"Guy is always wrong"

[PinotNoir]

This is something I hear every now and then among my guy friends.

Guy A: "My girlfriend and I got in a fight last night. *lays out sound reasons for why he is right*"
Guy B: "You got to understand... the guy is always wrong. She is always right even if she's not. Just say sorry and move on."

I just don't like this mentality or this kind of relationship, even though it's a running gag in comedy.

In my early relationships, I was the "martyr" (like most men). Even if i was right, I would apologize and say "sorry" and try to keep the relationship smooth -- afloat like a captain saving a sinking ship.

Now, if me and a girlfriend get in an argument, I try to smooth it out of course. Talk through it. Then move to a lighter topic. However, this just isn't always the case. Sometimes, the argument will blow up, and she'll just stay in the emotional hurricane without being able to move on. So, I just give her space and then talk with her again in a couple of days. I don't apologize though if I'm actually right.

What do you guys do?

 

[trashKENNUT]

PinotNoir,

I just give her space and then talk with her again in a couple of days. I don't apologize though if I'm actually right.

What do you guys do?

You do it correctly. You don't apologize if you are right, and you don't apologize if you are wrong, UNLESS the wrong is really wrong. and that one also, you talk to her and hear her point before you apologize and leave her there for awhile, and for yourself to have some own space and think about what you did.

Most guys makes it a comedy, and behave likewise in that comedy. It is funny, because they make themselves so. There's no right or wrong in that, only choices.

Zac

 

[Franco]

Hey PN,

Good topic here, and it's something worth discussing.

What do you guys do?

One way you can apologize that has worked for me before is to apologize for how you made her feel.

For example, I had a friend that I slept with back in early November 2012 who was always kind of flirty with me, but she had a boyfriend prior to that time. We had been friends for almost a year at this point. As soon as she broke up with her boyfriend, I took her out to a football game with me, we drank a lot, ended up at her place, ended up in her bed... and well, she's attractive, so I couldn't quite help myself.

We had some hot sex, I slept over, and then I had to leave for work in the morning. I texted her the next morning that the previous day was fun, and she agreed. However, it just so turned out that I didn't see or talk to her again for about a month -- this had almost nothing to do with her and had more to do with things going on in my life. When I finally contacted her, she tried to give me drama about fucking her once and then not talking to her again; she said it made her feel like a hoe.

So instead of apologizing for the act, I apologized for the way I made her feel. I still have the text in my phone, so here's the sentence I used (in the middle of a longer paragraph):

"I am very sorry if you felt like I treated you that way because it was not my intention. I like and respect you as a person, and I wouldn't want this to affect our relationship."

This text was in the context of a longer one, but that was the main line I wanted to point out. She didn't respond to this text, so I gave her a couple of weeks to cool off, and then we hung out again (as a group with mutual friends) on New Year's weekend. If anything, she's been more affectionate and friendly since before we originally hooked up...

Anyway, the point of this post was to let you know that you can apologize for making a girl feel the way she did (and only do this if she's REALLY upset and accusing you of making her feel like used), but never apologize for the actual action unless it was something that you were obviously in the wrong about.

Just wanted to give my input. =)

- Franco

 

[PinotNoir]

apologize for how you made her feel.

I never thought of that. That is really sage advice. I'll have to remember that one.

On a side note, I haven't seen you write an article in a while; do you have any plans for putting one up? No doubt, Chase's articles are fantastic, but it's nice to have variety.

 

[Franco]

PN,

I wish I had the time and the patience to write articles. Unfortunately, it's probably not in the books for me.

That being said, Chase is recruiting a few writers that should show up on the site here soon. Keep your eyes peeled!

- Franco

 

[Chase]

Pinot-

Now, if me and a girlfriend get in an argument, I try to smooth it out of course. Talk through it. Then move to a lighter topic. However, this just isn't always the case. Sometimes, the argument will blow up, and she'll just stay in the emotional hurricane without being able to move on. So, I just give her space and then talk with her again in a couple of days. I don't apologize though if I'm actually right.

What do you guys do?

My preference for long-term relationships these days is "Win the argument."

Not just logically, but emotionally. You need to use the same tactics against her that she uses on you... it's the only way to win these.

She uses moral indignation? So do you... but MORE of it.

She uses the silent treatment? So do you... but even MORE.

Basically, you just take her position, and throw it right back at her with a stronger helping of it.

Of course, you've also got to be fine walking away if need be. When I've had blow ups like these, very frequently I thought the relationship was over, because the girl wasn't going to apologize, and *I* certainly wasn't going to apologize, but that was fine for me, because I'd be saying, "Great! Now I can more easily get a move on and go hit up some cities and countries I haven't seen yet and sleep with a lot of pretty girls in exotic locales." And then the girl would come back after a while and apologize and say she didn't mean it and she was just kidding and why did I have to be so mean. And I'd say are you kidding? I was just minding my own business and suddenly you were attacking and accusing me! And then she'd say sorry, she wouldn't do it again, but could I be nicer? And I'd say what, you mean like I shouldn't say the kinds of things to you that you said to me? And she says, well, she's a WOMAN and her feelings are more sensitive than mine are! And I'd just laugh and it'd be back to normal.

Be aware that if you run your relationships this way, you will gradually come to dominate the woman, instead of the woman dominating you as happens in most guys' relationships. That may sound ideal, but sometimes it can lead to women becoming a little TOO dependent on and submissive to you... there's no easy fix.

The longer a relationship goes on, the more one of you is going to end up in the dependent/submissive position, unfortunately.

Chase

 

[Captain CornontheCob]

Pinot-

Now, if me and a girlfriend get in an argument, I try to smooth it out of course. Talk through it. Then move to a lighter topic. However, this just isn't always the case. Sometimes, the argument will blow up, and she'll just stay in the emotional hurricane without being able to move on. So, I just give her space and then talk with her again in a couple of days. I don't apologize though if I'm actually right.

What do you guys do?

My preference for long-term relationships these days is "Win the argument."

Not just logically, but emotionally. You need to use the same tactics against her that she uses on you... it's the only way to win these.

She uses moral indignation? So do you... but MORE of it.

She uses the silent treatment? So do you... but even MORE.

Basically, you just take her position, and throw it right back at her with a stronger helping of it.

Of course, you've also got to be fine walking away if need be. When I've had blow ups like these, very frequently I thought the relationship was over, because the girl wasn't going to apologize, and *I* certainly wasn't going to apologize, but that was fine for me, because I'd be saying, "Great! Now I can more easily get a move on and go hit up some cities and countries I haven't seen yet and sleep with a lot of pretty girls in exotic locales." And then the girl would come back after a while and apologize and say she didn't mean it and she was just kidding and why did I have to be so mean. And I'd say are you kidding? I was just minding my own business and suddenly you were attacking and accusing me! And then she'd say sorry, she wouldn't do it again, but could I be nicer? And I'd say what, you mean like I shouldn't say the kinds of things to you that you said to me? And she says, well, she's a WOMAN and her feelings are more sensitive than mine are! And I'd just laugh and it'd be back to normal.

Be aware that if you run your relationships this way, you will gradually come to dominate the woman, instead of the woman dominating you as happens in most guys' relationships. That may sound ideal, but sometimes it can lead to women becoming a little TOO dependent on and submissive to you... there's no easy fix.

The longer a relationship goes on, the more one of you is going to end up in the dependent/submissive position, unfortunately.

Chase

Whoa, tight but hey Chase could you elaborate more on this in like a blog post or something, I kind of get it but maybe examples would help me or others if they don't understand more fully. Also I am confused, does this mean if she calls me names I call her worse names back, anything she verbally throws at me I throw more at her? Seems counterproductive, won't she resent me instead?
Also, another question what if a women tries to fight you, throws dangerous objects at you, I would just bear hug her( like you would a child) until she calms down or should I run away?
Thanks for the post.

 

[trashKENNUT]

Everyone,

Whoa, tight but hey Chase could you elaborate more on this in like a blog post or something, I kind of get it but maybe examples would help me or others if they don't understand more fully. Also I am confused, does this mean if she calls me names I call her worse names back, anything she verbally throws at me I throw more at her? Seems counterproductive, won't she resent me instead?
Also, another question what if a women tries to fight you, throws dangerous objects at you, I would just bear hug her( like you would a child) until she calms down or should I run away?
Thanks for the post.

I have to agree with Chase, although he is more likely to make the girl work harder when she do negative things like calling names or throw verbal abuse. This is what i am likely to do, too.

Unfortunately there will be someone will always be playing the one down position. and i understand more now why giving her what she wants (in a occasional basis) is an important thing. Practically you have to let people have their own lifes, and accept that people are going to feel down at times, and feel insecure. You have to not letting them run your life.

I guess it is just the way it is. You cannot really please everybody, even her as well. It goes back to an article Chase and myself discuss in an old post on the stages of desire. IT is this one, viewtopic.php?f=6&t=41

So many thoughts, hope this does not detracts.

Zac

 

[Chase]

Captain-

Whoa, tight but hey Chase could you elaborate more on this in like a blog post or something, I kind of get it but maybe examples would help me or others if they don't understand more fully.

One or more of these most likely has what you need - mostly similar ground being covered here:

• Women and Drama
• Operant Conditioning in Your Romantic Relationships

Also I am confused, does this mean if she calls me names I call her worse names back, anything she verbally throws at me I throw more at her? Seems counterproductive, won't she resent me instead?

Don't call her names. Just insist she explain herself. When women do this to me (and they're very angry), I say, "Explain. Stop - explain yourself right now. You're calling me a [whatever] - you need to explain to me why I am this. Explain it to me." Just keep insisting that she explain until she does. This calms her down and forces her to think more logically - she's now got to make an argument instead of just labeling you - and you can address her argument and get to the crux of the issue.

Also, another question what if a women tries to fight you, throws dangerous objects at you, I would just bear hug her( like you would a child) until she calms down or should I run away?
Thanks for the post.

I've never had a woman throw a "dangerous object" at me or try to hit me, but I imagine that'd be grounds for immediate dissolution of the relationship. Actually, I'd kick her out first - "Time for you to go" - or leave myself, if it's her place - "I'm out of here" - and then NOT contact her for several days. The reason for this waiting period is to let her cool off emotionally and avoid any extreme reactions from her (e.g., her calling the police to tell them you beat her, or raped her, or assaulted her, or whatever).

Then talk to her and tell her it's time for this relationship to be over because it isn't healthy.

Chase

 

[trashKENNUT]

BUMP!

 

[Thedoctor]

I'm surprised this article hasn't come up in these replies yet:

https://www.girlschase.com/content/shoul ... gize-women

-Doc

 

[Just_Dave]

To kind of build off of everyone else and throw my own two cents in, I normally have the girl explain herself and then if she can't give me a solid answer I just laugh and say "This argument makes no sense." It knocks her off her train of thinking. I then reestablish the "Team Frame" and tell her "All this arguing is doing neither of us any good, instead of fighting we need to work together. That's the only way we're going to make the relationship work." From there give both of you sometime to relax and cool off. Being a doormat in a relationship blows, besides you're a man and show her you're the man in the relationship. If she doesn't like your rules than she can leave.

Just Dave out!

 

[Whizzy]

To kind of build off of everyone else and throw my own two cents in, I normally have the girl explain herself and then if she can't give me a solid answer I just laugh and say "This argument makes no sense." It knocks her off her train of thinking. I then reestablish the "Team Frame" and tell her "All this arguing is doing neither of us any good, instead of fighting we need to work together. That's the only way we're going to make the relationship work." From there give both of you sometime to relax and cool off. Being a doormat in a relationship blows, besides you're a man and show her you're the man in the relationship. If she doesn't like your rules than she can leave.

Just Dave out!

I fully agree with Dave and others here. Many times the girl admits she was being overtly emotional later on and respects the guy a lot more for not giving in like everyone else in her life may

 

[Longshanks]

My last girlfriend reinforced Chase's teachings to me. I pissed her off once by doing something mildly dickish/indelicate. I apologized right away and tried to smooth things over, but I didn't really understand why she was so upset in the first place. It seemed to work, but then next weekend at another party, she reported the whole story to a male friend of hers. I met her after the party, and she said that her friend's response was to take her side. It upset me that she was sharing negative things about me to this guy, because it seemed like it was a move away from our relationship, and I thought she'd moved past the incident. This time, I took the time to draw her out, to find out what she was feeling. I finally realized why my initial misstep had struck such a nerve with her; I still felt like she had overreacted, but I could at least tell her I was sorry I had made her feel bad. Then she told me, "I don't always want you to apologize right away. I want you to think about it first, to understand who is right and who is wrong. And also, to try to understand me. "

Apologizing right away, regardless of whether you feel in the right or not, shows a lack of spine. I panicked because I'd never really had to deal with a girl crying b/c of something I'd done (other than a break-up, which is what I feared!). Don't rushing to smooth things over at all costs. She'll see what you are doing, and it looks weak. Women like men to be able to handle them when they have a (inevitable) meltdown.

Apologizing right away also says you didn't take the time to think/listen/draw her out. An insult is one thing, but it's an injury if you also imply that you care less about understanding her than you do about having her shut up. This is a great way to put a girl either into autorejection or very deep into one-down-ness.