and she send me a text 2 hours after our date basically telling me to fuck off. But I think this is a crucial experience to improve my game since this is the first time I get this kind of extreme feedback from a woman after our date.

Here it goes.

So I met her a couple of days before our date. During the initial interaction, she seemed really interested. Playing with her hair and her legs crossed when talking to me. However, the short conversation was rather platonic that day. Got her number, and we went out on a coffee date today.

She was waiting outside the cafe already and was happy to see me. We went inside, ordered our drinks and sat down. Initially just some rapport building conversation that's light and fun. We shared our cooking disaster stories and getting to know each other. She seemed to be a straightforward person, and I qualified her on that, saying I hate people being passive aggressive. At one point I asked her what her first kiss was like and she told me she had never have a bf. I was surprised. I found out her parent was a bit strict on her during her teenage years, and I could totally relate to that. I think this girl is rather inexperience and unadventurous. Didn't ask for her age, but I'm guessing 18-19. Have never gone to a bar and only had a brief alcohol experience. After chatting for about an hour, I invited her home and kept the conversation light and playful on the way to my place. So far the conversation is not too sexual.

Back to my place, I could tell from her body language she seemed a bit "stiff". I made some conversation and turn on the music, but all this time she's letting the conversation die down, and this was the case back in the cafe as well. I touched her on the arm a couple of times during the conversation when she's laughing, then I grabbed her hand and moved her to look at some pictures on my wall. I hold her hand for about 30 seconds while telling her about the picture. She wasn't holding my hand tight, so I decided to let it go. Then she backed off a few steps behind me.

Anyway, I continued the conversation and we talked for a bit more. I only talked very little bit of sexual stuff, and dialed it down a bit because she seemed inexperienced. Then at one point, I tried to manhandle kiss her, and maybe it was a mistake to do that or maybe not (?). The longer I waited to kiss her, the more anxious I became, so I thought I'll get it over with. Before I even leaned in, she moved her head away. I smiled and said "I want to kiss you". She smiled but didn't say anything. I changed the topic and continued the conversation like it's not a big deal. I sit down on my bed and told her to show me her fringe because it was tied back. She looks pretty cute. I hold her hand again and her palm was sweaty. I jokingly teased her why it's sweaty and let go of her hands.
We talked for a bit more then she started looking at her phone, so I gently grabbed her phone and looked at her pictures. She had absolutely no interesting photos (not even selfies!!), except some cooking recipes. So we talked about some recipes and I gave her her phone back. I asked her to sit next to me on the bed, but she's reluctant.

At this point, I'm tired of making conversation, then she suddenly asked me if I have any plan because she told me she has to go home working on her essay. She wanted to add me on fb or wechat, but I told her I don't have both. I told her to give me a hug. She gave me a hug but her head pulled back as if trying to avoid a kiss. I laughed and thought it was funny and a lame move. "It was very nice meeting you!" She smiled as she left my room.

Two hours later, I get this text...
Her: "I told you that I'm straightforwad. So I'll tell you these striaghtforwardly. I don't like what you done today. LIke hold my hands, or trying to kiss me. I don't like you grab my phone for a long time and check my photos and videos without ask me before. I just think that phone number is one of the communicate way like fb or wechat, but you think I'm easy to be your gf or sex partner. haha that's totally wrong. I don't like you, so there's no need to contact. I'm sorry but good luck"

I was thinking in amusement because her photos weren't even that interesting and I only watched a fucking 3 seconds video on her phone that's just showed black screen....
It was a little confusing, so since I knew she had no intention of seeing me ever again, I thought I'll get more feedback from her.

Me: "Ok but what I don't understand is why you didn't leave right after I hold your hand or even when I tried to kiss you?"

No reply yet, but I'm very curious because she stayed for about another 20 minutes after I tried to kiss her and the conversation afterwards was fun and not awkward.
I also tried to calibrate my physical escalation because I didn't want to freak her out, but it ended up freaking her out anyway.........

If this had happened to me 6-7 months ago, it would have completely crushed me to get rejected this way, but I'm going to be positive and take this as a learning experience.
To be honest, I didn't know what triggered her to send a long text to reject me lol Everything I did seemed pretty "normal" to me because I've done it several times before. I thought the fact that she stayed after I tried to kiss her means she's still interested but just not comfortable enough.

Now that I look back in the last couple of months, I remembered a couple of girls who weren't comfortable when going back to my place, so I think I'm missing something or not doing something right. I would like to think that "They're just not interested! and I just screened them out!" but I'm hoping someone can share some insight on this.

So what do you guys think?
Is there anything I can improve on if similar things happen next time?
Did I miss some important female psychology?

Cheers

 

[ray_zorse]

Re: FR/FU A rather strange learning experience

It's attainability brother.

Low value -> she lets you down gently.
Unattainable -> she blows you out harshly.

Basically, she thinks (correctly) that you have probably done this with a lot of girls and are a bit of a player.

She was expecting multiple dates and to be wined and dined and maybe hold hands on first date, kiss on the cheek second date etc. Because you didn't try to do this and she's inexperienced, she thinks you don't care.

Much the same thing happened to me with an 18yo Vietnamese chick who had just arrived in Australia and whom I really liked. We had a great insta date lasting a number of hours, but when I escalated in a pretty gentle way with some sexual frames and compliance requests and touch, it turned her right off. I realized later that due to her inexperience with men, she wasn't really expecting this kind of behaviour, and it wrecked things. I reckon had I moved slower and built more attainability first, I'd have been okay. So the mantra of moving fast, etc, etc, has to be taken with a little calibration in these situations.

The rapid turnabout in her emotions that you describe is typical of missed escalation window. Typical missed window scenario is:
You didn't care enough to make a move -> you're unattainable.
You didn't have the balls to make a move -> you're low value.
Either way she ends up angry and disappointed, like she is in this case. But in this case the double whammy I suspect came from this:
You made a move and appeared like a player -> you're unattainable.
You didn't build a strong enough connection first -> you're low value.

Ray

 

[Smith]

Re: FR/FU A rather strange learning experience

Thanks Ray,

I think you're quite right about the attainability, and I definitely needed to calibrate my escalation in this case. I thought I was already moving slow and building enough connection but I probably needed to move A LOT slower than I thought when it comes to these type of girls. Anyway, that text came out of nowhere lol and was really unexpected because I didn't even text her and she wanted to blow me out already. I suspect she probably talked to her friends as well and somehow I got stereotyped as the "heartless player".

 

[tvktvk]

Re: FR/FU A rather strange learning experience

Smith,

This is very similar to the type of experiences I've had recently and I believe it has a lot to do with how inexperienced young girls are when it comes to dating and sex. I think Ray's answer is absolutely spot on and clears up a lot of the confusion I've had. The best solution I believe is to screen future girls harder and see which ones are more sexually open. I personally don't have time these days to set up multiple dates with a single girl.

tvktvk