is suicide really so bad

[Ree]

i have never understood why suicide is regarded as such a bad thing.
your life is your life and you are free to do whatever you want to do with it.
my government will not have suicide prevention centers,
instead we will have suicide enabling centers where a team of doctors can painlessly and quickly kill you and harvest your organs.
these will then be given(not sold) to sick people

 

[readjusting]

It's not good, not bad.
My country doesn't have a suicide prevention center.
Some people suicide.
Usually when people suicide, they make it to the newspaper.
Other people read it for fun (yeah, I used to be one of those people, but nowadays I do other things).

I think it's some guy in your country have a life mission of "I'll save all the suicide people," and you got the suicide prevention department.

I like your "organ donation" idea though. It makes the suicide people useful.

 

[Regal Tiger]

Because the very goal of life is to live.

My guess is, is that it's considered immoral is because other people don't want to believe that they themselves could end up doing it. For example whenever someone does something tragic and bad there's always this othering that happens. I would never do that! People always say.

But the fact of the matter is, is that anyone can be pushed to any extreme and we don't want to be reminded that we are all the same. So if people close to us starting committing suicide then that means we ourselves could commit suicide. And when you have a bunch of people committing suicide it gives social proof to the fact that suicide is a good thing. Like how in a cult when it comes time to drink the cool-aid. All you need is one person that you consider like yourself (which there will be some bonding in a cult situation so you won't think other people are so different than you) to drink and kill themselves before someone else will do it. Then another, then another and then another. Social Proof in a nutshell can cause people to do crazy things. If it's socially acceptable then more people would do it.

This is bad for society because then you don't have those people in the workforce contributing to said society. Like in a flock of sheep, they're useless to the shepherd when dead.

There's also the pain that the living left behind feel when someone close to them dies.

But if suicide is considered immoral and selfish akin to murder then less people will do it. This is good for society.


But overall, suicide really isn't that bad in general. It's just bad for society much like murder and therefore is considered immoral.


My opinion/thoughts.

 

[Ree]

Because the very goal of life is to live.

My guess is, is that it's considered immoral is because other people don't want to believe that they themselves could end up doing it. For example whenever someone does something tragic and bad there's always this othering that happens. I would never do that! People always say.

But the fact of the matter is, is that anyone can be pushed to any extreme and we don't want to be reminded that we are all the same. So if people close to us starting committing suicide then that means we ourselves could commit suicide. And when you have a bunch of people committing suicide it gives social proof to the fact that suicide is a good thing. Like how in a cult when it comes time to drink the cool-aid. All you need is one person that you consider like yourself (which there will be some bonding in a cult situation so you won't think other people are so different than you) to drink and kill themselves before someone else will do it. Then another, then another and then another. Social Proof in a nutshell can cause people to do crazy things. If it's socially acceptable then more people would do it.

This is bad for society because then you don't have those people in the workforce contributing to said society. Like in a flock of sheep, they're useless to the shepherd when dead.

There's also the pain that the living left behind feel when someone close to them dies.

But if suicide is considered immoral and selfish akin to murder then less people will do it. This is good for society.


But overall, suicide really isn't that bad in general. It's just bad for society much like murder and therefore is considered immoral.


My opinion/thoughts.

wow...deep

 

[Mr.Rob]

Everything is subjective isn't it?

If the homeless crack addict that has burdened the tax paying system and generally conducted himself as a nuisance to society offs himself from a utilitarian view this would probably be highly productive.

If on the other hand sayyy a man with a son who depends on his father for support, direction, and providing for needs takes his life and his son gets put in an adoption home and is heartbroken (assuming the man had the capability to provide these things) and has a broken life and eventually becomes a ruthless drug dealer could be seen as immoral and selfish.

my government will not have suicide prevention centers,
instead we will have suicide enabling centers where a team of doctors can painlessly and quickly kill you and harvest your organs.
these will then be given(not sold) to sick people

Fascinating.

I think a potential drawback of this is if the social proof thing that RT pointed out is that you may have too many people potentially committing suicide which would be bad for population, morale, and interrupt religious compliance(famous for helping control/promote strong societies).

You might would have to rewrite/instill a new or revised religion to make up a story for why suicide would be considered righteous.

-Rob

 

[Richard]

As someone who views things from a humanistic psychological lens I think people are free to do with their lives what they want. If someone wants to take their life and they've made that decision then I don't think anyone has the right to police that person.

That's not to say I wouldn't try to help that person or talk to them but I'm not responsible for the decisions other people make. So, while I would prefer people not commit suicide, I think if they make the decision to do so then so be it.

-Richard

 

[Regal Tiger]

I think a potential drawback of this is if the social proof thing that RT pointed out is that you may have too many people potentially committing suicide which would be bad for population, morale, and interrupt religious compliance(famous for helping control/promote strong societies).


-Rob

I admit it sounds kinda crazy when I say it but if anyone has ever read the book "Influence" by Cialdini then they'll understand. It's really an incredible book. He goes into it a lot better than I ever could.

 

[Ree]

Everything is subjective isn't it?

If the homeless crack addict that has burdened the tax paying system and generally conducted himself as a nuisance to society offs himself from a utilitarian view this would probably be highly productive.

If on the other hand sayyy a man with a son who depends on his father for support, direction, and providing for needs takes his life and his son gets put in an adoption home and is heartbroken (assuming the man had the capability to provide these things) and has a broken life and eventually becomes a ruthless drug dealer could be seen as immoral and selfish.

my government will not have suicide prevention centers,
instead we will have suicide enabling centers where a team of doctors can painlessly and quickly kill you and harvest your organs.
these will then be given(not sold) to sick people

Fascinating.

I think a potential drawback of this is if the social proof thing that RT pointed out is that you may have too many people potentially committing suicide which would be bad for population, morale, and interrupt religious compliance(famous for helping control/promote strong societies).

You might would have to rewrite/instill a new or revised religion to make up a story for why suicide would be considered righteous.

-Rob

i really wonder what percentage of the population is suicidal.....if it is that many people....maybe my govt is not very good.....i think the number of suicidal people at any time is a good opinion poll

 

[Lover]

I'm a hospital intern right now, and I see old people being pumped up with so much medical and surgical treatment that it makes my mind blown. One patient has asked the doctors to avoid revival if it ever came to a heart attack. Said patient claims to have lived life to its fullest, and more days of living would not make any difference.

I don't think suicide or consented killing due to age and/or chronic disease would be a bad idea. If they have a bad chance of staying alive for much longer, or it looks like they're going to be ill for the rest of their lives - which drains a lot of your life quality in most cases - why should it be bad if they committed such?

(Ree, I'm guessing that you weren't talking about old, sick people, but I felt I'd mention it anyway).

If we talk about regular people living regular lives, that's a different story.

I've never been truly suicidal myself, but I used to (and occasionally still) have a feeling of emptiness. And I couldn't help but think about solutions. One was to find fulfillment. The other was to commit suicide, but it was out of the question because I don't want to solve life problems by ending my life. I began to empathize with people who feel this way as a side effect. And I see that suicide can be effective if you cannot cope with your emptiness in the long term.

I don't know other reasons why healthy indiviaduals would commit suicide... But I believe that the intentions behind suicide is important to consider when you're not the one committing it. And if there was ever created a suicide enabling center around here, I hope they will have some criteria the applicants have to meet before they can accept the suicide.

 

[Ree]

i think you raise a good point when you bring up the aged and the chronically ill