How to deal with the bitchy obstacle friend?!

[Landlord]

Last night met HB8 blonde lawyer in a bar, nice chat....decided to move her to another part of the bar and isolate her.

Had met her girlfriends and exchanged names but as HB9 was in between me and them, didn't build any rapport with them. When I tried to move her, the obstacle protested wouldn't let her go...I promised to have her back in 2 minutes and led her away by the hand.

This girl was really into me, we had a great conversation, I went in for a kiss, she protested, I insisted, she gave me a strong, aggressive kiss/....she even 'apologized' for being so aggressive. Within 20 seconds, obstacle grabs her hand and drags her away.

HB9 immediately changes tone...says "you had your chance" and gives me her back walking away. I wait, go to the bathroom, then pursue. Ask for the number, she says "I would rather take yours, I want to be in control." I make a joke about that, put my number in her phone, then ring myself. She gives me shit about that. Will try to follow up, but not expecting any response.

A great interaction with a girl which included a kiss close and a number close was spoiled because I didn't handle the friend right....
I got lazy on this one.
Let's discuss ideas and tactics for managing antagonistic obstacles in night game!

 

[Sly]

I'd love some new ideas on this topic too.

My two moves are usually incorporating my wing into distracting the cockblock or like you did escalating and isolating quick enough so that the cockblock cannot protest. Obviously you can't use the first technique if you're solo and the second technique will only work if you're good enough to captivate the girl's attention right away. There's gotta be other ways out there...

I too hate it when girls are literally pulled away from you with their friends. I've had numerous girls really into me but their friend for some reason feels like they have the authority to just pull them away from the conversation. As well, just a couple nights ago I was talking up a couple girls who were definitely into the convo, when their third ugly friend pulls one of them in and I see her mouth EWWW. I know staying unphased in a situation like this is my best bet, but I hate it when women regardless of their looks, whether they're a 1 or a 10, act superior and just blatantly rude. Lets just say I didn't let that one slide...

Another interesting example I had some time ago was out on the dance floor of a club. I was about to approach a looker when I noticed her not-so-attractive friend warn her I was coming to speak to her. As I approached the both of them, the ugly friend spoke for the hot one and "she doesn't want to talk to you!" At that moment I decided to try something out. I told the ugly girl I was interested in her and not her friend. She was shocked, like mouth wide open! She responded to me "noo way- everyone wants her and not me!" Once I repeated I was there for her, she was sooo nice. Moral of the story: Ugly girls hanging out with HBs feel left out.

So I too like Landlord wonder how to deal with rude, sour, bitchy friends?

 

[Landlord]

great reply Sly. As usual.

 

[Tyme2k]

"What do you think a person with aids thinks when they see "the deadliest catch" on tv? They're probably like wow... crabs?"

When the ugly friend didn't laugh, I said, "Ooooo I'm sorry. You must have aids huh.."

Bam, gave the ugly friend aids. She had no chance.

This was one instance I found extremely amusing, went on to make out with the hot friend, onto 3 dates, failed escalation, auto-rejection.. Boo hoo cry me a river.

Some RSD pros will get extremely territorial saying things like,"back off bitch shes mine now." This can lead to a tug of war match though.

Another strat is to turn the hot friend against her friend,"Are you gonna let her ruin you being happy?" "Does she try to ruin your night everytime?" "Are you the type of girl that let's others tell her what to do?" "If you're having a good time you need to handle your friend"

I think the best way is to befriend the girls as a group and pretty much become a solid figure in the group. They will trust you later when other chodes try to pull. ALex RSD method, spend the most time with the girl/group then isolate and escalate.

 

[Landlord]

yeah in my experience, i did not invest in the group AT ALL.
good news is, once extracted from the cockblocker, HB and I are texting, going to meet her soon.

 

[NarrowJ]

My issue is usually "dealing with fattie"... you know, the ugly overweight girl in the group that is pissed because her good-looking friends are being hit on.

I find that most women (at least around here, anyway) will pretty much leave their friends to decide if they go home with a guy, and/or who they go home with. I see a lot of women on facebook posting shit to other girl's walls like "hey let's go be hot mess sluts this weekend!" lol... of course most of the women I hang with are anywhere from 21-25 or so.

I assume, this woman being an attorney, she is at least 28 or so and her group probably in that same age range or possibly older?

 

[NarrowJ]

I'd love some new ideas on this topic too.
Another interesting example I had some time ago was out on the dance floor of a club. I was about to approach a looker when I noticed her not-so-attractive friend warn her I was coming to speak to her. As I approached the both of them, the ugly friend spoke for the hot one and "she doesn't want to talk to you!" At that moment I decided to try something out. I told the ugly girl I was interested in her and not her friend. She was shocked, like mouth wide open! She responded to me "noo way- everyone wants her and not me!" Once I repeated I was there for her, she was sooo nice. Moral of the story: Ugly girls hanging out with HBs feel left out.

Hahahaha this ^^^

 

[Chase]

I'm doing a post on preventing and dealing with cockblocking up on the main site soon.

Meantime-

This girl was really into me, we had a great conversation, I went in for a kiss, she protested, I insisted, she gave me a strong, aggressive kiss/....she even 'apologized' for being so aggressive. Within 20 seconds, obstacle grabs her hand and drags her away.

One of the all-time leading things that prompts friends to drag their other friends away from you is doing something explicitly sexual with their friends in eyeshot. Killed me more times than I could count starting out... make out with the girl, then BOOM! she's gone, dragged off by friends. If the friends are REALLY nice, and take a shine to you, they'll let you finish the make out, then say goodbye... and THEN they'll drag her off.

About the only friends I found to be fine with me making out with their girlfriends in front of them and didn't cockblock were the ones who were extremely liberal and were used to hooking up and watching their friend hook up (or, they really, really wanted their friend to get laid because they think she's too stiff and/or because she just came out of a relationship and they want her to rebound).

Once girls start kissing guys they've just met in public, their friends tend to start policing them like hawks. If you must kiss her in public, it's better to make absolutely sure you're somewhere that no one who knows her will see it, to prevent them from switching into cockblock mode and becoming vigilant about protecting their friend from "making a mistake."

Chase

 

[Landlord]

Follow up on this... I DID get the lawyer's number, and we did exchange great flirtatious banter for a while.
Never went out with her, b/c the guy she was 'sort of seeing' apparently agreed to whatever she was asking for from him at the time.
I suspect she'll be back at some point.

but Damn, wouldn't you know I had the same kind of thing happen to me this week?!
Approached a 2 set HB9's (latinas!) in a bar in New York city. I was with a big gang of friends, they were a couple of table over.
Originally liked HB9-a, but after a brief chat, changed my mind to HB9-b who was physically closer, made better eye contact and had a cute Venezuelan accent.
All was going well until Bitchy Obstacle friend-7 came along.

I screwed up in TWO ways with BO-7:
1. I bought the girls a round "in exchange for" HB9-a lending me her phone charger previously... but since BO-7's margarita glass was nearly full, I topped her off from our pitcher, while the HB0's were drinking Sangria, so I sent a round over. BO7 kind of complained about it, which I ignored...(should have given her shit about it to make her feel wanted)

2. At one point the four of us were talking about eyes...After I complimented HB9b's blue eyes, HB9-a (brown eyed) suggested I check out BO7's. I did, they were also nice, and I did compliment them. In retrospect I should have noticed how much she lit up about that. I didn't pay much attention to that, alienating her further.

Long story short, within an hour (during which I went back to their table to chat several times) BO-7 was in full on bitch mode—telling me (loudly) that I was annoying them, saying I was a dirty old man, etc.(they were early 20's, I'm 42). HB9-a joined in the fray supporting BO7 and being bitchy—whereas she originally was the most flirty of them, vying for my attention against HB9-b. ONLY HB9b (with whom I had built the most rapport by far) continued to be warm and friendly,—I'm certain I could have number closed her if I could have separated her)


DAMN, so many lessons to learn here!
This is a really sophisticated art to learn...how to balance the friends when you're really interested in just one of them.
If one does NOT do it correctly, it seems for SURE the BO will ruin everything.
It's like they can't stand to see their "friend" having a good time/getting attention so they "rescue" them and turn them against you!

 

[Chase]

Landlord-

Forgot to link to it here earlier, but ended up writing that article up: How to Stop a Cockblock (Without Breaking a Sweat).

Note on what you posted above-

Long story short, within an hour (during which I went back to their table to chat several times) BO-7 was in full on bitch mode—telling me (loudly) that I was annoying them, saying I was a dirty old man, etc.(they were early 20's, I'm 42). HB9-a joined in the fray supporting BO7 and being bitchy—whereas she originally was the most flirty of them, vying for my attention against HB9-b. ONLY HB9b (with whom I had built the most rapport by far) continued to be warm and friendly,—I'm certain I could have number closed her if I could have separated her)

This is a no-no in effective pickups - unless you've got an extraordinarily valid reason for flitting about (i.e., you manage the bar you're at, or you're hosting a gala there and must circulate amongst the rest of the folks, etc.), you don't want to break away and come back again more than once. More than that, and it becomes annoying - it took me years of doing it to realize there was almost no scenario in which this didn't make things go downhill fast. It's generally called "social butterflying," and it doesn't really do too much for you in any department.

If you find a girl you like, you want to zero in on her until you've gotten where you wanted to get with her - phone number, extraction, pull, etc. If you can't afford to stay long, tell her as much and grab her number, rather than repeatedly pinging her and looking like you can't pull the trigger.

When thinking about what causes the annoyance here: I think it slots you into "Jester" territory on that sprezzatura chart (from Sprezzatura Effort and Investing); you're putting in lots of work (coming, going, resuming conversation, leaving conversation, re-resuming it, etc.) but getting little return for it (nothing much tangible has happened - you haven't move the girl, gotten her phone number, gotten much deep conversation going on, or really escalated things in any meaningful way). Meanwhile, they've mostly been sitting around relaxing while you've been putting in work to continue coming over and visiting, then leaving, then coming back around again. You start looking unattractive / ineffective because of it.

The solution is to hit it out of the park when you're there, and wrap up what you need to before you leave the first or, at most, second time.

Chase

 

[Landlord]

Noticed and read the article (and related) this morning in fact, Chase...thanks for the link.

"I'm FAMOUS!"

You're right about the flitting in and out / Jester thing.
I was totally having fun, hanging out with my friends and dropping in on occasionally, but there was no progression.
I can't even remember learning anything more about them after the initial exchange.

 

[trashKENNUT]

- it took me years of doing it to realize there was almost no scenario in which this didn't make things go downhill fast. It's generally called "social butterflying," and it doesn't really do too much for you in any department.

Cool stuff, Chase. I read this. It's relevant to me. PEople don't like so much "social butterflying". It's too much when you come back to them for too many times.

Zac

 

[Chase]

Landlord / Zac-

Just put up a T/T post on social butterflying here.

Chase

 

[trashKENNUT]

BUMP

 

[Dr. Manhattan]

I find it's usually a mutual annoyance & can be used as such...

The girl you're vibing with is usually looking at her friend like... "O.O bro... what are you doing?" & you can give her the :/ sigh which lets her know you'd love to just be with her... it also builds a one to one communication through non-verbals.

Go get em' tiger!

Doc

 

[jakesykes949]

Befriend the friend. This is one of the most important mindset shifts I ever had.

Yes, nobody likes a bitchy friend - but think of yourself as a "sigma male" moreso than an "alpha male."

Alpha males are bound to a single social circle/structure, and have very little mobility because of that.

Sigma males can enter and exit multiple social circles, and still rise to the top, much like an alpha.

Think of a sigma male as a wandering or mobile alpha male, who can attract multiple women, from multiple circles.

So, the key to infiltrating/entering this "circle" so to speak, is befriending her bitchy friend. Kill her with kindness.

 

[trashKENNUT]

Befriend the friend. This is one of the most important mindset shifts I ever had.

Half True. If she is an asshole, she's an asshole. You just bring the fight to the forefront. If the tribe is an idiot, run. There's deeper problems. Just ask Chase Amante. No I am kidding. But he noted something of a girl who is beautiful and a social circle who behind her back says that she deserves better.

Thanks to your post, that Chase's comment reaffirms my point of view, that you have to face things head on.

The manipulation is the belief that they won't be bitchy. So yea, The world is not built on niceness. Good honest people had to kill a lot of idiots along the way.

Zac