What's new

Best books/tools for learning Japanese & Chinese?

PinotNoir

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jan 4, 2013
Messages
747
My favorite books for Japanese are the Genki series, which I used for 2 semesters in college. They're detailed, and I feel like they give you a strong grasp of the fundamentals (unlike Dummies series or just Tape series which tend to gloss over all of the details which hurts you later on).

I very much like Anki for making flash cards.

As for Chinese, I'm clueless. Which books do you guys recommend?

Also, you guys have any favorite podcasts or other tools for learning Japanese and Chinese?

I would like to learn both Mandarin and Cantonese, but I'll probably just stick to Mandarin Chinese for now, as I've heard it is easier.

I'm probably going to make a separate post on thoughts/theories about how to learn a language in general, so look forward to that!
 

Chase

Chieftan
Staff member
tribal-elder
Joined
Oct 9, 2012
Messages
6,275
Pinot-

I don't know about books, but I've found Rosetta Stone Chinese stunningly easy to use and fast for picking stuff up. I tried their Japanese a few years back but it was pretty basic... was amazing the difference between the two programs. They might've upgraded their Japanese since then (I think I remember them saying there was an upcoming version, and this was back in 2010 or 2011 I took it for a test drive); unsure.

I used TellMeMore before these for both Spanish and Japanese and found that a superior program as well. However, for pure fun / ease of use, I'd go with an updated Rosetta Stone program any day. TellMeMore is wonderful, but it's a real grind. Rosetta Stone though... it's actually enjoyable. It's also interesting to see how they structure the teaching; it's clear they have some really exceptional teachers on the staff to be coming up with the exercise formats that they do.

Live Mocha is an excellent option if you want something free and/or something where you interact with real people. The way the site works is basically that you run through the exercises, record yourself at the end, and then native speakers rate your pronunciation. And you can make friends with all these people speaking the language you want to speak. It's like Facebook, only instead of throwing your time into a bottomless pit you actually get something out of being there.

(for what it's worth, I still can't speak Spanish, Chinese, Japanese, or any of the other languages I've tried studying - French, Russian, Italian, German, Korean, Thai. Although, my French and Spanish are okay enough that I can grasp some of what's being said when I'm around folks who speak those languages, but, yeah, language has always been something I get excited about for a week or two and then something else distracts me)

Chase
 

JPWorld

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Feb 6, 2015
Messages
73
Hey Pinot

I don't know if you're still wanting to study Mandarin or Japanese but for what it's worth italki.com is a website where you find tutors or language partners online. The tutors are stupidly cheap, just a couple of pounds (dollars) for an hour on Skype, and when you sign up tons of Chinese people will message you wanting to do a free exchange.

Once you've found a tutor organise a session maybe twice a week, and then get their advice on best books. One other good starter course is "Teach Yourself Complete Mandarin" but sometimes it's hard to get the motivation to just sit down and plough through a text, whilst a Skype session means you commit before-hand and have to do it. Combine the two together and you'll be golden.

I'm currently living in Beijing and studying Chinese (at Uni) and I actually use the service to find partners and tutors nearly daily even though I live where it's spoken. My mum has just started it for Italian too and found a great tutor and is absolutely loving it.

They are also hosting a language challenge in June where if you complete twelve sessions with a tutor within the month (so maybe do 3 a week), you'll receive free 'credits' to use for more lessons. It's meant to be a big motivation booster and a great way for someone to start (in any language). I'll be taking part! http://www.italki.com/languagechallenge

memrise.com is great on PC and you can download it onto your phone and use it on the go, it already has Chinese and Japanese vocab lists ready.

I'm a big language nerd and have tons of resources for Asian and European languages so just hit me up!

- JP
 

ray_zorse

Modern Human
Modern Human
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
Messages
1,982
italki is golden, I was using it for Vietnamese exchange and Japanese paid lessons and it rocks. I can recommend a JP teacher called Misa on there, she also has an interesting JP language learning blog. Misa was based in JP when I started with her, but she travels around the world using italki as her income, she's an interesting person to talk to. I also hit up tons of cute VN girls and became moderately close to some of them, one of them (a married housewife who was at home with a baby and constantly bored during the day) I was trying to get her to take her top off and engage in Skype sex, I didn't succeed in this but she nevertheless messages me frequently to reinitiate the dialogue, I haven't responded because I have a cute real life Vietnamese gf now (and learning new words at a great rate). Anyway, if you can learn a language and practice pickup at the same time it's not a bad deal, you might have a lay waiting for u when u get there :) I have also found the picture-in-picture of yourself in Skype to be useful for practicing your vibe and facial expressions.

About JP learning, I use "Minna no Nihongo", I have some mixed feelings about this but overall I would recommend it. A friend finished "Minna no Nihongo" and proceeded to "New Approach" and that's also supposed to be good. However, if you are a beginner I highly recommend Tae Kim's "Guide to Japanese" which is free on the web. It doesn't have much vocabulary (Minna no Nihongo is strong on vocabulary but the vocabulary is in a separate book called the "Translation and Grammatical Notes" which is a gotcha, the main book doesn't have any English in it), but Tae Kim's guide gives you lots of useful grammar and howto's, plus a proper basic understanding of the underlying system which the other books are especially weak on, since they try to teach by example, yet the examples are obscured by use of polite speech.

As an example "karita" means "I [or some other implied pronoun determined from context] borrowed", and "hon" means "book". A useful grammar that forms the foundation of nearly all Japanese grammar is "VERB NOUN" which means in English "the NOUN that VERB", for instance "karita hon" means "the book that I [or whoever] borrowed". However, the usual resource books will not teach you "karita" because it might be rude to use with superiors, so they only teach you the polite form "karimashita". This is utterly useless because you cannot say e.g. "karimashita hon", you have to say "karita hon" and there is nothing rude about that. Nobody should learn stuff like "-mashita" until they already have a basic grasp of the language, its grammar, and building blocks, and that's where "Minna no Nihongo" and its ilk really fall down (because most if not all of the grammar exercises are just teaching you to unlearn what you already learnt) and where Tae Kim really shines, because you learn the way a child would learn.

Also check out "Mangajin" magazine and "Mangajin's basic Japanese through comics" textbook, very useful. These are no longer in print but available to download or read on the web.

As a seducer you will never want to use polite speech in Japanese, it sounds really weak and pathetic. So go to Tae Kim, learn the casual (normal / childish) speech, and get used to calling yourself "Ore", never "Watashi", maybe "Boku" with superiors. I went to Japan for a week to do cold approach and I never used polite speech even once, it didn't even occur to me to be honest, the only times I ever used it in the past were with my supervising professor and my girlfriend's parents and it's useful for that, but otherwise useless, so don't fall into the trap of following the textbook here! Get it right from the beginning and your experience will be so much more rewarding, as you'll form closer relationships with everyone you meet.

Ray

Edit: Just realized this is an old thread but anyway hope the advice is useful, I may try memrise since I'm sick of having to orepare my own flash cards from Minna no Nihongo vocab.
 
you miss 100% of the shots you don't take

JPWorld

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Feb 6, 2015
Messages
73
Howdy Ray!

Glad you agree about the Italki! And some very interesting stuff on the Japanese there! If Pinot starts learning Japanese I'm sure he'll be sorted.

ray_zorse said:
I was trying to get her to take her top off and engage in Skype sex

You cheeky minx ;)

And also, hold tight guys, I'm in the process of writing a 3 part How to Learn a Language Guide at the moment to see if I can help some other guys out with some techniques and resources I know!

Cheers

- JP
 

PinotNoir

Tool-Bearing Hominid
Tool-Bearing Hominid
Joined
Jan 4, 2013
Messages
747
Thanks very much guys for all of the advice :)

I feel like there is a better way to learn language that we just haven't discerned or tapped into yet. I've been trying with more experimental ideas and trying to think of my own. I am grateful for the fundamentals I learned in college, as books are pretty weak when it comes to fundamentals, but at the same time, I feel like the "system" isn't the best way, just the "safest" way (absorb this as a sponge, squirt it out).

I'll definitely try to use all of these resources.

ray_zorse, I'll definitely keep your info in mind. However, in my own experience, I haven't had that issue. A girl knows I'm a foreigner, so she knows that I'm not using polite form because I'm weak. I think if your delivery is good with deep voice and eye contact and all of that jazz, it doesn't matter that much. Still, I'll keep what you said in mind and experiment with using Ore and short form more when out, as it's very important to learn anyway (since polite form is really only limited to work and stuff like you said).
 

ray_zorse

Modern Human
Modern Human
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
Messages
1,982
Yeah, I see what you mean about the polite speech, but I'm not sure that I can agree, I have the feeling that the language you use affects her at quite a primal level because of the fact that it's her birth language. As a thought experiment, imagine you're, say, a European and you're seducing in the USA and you say on a date stuff like "Would madam kindly take a seat in the vehicle" instead of "Jump in the car", it would sound a bit cutesy, and she'd definitely perceive you as more nice guy than a badass seducer.
Ray
 

Zoro

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Dec 25, 2012
Messages
1,124
The App Human Japanese. Helped me read kana and some kanji.

HelloTalk is another great app for language exchange.

Best two apps I have ever used period.
 
Top