Cold approached girl would only give her Instagram. Useless?

[ThePhoenix]

Did a day game mission yeaterday in the megamall. First approach of five. (The other four were kinda duds; FR coming soon, as one of the others was a doozie.) It was a fairly good approach, and the girl invested in the conversation, asking questions etc. Decent incidental contact, and a small bit of teasing on my part. Not a model-perfect approach, but Iʼve never had one of those yet, but have still gotten laid approaching.

However, I did somewhat miss closing at the peak, and itʼs also possible my vibe was off.

I also made what I consider a fairly large error, which I keep doing habitually and need to stop!!! I grabbed my phone from my pocket at the same time as I was suggesting to meet up, before she actually responded. Iʼm finding that when I do this, girls usually refuse. I think itʼs important to at least try to get her agreement before taking out the phone, because otherwise she sees youʼre trying to grab her number, so now all of a sudden youʼre trying to get compliance on two things at once (date idea and number) instead of stacking compliance.

So, hereʼs how it went, roughly:

...

me: We should grab a coffee some time. [taking out phone — bad idea, along with the words “some time”, another bad habit]

her: I canʼt give you my number.

[I pause as Iʼm kind of thrown off]

her: Do you have Instagram?

me: Technically, I do, but I barely use it. I havenʼt even been on it in ages.
me: Do you use WhatsApp?

her: No. I can give you my Instagram.

(Regarding WhatsApp, it seems like the girl had come here from elsewhere — I had a bit more trouble than usual placing her, but I suspect West Africa or maybe the Caribbean, though quite possibly another Western country — and itʼs pretty common for people with relatives abroad to use that to talk to them.)

I had a new contact sheet open in the phone app (i.e., same Iʼd normally take a phone number into), and I gave it to her.

me: Well, here, put in your name.

her: Okay, but I canʼt give you my number.

She put her name and gave me back the phone.

At this point I basically broke down and told her to put it (her Instagram address) in the e-mail field, then.

I wound down the approach after getting the IG. Itʼs worth noting that she never actually addressed my meet proposal directly, and I didnʼt bring it back up, either. So that kind of got derailed, which was partly my own fault, by having grabbed my phone too soon.

I looked at this approach basically as a failure, because she wasnʼt sold enough to give me her number. (Iʼve read a post somewhere on GC about some countries where girls routinely wonʼt give casual dates their phone number and only give them social media, but as best as I can tell thatʼs not the case where I live. Before my vibe got thrown off by sexual failure, Iʼd get a number from about 1 of 5 day game approaches, and about two‑thirds of those would be responsive.)

My IG account is completely useless; it has just a few self-portraits from a while back, and like two followers, and is basically abandoned.

I think I should not have even admitted to having Instagram at all, both because my IG is useless and because it gave her a comfortable escape from giving her number. I would in retrospect have preferred to either get the number or just walk away. It feels like I gave in to her frame.


Questions:

1. Is there any way I could have at least tried harder to overcome her objection that she “could not” give me her number? She didnʼt even state the reason, nor did I ask. Maybe I should have?
   
   
2. Now that I have her IG at least, should I actually try to contact her on my basically empty IG account? On one hand, I think of it as a bad idea — i.e., “Iʼd rather lose the girl than lose my frame.” But on the other hand, I kind of already lost it by taking down her IG, and I donʼt get dates nearly often enough, so if there is a reasonable hope of converting her, maybe I should try.

I do know that Iʼm not going to go liking some chickʼs IG pics. Iʼm fully aware that IG is a huge attention whoring venue for girls, and I donʼt want to feed into that. I chatted up four other girls the same day I met her — I have zero willingness to be her on‑line orbiter! LOL

If I do interact with her on IG at all, Iʼm just going to use it the same way Iʼd use SMS, to immediately try to get her to meet up. Because I want to fuck her, not look at her pictures.

 

[Marcellus]

I was gonna say that you made getting the number the big event whereas the big deal and what was really important was agreeing that you two should get coffee sometime!

Thought it was funny haha

Next time, ask the girl out( we should grab coffee sometime by the way is a perfectly fine line, means its going to be sometime in the future whenever you're both free, it's a good line!) and then if she responds yes, THEN you can pull out your phone and get her digits.

It was a good approach you just lost your eye on the prize at the close but all good happens to everyone

And you might as well shoot your shot and follow, then msg her on insta! You'll be shooting from a long distance away haha but you have nothing to lose so why not

-Marcellus

 

[Space]

About Instagram. It's about experimenting. As as remember you are American. Depending on your location which communication vehicle the two of you agree upon can be a huge mess. Though @Fluxcapacitor's previous post in the thread lit a light bulb in my head. Heck, previously it happened that the contact info I was deliberately asking for was Instagram. I didn't know what I was even doing LOL.

 

[thats_a_penis_disgustang]

I ask her to show me her insta and say - no good content to subscribe for. it is useless

 

[Glow]

Instagram is the thing to do in certain groups. Many. How a huge group in the world today communicate. Especially many "hot" outgoing girls and guys.
Which means its her giving you her number sorta. Or at least a good initial way to connect. its the cultural standard. asking for number is a bit not getting it. Unless youre confident and have a reason providing a frame for that.
You could tease her on it. and propose you saw her more as a linkedin girl w. a smirk (provocative mini-cold-read)
then take instagram and say just joking.
or whatever.
I would just accept its a part of how things are done these days. and see it as fine.

That said, i personally get them on fbook cause i can manage comms more easily on ONE platform. So i avoid text fully. Just explain that insta is not my thing - give a good equivalent. Send the signal i hold my time as important(vibe).

If you enforce the number from an ego sort of approach, or cause you think you have too - youre loosing points - subtle or less subtle brutality & pride is never the answer and is the biggest fuckup of most intermediaries (happens for many - you know a little and go rough on rules which are premature conclusions).

If you follow cause its a rule and youre uncertain whats good on the area, fine - just understand that what migth be better according to some pua rule is just maybe the best option. But not the good option. nor appropriate at the moment. Girls gravitate a lot more in their assessments and smaller in between moves smoothn that process up. You never wanna force it cause its a rule. instead be curious. follow her lead and ask in along the way when you know her better. learn why she did it. It will teach you good nuances.

Rules and egos are what creates "over gaming" - using way too much effort to do things and not seeing reality. Fine to follow in the beginning but look beyond that.

 

[Watts]

me: We should grab a coffee some time. [taking out phone — bad idea, along with the words “some time”, another bad habit]

her: I canʼt give you my number.

me: Well, here, put in your name.

her: Okay, but I canʼt give you my number.

Did no one else think she might have a boyfriend, or sorta boyfriend?

Did you consider that at point you should have asked? Or at least said "Why can't you give me your number?"

 

[Space]

I had a new contact sheet open in the phone app (i.e., same Iʼd normally take a phone number into), and I gave it to her.

Regardless of whichever contact info you exchange ideally you don't take out your phone to put in her info. You make her put your info into her phone and send you a message right away.

Did no one else think she might have a boyfriend, or sorta boyfriend?

Then what? Nearly every decent girl has at least some beta "boyfriend" these days. Depending on the situation, maybe you just went up to her to "practice" she wasn't really a Fuck Yes girl to you and she has a fiance, then you say goodbye and move on. Otherwise it's quite common that she sees more potential with an new decent man than with her beta boy, in this case just go ahead.

Heck, the last time I really hit it off with this nice girl and got her contacts while she way waiting for her boy on their "date." I just always screw up the myriads of contact options people use here but that's my problem. So I don't agree our aspiring YouTube star @nad_bigger saying when she says she has a boyfriend just move on. Though I haven't been there from ThePhoenix's description I've read maybe simply there wasn't enough chemistry.

 

[Cody Lyans]

All questions asked to a woman fall under ONE PRINCIPLE
Is it a binary choice of yes no pleaseee
Or is it a fruit basket of added goodness

Hey meeting you was great, I really don't want to go, do you have a number and we can keep in touch.
Her: uhhh insta
Ha are you on insta a lot, nice, I only ask cuz you seem like a person who might be pretty interesting. I know some great places to grab a coffee, and a cookie.
It's warm and nice.

If she says no to you adding lots of positives on just be like, OK cool sounds like you are just too busy was nice chatting and neeeeext
You want good chemistry not funny bizniz

To answer your question though it's all about her tov
If she raised it like a question, that's good
If it trailed off like she's planning to forget you, no good

 

[JacobPalmer]

Did no one else think she might have a boyfriend, or sorta boyfriend?

Did you consider that at point you should have asked? Or at least said "Why can't you give me your number?"

Watts brings up a good point here. doesn't really sound like you asked her why she doesn't give out her #. could be tons of reasons (bad experiences in the past, dick pics out of nowhere, guys texting her constantly etc). But you gotta ask first, then you can calibrate. You can always flip this around as well:

You: Well I don't use insta, but grabbing your number would work best for me, so long as you don't text me 600 times a day and you don't send me any unsolicited dick pics."

Flips things and also conveys you understand what it's like being a chick when she gives out her # most of the time.

 

[Watts]

Watts brings up a good point here. doesn't really sound like you asked her why she doesn't give out her #. could be tons of reasons (bad experiences in the past, dick pics out of nowhere, guys texting her constantly etc). But you gotta ask first, then you can calibrate.

That was the main point, it seems there was a major piece of information to be uncovered and it was ignored.

Not to be negative, but it's almost socially inept NOT to bring it up. As in, she's giving you a hint @ThePhoenix , and in the subtle ways most girls communicate, you should engage it and explore it.

 

[Watts]

Then what? Nearly every decent girl has at least some beta "boyfriend" these days. Depending on the situation, maybe you just went up to her to "practice" she wasn't really a Fuck Yes girl to you and she has a fiance, then you say goodbye and move on. Otherwise it's quite common that she sees more potential with an new decent man than with her beta boy, in this case just go ahead.

Please don't make assumptions about what I'd consider next. This whole statement seemed to be projecting something, maybe this guy @nad_bigger is very blue pill and you have an issue with him? I don't know but you two should work it out together.

I actually have very little regard for the boyfriend relationship (I even said it recently in some previous post of mine), and personally draw the line at married women or women with children who are with the father (or women with children in general, but for other reasons).

So my standard answer to if she has a boyfriend is to ask if she is happy. I also like playfully accusing her of being in a relationship while he acts single. But there are plenty of people with good ideas for this stuff, @Bacchus just posted a LR with a girl with a boyfriend, check it out.

Also, I tend to assume an attractive social girl is fucking somebody under some conditions, and even have a mini-routine around it when I can tell she leans in that direction (more casual partners, goes out a lot etc.).

 

[Hector Papi Castillo]

Regardless of whichever contact info you exchange ideally you don't take out your phone to put in her info. You make her put your info into her phone and send you a message right away.

It's not too important. You can bring your phone out, get her info, add her/text her, then be like, "Here, see if you got it." This is especially important with Instagram where some girls have private profiles and you want to get an accept request immediately and also this helps with DM'ing. Sometimes girls are slow to add (though still interested), and you wanna dm them, but you go in the general inbox not the primary if you're not being followed/follow her.

Did no one else think she might have a boyfriend, or sorta boyfriend?

Did you consider that at point you should have asked? Or at least said "Why can't you give me your number?"

I always ask, "Ah, you have a boyfriend, don't you?" Usually, I move on from these. Sure, you can cuck him, but this is like 0.01% happenings. Is she down for it in the moment? Hell yeah! But then she walks away and guilt/shame/fear starts to grow in her and she reconsiders her relationship.

Girls you can snatch from other guys, they're usually SUPER into you from the get-go.

"I would love to...but I really can't. I have a boyfriend."

"oh, is that right?"

"Yeah, but you're super cute! haha"

"Think so?"

"haha yeah."

"I think you're super cute, too."

Keep talking...reroute conversation, etc. It's SUPER RARE but it happens. And I guess it doesn't hurt to push for an extra couple few seconds? I think I've fucked with one and fooled around with another girl who had a boyfriend this year? So, super rare.

The one I fucked was into me and even though telling me she had a boyfriend, didn't change a beat in her interest. Plus, a lot of good context (she was out alone, etc).

The one I fooled around with also brought up the boyfriend, but was still interested in hanging out with me. She pained it as platonic and even brought her female roommate. Still ended up fingering her on the couch at her place. But she was going through a super slut phase, had a semi-alpha boyfriend who white knighted her too hard in the begining then got cucked that same weekend 2 days before I also cucked him...so yeah, big window.

Also, the tone in here is a bit...hot.

Let's chill a bit.

Hector

 

[naturalmikey]

girl: “let’s wxchange instas”
me: “i’m not really trying to be another guy in your dms but if you wanna exchange numbers that’s cool”
girl: “okay”

numbers aren’t great. being another dude in her dms is absolutely pointless.

 

[Watts]

girl: “let’s wxchange instas”
me: “i’m not really trying to be another guy in your dms but if you wanna exchange numbers that’s cool”
girl: “okay”

numbers aren’t great. being another dude in her dms is absolutely pointless.

Another idea, is it possible she has a boyfriend who will see texts popping up in her phone, but that coordinating through her dm's will allow her to cheat?

I know I'm dating myself here, but I remember a girl I hooked up with in high school who gave me her best friend's house number, because she had a boyfriend!

But yes, social media close is a weaker close, unless you have an extremely strong social media that you're confident will build attraction (5k+ followers, great pictures at cool places etc.).

 

[Space]

Please don't make assumptions about what I'd consider next. This whole statement seemed to be projecting something

That's not what I said.

maybe this guy @nad_bigger is very blue pill and you have an issue with him?

He is a cool guy, no problem with him. He was very active here like 6 months ago then went on a hiatus then came back as an aspiring YouTube star. So I gave you the context.

Regardless of whichever contact info you exchange ideally you don't take out your phone to put in her info. You make her put your info into her phone and send you a message right away.

It's not too important. You can bring your phone out, get her info, add her/text her, then be like, "Here, see if you got it." This is especially important with Instagram where some girls have private profiles and you want to get an accept request immediately and also this helps with DM'ing. Sometimes girls are slow to add (though still interested), and you wanna dm them, but you go in the general inbox not the primary if you're not being followed/follow her.

Argh. It's not so intuitive to double quote here for the context. If anyone cares about these things besides me.

Now to answer you. Let me see. When a girl was really into me she often handed me her phone to put in my info. Consider it the best option. Most guys just want to put the girl's info in their phones and I like to be a little different so for me the 2nd best option if she doesn't hand me her phone is to me proactively put my info into it and make her ping me right away.

But whatever works man, it isn't a hard rule. There's a reason it's called an art.

 

[Watts]

That's not what I said.

I'll take the charitable approach and say we can agree to disagree.

In the future, if you are going to quote me in a response, please only address what I actually said and it's implications.

Be well @Space, best of luck out there!

 

[ThePhoenix]

Thank you for the responses, guys! Iʼll answer some of them separately so that Iʼm not all over the place in one post.

Just to update...

My Insta was actually more of a ghost town than I even remembered. I was following like 15 accounts, mostly cultural event related, and had zero  followers. And no posts at all. Hahaha! Well, I told her I donʼt use Insta!

I threw in a single post, just of a pretty good pic of myself and with a catchy element of attire that was the same as when we met. And made it public.

Found her account. She has it private but only has four posts anyway. But about 2500 followers (how the fuck do you get 2500 followers when you barely even post?!), and she follows about 900 accounts herself.

I decided not to follow and just DM, since becoming her follower I think puts me in a bad frame. So I sent her a simple DM with a bit of callback humor. That was on Sunday.

Unfortunately, from what I understand, the person doesnʼt even see your message initially, instead just seeing a request to send a message. And if youʼre not following/followed, you end up in a separate inbox Iʼm guessing might never get looked at. Maybe I shouldʼve done the follow thing first, I dunno.

Well, she hasnʼt answered yet, which doesnʼt surprise me, especially considering how IG handles this. I also made a significant error when closing; had I not done so, who knows, maybe Iʼd have gotten her number instead.

Oh, and my guess of her possible background in the original forum post here, had only been a guess after the fact based on my apparently rather poor recollection of what she looked like, plus what I usually see here. On seeing her pic with my brain more relaxed, I completely take that guess back. Iʼd say sheʼs far more likely Luo (Kenyan or thereabouts). But in weave — ugh.

 

[ThePhoenix]

I was gonna say that you made getting the number the big event whereas the big deal and what was really important was agreeing that you two should get coffee sometime!

Yup, absolutely. Well, thatʼs what I did say, but unfortunately I contradicted it physically. Bad habit... I need to stick my face in poo every time I do it!    

( we should grab coffee sometime by the way is a perfectly fine line, means its going to be sometime in the future whenever youʼre both free, itʼs a good line!)

Yeah. Iʼve certainly had it work. I just kinda feel like “sometime” is a bit wishy‑washy. In retrospect, I might prefer “soon”, although that could sound a bit off. Iʼve sometimes gone with just, “We should grab a coffee.” But then, in some cases she thinks I mean right  now — which could be good or bad depending on the situation!

 

[ThePhoenix]

I ask her to show me her insta and say - no good content to subscribe for. it is useless

Bwahahahahahaha! I love this, as much as I don't quite see myself doing it. But what sort of responses do you get when you do this?

 

[ThePhoenix]

its the cultural standard. asking for number is a bit not getting it.

Oh, God, I sincerely hope youʼre wrong. Cuz Iʼm so not a social media person. Very private. Hell, my best friends donʼt know where the fuck I went to for many weeks at a time!    XD Nor am I one to generate a plethora of selfies with cool people and places. Having to curate a digital presence is one of the reasons Iʼm not much for on‑line game. Iʼd loathe day game turning into the same thing!!

(And fuck Cambridge Analytica having my whole life in their datacenter.    LOL)

Fortunately, so far I actually have managed to close through phone numbers at a fairly decent percentage. I think it boils down to how sold do you have her in the first place? Sell her on the date first, and ideally the mode of communication shouldnʼt matter, itʼs just a practicality of setting up the date.

You could tease her on it. and propose you saw her more as a linkedin girl w. a smirk (provocative mini-cold-read)

Haha, I like this!

... follow her lead and ask in along the way when you know her better. ...

Hm, trying to appreciate this.

Well, nothing is a clear, set-in-stone rule. For instance, I generally always respond to “Iʼll  let you  know” sort of things by retracting my proposed date rather than accepting the frame of waiting around for her decision like a lost puppy. However, I did have one case (which  led to  sex) where the girl gave me an “Iʼll  let you  know”, but was extremely warm about it. Went with a common sense compromise — instead of retracting, I just went silent until the day — and it worked out. However, when she tried the “Iʼll  let you  know” frame again on the morning of the date, I then did retract the date — and then she chased and it happened. And I donʼt think it would have had I just given in again. So, itʼs a fine line between being too hard and being too soft, it  seems.

But when you say to “follow her lead”, this Iʼm having trouble with. Like, if you try to guide a girl right and she veers left, following her left is usually not a good thing, going by just about anything Iʼve seen anyone experienced on GC ever say or indeed my own experiences. Being the leader is, I thought, one of the most critical elements of seduction — “smooth  authority”, as I believe @Seppuku has called  it.