FR+ Missed Escalation Window

[Bboy100]

I met this girl via Tinder last night. We met up at a bar about 15 mins from my house. Originally, she had told me that she had the day off the next day, but midway through the night she mentioned that she ended up having to cover someone's shift the next day and she has to get up @ 6:30. This kinda ruined a huge portion of my plan for the night because I was intending to move her elsewhere. But by the time she told me, we only had half an hour till she had to leave.

Anyways, I met her @ the bar. We did some light bantering+deep diving for a while. Occasionally, I touched her here and there. At one point I disqualified myself as a BF.

Me: Na, I'm moving away for school again in a couple months.

Her: [Looks away with just a hint of sadness in her voice] Oh really, where's your school at?



The problem with using this as any type of gauge for how she felt about me is that she was kind of adhd-ish in general and her EC was terrible (i.e. she quickly broke eye contact and looked away throughout the entire date). And the sadness in her voice might have been something I was just imagining. Like, I'm legit not sure if it was even there. Her voice may have been entirely neutral. I can't remember very well.

Anyways, other than that, I moved her around the bar a few times, we continued chatting the whole time. I didn't really manage to create much of a sexual vibe. But I've noticed that's not always necessary to escalate. So as the date progressed, I consistently touched her to gauge how she feels about kissing me (ex. I was touching/stroking her hair at one point}. Eventually, I just went for it and kissed her. It was pretty brief and she broke it first, giggled and excused herself to go to the bathroom.

We talked some more etc. And she said she has to leave (this was 10 minutes later than when she said she had to go earlier, so I feel like it wasn't just an excuse to get away from me). It took us a while to get the bartenders attention so we could pay. So again, we talked and I also kissed her one more time. Again, she broke it after a brief period of time and giggled.

Finally, we left. She walked me down to my car, I had already asked about her favorite music etc.

Me: Let's go in my car and listen to music

Her: Yeah sure, go ahead I'm gonna go to my car (or something along those lines). [I'm not sure if she heard me correctly and pretended to ignore it as a form of politely saying no or if she genuinely thought I said I wanted to do it alone]

Me: Ok

As a goodbye, we made out for a little bit longer this time. Like, 10-15 seconds instead of just 1 or 2. Also this time it included tongue. Also, at the end, I grabbed her ass to try to escalate. She broke the kiss shortly after, giggled and told me to text her. She left.

It is now the next morning. I've checked Tinder and noticed that she's unmatched me. I also sent her the standard "I had a good time" text. She hasn't replied. And since she unmatched me, I don't expect her to.

As a final note, we're both lightweights and we had quite a few drinks. I was pretty drunk by the end of the night, and she was tipsy if not also drunk.

What do you guys think. I'm guessing this is a missed EW? Or based on all the giggling after every kiss, maybe she's not used to even kissing guys on first dates, and she's having "buyer's remorse" and feels taken advantage of cause she was tipsy/drunk (she seemed pretty conservative relative to a lot of girls I meet)?

Also, as a side note, I feel like I'm pretty bad at recognizing EW's. Like, I probably could have kissed her 10-20 mins earlier than I did. And had I been sure she wanted me to pull her (as opposed to the random shot in the dark I took), I probably would have been much more persistent. You guys know any advice or articles specifically about recognizing EW's?

 

[Smurf]

Hey BBoy, nice date dude!

Good job moving in for that kiss, always push for that.

she had told me that she had the day off the next day, but midway through the night she mentioned that she ended up having to cover someone's shift the next day and she has to get up @ 6:30.

Not sure if she was lying here or not. If she was planning on the date, she definitely should've known when she had to work, so maybe it was a time constraint she placed further into the date when she wanted it? That meaning that she might've lost interest somewhere along the way.

Me: Na, I'm moving away for school again in a couple months.

Her: [Looks away with just a hint of sadness in her voice] Oh really, where's your school at?

Good disqualification here.

The problem with using this as any type of gauge for how she felt about me is that she was kind of adhd-ish in general and her EC was terrible

Nerves/submissive attraction I believe. Did she seem nervous at all?

Eventually, I just went for it and kissed her. It was pretty brief and she broke it first, giggled and excused herself to go to the bathroom.

Break first, always. Since she went to the bathroom right after, she might've been logically thinking about that and that trip might've gave her time to do so.

Me: Let's go in my car and listen to music

Her: Yeah sure, go ahead I'm gonna go to my car (or something along those lines). [I'm not sure if she heard me correctly and pretended to ignore it as a form of politely saying no or if she genuinely thought I said I wanted to do it alone]

Looks like a polite no here to me. I've seen girls at my work do this to co-workers for minor things. It fucks the person that they say it to up because of the weird way it's worded. It agrees, and then suggests something else so your mind is inclined to say, "Okay, sure." It's honestly a good technique to suggest doing something else if you don't want to do something.

I think you might've lost it before this, but since it's tinder/cold approach, you might as well have pushed a little more, "Just one song, I promise you I have some music we can jam out to."

Again with the kissing, you should break first always.

What do you guys think. I'm guessing this is a missed EW? Or based on all the giggling after every kiss, maybe she's not used to even kissing guys on first dates, and she's having "buyer's remorse" and feels taken advantage of cause she was tipsy/drunk (she seemed pretty conservative relative to a lot of girls I meet)?

Was there any sort of extreme mood change from the first half of the date to the second? She might've lost attraction gradually as the date progressed. That, or my other theory is that she wanted you to lead her more and you didn't. How long did you guys stay at the bar? You might've wanted to change scenery, take her on a walk or something.

Otherwise, good job man getting her out and kissing her! Keep it up!

Jake.

 

[Bboy100]

Not sure if she was lying here or not. If she was planning on the date, she definitely should've known when she had to work, so maybe it was a time constraint she placed further into the date when she wanted it? That meaning that she might've lost interest somewhere along the way.

Perhaps. But she seemed pretty sincere. Plus, she seemed pretty into me. And in most cold approach dates, girls usually have no problem just saying "I gotta go" when they want to leave. And she probably wouldn't have kissed me if she wasn't interested (the first kiss happened after this).

Nerves/submissive attraction I believe. Did she seem nervous at all?

The adhd/ bad ec thing were her words, not mine. I hadn't even noticed till she pointed it out. lol. She didn't seem nervous.

Break first, always. Since she went to the bathroom right after, she might've been logically thinking about that and that trip might've gave her time to do so.

Yeah, I normally try to. But this girl broke it quicker than any girl I had kissed before. It was literally like, 1-2 seconds. lol. And I didn't break first next to my car cause I was hoping to escalate (the parking lot was pretty secluded and we were right next to my car).

Was there any sort of extreme mood change from the first half of the date to the second? She might've lost attraction gradually as the date progressed. That, or my other theory is that she wanted you to lead her more and you didn't. How long did you guys stay at the bar? You might've wanted to change scenery, take her on a walk or something.

I was actually going to initially take her to a nearby park. But since she told me she had to go early, I decided I didn't have time for that. As a substitute, I did take her to a different part of the bar. And there was also no one there (I found out later we weren't supposed to be there). So it was kind of a change of scenery/vibe. But still probably not the same as actually getting up and going somewhere else entirely.

There was no noticeable change in mood at all. That's why I was almost sure I would be ok with not pulling her that night. We stayed for about 1 hr 45 mins. As for leading her, yeah, I might have kind of lost the role as leader towards the end via her breaking kisses and also she's the one who announced it was time to go.

 

[Smurf]

In that case she just seemed really submissive to me.

I hate when girls break the kiss 1 or 2 seconds later, it SUCKS! Good shit moving her around the bar in that case though. I can't really get a read on this girl :/

You did a really good job persisting here honestly. It's a good reference experience if she doesn't text you back, but if she does, hella get her on that day 2

Jake.

 

[Bboy100]

Yeah, this one feels hella sketchy. The only thing I could have really changed was persisting a little harder towards the end and maybe not kissing her for a second time until we got to the car. I'll just call her tomorrow & try to invite her to a second date. If she doesn't pick up, I'll NEXT her.

 

[ray_zorse]

I think you revealed your intentions towards her too early. If you knew you couldn't escalate and would have to go to a date #2 you should've been pretty chilled, more of a regular-guy vibe, this is something radeng taught me recently, she should be thinking "yeah, he seems like an ok guy, why wouldn't I go on a date with him", if you're gonna get out the intense EC, sexual vibe, sexual framing, intimate touch, etc, then you should follow through with sex the same day, cos it's a double edged sword, when her emotions cool she's gonna have a lot more apprehension about meeting you again and what will probably happen if she does. Plus you want her chasing, thinking "does he like me, does he not", and the kiss ruins the tension and intrigue, she knows she has you after that. Furthermore girls are nervous about kissing in public, it's an inbuilt reputation-damage thing. That would be why she broke it off, not that she wasn't into you.
Ray

 

[Bboy100]

I think you revealed your intentions towards her too early. If you knew you couldn't escalate and would have to go to a date #2 you should've been pretty chilled, more of a regular-guy vibe, this is something radeng taught me recently, she should be thinking "yeah, he seems like an ok guy, why wouldn't I go on a date with him", if you're gonna get out the intense EC, sexual vibe, sexual framing, intimate touch, etc, then you should follow through with sex the same day, cos it's a double edged sword, when her emotions cool she's gonna have a lot more apprehension about meeting you again and what will probably happen if she does. Plus you want her chasing, thinking "does he like me, does he not", and the kiss ruins the tension and intrigue, she knows she has you after that.

Yeah, the whole kissing/escalating thing still confuses the shit out of me. When I started out, I religiously followed Chase's "No kissing till you get her to yours" rule. Then I noticed girls going cold on me after the first date. Every time. No exceptions. So then I started kissing girls on first dates. I had one who rejected my kiss attempt go on a second date with me. And all the rest turned into either missed EW's or lays. Tbh, I've only been on 2 second dates in my life (not counting girls who I laid on the first). And I feel like its related to physicality one way or another. Because very few girls are genuinely uninterested in me when I go on dates with them. Most of them seem to be having a good time. So I can't imagine its a value issue.

As for keeping a regular-guy vibe. I guess I can try that again now that my fundementals and conversation skills are better. But I'm just worried that it'll slot me into the "Boring friendly guy" category. Cause Kiss attempts=attainability+value right?

Furthermore girls are nervous about kissing in public, it's an inbuilt reputation-damage thing. That would be why she broke it off, not that she wasn't into you.

Good call! This also might explain all the weird giggling.
Its too bad. I actually liked this girl. haha

Edit: If its not a missed EW (i.e. auto rejection), she might not resent me atm. She might just be hesitant to meet me. Could some form of apology for "getting sloppy/missing social cues" be helpful? Or would that sound supplicatory?