case study: the girl who doesn't comply but who keeps contact.

[Quicknick]

So i'm a 40's guy who's manager and coach in a big company to a 21 year old girl. There are plenty of girls like her here and plenty of managers/coaches.

We use to work in person last year until february. In ocotber this girl started messaging me, first about work related stuff then flirting a bit. I'm a very busy guy so i did what i've learned here: Keep texts to a minimum, and call her bluff out right away. After the first few messages from her I blatantly send a few sexualized (not rude or hard core, of course) replyes thinking that if it wasn't her intention she would not do it again and that was it.

Well she kept doing it. So, once again tried to put in pratice what i've learned here call her to meet in person. She gave half hearted replys " that can be good ideia" "maybe" etc. However never came or showed interested to reschedule. So I dismiss her as an atention seeker (i'm resonabily atractive and have some power inside de company, and usually i'm pretty cool to be around). I thought that she would just get validated by my interest and move to another guy.

Well she didn't. She send more messages saying more flirty stuff, like "i miss you" "you are my favoutit manager" " I like you". "we have a crush on each other". Pretty straight forward right? Well tried again for compliance "lets see each other, no pressure, lets just hang around". To all of that she said "it's not a good idea", It's better not" etc.

So this time I thought "over and out". She will be out for christmas i will not ever be flirty again with her. Don't chase, replace. However she still send me messages to wich i was more neutral. January begun with the same tone, fliting (in person and by messages) and we cross each other alone for the first times at work and got hand together and sit close for just a few moments.

One day i finaly got her alone, moved her fast to a safe spot and went for the kiss. She resisted hard, saying "this is not right", "we can't do this". But didn't go away. Finaly we did kiss. Game on, right?

Well no, she went to work for another town for one month, kept texting me (even saying she missed the kiss albeit that being wrong). When she came, i tried to get her one on one once again. "I don't think it's a good idea". And here we are.



So, I can't figure out this girl. I have 3 handicaps (age gap, work relation, and being commited) these are factors (and please don't be moralist about any of those because i don't care and i'm in peace with all of them). But in the past, with all this factors I had girls complying when they were interested in me.

This one seems interested but then she flakes and does not comply. She was always the one iniciating text with me. Always. I fancy her, and woud like to fuck her of course, she's atractive and cute, but if she stoped today sending me texts I would never text her again.

Can she just be a twisted attention/validation seeker? for 5 months? Wouldn't that be too much work on one guy? Then again I don't trust anything she sais because at the same time it seems fake because she does not comply.

Advice appreciated.

 

[Rakehell]

Just move on man, you can keep it flirty and pleasant when you see her but don’t expect it to go anywhere.

You can maybe try ramping up preselection & making her feel like she’s lost her chance with you. That might provoke her into chasing.

But at this point you’ve already slotted yourself as the one in pursuit, and i’m not sure where you’re located but this already constitutes as sexual harassment given your position over her which could come back to burn you if she chooses to take it there even though she plays along.

 

[Chase]

@Quicknick,

Tactics Tuesdays: Who Should Use a BIHC Text?

The ball-in-her-court text can be very effective at getting flaky girls onto dates. It’s also easy to misuse, however… and even sabotage your attractiveness with. Recently on the forum we had a relatively new member claiming the ball-in-her-court text “doesn’t work” for him, and that women can...

www.girlschase.com

Chase

 

[Swati]

Call, video chat, voice memo

Everyone hides behind a screen with words, you are trying to seduce the girl. Have to do something different. If she's in that group range I highly doubt she has less than 10 guys in her "messages" all trying to get in her pants

 

[Quicknick]

Thank you for your replies. @Rakehell - My intention is exactly to move on. I made the biggest effort to not chase but of course when she gave signs I had to invite her, otherwhise I could not lead. So it might be chasing, but doesn't she chases too when messaging and flirts and goes to where she knows I'll be?

@Chase I do qualify for the BIHC - She gives me attention and there is no way I will boycot myself texting her first. But I'm waiting for her to drop the sign of "meeting". Great article BTW, I hadn't read it before.

@Swati - Calling will be on the cards for sure. Good hint.

This week I stoped flirting, she texted me everyday, baiting me several times in order for me to chase "I would like to be closer to you but we can't" "I miss you" "look at these pictures of myself I took" "Another secret we share", " it must be destiny [when talking about something we both enjoy]" etc. I basicaly ignored and deflected all those baits because I sense the minute I cave in she's going to say "no" " don't think so", "Better not". I just went light and witty with short answers. Oh and i disqualified her based on her age, saying (lying of course) that until last week i thought she was 23 and not 21. I did that convincingly with a very specific professional technicality.

So what do you think? This girl is in to me, or just another time consumer? Note one last thing, I'm not a Skilled Seducer by any means, not compared to you guys at least, so don't be too hard on me

 

[TomInHo]

This girl is a massive attention whore. She doesn't want you... she wants your validation

So it will be wise to strip some validation before you move on

Let her know she was fun at first but now you think she is "all talk" and secretly a scaredy cat. You prefer women that go after what they want and that doesn't seem to be her the way she acting

Then cut all contact, move on and be careful not to get sucked into her future attention seeking behaviors because trust me she will keep trying to get your attention

If she contacts you again, you have to mean what you say. No more trying to "game" her, no more trying to up her compliance. If she reaches out you can banter a little then pitch a date or another form of isolation

Any response from her other than a "yes let's plan it" means you should leave her on read and keep living your life

There are too many attractive women in the world that will be easy and less of an emotional drain than this girl. So why waste any more time on her?

 

[Quicknick]

It's been virtually impossible to cut contact with her. She messages me every single day and even made a checkmate move a few days ago in that regard: Every trainee will have a coach for an individual project next year. According to internal policy, the trainee essentially chooses their coach. Out of 21 available coaches, guess who she picked?

So cutting her off entirely is very difficult—hence my struggle with this. Over the past two weeks, I've been very neutral, brief, and slightly witty. She’s also tested the waters to see if I would chase her. But trying to set up a meeting is off the table for me. It has to be her who invites. I've done it five times already—that's enough.

 

[TomInHo]

I understand cutting contact is emotionally difficult but what else are you going to do?

You want to isolate this girl but she keeps refusing and milking you for attention. Even if she texts you everyday it's still your choice to respond

But trying to set up a meeting is off the table for me. It has to be her who invites. I've done it five times already—that's enough.

She is not going to push for a meet with you when you are easily available already. If you have tried 5 times already and keep talking to her, why would she magically feel compelled to set up a date for both you?

You will still need to most likely make the suggestion, but only AFTER she chases when you set clear boundaries and cut contact. And if she is still unsure she will be proving how much of a waste of time she is

Remember you are in your 40s and this girl is only 21. If you don't lead properly she will be the one leading most likely in a direction both of you won't like. And at this moment she is the one firmly in control

I just think it will be wise to set boundaries and go for women more compliant if you want less emotional turmoil in your life

 

[Skills]

I personally advise about messing with co workers, never ends well iny experience... But, since you are saying no to judge that.... The strategy with girls like that is to either move on or play looong game, i have fucked girls like that... The strategy is to be neutral flirt and wait till her is the one that hints a meeting... You never proactively hint a meeting, please read post and answers in the post and samples for context....

How to Bait via text to get her to hint a meet

Guys you know I like to ramble, but my rambling are PRACTICAL, just stay with me, you know how I love to make shit simple… A seducer asked me to do, a how do I do my baiting (actually there was a texting guide by ijjji rip where he kind of explain my texting style really good based on a post I...

www.skilledseducer.com

 

[TomInHo]

I personally advise about messing with co workers, never ends well iny experience... But, since you are saying no to judge that.... The strategy with girls like that is to either move on or play looong game, i have fucked girls like that... The strategy is to be neutral flirt and wait till her is the one that hints a meeting... You never proactively hint a meeting, please read post and answers in the post and samples for context....

How to Bait via text to get her to hint a meet

Guys you know I like to ramble, but my rambling are PRACTICAL, just stay with me, you know how I love to make shit simple… A seducer asked me to do, a how do I do my baiting (actually there was a texting guide by ijjji rip where he kind of explain my texting style really good based on a post I...

www.skilledseducer.com

Ye but she sees him at work all the time and also rigged it so he can coach her directly

I honestly don't see this girl ever pitching isolation with him although I agree that is usually the best strategy. Plus not sure he has the patience to wait as long as it may take

 

[Will_V]

So i'm a 40's guy who's manager and coach in a big company to a 21 year old girl. There are plenty of girls like her here and plenty of managers/coaches.

We use to work in person last year until february. In ocotber this girl started messaging me, first about work related stuff then flirting a bit. I'm a very busy guy so i did what i've learned here: Keep texts to a minimum, and call her bluff out right away. After the first few messages from her I blatantly send a few sexualized (not rude or hard core, of course) replyes thinking that if it wasn't her intention she would not do it again and that was it.

Well she kept doing it. So, once again tried to put in pratice what i've learned here call her to meet in person. She gave half hearted replys " that can be good ideia" "maybe" etc. However never came or showed interested to reschedule. So I dismiss her as an atention seeker (i'm resonabily atractive and have some power inside de company, and usually i'm pretty cool to be around). I thought that she would just get validated by my interest and move to another guy.

Well she didn't. She send more messages saying more flirty stuff, like "i miss you" "you are my favoutit manager" " I like you". "we have a crush on each other". Pretty straight forward right? Well tried again for compliance "lets see each other, no pressure, lets just hang around". To all of that she said "it's not a good idea", It's better not" etc.

So this time I thought "over and out". She will be out for christmas i will not ever be flirty again with her. Don't chase, replace. However she still send me messages to wich i was more neutral. January begun with the same tone, fliting (in person and by messages) and we cross each other alone for the first times at work and got hand together and sit close for just a few moments.

One day i finaly got her alone, moved her fast to a safe spot and went for the kiss. She resisted hard, saying "this is not right", "we can't do this". But didn't go away. Finaly we did kiss. Game on, right?

Well no, she went to work for another town for one month, kept texting me (even saying she missed the kiss albeit that being wrong). When she came, i tried to get her one on one once again. "I don't think it's a good idea". And here we are.



So, I can't figure out this girl. I have 3 handicaps (age gap, work relation, and being commited) these are factors (and please don't be moralist about any of those because i don't care and i'm in peace with all of them). But in the past, with all this factors I had girls complying when they were interested in me.

This one seems interested but then she flakes and does not comply. She was always the one iniciating text with me. Always. I fancy her, and woud like to fuck her of course, she's atractive and cute, but if she stoped today sending me texts I would never text her again.

Can she just be a twisted attention/validation seeker? for 5 months? Wouldn't that be too much work on one guy? Then again I don't trust anything she sais because at the same time it seems fake because she does not comply.

Advice appreciated.

The problem with the dynamic here is that you're the only one showing any real intent.

You were the one who sexualized on text, you were the one to kiss her, you were the one to invite her and try to make things happen.

She always stayed somewhat in sync, but pretty far behind in terms of intent.

At this point all your cards are pretty much on the table, and her intentions are still a mystery. There is no ambiguity left to you, but there is plenty to her, and she's already shut down multiple offers from you. That's a bad place to be.

Remember as they say "if you are not willing to walk away from the deal, you don't have any negotiating power" well it's not clear at this point - certainly to her - whether you can walk away. And that means she has no reason to change anything she's doing.

I think @Chase's BIHC idea is good, but I doubt you'd be willing to follow through with it if she kept whimpering on your phone. So you need to find a way to reintroduce ambiguity into your position. I'd suggest something like:

a) completely ignoring her for a period of time (at least a week or two) and see where that leaves things
b) being playfully resistant, like when she sends a juicy text go "naughty girl, I'm going to have to keep you at arms length or we'll get into trouble together "
c) generally absorb her interest and respond playfully and warmly while reflecting little sexual intent.

The goal being to get her to change her position - either to withdraw or to advance.

It goes without saying that if she's burning up your phone every day, you definitely should not be responding with the same frequency. Your time and attention is your most valuable commodity, especially for someone in your position, and she's spending it freely right now.

At the end of the day this is a clear cut example of why sexual abundance matters, so that a guy can sail past the sirens without getting baited into bad dynamics. If you are unable to take control of this situation and impose your frame regardless of how tempting she is, she'll simply take you for a ride for as long as she wants until she's tired of it all, and then simply disappear.

PS as others have alluded to this is certainly a case of you putting your arm in the crocodile's mouth, she's got everything she needs to make a hell of a lot of trouble for you if she wanted to - especially with the way that you pushing forward and her resisting can be seen as pressure from someone in your position of authority. But you say you're at peace with that and it's your choice. Make sure you're as ready as you can be if it happens though.

 

[Quicknick]

Nice inputs guys, thank you all. Though being the one who's not in control, I do rationalize interaction to flip the power a bit: 1- I never ever text first. 2- I mostly leave her on read and do not anwser all her messages (she double texts frequently), 3- I do have some social proof in front of her with other young atractive girls (though I don't really know if that affects her or not) 4- I don't go all over her social media. 5- stoped entirely to interact with her flirt baits.

The reason I think this is an interesting case is that I've had plenty of attention seekers before and in love girls. The attention seekers would get tired/bail out as soon as something was "on". The in love girls would be open to meet up. This girl does not fit any of those boxes. Invests in interaction for 5 months and even looks "in love" by the way she's anxious, looks at me and acts around me. But then when the oportunity arises she backs off.

Of course the main goal would be to get some good time with this girl, but now it has to be her who chases. If not, no problems for me and move on.

But cutting contact in a hard way has it's drawbacks too. I looks uncool and bitter, impling weakness. So I will study your sugestions, to implement them in a effective way.

 

[OldGuy]

I think she is in a form of auto-rejection. I had a woman like that. We did not work together, so she was eager to date, but nothing further than friends. I see this woman is eager for contact, but nothing more. No idea what to do, in my case (pre-texting) I moved away and stopped contact.

 

[TomInHo]

But cutting contact in a hard way has it's drawbacks too. I looks uncool and bitter, impling weakness. So I will study your sugestions, to implement them in a effective way.

Cutting contact does not imply weakness at all. It implies you value your time

I personally have run into situations like this in the past and noticed when girl really likes you for real she will start to chase when she feels you slipping away

If you reward bad behavior you will get more of it

This girl sounds inexperienced and you are not going to change her behavior if you never give her consequences for her actions

 

[Skills]

It's been virtually impossible to cut contact with her. She messages me every single day and even made a checkmate move a few days ago in that regard: Every trainee will have a coach for an individual project next year. According to internal policy, the trainee essentially chooses their coach. Out of 21 available coaches, guess who she picked?

So cutting her off entirely is very difficult—hence my struggle with this. Over the past two weeks, I've been very neutral, brief, and slightly witty. She’s also tested the waters to see if I would chase her. But trying to set up a meeting is off the table for me. It has to be her who invites. I've done it five times already—that's enough.

oh woow did not see this, correct, that is what i said.... this is the right strategy...

 

[Skills]

Ye but she sees him at work all the time and also rigged it so he can coach her directly

I honestly don't see this girl ever pitching isolation with him although I agree that is usually the best strategy. Plus not sure he has the patience to wait as long as it may take

she may be conflicted, cause they work together.... It is still possible... i see normies at different work places in similar situations, sometimes after a while they hook up (usually i seen a lot of orbiters when she has a dude and then they get promoter to messing around or even bf).. and i experience does situations when dealing with break up girls, i did a post on this for op as well reference, is the same strategy @Quicknick i recommend you do with this girl..... I can tell quicknick is not your average afc, he has tons of experience he is 40, he is in a power work position (this is attractive), he is coaching (attractive)... And she still texting and pinging etc... a girl with no interest don't do this, i think he just hard closes and she flakes which is why i recommend the super passive let her be the one that hint the meet strategy, due to similar strategy of post break up girls, op check this post (cause strategy similar) more long gamish/patience:

The type of game required is a totally different game on what we are used preach such as "move faster" "get her out" "go for the kill" "make the ho say no" etc.... So you need to calibrate and move to a different type of game that is super patient, slow compare to the regular seduction game, gayish/friendzonish (but not the friendzone of guys being friendzone for scare of making moves is the cool sexy friend type when i refer to friendzone)...

I found this type of game a bit of advance in the sense that if you are not banging other women while doing this, due to the patience required you are going to have issues... Also, I seen guys that have done everything perfect but then they had an "AGENDA", There can not be any agenda subcommunication in your part, this is the most hard thing to portray cause is contradictory.... I never played poker but a lot good poker players are seducers (wm, todd, etc...), you can not show your cards, so even if you have an agenda (to fuck her), this have to be super hidden.... For example i saw a guy that did it good, but started preaching on not going back to the ex (right advice) but you can tell he was giving the advice coming out from his agenda perspective, even though he did not know he was doing that, when i was reading the transcript the subcommunication was clear, and this guy is good.... So again this is slight mistake there can not be ANY agenda...

how to seduce emotionally vulnerable girls

I have been able to seduce a lot of emotionally vulnerable girls.... There was one in particular that i was like wowow, how i did this (lay report is in nextasf, tldr i made out i told boyfriend cause I thought she snitch on me, but she did not (bf i kind of knew, if i find it will post here...

www.skilledseducer.com