FU Lost another girl over texting. What could I have done differently?

[DarkJedi]

I really think I lose quite some girls over texting. Girls being super flaky here on text. I do much better if I can get her out on an insta-date, but that can't happen always.

Anyway, I think this one I also lost due to texting, but maybe it was something else?

TLDR: Had a fun and spontaneous approach with a girl in the grocery store. Wasn't much sexual tension, but was fun and slightly flirty. Skip to the Texting section if you wanna be quick.

The Approach
I saw this girl coming out of the train station, but since I was on a bike and it was already dark, I figured the odds would be slim for a good approach. Let it go. Then while inside the grocery store, I see her again, and I decided I have to approach.

Approach went smooth I think. She hadn't seen me. While she was at one of the checkout counters, I went to the one just next to her and while paying I casually glanced, acted a bit surprised and said:

DarkJedit: Hey! That's a really nice coat!
HB: (smiling) Thanks!!
DarkJedi: Wait, you're not really from here, are you?
HB: No, I'm from Spain
DarkJedi: (smling) Ahh I knew it
HB: (smiling even broader) How did you know?
DarkJedi: Well, the dark hair, those eyes. You're definitely from Southern Europe. Could be Italy too, but I was betting more on Spain. And that wallet you have also looks from somewhere far away
HB: You're right, I bought it in my hometown

Then, some random chitchat happens. I'm done paying, and since I notice she's getting a bit flustered trying to find stuff in her wallet, I start walking away and say:

DarkJedi: I'd like to continue talking but I see you're having trouble with the payment, so I'll let you concentrate on that
HB: Actually I think I forgot my card
DarkJedi: oh really?
HB: Yeah. Hey sorry, but could you pay for me? I can pay you by bank transfer right now. Or cash if you want
DarkJedi: Hahahaha. (pause) ok I can do that. But bank transfer please, I don't use cash! (I also knew bank transfer would mean she would need my phone number)

So I pay for her, we walk out together with some more chitchat. Outside, she puts in her number on my phone.

DarkJedi: This is so random, I still don't know your name, so can't even save it!
HB: Hahaha so true. I'm HB
DarkJedi (shakes hands): Nice to meet you HB. I'm DarkJedi. You know, I just talked to you coz I liked your coat, but in the end I saved your ass.
HB: You're totally right. I dunno what I would have done otherwise.
DarkJedi: Yeah, you got saved by your coat.
HB: Yes!! This never happens to me though!
DarkJedi: I dunno. We should check that out. We should go for a coffee, let's see if you forget your card again then hahaha
HB: Hahaha sure.

I sent her the money request, with the message "saved by the coat". While she paid me back, I said

DarkJedi: I'm serious. Let's go grab a coffee soon. It was super random how we met, but you seem interesting
HB: Sure, that would be cool. I'm really busy this week though. I'm organizing a science fair in the weekend, got lots of prep. But maybe if you are interested in that you can come by and we can have a coffee. Its very close to where you live.

This is where I normally consider a girl politely blowing me off, but she kinda seemed genuine

DarkJedi: Oh I see. What's this fair about?
HB: blah blah about fair
DarkJedi: Cool. Sounds interesting. Not sure I'll have time in the weekend though. Else we'll do it sometime later. We'll figure it out
HB: Sounds good

The Texting
Thought of starting with a bit of chase framing, and also familiarity

DarkJedi: Hey, that was a very interesting way of asking for my number. I'll never forget
HB: Hahaa
HB: Well it wasn't the initial intention but yeah funny

I see that she's not wanting to buy into my frame. Decided to reply partly sarcastic and change course

DarkJedi: Yeah of course
DarkJedi: Where is this place in your whatsapp photo? Looks cool
HB: Lisbon!

I felt that she's not investing much. I didn't like the one-word answer in the end, so left her on read.

A few days later, on a day with pretty bad weather I text

DarkJedi: Hey HB! How are you doing? Hope you're not enjoying the amazing weather too much!
HB: Good
HB: Actually had to cycle a lot today haha
DarkJedi: (sent a video of people falling off their bikes in the wind)
DarkJedi: Like this?
DarkJedi: Actually went for a walk. Actually is nice outside when it ain't raining!
HB: (replying to the last message) yeahhh indeed

At this point I don't like the difference in investment levels, so I pull a hail mary and send a voice message an hour later:

DarkJedi: Anyway HB, hope you're having a good evening! I was thinking let's not be texting buddies and get that coffee we talked about sometime soon. This weekend will be tough, but let's do it sometime next week. What do you say?

I was left on read.

I would like to know your thoughts on what went wrong and how I could have done things differently.

I'm thinking

• The initial interaction was fun but didn't have strong sexual tension. Was it doomed to begin with then?
• Am I overthinking the texting too much and it should be simpler? Could have continued talking after the initial one word answer and not let it go cold by leaving her on read?
• Asked her to set a date on text earlier instead of bantering?
• Should I play it safe and not do chase frames and stuff on text?

This texting thing really drives me nuts. With high interest girls it just flows naturally, but other times its a hit or a miss. Just makes me anxious about texting! I even wonder if texting is even the problem to begin with or if its just a problem of not enough initial interest most of the times (which means I need to up my approach game instead of focusing on textgame)

Need some perspective guys!

 

[Will_V]

Looks to me like the frame during the approach wasn't all that great and you came across as more invested than her.

"I'd like to continue talking but I see you're having trouble with the payment, so I'll let you concentrate on that" that's fine but it is a little bit of a show of investment from you (I want to talk, you are distracted) that was then followed by you paying for her stuff, which dipped the investment scales a lot more on your side.

To rebalance I think you could have teased her a lot more, which you sort of did, but you did it by bringing up the coat which is again a small investment that you made at the beginning (I like your coat). So now the frame is like 'I want to talk to you but you're distracted so I'll pay for you because I like your coat' which just isn't a strong and dominant frame and feels like you're hiding your intentions a bit. And it just leaves your overinvestment (paying for her) there like a debt that you'll want her to replay at some point.

I reckon you could have come in with a harder frame like 'are you always going to be like this with me, needing me to save your ass?' it's a strong frame but it's almost like she's your little sister or something so it's not too intense, and also makes her think about proving herself to you, and frames you as already together.

The way you set up the date was a bit weak: "I'm serious. Let's go grab a coffee soon. It was super random how we met, but you seem interesting" here the frame is 'I'm serious but you're not' again a bit of an overinvestment followed by a very weak qualification of her. And her reply is basically 'if you're interested you can come see me where I'm going to be anyway'.

You did a good job of avoiding that but I think the interaction needed a bit more fuel before it could go to text, you maybe could have shown a bit more intent and sexual interest by just changing topics and using more body language, eye contact, touch etc. She has to go away basically knowing that you want to fuck her and you won't be wasting forever, that way even if the frame went a bit weak it will have ended on a strong and clear note.

Later on text you went on to too many boring threads - what's the place, the weather, people falling off bikes, nice walks. What was needed here was more teasing or even a soft close to make it clear you're not going to hang around forever trying to get around to the date. When your frame is weakened you have to push hard but not overextend, that tells her that you're ready to correct yourself immediately but you're not going to lose control.

At the end you went for a hard close from nothing and this was the most intent you showed the whole time: "I was thinking let's not be texting buddies" which isn't the strongest way of showing intent.

My guess is that at the end she simply wasn't 'feeling it', as in you simply came across a bit too unclear and overinvested.

My point of view is that when your back is against the wall - as in you have made a bunch of wrong moves - it's best to simply dominate the present moment as much as possible, even if it comes across too strong and burns the interaction out. Showing more intent, making more risky moves, but always with the demeanor that it doesn't matter if it doesn't pan out because you'll have done your part. Some girls when they see you do that they simply get turned on in the moment and then that feeling stays between you from there on.

 

[Skills]

After the bad weather forward it was bad .. she and you already made plans for coffee.... You open with a hard close to go for the coffee faster is bad texting.... She was already inviting you for the coffee in the event, for me comes out autistic and desperate...

 

[DarkJedi]

Amazing explanation, @Will_V . Thanks!!

You know, at some level, I can feel it when I start off at a weaker frame, but I find it very difficult to turn that around then. It feels incongruent to switch to being more dominant after the precedent is set.
It also depends on the girl. Like, when I teased this girl, she didn't seem to get more attracted, just laughed politely. I'm then thinking she already thinks she has the more dominant frame and I can't turn it around. But if she accepted the tease and became more feminine, it would be easy for me to continue on the dominant frame. I wonder if this is a mindset issue or I just need more practice.

"I'd like to continue talking but I see you're having trouble with the payment, so I'll let you concentrate on that" that's fine but it is a little bit of a show of investment from you (I want to talk, you are distracted) that was then followed by you paying for her stuff, which dipped the investment scales a lot more on your side.

Makes sense. I felt I was at an impasse here. If I didn't help her out and still just tried to talk and get her number, I'd look like an asshole or socially uncaibrated.

I reckon you could have come in with a harder frame like 'are you always going to be like this with me, needing me to save your ass?' it's a strong frame but it's almost like she's your little sister or something so it's not too intense, and also makes her think about proving herself to you, and frames you as already together.

Brilliant!!

Later on text you went on to too many boring threads - what's the place, the weather, people falling off bikes, nice walks. What was needed here was more teasing or even a soft close to make it clear you're not going to hang around forever trying to get around to the date. When your frame is weakened you have to push hard but not overextend, that tells her that you're ready to correct yourself immediately but you're not going to lose control.

I have become too careful with teasing on text. I have screwed up things by over-teasing or uncalibrated teasing over text in the past. I'll start bringing it back.

My point of view is that when your back is against the wall - as in you have made a bunch of wrong moves - it's best to simply dominate the present moment as much as possible, even if it comes across too strong and burns the interaction out. Showing more intent, making more risky moves, but always with the demeanor that it doesn't matter if it doesn't pan out because you'll have done your part. Some girls when they see you do that they simply get turned on in the moment and then that feeling stays between you from there on.

Thanks. Stronger frame control and detachment to outcome. Going to focus on these in coming interactions.

 

[DarkJedi]

After the bad weather forward it was bad .. she and you already made plans for coffee.... You open with a hard close to go for the coffee faster is bad texting.... She was already inviting you for the coffee in the event, for me comes out autistic and desperate...

So you say it would have been fine to go have coffee with her in her event? I was thinking it would then be completely on her terms. I was already over-invested and her texts were dry.

 

[Will_V]

Amazing explanation, @Will_V . Thanks!!

You know, at some level, I can feel it when I start off at a weaker frame, but I find it very difficult to turn that around then. It feels incongruent to switch to being more dominant after the precedent is set.
It also depends on the girl. Like, when I teased this girl, she didn't seem to get more attracted, just laughed politely. I'm then thinking she already thinks she has the more dominant frame and I can't turn it around. But if she accepted the tease and became more feminine, it would be easy for me to continue on the dominant frame. I wonder if this is a mindset issue or I just need more practice.


Makes sense. I felt I was at an impasse here. If I didn't help her out and still just tried to talk and get her number, I'd look like an asshole or socially uncaibrated.


Brilliant!!


I have become too careful with teasing on text. I have screwed up things by over-teasing or uncalibrated teasing over text in the past. I'll start bringing it back.


Thanks. Stronger frame control and detachment to outcome. Going to focus on these in coming interactions.

You'd only want to tease/push harder because of the initial lack of energy, if she was eating up your vibe at the start there'd be no need for it. But when she's deflecting it, you have to get her on the back foot a bit or else it'll probably end up wasted time.

 

[foggy]

DarkJedi: Where is this place in your whatsapp photo? Looks cool
HB: Lisbon!

She was choosing to keep the conversation going here and not make things awkward by adding an exclamation mark

I view this as a stepping stone to more compliance

A question you could ask to draw her further into conversation:

what’s your favorite thing about Lisbon?

Aim to find emotional information from her. It’s easy to work with to establish more stimulating threads. Easy to soft close off of too.