Kick-starting by club pick-up skills

[Prehistoric]

Recently I have started to pick up in clubs, which is kinda new to me.

I went yesterday and made at least 7 approaches.

3 of these the girls reacted very coldly and distantly as if they didn't want to talk to me but all of them were staring at me later. The point is that I have some problems re-approaching a girl who shot me down in an arrogant way. My problem is not the rejection but their acting as if you were a criminal stalking them. One thing is taking a NO, one think is being treated like a sexual harasser. How did you guys overcome that?

2 reacted very warmly but I learned later they had a guy with them. 1 actually reacted very very very warmly. How long do you get physical in clubs after starting conversation (because I have the impression I might have missed a window)?

1 very hot one reacted saying she's a foreigner and doesn't get the language, although my friend and I have the suspicion she (and her friend) were hookers.

Now, the most interesting approach I did was this one. It was something that I tried naturally without even planning.

There was this very very very good-looking little girl. A lot of guys were around her. I think some were her friends and some were guys trying to pick her up. Instead of walking to where she was and talking to her, which was basically what all the other guys were doing, I stood firm some meters away from her and looked at her for a prolonged time. She noticed I was looking at her, kinda smiled a bit, then turned her attention away, then again at me, then away, then again at me. At one point, as we dancing, she actually came very close to where I was staying.

Without talking I blew some air in her ear. She smiled but pulled back a bit Then I started caressing her hair. She smiled but pulled back at bit. Then I started caressing the skin around her shoulder and arm. Again she smiled but pulled back a bit. Then I reached my hand for her as if I wanted to invite her to danceand, always smiling, she nodded no. I kept my hand there for quite some time because she looked like flattered by the proposal but not willing to accept it. She pulled back a bit more but didn't leave the spot. I was waiting for her to come close to me again. Then 1 minute later her friends said they wanted to go (were they trying to spoil my game?) and she left with them.

Later I was drinking with my buddy at the bar, and she was putting her jacket on and about to leave the club and was staring at me.

I kinda had the impression that the usual "walking up to her and start a conversation" is what everybody does in clubs. Guys lose a lot of inhibitions they have outside when they're in a club. Maybe they feel like the club is an alternate universe completely detached from the rest of the world and its social rules. I am looking for ways to differentiate myself from the competition when I am in a club.

Any advice on the situations I described and on how to improve in general?

P.S. while looks is certainly not the most important thing, I kinda have the impression that very very well dressed guys and guys who work out a lot have an initial advantage.

 

[Franco]

Prehistoric,

3 of these the girls reacted very coldly and distantly as if they didn't want to talk to me but all of them were staring at me later. The point is that I have some problems re-approaching a girl who shot me down in an arrogant way. My problem is not the rejection but their acting as if you were a criminal stalking them. One thing is taking a NO, one think is being treated like a sexual harasser. How did you guys overcome that?

That's just one of the difficult things that you need to overcome for night game! The thing to keep in mind is that these girls aren't actually upset/arrogant about you, they're just trying to keep up appearances and protecting themselves in a situation where they feel the most vulnerable.

When you're at a club, girls feel kind of like these dancing pieces of meat, and surrounding them are tons of wolves just looking to get a bite. So when you approach, you have to keep in mind that she's first trying to figure out if you're a wolf, so although she might treat you like a wolf in the first interaction, she'll still be analyzing you AFTER you approach to see if her assessment was correct or incorrect. Since she knows you've shown interest in her, she's trying to determine what type of guy you are now that she knows she's at least gained enough of your interest for you to man up and approach her. So if she determines that you seem like a genuinely sexy but good guy, she can tend to be very warm on the re-approach.

It's just something you have to get used to in the club environment -- none of a girl's apparent arrogance actually stems from her personality, it just stems from her guard being up before she can decide what type of person you are: are you the sexy man she's hoping to meet that night, or are you the wolf out for a piece of meat?

How long do you get physical in clubs after starting conversation (because I have the impression I might have missed a window)?

Generally very, very quickly. Once you've determined that a girl has shown interest, you have to move ten times as fast as you would in day game. During day game, sometimes I won't even touch a girl. Yet in night game, if a girl seems to react extremely warmly, you quickly want to move to doing things like touching the small of her back or touching her elbow to gauge if she's receptive to your touch. If she is, then you can escalate from there by putting your arm around her waist and being very close to her body when you communicate with her.

Any advice on the situations I described and on how to improve in general?

P.S. while looks is certainly not the most important thing, I kinda have the impression that very very well dressed guys and guys who work out a lot have an initial advantage.

Yeah, in general alcohol and the environment helps remove the inhibitions that all guys have about approaching, and it feels much easier. In that regard, a good-looking man who is not afraid to approach is going to have a distinct advantage initialy, but if he does not know how to communicate with women (both verbally and physically), then he can lose that initial advantage fast.

This is why day game has a large advantage for men who approach -- women never get approached by men during the day, and regardless of how physically "handsome" you are, you still appear very masculine and confident just by doing so, which is a complete turn-on for women. Men who approach in clubs don't appear extra masculine or confident because getting approached by men in clubs is just the "norm," so you'll find that you'll have a more difficult time getting mostly "warm" receptions on your initial approach. However, clubs also present an environment where lots of attractive women are herded together in one location, so if you do lots of approaches in a quick amount of time, you can still end up with a girl or a few phone numbers after a few hours. But you have to have more of a "numbers game" mentality for clubs since initial reactions from women are usually very hot or very cold.

Hope that helps!

- Franco

 

[Prehistoric]

very helpful, thanks!

yesterday I went clubbing again. I don't wanna get obsessed and make clubbing the only way I meet girls, but I am very interested in cracking the code of how to get laid in that particular environment.

It went better than the night before but there is still a lot of progress to make.

Here's some feedback I got.

1) I tried for 30-40 minutes to talk to girl and for other 30-40 ones to just grab girls without even talking and start dancing with them. I don't know it this is a general rule, but the second method was statistically way more successful than the first. Out of 10 girls I grabbed, I managed to dance with 3 and get very physical with one (they left later because I probably made some other mistakes and because there were really A LOT of men, many of which clearly much more skilled than me at picking up girls in that environment). The girls I tried to talk to were other mildly receptive, or simple disinterested or cold. Some actually reacted with a surprised expression, almost as if they were saying "we are in a club, what the hell are you trying to start a conversation for?"

2) I noticed something that made me remember Chase's article about peacocking. Guys who were not simply stylish, but had very original styles which made them stand out were at a much bigger advance getting girls attention and interest in the first part of the interaction.

3) A lot of guys made out with girls but then they lost them and they were off dancing with somebody else. I am asking myself how effective it is to actually make out in a club if you're planning to bring that girl to your place later.

4) Some girls who seem to be on their own or with friends are in reality there with their boyfriends/lovers who are kinda "invisible". They're often not dancing, drinking at the bar or sitting on a sofa not that far from where the girl's dancing.

5) As you said it really is a number's game. Most girls end up dancing/making out with one guy rather than the other based on very subjective criteria. I saw one guy being treated like a leper by one girl and then later making out immediately with another one.

6) persisting can either make the girl more willing to interact with you or make her (and her friends) very angry. sometimes one girl can dismiss you in a warm you, making you want to keep on trying, but than her "pit-bull" girlfriend shows up and starts pushing you away from her.

Well, I guess I just need to keep on going there, experimenting, observing and learning.

 

[ray_zorse]

Franco makes a great reply which means it is almost unnecessary for me to jump in, but I want to amplify on something he said, which is that guys who don't know how to talk to women can lose any advantage they had very quickly. And this is where a bit of daygame experience can come in extremely handy. Nightgame is a hostile environment because they're looking to blow you off and gain validation by doing so. Daygame can be a hostile environment simply because you come out of left field while they're otherwise busy and you have to quickly engage them or lose them. So if you can engage them quickly and you approach in nightgame with a pretty low-key sober approach where you basically just introduce yourself by name, ask them about their day/night and take it from there, you're onto a winner. What I see in nightgame is guys approaching girls and forgetting to do the basic steps that'd be obvious in daygame such as introducing yourself by name. I find if you start by introducing yourself by name, you become a person to them and then you can get away with almost anything
-Ray
PS. I also would try to persist, persist, persist through bitch shields... think of it as a competition... for instance you sit down at a table with 3 girls and they ostentatiously ignore you, talking amongst themselves and refusing eye contact... just be self amused, sit there for quite a while and let the tension build, eventually they will talk to you, even if it's to say "fuck off"... and even the "fuck off" is investment, you can build on that. "Oh, are you always this rude?"... etc. Where it's not a good idea to do this, is if you approached them on the dance floor and they're clearly in party mode and grinding on their girlfriend and being circled by a lot of guys who are getting blown off. Essentially if I see them blow off a guy, then I would leave them alone until their situation or location changes.