Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferably)

[andersen09]

So today, I was seeing one of the girls I usually spend time with.

Before we even started 'dating an open relationship', I laid out the rules with her because I believe in honesty and don't believe in lying to her for no reason.

1. This will be an open-relationship, I will be seeing other women/fucking other women, and she's free to do the same (She agreed)
2. I can only spend a certain amount of time with her each week because I have many other things to do.
(Building a business, College, Seeing other women, Family, ETC ETC)

Now with that being said, this one in particular is a little inexperienced in relationships as she's young, 18 years old.
But today, something little bit alarming happened that made me think 'is this a red flag? or is this girl just afraid?"

We usually spend 2-3 times a week due to having classes together, but recently I dropped out.
Today, we were spending time together and I told her we can only see each other once a week now because I'll be working more to catch up on my other classes and putting that time in.

Conversation Prior:

Me: How important is your morning class next Wednesday?
Her: Not really important
Me: Good, skip it. We're spending the morning together (She was really being thoughtful and in a positive mood/affectionate today)
Her: Really?! You never spend time with me in the morning.
Me: Well there's a first time everything.
Her: (Hugest smile)

And we spent about 2 hours today before I decided I need to get back home to which she replied,

Her: Whyyy can we spend a little bit more time? I'm going to miss you"
Me: i can't I have to go
Her: Just 10 more minutes
(Btw, there was another girl nearby who was watching all this today and happened to take the same Uber I was taking. I got her number after conversating with her in my Uber ride and she's replying almost immediately to my texts) Pre-Selection and my girl saw this as well.

I stay firm and decide to go home. And afterwards I get this text a little bit later.

Her: Why did you leave me?
Me: ?? What? What you mean
Her: Idk.. I just feel so alone
Me: When I'm with you?
Her: nevermind
Me: Stop saying nevermind to avoid communication
Me: ??

Her: Maybe I do like u way 2 much....
Me: You're scared
Me: When there's no reason to be scared
Me; I just dont get why ur feeling alone

Her: Emotional Isolation
Her: Please don't abandon me

Me: We'll talk in person another time, go get some rest
Me: Just know that ive kept my words with you and havent lied to you so far. So you need to learn to trust me

She's stated before that she has hard time trusting guys/people. (I guess she's been hurt before)

Her: okay i'll try

And finally, I've also had this situation happen to me before where when I was in relationships, my gfs have cried and told me that they're scared of me?
1. I like you so much, and usually I can figure out people in a day, but I still don't feel connected to you and feel like don't know anything about you (And she literally bawled her eyes out the whole night while I was comforting her) (This was in a serious relationship 3-4 months of open relationship before going into a serious one)


So with that being said I can see this as two signs.

1. She's falling for me harder than she thought, and she's trying to control her emotions and scared that I'll leave her.
2. It's a red flag with the choice of her words.
"Emotional Isolation" - She's had therapy for depression/anxiety when she was younger
"Abandon me"

What's your guy's take and inputs?

 

[Seppuku]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Hey Andersen,

Yes it could very well be that she is falling harder than you or she thought she would. And it is a very normal thing for a girl to do, especially in this young age. The number one reason to not seeing a girl more than once a week in an open relationship, is precisely to avoid this situation.

The way I understand things here, is you initially established a routine of seeing her 2 to 3 times a week. Then now, circumstances changed, you want to withdraw to once a week. You think it is fair to do so, because you vocalized the rules from the very beginning. Correct me if I misunderstood.

Unfortunately it doesn't work like this. Whatever the rules you "agreed" with her, she now has an expectation to see you 2 to 3 times a week. Now that you're telling her that you will reduce the frequency, she is getting emotional. Remember, expectations can only go higher, and expectations is what ultimately hurt us. Whatever rules you logically agreed before won't help.

In addition, by seeing her relatively frequently, she is now getting attached to you. And most girls will do, in the same situation. They are biologically programmed to get attached to the man they submitted to. For her, you are now "her" man.

To avoid these sorts of problems, I usually handle my own open relationships this way:
* I never vocalize the rules. It's counterproductive. The rules are always implicit.
* I establish a routine of seeing her once a week at most. It is always a "de facto" situation
* If I see signs of attachment in spite of this, I may decrease the frequency for a while

The opposite holds true. If I really like her and ready to take things to the next level, then I increase the frequency. Remember however that it will be difficult to go back once you do that, so to be handled with care.

Well, in your case, handle her carefully please so as not to hurt her.

Cheers,
Seppuku

 

[andersen09]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Unfortunately it doesn't work like this. Whatever the rules you "agreed" with her, she now has an expectation to see you 2 to 3 times a week. Now that you're telling her that you will reduce the frequency, she is getting emotional. Remember, expectations can only go higher, and expectations is what ultimately hurt us. Whatever rules you logically agreed before won't help.

In addition, by seeing her relatively frequently, she is now getting attached to you. And most girls will do, in the same situation. They are biologically programmed to get attached to the man they submitted to. For her, you are now "her" man.

To avoid these sorts of problems, I usually handle my own open relationships this way:
* I never vocalize the rules. It's counterproductive. The rules are always implicit.
* I establish a routine of seeing her once a week at most. It is always a "de facto" situation
* If I see signs of attachment in spite of this, I may decrease the frequency for a while

The opposite holds true. If I really like her and ready to take things to the next level, then I increase the frequency. Remember however that it will be difficult to go back once you do that, so to be handled with care.

Well, in your case, handle her carefully please so as not to hurt her.

Thank you, it makes sense to implicitly imply rules in action than to verbalize since logic doesn't apply in these types of situations.
And yes, if I think about it, I unconsciously laid out the rules thinking it was going to minimize her from being hurt if things happened to go south, but my actions stated other wise. Now it makes sense why she started becoming more affectionate lately (kissing me more often/hugging/wanting to cuddle more) because my actions were reinforcing a higher expectation.

With that being said, when you say expectations are always to go higher in levels, does that mean there's no way to reset the expectations? As in, reducing the frequencies slowly and gradually to once a week and keeping that consistent? (even if she becomes emotional for bit in the short term) as I wouldn't want her to be hurt more in the long run.

Sincerely

 

[Seppuku]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Hey,

With that being said, when you say expectations are always to go higher in levels, does that mean there's no way to reset the expectations? As in, reducing the frequencies slowly and gradually to once a week and keeping that consistent? (even if she becomes emotional for bit in the short term) as I wouldn't want her to be hurt more in the long run.

Not impossible but harder. That's why it's better to start low then increase. However if I were in your case, given what had already been done, yes, I would proceed exactly like you said. Expect some emotional turbulence. What you are effectively doing is "downgrading" her. She may go along with it, or drop it.

Will be interesting to see. If you don't mind reporting here the outcome after a couple of weeks.

Seppuku

 

[Yhaceed]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Hey Andersen,

I thought other guys might chime in but maybe later as this issue is a little bit related to someone I've been seeing. As it stands I'm free to be with whomever I want but she doesn't like that. I even mentioned a "date" with a friend a few times and it was like she got jealous even though the rules had been set out. She was like "I know what I said but that doesn't mean I have to like it." She also said she felt cheap because I had gone out with my friend. Maybe if it wasn't to see a movie and just coffee or something that would have made a difference but it was a little too much for her. She also asked me if I kissed her to which I said no which was true. All that to say this girl probably wants you guys to be exclusive or to feel like that and maybe not "blatantly" talk to someone else right in front of her. She may agree to an open relationship "on paper" but my guess is she doesn't want all the details of what you're doing with other girls. Also as for it being a red flag that's possible because if she wants some sort of exclusivity and then doesn't get it she's going to be hurt if she's investing more into you guys' relationship. I really feel like where my girl is concerned if I were with someone else right now she would be very hurt even though on the surface she knows we're not exclusive. And you're already seeing other girls obviously but that doesn't mean she doesn't want more than you're giving her. So if you continue seeing her she risks being hurt. It's just up to you if you want to take that risk. Hope that helps.

~Yhaceed

 

[andersen09]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Will be interesting to see. If you don't mind reporting here the outcome after a couple of weeks.

Will do.

Hey Andersen,

I thought other guys might chime in but maybe later as this issue is a little bit related to someone I've been seeing. As it stands I'm free to be with whomever I want but she doesn't like that. I even mentioned a "date" with a friend a few times and it was like she got jealous even though the rules had been set out. She was like "I know what I said but that doesn't mean I have to like it." She also said she felt cheap because I had gone out with my friend. Maybe if it wasn't to see a movie and just coffee or something that would have made a difference but it was a little too much for her. She also asked me if I kissed her to which I said no which was true. All that to say this girl probably wants you guys to be exclusive or to feel like that and maybe not "blatantly" talk to someone else right in front of her. She may agree to an open relationship "on paper" but my guess is she doesn't want all the details of what you're doing with other girls. Also as for it being a red flag that's possible because if she wants some sort of exclusivity and then doesn't get it she's going to be hurt if she's investing more into you guys' relationship. I really feel like where my girl is concerned if I were with someone else right now she would be very hurt even though on the surface she knows we're not exclusive. And you're already seeing other girls obviously but that doesn't mean she doesn't want more than you're giving her. So if you continue seeing her she risks being hurt. It's just up to you if you want to take that risk. Hope that helps.

~Yhaceed

Hey Yhaceed,

Yes it's true, it's not the fact that me, you, or anyone else is seeing other women, it's more of how they find out that's more important.
(Because let's face it, if you couldn't see other women, she wouldn't be with you, and when women get jealous/possessive, it's a feeling they actually enjoy even though 'they don't like it, like feeling pain but they actually kind of like it as long as it's not too much **btw only for experienced seducers only)

So I think the universal principle applies here. Yes they want to be with a man who other women wants, but they don't want to be told explicitly.
It's just like a guy coming up to her and saying "Yo I got lambhorghini and women" (in extreme cases)
Instead of just carrying that inner confidence due to your achievements and flirting with her from a position of confidence. (Implying Success)

I think our positions are similar on surface but little different underneath.

We agreed to keep this a secret, as I do with other women as well. BUT she became friends with another girl that I used to 'flirt' with and everyone in the class started talking about how it would be cute if we became a couple. And she subtly commented one day saying
"soo.. how do you know this other girl?"
"Oh I used to XYZ"
"Yeah some girls were talking about you saying you and 'Blondie' would be a cute couple"
"That's funny"

And she started indirectly asking me questions that implied the following
"Tell me I'm better than her?" -> "Soo, what do you think of her? Do you think she's pretty?"
"I am better than her because of XYZ" -> "I heard she's a little dumb, and she got mad at me cause she was dressed really nice and I said she's wearing way too many bright colors with no sense of taste"

So when she found out indirectly, her response was a bit more of respecting me and knowing she should be on her best behavior.


But if I were to tell her directly, "I'm going on a date with so and so", it almost comes off I'm TRYING to make her jealous from her pov and will feel 'cheap' per say as she feels like you're not respecting her in terms of how she treats you.

Imagine a guy saying "Bro, I can beat your ass in a fight" -> Your response would be -> "Fuck Off fuckboy"
BUT if you find out that he's a professional MMA fighter but was genuinely nice -> Your most likely to respond --> Wow this guy is the shit, I should behave.

And I think that's what happened with your case when she was saying
'I feel cheap'
"I know what I said but that doesn't mean I have to like it."

She's almost coming from a position of entitlement and demanding.

I really feel like where my girl is concerned if I were with someone else right now she would be very hurt even though on the surface she knows we're not exclusive. And you're already seeing other girls obviously but that doesn't mean she doesn't want more than you're giving her. So if you continue seeing her she risks being hurt. It's just up to you if you want to take that risk. Hope that helps.

And yeah you're right in that I risk being hurt.

At the end of the day, someone is going to get hurt 100%.

But that pain can have two consequences depending on the intention.

1. If a guy just used her for his own ego to cause her pain -> It's going to affect her life in the future in terms of her not trusting, defensive, baggage, and etc.
2. If a guy really let her go with good intentions of growing more and ending it in good terms -> She will go through a phase of depression and crying -> But that pain will help her mature (Depending on her age) to understand and respect you as a guy who helped her become better.

And what I was implying was she's going to get hurt. It's just a fact of life.

But what I CAN control is making sure she knows it's not the type of pain that's #1, versus #2, which is based on her perceptions of how I treat her and how she looks back to our relationship when she is little bit more clear headed.

So I need to know how I can adjust my presentation so that
A. She's knows this is just to enjoy each other's company while it lasts.
B. She also can look back and know there are good men out there when dealing with 'assholes' of the life.

This is a bit more in depth but just to clarify where I'm coming from.

 

[andersen09]

Re: Is she scared of falling harder? Or a red flag??(Advanced Seducers Preferabl

Will be interesting to see. If you don't mind reporting here the outcome after a couple of weeks.

Seppuku

Just a little update.

I received a text from her since the last time we talked. (I've been busy with other things and kind of forgot about it)

Her: Hey.. I'm sorry about the embarrassing rant the other day.. hehe
Me: It's okay, you're just being a girl (Might've been bad)
Me: But next time, talk to me, instead of holding it in
Me: Can you do that?
Her: It's not easy 4 me.. but okay
Me: I know, but it's gonna cause more problems down the road and I can't read ur mind
Her: Got it :')
Me: Good~ Enjoy ur day, see you soon
Her: you too <3