How Do Women React When Made Aware of Their Preferences/Criteria?

[CassieDon]

Generally speaking, has anyone ever found that when it comes to the topic of how people choose their partners, there seem to be 2 types of women?

1. Ones who are aware of how they choose men
2. Ones who are unaware of how they choose men

(Choose = date/relationship etc anything beyond friendzone)

#1 is aware that looks/status/money/personality comes into it their selection process and how much each variable is weighted e.g. looks could be more weighted than personality and #2 is not. That's not to say it is fixed, of course, things can change- but this is first impressions, where certain types will have it easier.

The interesting part: if you bring it to the attention of women that fall under #1, they don't mind and you could even have a chat about why certain men and not others. Yet, if you bring it to women that fall under #2, they dislike this being brought to their attention - even if their dating history indicates it.

Why is this?

I appreciate there is the notion of them feeling judged as if they are closing off a section of prospects. Or it contradicts the viewpoint that a connection "just happens".

This could be a scenario where you don't bring the scientific approach into something, but I was curious what you chaps would think since you have likely dealt with this scenario and perhaps know why this would be the case.

IMHO, there is no shame in wanting what you want. But, at the same time, I can't help but think I'm seeing this from a very male perspective.

What do you guys think?

 

[trashKENNUT]

This could be a scenario where you don't bring the scientific approach into something, but I was curious what you chaps would think since you have likely dealt with this scenario and perhaps know why this would be the case

There was 2 females.

My high school crush and I really liked each other, but she just could not. I was in the boyfriend zone, and she already has a boyfriend.

i explain this phenomenon before. This is very very outlier.

The second one.

She knew that she had a crush on me and actually like me, But she was adamant about what she wants. A guy who is deemed slightly more successful (career wise).

I had a friend whom I convinced to TROLL her and she was really really angry after many silences.

TLDR: It's complicated to explain it in short, but if you are able to see what I see, from my post here, you gotta have a laugh at women. There's too many stories.

I do laugh at women sometimes. It's kinda funny. It's like being a director, knowing how the show series plays and how it ends.

z@c+

 

[Chase]

@CassieDon,

Different cultures have different mate selection criteria that are considered socially acceptable, and others that are not.

Some people are more concerned about public face and will deny to others and themselves that certain factors impact their mate selection. Other people are less concerned with maintaining face in public, or have such strong preferences that it isn’t practical denying them, so will admit to unacceptable or less acceptable criteria.

Some of the things people in American society, for instance, are not “supposed” to factor into their mate selection:

• Looks
• Age (men choosing women only)
• Fatness (below obesity)
• Endowments (breasts, butt, & penis size)
• Previous romantic history (“The past doesn’t matter”)
• Reproductive history (abortions, preexisting children, etc.)
• Bedroom performance (women choosing men only)
• Financial prospects/wealth
• Socioeconomic status
• Race / ethnicity
• National origin
• Genetic issues (e.g., family history of heritable disease)

Among certain crowds, transsexuality is also supposed to be a non-factor. e.g., if you only want to date a biological male/female, that is shameful/bigoted.

In many other parts of the world, particularly outside the West, people are open about these criteria because there is no culture of shaming people for romantic preferences, and everyone around them more or less shares those preferences.

In the West though, there are many things you aren’t “supposed” to consider when selecting a mate, and unless you’re one of those people who is independent-minded (or, alternately, socially oblivious) enough to not care, you aren’t going to want to be accused of having “unacceptable” mate choice criteria.

Other things that ARE supposed to heavily influence your mate selection in the West but most people do not really care nearly as much about as they do other qualities include things like:

• Kindness / selflessness / goodness
• Being on the “right” side politically
• “Everything s/he’s done for me”
• Approval from friends
• Public image

If you ask a #1 person (male or female) whether he or she cares about such things, the answer will be an emphatic “Of course! More than anything else!”

The #2 person will tell you, “Maybe a bit, some of those things, but most of them, eh, not really.”

Ever notice how often people who say they want to date really KIND people end up with schizos and psychopaths? I’ve noticed it…

Chase

 

[Will_V]

Generally speaking, has anyone ever found that when it comes to the topic of how people choose their partners, there seem to be 2 types of women?

1. Ones who are aware of how they choose men
2. Ones who are unaware of how they choose men

(Choose = date/relationship etc anything beyond friendzone)

#1 is aware that looks/status/money/personality comes into it their selection process and how much each variable is weighted e.g. looks could be more weighted than personality and #2 is not. That's not to say it is fixed, of course, things can change- but this is first impressions, where certain types will have it easier.

The interesting part: if you bring it to the attention of women that fall under #1, they don't mind and you could even have a chat about why certain men and not others. Yet, if you bring it to women that fall under #2, they dislike this being brought to their attention - even if their dating history indicates it.

Why is this?

I appreciate there is the notion of them feeling judged as if they are closing off a section of prospects. Or it contradicts the viewpoint that a connection "just happens".

This could be a scenario where you don't bring the scientific approach into something, but I was curious what you chaps would think since you have likely dealt with this scenario and perhaps know why this would be the case.

IMHO, there is no shame in wanting what you want. But, at the same time, I can't help but think I'm seeing this from a very male perspective.

What do you guys think?

The only thing I can say is that older women tend to be more clear about preferences since they are necessarily more practical about things. They also interrogate a lot more.

Other than that I've found women to be more interested in knowing what I want to hear than telling me what they prefer (if they are even aware of it). Not to say they don't have distinct biases, but I don't think they generally enjoy being conscious of them, probably because choice implies responsibility.

 

[trashKENNUT]

In many other parts of the world, particularly outside the West, people are open about these criteria because there is no culture of shaming people for romantic preferences, and everyone around them more or less shares those preferences.

There is. It's just not visible.

'Kuala Lumpur Muslims vs Malaysia Muslims'.
Two parallel realities that exist in Singapore, Malaysia, Indonesia, India.

Canada Muslims, Britain Muslims, Sweden Muslims would probably have this. But I'm assuming. Limited knowledge on it.

In order for men to solve Woke-ism, East (unquantifiable/non literal/non linear) must really meet West (quantifiable/literal/linear).

Damn

z@c+

 

[CassieDon]

Some good replies.

Though surely looking through their dating history, you'll be able to identify a pattern?

@Chase The idea of saving face came to mind, but I'm unsure save face from whom, Western society's virtues, myself as the asker, or who they think they are (in contrast with who they really are)?

In some ways it comes down to fear of judgement.

Another avenue is, does the opinion of the person asking the question matter? Would we get different results from person #2, maybe #1 if different people asked the question?

 

[Chase]

@CassieDon,

@Chase The idea of saving face came to mind, but I'm unsure save face from whom, Western society's virtues, myself as the asker, or who they think they are (in contrast with who they really are)?

It may be any of the above.

If you ask in an especially gentle, circumspect way, that does not make it seem like you are judging her or trying to 'expose' her, you may find her more willing to admit to some less polite preference if she is really just worried about you or society judging her.

If it's herself, and she's in straight denial about her own preferences, it won't matter how you ask, because she's just in denial.

Another avenue is, does the opinion of the person asking the question matter? Would we get different results from person #2, maybe #1 if different people asked the question?

See my answer above.

If she knows you don't care, and it's anything other than denial, you may get the honest response here.

If she thinks you're going to judge her though, you're going to get a fake answer from most women.

The more judgmental you seem to be, the more women will conceal things from you... some women being more paranoid or self-conscious than others, of course.

Chase

 

[CassieDon]

@CassieDon,



It may be any of the above.

If you ask in an especially gentle, circumspect way, that does not make it seem like you are judging her or trying to 'expose' her, you may find her more willing to admit to some less polite preference if she is really just worried about you or society judging her.

If it's herself, and she's in straight denial about her own preferences, it won't matter how you ask, because she's just in denial.



See my answer above.

If she knows you don't care, and it's anything other than denial, you may get the honest response here.

If she thinks you're going to judge her though, you're going to get a fake answer from most women.

The more judgmental you seem to be, the more women will conceal things from you... some women being more paranoid or self-conscious than others, of course.

Chase

@Chase Good points, I reckon that probably hits the nail in the head, especially the part where they will feel "exposed", which works hand-in-hand with saving face.

Though, I suppose, if speaking to a guy about it, I suppose with some women becoming self-conscious/paranoid makes you wonder why. If a girl is blunt about it and the guy does not meet the criteria, this is a scenario that makes sense. Especially when the guy points out their preferences and/or highlights their track record with said preference since the guy's opinion makes no material difference to the woman's dating life or her life in general.

What becomes interesting is the same outcome is true for women that will become self-conscious/paranoid to men who point this out and/or cite their track record -- even men that do not meet the requirement (either will never meet it or do not meet it at a given point in time). This is a scenario that makes no sense. Do the women like the men and not want them to self disqualify based on this pattern? Especially if they won't match the pattern, or if they will eventually match the pattern? Or is the potential "settle choice" passing or their preferences are changing?

I suppose the rationale of the paranoia doesn't make sense. Depending on don't he "who" it makes sense. But since this is a seduction forum, I thought I would make it relevant in terms of would it have any application to seduction, and is it something men can use,or avoid? (In both scenarios; one where the woman is firm and the other where she goes 'mad')

 

[Chase]

@CassieDon,

What becomes interesting is the same outcome is true for women that will become self-conscious/paranoid to men who point this out and/or cite their track record -- even men that do not meet the requirement (either will never meet it or do not meet it at a given point in time). This is a scenario that makes no sense. Do the women like the men and not want them to self disqualify based on this pattern? Especially if they won't match the pattern, or if they will eventually match the pattern? Or is the potential "settle choice" passing or their preferences are changing?

I suppose the rationale of the paranoia doesn't make sense. Depending on don't he "who" it makes sense. But since this is a seduction forum, I thought I would make it relevant in terms of would it have any application to seduction, and is it something men can use,or avoid? (In both scenarios; one where the woman is firm and the other where she goes 'mad')

If something seems to not make sense, it should be a signal to you that there is something there you're missing.

In the case of women's rationale, well, think of it like this:

You're talking to a fat girl. You're not sexually attracted to her. She feels you out to see if you want to go back to her place, but you decline.​

​

"It's because you like skinny girls, right?" she says. "Admit it. You choose women who are skinny. It's okay. You can just be honest."​

​

If you're like most guys, you are going to feel REALLY awkward telling her to her face, "Yeap, you're right, I don't wanna bang you cause you're fat."​

Why can't you just be honest?

You aren't into her. There is no rational motive for you to conceal your preferences. Or is there?

Human socializing is not a binary switch, like, "Either we're going to get together or we're not going to get together. If we're not going to get together, then nothing I say or do matters, because this person is completely irrelevant to me in all ways and can never impact my life."

This girl might have friends. She might become your enemy if you insult her pride. She might attack you when you turn your back, or cockblock you with a girl you DO want out of bitterness.

It is far better if you tell her, "No, it's not that, but our personalities really are not clicking, and I need a certain something to run off into the night with a girl." That limits the fallout from a bad interaction and allows her to leave with face more or less intact.

There are a lot of potential downsides to just dumping your raw, unfiltered rationale onto someone, with the upsides frequently being nil.

It is not irrational for people to choose not to open up their inner hearts to strangers they aren't interested in, possibly (even probably, I would say) opening themselves up to angry blowback and later interference into their affairs in revenge, or worse.

Instead, it is rational: a protective measure that limits enemies by not handing over information that might cause others to resent you.

Chase

 

[CassieDon]

@Chase

That makes quite a lot of sense. Though, the impression I get — feel free to correct me if I understood wrong — the notion is for men/women to let the other person down gently without tarnishing their self-worth by providing their unfiltered view. Especially when you think you're being "real" or "alpha" not realising that's going to likely mess up your "cred" or chances.

I speculated about two possibilities that I wanted to get your views on.

The first possibility is what you outlined about bitter women spoiling your chances with women you do like (re the other side some bitter men may do this or maybe go stalk or do things we shouldn't do like be in the friend/bro zone etc).

There was an additional scenario I had in mind when typing my reply is perhaps a glorified shit test. Where for some reason despite some reason a guy piqued a woman's interest (building an emotional connection and setting boundaries to avoid friendzone). However, probably this is not the case with person #1 in my case hence the honesty. This is likely with person #2* hence they dislike the idea of someone like this disqualifying themselves. Either that, or they see someone like this eventually "growing" into matching their usual type, their dating preferences are shifting, or the chap has is unique in some way relative to her.

The odds of the additional scenario, I imagine are a lot lower than average unless you're a certain type of guy, I imagine.

*excluding cases where they want to hold onto fairy tale notions that love "just happens" etc.

 

[Chase]

@CassieDon,

Though, the impression I get — feel free to correct me if I understood wrong — the notion is for men/women to let the other person down gently without tarnishing their self-worth by providing their unfiltered view.

Right.

Most people don't react well to raw, unfiltered truth.

Further, most people do not actually KNOW the raw, unfiltered truth. What is the REAL reason she rejected you?

You will most often have situations like this:

1. She tells you she's rejecting you because she "doesn't feel a spark"
2. She thinks to herself it's really because you hold views she finds offensive and the two of you have nothing in common
3. Meanwhile the most powerful underlying reason is you failed a few tests of hers and weren't able to hold frame

She has no idea your inability to hold frame is the most important reason she lost interest in you. Neither what she tells you nor what she tells herself is the truth, because the truth is something that operates at a level lower than her conscious awareness.

So there is literally no value in her telling you 'the truth'. The truth she would tell you isn't even true, and it would alienate you / piss you off / stir up a lot of potential trouble with you, to boot.

The things people will tell you they value in mates tend to be just a fraction of what they care about, or even total bunkum much of the time. You may have a girl you think is really aware and honest, a #1 girl, because she admits she cares about a man's looks and wealth, then catch up with her two years later and find she's dating a guy of average looks and means. Why's she with him? I thought she was into looks and wealth! Well, it turns out he has some personality characteristics she finds attractive she could ill have defined to you when asked, but she just likes those characteristics (and, hence, also likes, and dates, the man).

There was an additional scenario I had in mind when typing my reply is perhaps a glorified shit test. Where for some reason despite some reason a guy piqued a woman's interest (building an emotional connection and setting boundaries to avoid friendzone). However, probably this is not the case with person #1 in my case hence the honesty. This is likely with person #2* hence they dislike the idea of someone like this disqualifying themselves. Either that, or they see someone like this eventually "growing" into matching their usual type, their dating preferences are shifting, or the chap has is unique in some way relative to her.

I think you're asking, "What if I ask a girl if looks are important to her, and she denies this because I'm not good-looking and she likes me and doesn't want to disqualify me by implying she thinks looks are important?"

That will happen.

When I was still a beginner, I used to stumble into situations where I would imply women liked some quality I did not have in spades, and girls would then start insisting they didn't really care about that.

At which point I would realize, "Goddamn it, I just made this girl start trying to protect my ego," which of course is pushing you into nice guy territory.

You do not usually want to be in a position where women are denying preferences to try to not have you disqualify yourself, unless you are doing it in a really cool, savvy, self-deprecating way... though if you can do it that way, it can be great:

YOU: Oh come on. I know girls really love guys with six-pack abs. Poor me with my belly fat, I'll never have a chance!​

​

HER: Not all girls like that. I can't stand six packs. They're so hard and uncomfortable. I'll take a little belly fat any day.​

​

YOU: Now that's my kind of girl. Maybe there's a future for us after all. But wait... do YOU have a six pack?​

Chase