Socializing I feel guilty... what can I do to stop this feeling?

[Nicko]

tl;dr I denied sex from a girl who was a virgin and had little experience with guys( 3 bfs and hasn't lost her V) she wanted me to sleep with her. I denied the sex because she wanted this to be a relationship.. She admits of wanting me for her self and i refused to do so on her terms.. i figured it was best to not sleep with her and not meet her again to prevent her from becoming really attached to me. She said she is 8/10 attached to me. I feel really shit for doing this to her because now she is emotionally distressed and her eyes was all teary as we parted ways on the train

I made a mistake on escalating her and stopping just before sex was about to happen and i regret it that she is now emotional distressed because of me.. as she has told me stuff that she only have told 2 people in this world... Obviously she really likes me.

She was such an innocent girl, who read twilight and expected a happy ending with us.. i can't it really grips my heart,

Am i over thinking this? what happens when we meet again because there is a real likelihood that we both go to the city and she works there where i often cold approach? i just don't know how to proceed and this was my first time pulling a girl home and escalating this far

prior:

i pulled her home with plausible deniability and i started escalating on her in my bed room,

She objected me to escalating with ''if you want to continue further it has to be a relationship'' of sort

Then took it easy and took 2 steps back and we ended up cuddling in bed, we talked. She picked up that i was kinda annoyed which was true lol)

we went back and forth escalating like making out then went back to talking.. as she typically softly put her hand around my head and pull me for a kiss while playing with my hair.

We talked mainly about the objection she was having '' a relationship'' and more random sexual topics and then i completely forgot she was a virgin as she then told me... she kept pulling me in for a kiss and escalating on me instead as i just stopped all together to think how to get this lay..

i threw in a hail marry that im: im not looking for a relationship, im looking for something casual and if you would like to leave you can''

because all the other verbal stuff said didn't work like ''i won't make you do anything your uncomfortable with'' ect.

Its not because she wasn't aroused i think as she was biting her lips and escalating me like getting closer to me in bed and pulling me in gently for a kiss and ect. But it was a genuine objection

She just kept escalating and i responded back in return without thinking again as we were making out, and eventually took having her bra off and her dress... on the agreement that it was on my terms of a one night stand.. she kepts saying she wanted to meet again...I look down and it was only her shorts left

suddenly it really hit me that hurting a gal like this for my selfish pleasure from a virgin is not ok. I can't take her virginity like this. I went against my sexual instincts.

She admitted while i was taking her bra off that she didn't want to leave the house because of me.. i was in a dilemma of preventing from hurting this girl..

I stopped all together, knowing for the best it was better to leave this girl alone, don't sleep with her

I ubered both of us to the station and took the train together( i live somewhere else) and parted ways there, she already knows that we are not going to see each other again as the way i talked to her...

 

[ljrozz69]

Hmmm...
It's not clear in your mind.

There's nothing wrong with taking a girl's virginity. You should check if you don't have Madonna/whore complex.
Also you need to know that oftentimes they can tell you and even think that they want a relationship but in reality they only want sex. It really depends on the girl and you need to build more experience for that.
For instance last year I seduced a near 30yo virgin(they exist lol, really conservative environment does this) . Despite having set (very) sexual frames and her agreeing with pleasure I was certain that she only believed them on a superficial level, and the right move was to let her go.

Whether you did the right move or not, you have to know that you did nothing wrong. Is it your right to choose on whether you want or not have sex with someone.

 

[Skills]

no matter at what level, age or type of girl... when in ANY relationship is a given that one or the other will eventually get hurt.... very very rare there is a tie where the both walk away without getting hurt....

I did a post of women are better of dating seducers vs the average joe, look how much empathy you have vs the average dude, look what an amazing experience and time she had with you... Now she probably lose the same virginity to a clueless civilian...

most women are looking for relationship or deep connection virgin or not, cause there sexual goal vs the male goal strategy is different in itself... I also wonder if you just found an excuse cause sex with a virgin may be harder and more challenging than sex with a no virgin....

Women femininity and strategy involves very high emotions, crying, guilt etc... That is sort of their strategy, women get over pain extremely quickly, again part of their biology...

"Papi. Just so you know, I don't hate you, but at the best advice of my friends, I am blocking you. I need much more attention and commitment than you can give me and I don't have the willpower to not fuck you. It was so nice to meet you Deisel. I hope you get everything you want in life. Maybe I'll run into you in another 6 years. Until then, stay sweet, funny, and handsome. . If you're ever ready to be my husband with 2.5 kids, email or DM me. Thanks for the ride baby. It was a good adventure."

 

[Velasco]

She objected me to escalating with ''if you want to continue further it has to be a relationship'' of sort

"Of course baby. Why do you think I'm here lol If I like a girl and the sex is good why the fuck would i want to ditch her after? It makes no sense lol" then escalate.

Only you did not definite what you meant by "relationship"

 

[ljrozz69]

"Of course baby. Why do you think I'm here lol If I like a girl and the sex is good why the fuck would i want to ditch her after? It makes no sense lol" then escalate.

Only you did not definite what you meant by "relationship"

Depends on the girl... If it's one that's a bit needy and you let her obsess with you and start stalking you and doing all sorts of weird shit, you just fucked up big time lol.

 

[Velasco]

you just fucked up big time lol.

Nope Every girl you sleeping with should be obsessed with you, stalking you for a bit of information about you (checking to see your social media) because you are such a private guy. It's kind of cute honestly haha

 

[Will_V]

tl;dr I denied sex from a girl who was a virgin and had little experience with guys( 3 bfs and hasn't lost her V) she wanted me to sleep with her. I denied the sex because she wanted this to be a relationship.. She admits of wanting me for her self and i refused to do so on her terms.. i figured it was best to not sleep with her and not meet her again to prevent her from becoming really attached to me. She said she is 8/10 attached to me. I feel really shit for doing this to her because now she is emotionally distressed and her eyes was all teary as we parted ways on the train

I made a mistake on escalating her and stopping just before sex was about to happen and i regret it that she is now emotional distressed because of me.. as she has told me stuff that she only have told 2 people in this world... Obviously she really likes me.

She was such an innocent girl, who read twilight and expected a happy ending with us.. i can't it really grips my heart,

Am i over thinking this? what happens when we meet again because there is a real likelihood that we both go to the city and she works there where i often cold approach? i just don't know how to proceed and this was my first time pulling a girl home and escalating this far

prior:

i pulled her home with plausible deniability and i started escalating on her in my bed room,

She objected me to escalating with ''if you want to continue further it has to be a relationship'' of sort

Then took it easy and took 2 steps back and we ended up cuddling in bed, we talked. She picked up that i was kinda annoyed which was true lol)

we went back and forth escalating like making out then went back to talking.. as she typically softly put her hand around my head and pull me for a kiss while playing with my hair.

We talked mainly about the objection she was having '' a relationship'' and more random sexual topics and then i completely forgot she was a virgin as she then told me... she kept pulling me in for a kiss and escalating on me instead as i just stopped all together to think how to get this lay..

i threw in a hail marry that im: im not looking for a relationship, im looking for something casual and if you would like to leave you can''

because all the other verbal stuff said didn't work like ''i won't make you do anything your uncomfortable with'' ect.

Its not because she wasn't aroused i think as she was biting her lips and escalating me like getting closer to me in bed and pulling me in gently for a kiss and ect. But it was a genuine objection

She just kept escalating and i responded back in return without thinking again as we were making out, and eventually took having her bra off and her dress... on the agreement that it was on my terms of a one night stand.. she kepts saying she wanted to meet again...I look down and it was only her shorts left

suddenly it really hit me that hurting a gal like this for my selfish pleasure from a virgin is not ok. I can't take her virginity like this. I went against my sexual instincts.

She admitted while i was taking her bra off that she didn't want to leave the house because of me.. i was in a dilemma of preventing from hurting this girl..

I stopped all together, knowing for the best it was better to leave this girl alone, don't sleep with her

I ubered both of us to the station and took the train together( i live somewhere else) and parted ways there, she already knows that we are not going to see each other again as the way i talked to her...

I'm not sure what I should say to this, it's one of those things that every man must decide for himself and integrate into his own personal philosophy.

But I will say a couple of things. First, seduction is an act of dominance and taking of pleasure. Although it is something she consents to, and is combined with you giving her pleasure in return, at its core, the impulse that drives it is to take something you want. It's not a service, her pussy is not something you take as a fee for something else you did for her, it's not a business negotiation. In the end, you want to penetrate inside her to deliver your intentions and enjoy her reactions. If that makes you feel guilty, I think that will make things really difficult for you.

Secondly, at a more abstract level, happiness is not the goal of life, in my opinion. The goal of life is to have experiences that shape you and stress you and form you and are at times fun and pleasurable but also hard and painful, but they help you grow and they are meaningful.

For a man, his strength, his mettle needs to be tested, sometimes painfully. A man whose father or teachers never test him is not only weak, but hates them deeply. But if they treat him as someone who is able to deal with life capably, to react properly to pleasure and pain, pressure and gratification, success and failure, in other words to take responsibility for his life, then he will feel like he is being shaped into a god.

For a woman, to my understanding, there is something of the same. That is partly why a woman will go after a bad boy or someone who treats her in a way that makes things difficult for her - because she knows that's where she will grow as a woman who is capable of getting what she wants from a man. It makes her feel 'levelled up', tested, found to be capable in her feminine qualities. That is why she loves romance stories where everyone is crying all the time riding on a rollercoaster of emotions. Sometimes she finds her limits - that is also part of life.

Part of growing is losing her virginity. The idea that it must be done on a bed of roses, with an orchestra playing in the background and heavenly light shining down, is a false illusion. What she needs, in fact, is a man who treats her with warmth and compassion and a level of skill, and guides her through it. But once she is on the other side, liberated, you will probably find that she is so excited about all the different men that you'll quickly lose your madonna illusion. Because for her, the point was simply to feel good and safe at a particularly vulnerable time, whereas you interpret that as something else according to your own reality.

And if you 'leave her alone', as @Skills pointed out, some loser will end up banging her in an alley somewhere when she's drunk and desperate to get to the next phase of her life, and she will miss out on having a great first time with someone who can enjoy her as she deserves.

 

[Velasco]

The idea that it must be done on a bed of roses, with an orchestra playing in the background and heavenly light shining down, is a false illusion. What she needs, in fact, is a man who treats her with warmth and compassion and a level of skill, and guides her through it.

Her issue was more with not wanting to lose her virginity to someone who will just fuck her then dump her. So in her mind, she felt she needed nicko to agree to be in a relationship with her, so that she felt good about her decision. Only that her limiting belief is that only a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship would provide that. And a casual fuckbuddy relationship would not. Hence her not being totally satisfied with nicko's "I'm not looking for a relationship. Just something casual" frame.

 

[Will_V]

Her issue was more with not wanting to lose her virginity to someone who will just fuck her then dump her. So in her mind, she felt she needed nicko to agree to be in a relationship with her, so that she felt good about her decision. Only that her limiting belief is that only a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship would provide that. And a casual fuckbuddy relationship would not. Hence her not being totally satisfied with nicko's "I'm not looking for a relationship. Just something casual" frame.

True, but I don't think that was a barrier for her.

@Nicko says his indirect comfort 'didn't work' but that she was simultaneously escalating on him (at least to some extent). And then (it seemed to me) that she was ready to go after accepting his frame of it being something casual. So it appears it was only a barrier for him, not for her, unless I'm mistaken.

But I agree with your point, and I think the frame you mentioned is what would have been best. She really needed to feel like he cared about how she felt, not that it was a forever thing.

 

[Fuck This]

Nicko i think it is important to leave a woman or a girl better than you found her. Had you P&D'ed her it would not have left her better, unless all she wanted was to burn her V-Card.

I think it is important to have her Enthusiastic Consent before you escalate to sex....But also tell her " I don't start things I'm not going to finish."

She was going to try to use sex to rope you into a relationship. Men usually use a relationship as justification for sex...and it is just as wrong in each case.

 

[Nicko]

Hmmm...
It's not clear in your mind.

There's nothing wrong with taking a girl's virginity. You should check if you don't have Madonna/whore complex.
Also you need to know that oftentimes they can tell you and even think that they want a relationship but in reality they only want sex. It really depends on the girl and you need to build more experience for that.

She was 20, came from Nepal and had a conservative up bringing. In school the teachers didn't allow the girls and boys have relationships or to mingle closely, her relationships were relatively normal and she only had 3 of which ended on her not being to able the relationships she hoped for , she has been single for 3 years since her last relationship. Turns out all her friends are virgins

a part of me thought of if i take this girls Virginity im going to carry all this expectation of being her BF, but that thought would contradict the frame that she is escalating on me and she is entering my frame with her own choice meaning she accepted Fuck Buddies. I think I just couldn't make sense of it at the time

Maybe i do have a bit of mondana/whore complex of thinking that if i fuck this girl she is going get too attached

i honestly think it was the attachment that got me all stressed out. She said it would make her 10/10 attached to me, she told me she gets easily attached.

no matter at what level, age or type of girl... when in ANY relationship is a given that one or the other will eventually get hurt.... very very rare there is a tie where the both walk away without getting hurt....

I did a post of women are better of dating seducers vs the average joe, look how much empathy you have vs the average dude, look what an amazing experience and time she had with you... Now she probably lose the same virginity to a clueless civilian...

most women are looking for relationship or deep connection virgin or not, cause there sexual goal vs the male goal strategy is different in itself... I also wonder if you just found an excuse cause sex with a virgin may be harder and more challenging than sex with a no virgin....

Women femininity and strategy involves very high emotions, crying, guilt etc... That is sort of their strategy, women get over pain extremely quickly, again part of their biology..

I agree that all relationships would eventually having the other person getting hurt, she just kept saying 'she was afraid of getting hurt' like previous heart breaks she had before. I honestly think that may have mind fucked me into thinking too much on the subject matter of

'''If i fuck her, im going to be in a relationship'' opposed to setting it in my frame ''fuck her and she would enjoy being my fuck buddy''

I wouldn't say she was easy with this it's my first experience going this far yet , we literally cuddled in bed for 3 hours then i released she was escalating on me most of the time and it was a green light. With that 3 hours we talked about what we wanted, she knew i wanted sex and she wanted a relationship and finding the 'common ground' where both of us get what we wanted while she was simultaneously seducing/escalating me lol

Which was impossible i thought believing buying into her frame of sex= relationship and I just wanted something casual.

physiologically i believed it, entering her frame and i couldn't make it something casual but that was just not true right? If i slept with her, would she keep asking me for a relationship or would she settle down for a FWB? that was also key factor of me hesitating on sleeping with her

I understand Female mating strategies as i have read Rollo Thomasmi in the past talking about feminine imperative and all that stuff.

Her issue was more with not wanting to lose her virginity to someone who will just fuck her then dump her. So in her mind, she felt she needed nicko to agree to be in a relationship with her, so that she felt good about her decision. Only that her limiting belief is that only a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship would provide that. And a casual fuckbuddy relationship would not. Hence her not being totally satisfied with nicko's "I'm not looking for a relationship. Just something casual" frame.

says his indirect comfort 'didn't work' but that she was simultaneously escalating on him (at least to some extent). And then (it seemed to me) that she was ready to go after accepting his frame of it being something casual. So it appears it was only a barrier for him, not for her, unless I'm mistaken.

But I agree with your point, and I think the frame you mentioned is what would have been best. She really needed to feel like he cared about how she felt, not that it was a forever thing.

I think it it was an issue with me, thinking that she wants a relationship so badly she would tie me down in the relationship not in exchange of sex(she entered my frame already) but for her emotional sake.

I was stressing on the idea of wondering if it was 'the right thing to do' i should take the girls V and make it a FWB. I remember reading one of GC articles on about a girls virginity as you should be responsible with it as its her first time and you don't want to make a bad impression, i may be wrong if an article like that exist or was it.

Morally i thought maybe this was a bad impression for her first to be FWB lmao

Nicko i think it is important to leave a woman or a girl better than you found her. Had you P&D'ed her it would not have left her better, unless all she wanted was to burn her V-Card.

I think it is important to have her Enthusiastic Consent before you escalate to sex....But also tell her " I don't start things I'm not going to finish."

She was going to try to use sex to rope you into a relationship. Men usually use a relationship as justification for sex...and it is just as wrong in each case.

I would have wanted to make her a better than i have found her but i just didn't' know what to do at the being and how to...

she was 20 and she honestly wanted to have sex with me but also wanted to continue to see me afterwards but in a relationship light, she would only accept the FWB if i eventually become her BF and i didn't think going down either would suit both of us, she asked me if i saw her as a person i would have in a relationship eventually in FWB but i honestly said no.

 

[Velasco]

If i slept with her, would she keep asking me for a relationship or would she settle down for a FWB? that was also key factor of me hesitating on sleeping with her

she was 20 and she honestly wanted to have sex with me but also wanted to continue to see me afterwards but in a relationship light, she would only accept the FWB if i eventually become her BF

She just didnt want you to fuck and dump her. You wanted a casual fuckbuddy relationship with her, so that shouldn't be a worry for her. Thing you need to understand is, most girls accept FWB as a way to get a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship with a high value guy. "I'll fuck this guy a couple times. Show him I'm a worthy girlfriend, then he'll want to be official with me." If they feel it's not happening, then they'll be like, "where is this going/I cant do this (FWB) anymore" so ya of course down the line she will expect you to want to be her boyfriend. Right now you just dont know. Trust me, how you feel about her now will be way different than how you feel about her in a couple months. Maybe you will want to be her boyfriend then. Maybe not. But why not give it a try (FWB) and see how you feel about her then, instead of making a decision now, for your future self

P.S. 2 of my longest FWB relationships (2+years) have been with girls in the single digit lay count who had never been in a fwb relationship before me (boyfriends is what they were used to), but I made it work for them

 

[Fuck This]

Nicko, If she was not a virgin would you have consummated the act? Under the guise of "Well she knows what she's getting into"?

 

[Nicko]

Nicko, If she was not a virgin would you have consummated the act? Under the guise of "Well she knows what she's getting into"?

umm honestly i wouldn’t really care if she was a virgin or not it was just that i felt i would bare a lot of responsibility for a girl to lose her Virginity to me.

im looking for a fuck buddy right and isn’t that going to hurt her more? she seemed pretty fragile and innocent lol she didn’t even know what was a fetish was

I kinda stressed if i went down with FWB i have this responsibility lingering to become her BF. She only wanted a FWB if i become her bf which is meh but I don’t see that would really work with my current age and the amount of information that is congruent enough i can share with her

she wanted to know ‘everything’ about me

 

[Nicko]

She just didnt want you to fuck and dump her. You wanted a casual fuckbuddy relationship with her, so that shouldn't be a worry for her. Thing you need to understand is, most girls accept FWB as a way to get a boyfriend-girlfriend relationship with a high value guy. "I'll fuck this guy a couple times. Show him I'm a worthy girlfriend, then he'll want to be official with me." If they feel it's not happening, then they'll be like, "where is this going/I cant do this (FWB) anymore" so ya of course down the line she will expect you to want to be her boyfriend. Right now you just dont know. Trust me, how you feel about her now will be way different than how you feel about her in a couple months. Maybe you will want to be her boyfriend then. Maybe not. But why not give it a try (FWB) and see how you feel about her then, instead of making a decision now, for your future self

yeah i think it makes sense to me why she wanted a ‘relationship’ its because she didn’t want me to fuck and dump her

so a FWB is viable ok. i get it now