Girls in group: easier by handing out business cards?

[lux7]

There's always been much talking about girls in group and how to approach them.
The whole "mystery method" is built around groups.

THE ISSUE WITH GROUPS
But I feel that no matter what you're always going to have a harder time with a girl in a group.
And it's not just about the cockblocker thing.
Much more so if it's a mixed group, but even in a group of just chicks the girl is likely to feel some "peer pressure" to say yes, to exchange phone number and to possibly being questioned by the friends on how it went etc. etc.
And in case she's got a BF the group pressure is that much higher

THE BUSINESS CARD FIX
So I was thinking, rather than asking for phone number, facebook, dates and anything, couldn't it be a possible way to skirt the social pressure thing entirely by making your opening, state your interest, possibly talk/joke a bit and then... Handing out your business card to the girl you like and telling her "contact me"?
That way she doesn't have to stand the social pressure of "saying yes" to you and feeling looked down by her friends for giving away phone numbers to complete strangers because she can do so alone at home, away from nosy intruders .

And... You'll save time, money and energies in (not) making the first step



What do you think?

 

[PinotNoir]

Hmmm, I actually like this idea a lot. However, a girl wants the man to lead, and wants the man to ask her out.

Here's how I could see this working out:

On only 1 of the business cards, write your cell phone # on the back and something like, "I couldn't pass you up, but I'm a man of respect and personal privacy, so I figured that this would be the most discreet way. You look absolutely charming <something unique to her>. Text/call me if you're interested. -Name"

However, this makes you look "cowardly." I say definitely try it, and let us know about the results! But, if you're really interested, just approach like Chase has suggested in either the group approach thread on the forums or in his article. Pre-opening and cutting in at the right time is key.

 

[lux7]

However, this makes you look "cowardly."

Very true, there's a danger of that.
Showing up, saying hi giving the card and leaving is only guaranteed to have the card taken and have your name read out loud to "give a name to the creepy idiot who just came by"

The point is, it shouldn't be used as an excuse not to man up and/or to make a good conversation/impression.

Everything should go as normal, the card should only be used to overcome the possible jealous friend cockblocker and the possible shyness/peer pressure the girl would feel in giving out the contact details.

Also it presents a possible upside: you can come off as very unneedy, the guy who doesn't even need to ask, like saying "I'm not even asking your number to call you, here I am, if you wanna have this great chance give it a try, if not, nice meeting you".

 

[Good Vibes]

Also it presents a possible upside: you can come off as very unneedy, the guy who doesn't even need to ask, like saying "I'm not even asking your number to call you, here I am, if you wanna have this great chance give it a try, if not, nice meeting you".

Try it with the next 100 girls you meet as breifly as you suggest and ask them to call you within the next week for a date. If you get 1 phone call or text from it with a girl asking you for a date, I'll eat my computer, monitor and keyboard.

 

[lux7]

Try it with the next 100 girls you meet as breifly as you suggest and ask them to call you within the next week for a date. If you get 1 phone call or text from it with a girl asking you for a date, I'll eat my computer, monitor and keyboard.

Where did I suggest a time frame?

I didn't say it's a fool proof method and as a matter of fact I don't appreciate/trust too much people coming out with "fool proof methods".

Anyway, in case you're that hungry I left my contact 2 times in the last month and one girl I met at the park whom I left my contact writing it on her thesis research book contacted me asking about that date I was talking about. More or less 7 minutes conversation.
And still -contrary to you who seems to have everything down to a mathematical science- I don't have certitudes and I'm not saying that's proof of anything, maybe it would have been OK even if I had asked for her contact as well.

And anyway, unless it doesn't add any value, I appreciate criticism as that's the best way too see the possible shortcomings.

 

[Good Vibes]

Alright perhaps I should have read your post better.

Are you suggesting I've given a "fool proof method" on something?

Look give me at least a week to chop up, blend, eat and digest the computer, monitor and keyboard.

... but seriously I was thinking more along the lines of getting someone to do the experiment for me as you have. (Are you sure she's not just a friend?)
as I would never waste my time just handing out cards by letting a girl lead and then wait for her to contact me.

You are better off telling her you want to put your phone number into her phone so she can ring you but then press send to you so you can ring her later but even that's not the best way to go about it.

 

[lux7]

Alright perhaps I should have read your post better.

Are you suggesting I've given a "fool proof method" on something?

Look give me at least a week to chop up, blend, eat and digest the computer, monitor and keyboard.

... but seriously I was thinking more along the lines of getting someone to do the experiment for me as you have. (Are you sure she's not just a friend?)
as I would never waste my time just handing out cards by letting a girl lead and then wait for her to contact me.

You are better off telling her you want to put your phone number into her phone so she can ring you but then press send to you so you can ring her later but even that's not the best way to go about it.

I wouldn't even dream of providing a fool proof method, which I very much doubt exist in most human endeavors BTW .

 

[lux7]

I was thinking that another possible use would be when for example the two of you are really in a hurry and/or have to move on the spot without time to take out the phone to exchange contacts -imagine her train has just come and you don't have to board it-.

The best possible outcome would actually be telling her to wait for the next one while she talks to you and she complying... But it's good to have a plan B.

 

[Good Vibes]

hey! lucifer7 you devil you;

Honestly, what good is it to you if someone here replies to your question with "yes it could work"?
These questions you are asking in this thread all have answers you already know.
There are plenty of ways to get lucky with girls but most people here want to learn and practise the best ways to increase your success rate, not ponder on "what if's" or "is it possible to".

 

[Franco]

Lucifer,

I'm going to have to play devil's advocate here and say that I have not had much success with giving women my number, even if it's my business card.

I've had interactions with women that have been incredible -- women that I thought for sure were buying in to what I had to offer. For every single one of those women in which I gave them my number and did not receive theirs in return, I never received a message from a single one of them.

Women put a lot of pressure on themselves when it comes to contacting men. A lot of times, they can be very interested, but they will be so interested and nervous that they will actually never end up contacting you! As counter-intuitive as it might sound, women will be afraid to make the first move even if you tell them it is okay, and even encouraged, to do so.

Now with that being said, Chase once mentioned a guy that used to tell women that he would never take down numbers and only gave his out telling them to contact him. I'm not sure what his return contact rate from women was, but I imagine it was rather low. I could only see such a tactic working if you were to approach a massive amount of women, and even then I feel like your success would be minimal.

So when it comes down to it, the best way to find out if it works for you is to go out and try it. My opinion though: you'd be best off learning to open direct and get phone numbers. You'll likely find much more success with this if you get your fundamentals down. =)

- Franco

 

[lux7]

Franco, I love devil's advocate point of views as they show flaws .

I don't make myself qualms in asking, it's just that sometimes I feel that having my contact on a paper could simplify some situations.
What you're saying is very true and very interesting as I hadn't thought about the psychological pressure of the first step on the woman's side, but 2 points that lessen a lot the "first step pressure":

1. Culture
The "first step pressure" also depends quite a lot on the culture.
Around here women are quite open, and it's not so uncommon for them to make the first step.

2. First step Pressure's off with social networks
I once left a phone number after a very good interaction with an Asian girl.
3 times I left my name and surname with a local girl and told to add me on FB.

The first went nowhere, the other 3 added me (2 FBs, 1 linkedin) and we took it from there to meet again with one, and with the other 2 I'm still in the process as it was only in the last few days (ok, disclaimer: one added me in front of me and 1 actually asked me the contact, so only once it was pure "leave unasked contacts and go", but still all the times it was me to leave contact details and not to ask for it).

This is quite important I think, because just adding someone on FB/Linkedin, especially with the younger generations, is a much smaller and obvious step than calling/texting.

Most younger people today would add anybody on social networks, so it doesn't feel like being too forward or anything.

 

[lux7]

Also, yes, I have to admit that part of the appeal for me is that in groups I do have some issues in asking contacts in front of the whole group. But at the same time I feel that she feels those pressures too.

And the second things that appeals me is that... It can feel very cool and powerful to leave contacts without asking in certain situations, as it sends off vibes of a strong self reliant person who's outcome independent.

--------------------

I'll give you one example from yesterday where being in a rush without readily written contact details might have thwarted a possible good future interaction:

It was at the tram stop and it was night.
I thought she was looking at me a bit and when she walked in front of me, she stopped as soon as I said hi. Conversation was great, then her friend's tram arrived. "Great" I thought. But behind that... There was also her tram that neither of us had seen.

I knew her name, so I asked for her surname, but not being from here I wasn't able to understand the spelling.
No time to write down anything.

No point in asking her to stay, at night there are long waits between trams.
If I had boarded, that would have been very chasy.

From the tram, she sent a flying kiss.

Now I can't be sure, of course, but I wouldn't be surprised if there was at least a 50% chance of receiving her friendship request if I had left a card telling her to add me and from there there might have been another 50% chance of meeting again.

With almost 0 effort from you side...

 

[lux7]

Anyway, just wanted to add, not trying to convince anybody, just here to sharing ideas/critics/feeds and get further inputs, good interacting with you guys

 

[Good Vibes]

And the second things that appeals me is that... It can feel very cool and powerful to leave contacts without asking in certain situations, as it sends off vibes of a strong self reliant person who's outcome independent.

That mind set will lead you to a path of "hey this is great" followed by disappointment and frustration, followed by a determination for learning and eventually success. Why don't you skip the first 2 steps?

From the tram, she sent a flying kiss.

I don't want to assume you are but don't get excited about that. Infact don't get excited with anything a girl does with you or your body until your penis is inside her.

This is quite important I think, because just adding someone on FB/Linkedin, especially with the younger generations, is a much smaller and obvious step than calling/texting.

Most younger people today would add anybody on social networks, so it doesn't feel like being too forward or anything.

Smells like friendship to me. Franco and I are talking about sexual relationships, not girls who see you as a fun friendly guy.
If you don't develop sexual tension then the girl may feel comfortable to contact you for a group date situation like with one of her friends but rarely in a one on one situation that a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship would do. That's just the way she would view it.

 

[lux7]

That mind set will lead you to a path of "hey this is great" followed by disappointment and frustration, followed by a determination for learning and eventually success. Why don't you skip the first 2 steps?

Because I can't be sure it's like you say, how can you be sure if you've never tried it?
And of course it's not something you'd use all the time just because you have a card with you, it might be something for, maybe, 5-10% of the encounters.

I don't want to assume you are but don't get excited about that. Infact don't get excited with anything a girl does with you or your body until your penis is inside her.

Nah, no way I'd get excited for someone I'll never see again .
It's just an example of those occasions that made me think "it would have been good to have a business card with me".

Smells like friendship to me. Franco and I are talking about sexual relationships, not girls who see you as a fun friendly guy.
If you don't develop sexual tension then the girl may feel comfortable to contact you for a group date situation like with one of her friends but rarely in a one on one situation that a boyfriend/girlfriend relationship would do. That's just the way she would view it.

So am I

Why do you say it smells like friendship, how is it possible to guess from a social network add -except from the name that is "friendship request"on FB, of course - is a first step towards friendship?

While it's very likely some girls I meet think of me as a possible friend and while it can also be true for those I listed where I was the one leaving the contact (will update on that), I honestly don't think it's possible at all to say they want friendship just because they added me rather than the other way around or because we used a social network.

I always ask girls if they prefer FB or phone number and so far I don't seem to notice much difference (except that on average the older they are the more frequently they go for the phone number, age bracket definitely makes a difference in that).

I think that all the girls I've had a sexual encounter with either are or were friends on social networks..

 

[Chase]

Chase once mentioned a guy that used to tell women that he would never take down numbers and only gave his out telling them to contact him. I'm not sure what his return contact rate from women was, but I imagine it was rather low. I could only see such a tactic working if you were to approach a massive amount of women, and even then I feel like your success would be minimal.

Important to note: this guy would build and build and build attraction and bait women and have them doing backflips for him until he got them to ask for his number. Sometimes they would ask on their own; sometimes he would just say, "I can't believe this," and the girl would say, "What?" and he would say, "Well, it's just that I've been talking to you for fifteen minutes and you haven't even asked me for my number yet." He would essentially lead them into asking him for the number, and then instruct them when / how to contact him later.

When you're just tossing your business card out willy-nilly, it's about as effective as handing out fliers for whatever X random product on the street. Most of them just end up on the ground. When I first started working a professional job and got my first box of business cards, I thought it was going to be my magic pass to easy phone numbers, and tried out giving my business card to women that I KNEW were very attracted to me and I easily could have gotten a phone number from. Never heard from any of them, and I was working for one of the highest prestige companies you can work for. Didn't matter.

If you're going to give your number out, you need buildup similar to what the fellow mentioned earlier uses. Without that, it's just another piece of paper she'll use to take notes on and throw away.

Chase

 

[lux7]

Seems like everybody is either skeptical or didn't have good experiences with it .

Just yesterday I was reading this article from Chase, titled "Get Girls Chasing: Give a Little to Get a Lot" (https://www.girlschase.com/content/get-g ... le-get-lot ).

It says:

After attempting to schedule a meet up with a girl, and her telling me she’s busy for a few days, I’ll tell her this:

Okay, no problem. Tell you what, just let me know when you’re free and we’ll set it up.

The ones who are very interested in you will take charge of this and let you know when they’re free. Even a lot of the ones who are still making up their minds about how they feel about you will make an effort to schedule something.

And what happens is, the woman becomes the one seeking to set up and coordinate the date. Because you put the ball in her court, you make her the pursuer when she later reaches out to you and tells you she’s free to see you. Just like the first example, she’s complying and investing by doing as you instructed her, and she’s pursuing a date with you.

This is exactly what I meant, rather than instead of using it after you've already made the first move and asked for a date, you use it right at the beginning asking her to make the first move.
That's even more powerful if she will contact you which, I take it from your answers, is more uncommon than I had supposed, point taken .
In a way, sounds a bit like one of those "high risk high reward" situations.

I will use it for a while on certain occasions, asking not to be called but to be added to social networks, mostly from younger girls, and we will see.
Have to wait to find a new job though as I don't wanna lie about my current employment status

 

[Franco]

Luc,

This is exactly what I meant, rather than instead of using it after you've already made the first move and asked for a date, you use it right at the beginning asking her to make the first move.
That's even more powerful if she will contact you which, I take it from your answers, is more uncommon than I had supposed, point taken .

Correct, it is probably more uncommon than you think. =)

From the tram, she sent a flying kiss.

Keep in mind also that things like these don't really mean anything either. In an example that I have, a girl asked for my number after kissing and nibbling on my shoulder and neck, and this was after about 30-40 minutes of conversation. I wrote down my number on a napkin and gave it to her thinking for sure this girl was going to contact me. I almost lost interest in her because it seemed too easy!

Sure enough, I never heard from her again. It left me befuddled for awhile, and tried the giving out my number a few more times to girls who were giving me strong IOI's. Never heard from there either!

Your best bet is this:

Important to note: this guy would build and build and build attraction and bait women and have them doing backflips for him until he got them to ask for his number. Sometimes they would ask on their own; sometimes he would just say, "I can't believe this," and the girl would say, "What?" and he would say, "Well, it's just that I've been talking to you for fifteen minutes and you haven't even asked me for my number yet." He would essentially lead them into asking him for the number, and then instruct them when / how to contact him later.

...but maybe you were referring to situations where you're in a hurry and don't have time to grab her number (or don't want to deal with the entire group of girls). Without an immense amount of attraction, I see it difficult for a woman to want to contact you first. So I would only use the business card thing as a "hail mary" when you're in a hurry and you don't have time for anything else. =)

- Franco

 

[PinotNoir]

So I would only use the business card thing as a "hail mary" when you're in a hurry and you don't have time for anything else. =)

This is what I'm thinking too. For example, if you see a beautiful girl waiting for a subway train and you're about to go on a different train and your train pulls up right then, you could maybe slide over real quick, tell her she looks beautiful and may never see her again, drop your card, and then rush back into the train. This could be for any time-crunch situation like a taxi, plane, etc. -- whenever you do not even have 5 minutes to type in her phone number.

The "business card" is starting to feel a lot like leaving your number on a receipt for a waitress. Results are just too low for me. Even for a shy girl, she's going to be too shy to call you anyway. No matter what women say, women want men to lead; it's just the truth. Giving out your card is just not leading effectively enough, but if you have a time crunch or have way too much social pressure or approach anxiety, then sure.

Just do whatever works for you. If you're getting consistent dates, then do it. If you're only getting 1 date per 20 cards, it's probably not worth it. In a low populated area where gossip spreads like wildfire, this may even slightly hurt your reputation.

I say just try it and let us know. Do it 25-50 times. That should be a large enough sample size.

 

[lux7]

Luc,


Correct, it is probably more uncommon than you think. =)

After such a long back and forth, I have come to accept that as a fact .

However, consider the chances vary depending on age and on... The communications means you are using. With social networks it feels much easier on the girl's side.

Keep in mind also that things like these don't really mean anything either. In an example that I have, a girl asked for my number after kissing and nibbling on my shoulder and neck, and this was after about 30-40 minutes of conversation. I wrote down my number on a napkin and gave it to her thinking for sure this girl was going to contact me. I almost lost interest in her because it seemed too easy!

Sure enough, I never heard from her again. It left me befuddled for awhile, and tried the giving out my number a few more times to girls who were giving me strong IOI's. Never heard from there either!

Right, I'll keep that in mind, however also consider it might be because of "simple" buyer's remorse and it might have been exactly the same if you had tried to call/text her.
Of course we can't know that and it might be because she felt ashamed of doing the first step, but we can't be sure about it.

This is what I'm thinking too. For example, if you see a beautiful girl waiting for a subway train and you're about to go on a different train and your train pulls up right then, you could maybe slide over real quick, tell her she looks beautiful and may never see her again, drop your card, and then rush back into the train. This could be for any time-crunch situation like a taxi, plane, etc. -- whenever you do not even have 5 minutes to type in her phone number.

The "business card" is starting to feel a lot like leaving your number on a receipt for a waitress. Results are just too low for me. Even for a shy girl, she's going to be too shy to call you anyway. No matter what women say, women want men to lead; it's just the truth. Giving out your card is just not leading effectively enough, but if you have a time crunch or have way too much social pressure or approach anxiety, then sure.

Just do whatever works for you. If you're getting consistent dates, then do it. If you're only getting 1 date per 20 cards, it's probably not worth it. In a low populated area where gossip spreads like wildfire, this may even slightly hurt your reputation.

I say just try it and let us know. Do it 25-50 times. That should be a large enough sample size.

Exactly, (certain kinds of) groups and even more time crunch situations are the situations I was mostly thinking about (quite a few times that the girl had to jump on the tram and I didn't feel like chasing them if I didn't actually need to take it myself).

As soon as I will get a business card I will put a few in my back pocket and give it a try and I will keep you updated.