Confused.. What should I do now? Advise needed, please!

[zqw 10k]

Hi everyone,

I've been a member on the site for about 2-3 months now and I read almost everyday some articles to get myself in the dating scene. I'm very happy with the site, it really is something wonderful and almost everything I tried out worked out perfectly! I try out all the tips and tricks of every article but some stuff is still kinda hard for me, things like moving fast is still a problem for me but I'm working on it. This site already changed a lot in my life, I learned to understand girls and I'm very happy about that, I also lost about 12kg already, pumped up a bit my muscles and use body language a lot better now.

So.. Now for the thing where I really would like some advise on, and some clarification because I feel like totally lost. There is this girl who takes the same bus as me every morning and evening to go to her college (we're not on the same college though, which is good I suppose)
I've been talking with her for some time now (3 months) and yes I know that this have been stupid: I moved slower than a snail.. But at the other side I don't really see how to move faster with her because she seems always busy, didn't had the time to see me in the weekends and she had a boyfriend where she wasn't at all in love with because she didn't talk even once about him for a month until I asked once what she would be doing in her weekend and she said "going to my boyfriend, I guess".
So now about this girl, I had some great deep diving experiences with her and we felt emotionally bounded, every morning I sat next to here even though we didn't talk a lot, I sometimes slept on her shoulder (want to know about this too.. Is this good or bad?) and every now and then I stroke her legs and she felt asleep a couple of times..
Then a couple of weeks later we took a group picture together (3 guys, her and without that other guy) and she nicely cropped the pic so only me and her were on it and she putted it as background on her phone.. So I knew she liked me too and I heard she broke up with her boyfriend (she brake up) and that's when I decided it was the perfect moment to ask her in a relationship: So that's what I did, I took her off home, walking together and deep diving a bit, the conversation was like magic and at the end I asked her. She responded with "Well.. I already have a boyfriend.." which is strange because she just brake up and I'm just almost fully sure that she doesn't have one..
She also often told me that she had stuff to do, or that she couldn't see me this weekend because blah blah blah everytime I invited her at my place.. And it turned out that almost everything was a lie too (I accidently found that out) so I went to her the day after I asked her and said I didn't like to be taken for an idiot and said I didn't want to hear these excuses anymore. he said it was the truth and then I left saying "Well maybe but I'm stubborn and I'm pretty sure you lie."

Now we don't talk anymore but.. I don't know.. What have gone wrong? And what can I do to fix it?
I think she likes me too much and that she was trying to throw me in the friendzone. That would explain all the lies because she doesn't want to have sex because she could "lose" me then. So she decided to keep it like this, but I declined it I think because I don't want the friendzone..

My current plan is to ignore her, I don't go to her, I don't talk to her, I don't even say hello. I want her to come to me, she should be chasing me and if she doesn't then I guess I'll try with some others.. I think she doesn't want to lose me (which explains her background pick and that she never said stop when I stroke her legs) and that she wants to keep me as friends to be sure to keep me. But as I said I don't want that and I try to show 2 options: Being her lover or fading out of her life where only the lover option would be the only one where she could be with me. I could also ask her out again, put her on a decision (fading or lover) and say that I would like to stay friends if the lover option doesn't turn out well.

What do you guys think? Please help.. Should or shouldn't I talk to her? Maybe should I just wait like 2 weeks and then try again like nothing happened?

PS: Sorry for my bad English, English is not my first language

 

[Light]

Hi zqw,

Sounds like she did like you, and she placed you as a "potential boyfriend" since you acted slow. Being in that zone is dangerous, as she can easily slot you into her friendzone if you never make it to the boyfriend zone.

But most importantly, I'm more concerned about all her lies. It sounds like she has been toying with you while having sexual fun with her so called boyfriends (lovers). So she was just keeping you on the side in case she ever needed you.

Stick with your plan of ignoring her, and if she wants you she will chase you. This mindset is good. I would not waste anymore time with such a girl, especially if I know she has been lying to me.

The next time you see her, just be cool. Nod your head at her as if you're saying "hello, you're alright?".
Obey the Law of Least Effort.
Start seeing other girls. once she starts seeing you with other girls... you never know

 

[Penguin]

- What did you invite her to do at the weekends? Was it an activity which was simple, and would have made it easy for her to get into your bed? Or was it something complicated like ice-skating which would give the impression that you were not intending to bed her quickly?

- You wanted her to cheat on her (unsatisfactory) boyfriend, therefore your date ideas should have been something covert, so that no one she knew would see her cheating.

- It sounds like you have been "Mr. Nice Guy" instead of a sexy, challenging guy. Try to act more strongly and confidently, and learn how to challenge women (on Chase's blog). You got a little bit of physical escalation which was good, but sleeping on her shoulder isn't exactly cool or bad-ass.

- Acting angry towards women looks weak and socially unskilled. It gives the impression that you have a history of rejection with women, and women are looking for guys that are desired by other women.

- Asking for a relationship isn't the best way to get a relationship. The best way is being a lover, and taking her to bed fast. That way, you will have priority over slow, timid guys who are chasing her and haven't bedded her.

- About her being busy- After you have suggested an activity, it's essential to ask women what days are good for them, rather than suggesting days and chasing them through their schedule. Also, women are attracted to men who are busy (with other women?) instead of men who sit around doing nothing.

- Like Light explained, the main error is that your slow and careful actions were seen as you trying to be a boyfriend. Women respond to this by moving slowly and carefully with you, as they continue to enjoy sex with bold and fast-moving lovers. Eventually most boyfriend applicants end up in the friend zone, because they are not making any progress.

- In the future, you need to be bold and fast with women.

 

[Vash]

Besides not moving fast enough and some questionable actions (Like sleeping on her shoulder? No offense, but really?), I think you went about it completely the wrong way by getting mad at her calling her a liar. You should never ever go on the attack with the girl, and instead you want to stay cool and level-headed. She makes excuses about not wanting to meet you, oh well. Girls make excuses all the time; this really isn't anything new or worth getting mad about. I would've just persisted for a while longer, and if she doesn't budge and is absolutely unbreakable, just move on, start over with a new girl.

 

[zqw 10k]

Thanks a lot for all the replies!

Hi zqw,

Sounds like she did like you, and she placed you as a "potential boyfriend" since you acted slow. Being in that zone is dangerous, as she can easily slot you into her friendzone if you never make it to the boyfriend zone.

But most importantly, I'm more concerned about all her lies. It sounds like she has been toying with you while having sexual fun with her so called boyfriends (lovers). So she was just keeping you on the side in case she ever needed you.

Stick with your plan of ignoring her, and if she wants you she will chase you. This mindset is good. I would not waste anymore time with such a girl, especially if I know she has been lying to me.

The next time you see her, just be cool. Nod your head at her as if you're saying "hello, you're alright?".
Obey the Law of Least Effort.
Start seeing other girls. once she starts seeing you with other girls... you never know

Alright.. Thank you very much for clearing that up! I like the idea of nodding to her, and I will definitely try it out tomorrow and see what fun it could bring to me. I know that I might have been wasting my time and that such girls are very.. unstable girls.. But I don't mind that, I'm someone very easy going so that's not a big problem for me, only thing I really hate is the friendzone as before knowing this site I've been in it for too long, entered a vicious circle of repetition which started to damage my self esteem.
I'll continue to ignore her, have a bit of eye contact teasing and head nodding and if she comes to talk to me I first want the truth even if it's hard and bitter. And I'll continue with seeing other girls of course because she certainly isn't the only girl in my region, and I want to discover many more

- What did you invite her to do at the weekends? Was it an activity which was simple, and would have made it easy for her to get into your bed? Or was it something complicated like ice-skating which would give the impression that you were not intending to bed her quickly?

- You wanted her to cheat on her (unsatisfactory) boyfriend, therefore your date ideas should have been something covert, so that no one she knew would see her cheating.

- It sounds like you have been "Mr. Nice Guy" instead of a sexy, challenging guy. Try to act more strongly and confidently, and learn how to challenge women (on Chase's blog). You got a little bit of physical escalation which was good, but sleeping on her shoulder isn't exactly cool or bad-ass.

- Acting angry towards women looks weak and socially unskilled. It gives the impression that you have a history of rejection with women, and women are looking for guys that are desired by other women.

- Asking for a relationship isn't the best way to get a relationship. The best way is being a lover, and taking her to bed fast. That way, you will have priority over slow, timid guys who are chasing her and haven't bedded her.

- About her being busy- After you have suggested an activity, it's essential to ask women what days are good for them, rather than suggesting days and chasing them through their schedule. Also, women are attracted to men who are busy (with other women?) instead of men who sit around doing nothing.

- Like Light explained, the main error is that your slow and careful actions were seen as you trying to be a boyfriend. Women respond to this by moving slowly and carefully with you, as they continue to enjoy sex with bold and fast-moving lovers. Eventually most boyfriend applicants end up in the friend zone, because they are not making any progress.

- In the future, you need to be bold and fast with women.

I didn't invite her to do something special, I just invited her home and I said that it would be fun and we could get to know each other a bit more.. I've talked about this with a friend (we try to get in the arts of seduction together, and we're both kinda the same) and he said that I should have invited her to a neutral place like a Kebab or something like that (I'm 18 years old btw, so that should do) and then take her home for some awesome movie or stuff like that.. I wanted to be mysterious but also direct, so that's why I did it this way and not the neutral place way..

That's true.. Very true, but when I only asked her this when we we're both together and alone, so almost no social pressure was involved, which I thought would be enough for her to answer yes.. Next time (maybe not for this girl if she doesn't come back but who knows) I'll try the neutral place way

Alright, I won't sleep on someones shoulder again because yeah I must admit it was weird sometimes.. On Chase blog there's something about the Genuine man and how to become one. It says that you first should go from Nice guy to Jerk and then to Genuine man. I tried to go directly from nice guy to genuine and I think I succeeded partially, and I'm still working on refining it.

I never got angry on her, because yeah I knew this one (and glad I did!). When I told her about her lies I was very calm, comfortable, no stress and I looked into her eyes (while she tried to NOT look back in my eyes). I also smiled a bit at her (sexy smile) like I wanted to say "I don't care much about it".

Very true ad I've tried this but just couldn't see any way to get her at my home which is why I tried to skip this step. I knew that it took too long, and I just wanted to skip it as it was very time and resource consuming

I'll try to be bolder and move a lot faster in the future, as I see now that this is a particular big mistake I made, thanks a lot for your post, advice and explanations!

Besides not moving fast enough and some questionable actions (Like sleeping on her shoulder? No offense, but really?), I think you went about it completely the wrong way by getting mad at her calling her a liar. You should never ever go on the attack with the girl, and instead you want to stay cool and level-headed. She makes excuses about not wanting to meet you, oh well. Girls make excuses all the time; this really isn't anything new or worth getting mad about. I would've just persisted for a while longer, and if she doesn't budge and is absolutely unbreakable, just move on, start over with a new girl.

I didn't get mad at her, just stayed calm, relaxed, looked her into her eyes and said it. I knew that girls would make these excuses every now and then but I honestly didn't knew she would be doing that every time for 2 months straight.. So that's why i wanted to break her a bit by telling her this, and to stay out of the friendzone of course
What I could do now is continue ignoring her, which I plan on doing but I could also force myself in persisting with her a bit more, and talk to her again like nothing happened and like we just met. But I think the ignoring one will be the best for the Law of least effort, to get her chasing me, to filter her out (if she likes me or not) and to stay away of the friendzone.


Also one question about another girl.. I accidentally smiled friendly towards her (showing teeth) and she said "I don't like it when you do that kind of smile", does that mean "I don't want to be your friend, but lover"?