Eye Contact

[Bboy100]

Hi guys.
So, I was on a coffee date earlier today. As I was talking to her, she would almost never hold eye contact with me. She pretty much always looked away. I would continue to hold eye contact regardless. Also, anytime there was a pause in conversation, I would continue holding strong eye contact (to create tension), and she would always giggle and start blushing (to break tension). So, I was pretty much looking at her the whole time except when A. Some of the time when I was speaking and B. I was making a joke or saying something which could be interpreted as showboating. In those cases, I broke eye-contact and looked away.

Anyways, eventually, I started teasing her about the blushing+giggling, and when she finally stopped laughing, she told me that it felt like I was staring at her and it made her uncomfortable in a very matter-of-factly tone of voice.
Keep in mind this date went "okay" at best, but honestly, it was probably more bad than okay (I tried to kiss her twice, and she rejected me both times), so all the blushing and giggling may not have necessarily meant anything. I did a variety of other things wrong (i.e. I lost control of the conversation halfway through, and my fundamentals literally crumbled as soon as I actually saw her... I literally stumbled into my chair LOL).

So here's what I'm asking: If a girl tells me she feels like I'm "staring at her" does that mean my eye-contact is too strong, or should I entirely disregard that statement and attribute what I would say was a pretty bad date to my other mistakes?

 

[ray_zorse]

I think your biggest mistake might have been to try to kiss her in public, she won't be down for this except in special circumstances... as to the eye contact I guess it might have been too strong, normal eye contact would be basically looking at them but with frequent breaks, only hold it hard if its a high point or you're trying to tell her something (kiss me now) or get her to invest (fill an uncomfortable silence) or build sexual tension (this won't work without other cues though) or some other reason... but I don't think it's a big deal, she was probably just trying to excuse her own poor eye contact.
-Ray

 

[Bboy100]

I think your biggest mistake might have been to try to kiss her in public, she won't be down for this except in special circumstances

I had no logistics, and given and the specific situation, I feel like I would have to be pretty advanced to pull her anyways. Because of this, I felt like I should try to kiss her to at the very least communicate that I'm not going to be her platonic guy pal. But based on the results, it seems your right, kissing in public is a bad idea. I should've just opted to keep my intrigue/mystery instead. Live & learn I guess.

as to the eye contact I guess it might have been too strong, normal eye contact would be basically looking at them but with frequent breaks, only hold it hard if its a high point or you're trying to tell her something (kiss me now) or get her to invest (fill an uncomfortable silence)

Good to know.

build sexual tension (this won't work without other cues though)

Ah, there's my mistake. I thought eye contact alone would build sexual tension.

Thanks Ray!

 

[Anonymous]

Bboy,

A lot of people are terrible at eye contact. There's a reason why people walk down the street, sit on the subway, on the bus, in public venues, sitting in their seats and at tables, staring at their phone.

Most of the time, they're not really doing anything important, but trying to alleviate their discomfort of sitting or being alone without something to distract their mind from their insecurities. Most people cannot walk down the street and make friendly, innocuous eye contact with another person.

You scared her. You have to adjust according to the person. Especially if the girl continually looks away and is clearly nervous and flighty. If you just bore into her face with your gaze, it's going to feel awkward for her.

And unless that girl is ready to tear your pants off, she is not going to kiss you in public, especially during the daytime.
Public + daytime = high alert. She's going to be self-monitoring… she doesn't want to be caught kissing a guy who she barely knows when she might be seen by people. Her reputation is at stake.

 

[Bboy100]

Haha, yeah, it looks like your right J.J.
After texting her to meet up again, she replied with:

"Hi! I would like to be honest with you. When we met, I realized that you're a very nice person. But you came off very intimidating and intense. Honestly, you kind of scared me away. I really enjoyed talking to you though. You are a smart and caring guy for sure, but we're just not compatible" (Kind of a self-contradictory message, but I'll take it at face value anyway)

At the same time though, I always thought seeming at least a little intimidating was a good thing. Most people with a dominate, high status vibe (i.e. good fundamentals) always seem intimidating to me. Part of the whole mantra of this site is to be sexual, high status and a little dangerous. So, I'm wondering, what's the difference between being what GC idolizes and just being plain scary.

 

[ray_zorse]

The thing is to be dominant while also coming in under the radar. This is a little hard to explain. To give an example when I meet a girl I give her $10 and say casually "go and order for us, I'll have a medium cappucino" or whatever... so this is a command but it doesn't feel like a command, because my tonality is very gentle and my vibe is like it's no big deal. So ideally she won't realize until later that she's following all your commands i.e. you're dominating her. It's also pursuant to the law of least effort, a guy who is used to being obeyed is not going to treat it like a big deal, he's just going to assume compliance basically.

The same with your walk, etc -- you're standing tall, shoulders back, taking large but slow strides......... and looking casual about it. Sounds contradictory no? Basically it's a question of being comfortable in your skin and toning down the dominance a bit. However, you want to be ready to get it out at a moment's notice -- the instant you're challenged... you stand up even straighter... drill that fucker with the eye contact... get out your most intimidating voice and so on. So it's basically a matter of matching your vibe to the situation. You also want to gradually ramp up the tension, what you could have done is started with a bit of banter and joking around (light eye contact), get into a bit of deep diving (heavier eye contact), escalated the touch, said some strongly sexual things (even heavier eye contact) and then with your hand on her arm, staring intently into her eyes, say slowly/huskily "let's go watch that movie.......", holding the EC so she gets your intention clearly.

I wonder if you have ever watched the TV series, Fawlty Towers? Americans don't generally watch British TV so I'd imagine not... well it's farce. What happens is each episode starts with a normal morning in the hotel... some guests check in, the phone rings a bit, Basil prepares the menus, etc... then things start to happen such as, a guest makes a complaint, or they're out of some critical ingredient in the kitchen, or whatever... the way the staff react is a little bit cockeyed... things start falling over even more... and pretty soon it's just a total madhouse, complete bedlam, guests running about the hotel everywhere, beating each other up, abusing the staff, an elderly resident walking around with a shotgun trying to shoot sparrows... Basil getting more and more manic, and so on. But the interesting thing is that you don't actually notice the gradual ramping up of the tension, it's so well done that it's almost imperceptible -> it remains believable.

-Ray

 

[Bboy100]

I see. Yeah, that kinda makes sense to me. No, unfortunately, I haven't seen faulty towers, but I get what you mean. What you're saying definitely seems legit, and it seems to be the case every time I've had success in the past (even though it was usually completely by chance haha).

However, I'm not entirely sure how this lines up with the concept of having a sexy vibe. Oftentimes I'll see people on this site talk about the idea of something along the lines of: being a charismatic man dripping with sexuality.



What I gather from something like that is that some men come off very sexual (in a good way) from the outset. I always assumed that this "exuding of sexuality" necessarily includes also exuding some tension. Is my assumption wrong or am I missing something here?