FR moving too fast + nervous girl

[Smith]

Hey guys,

the last two dates I went on had a similar pattern like this, where the girl is nervous when we got back to my place and they become really quiet. Anyway, here's the date today. Let me know what you think!

So I saw this girl as I was about to cross the road and head home, but I turned around and caught up with her. She was flattered when I gave her a compliment. I remember I felt great after the gym and already had a good interaction with another girl a few minutes before, so I was riding the wave of social momentum. Everything was pretty good in this interaction. My intent was clear and I was free-flowing and joking with her. However, after finding out a little about her, I had a gut feeling that we might have a good sexual connection but she doesn't really have anything that interests me because she kept telling me she's boring and doesn't do any sport stuff or anything. So personality-wise, I didn't think we would be a good match. I asked her out on an instant-date but she said she had to go to church and offered to exchange numbers. She put her number in my phone and mine's in hers. I didn't send her an icebreaker that night because she already had my number and I was also planning on asking her out the next day.

Next morning comes, I send her a typical "Hey XX, thinking about grabbing that coffee sometime! what's your schedule like?" She replied 30 mins later saying she's free this afternoon or next weekend. I told her to meet me in the afternoon, and we set up a time and place.

I meditated for about 10 mins before the date. I found that this always helps me to enjoy the date. Anyway, skip forward to the date. The initial vibe was ok. We were both enjoying ourselves. Started with a little of fluff talk, then transitioned into building connection. One thing that annoyed me a little was that she didn't have any stories to share, and I was the one coming up with funny stories. That I found weird because she's 29 and I'm 23, and she has studied oversea before, so there must be something she could talk about. Maybe she felt put on the spot and couldn't talk about herself. We talked for about 30 mins, but I didn't realize the cafe close early today, so we were kindly asked to leave.

This kind of screwed up my date process a little. I felt a little rushed to escalate because my date process is usually sit at the cafe and build connection and have fun for about 45mins to an hour and then when there is that moment of "silence" where we kind of like each other, then I suggest we go for a walk where I can start escalate. Anyway, since the cafe was closing, I suggested we go for a walk and sit down at a grassy area in front of a river nearby. But the whole thing still feels a little rushed to me. My past experience told me that rushing a date and moving too fast could freak out the girl. On the way there, I started to hold her hand to test the water. She was loosely holding onto it and doesn't hold on tight when I let go a little. It was good that I started escalate, because waiting any longer probably wouldn't do anyone any good either. However, at that moment I felt like I should've called it out, like "this is too fast" but I didn't. I wonder if that was the right move.

I think my frame here also started to get into competitive mode and that's probably what went wrong. As we sat down on the grass, my voice felt constricted, which is a sign of getting into this competitive frame Tyler talks about. I wish I realized this at that time. You should always come from a collaborative frame. You're "in her head" to share the fun. My energy felt constricted too instead of being expansive.

She started to become a little quieter and conversation was ok. I felt like I could have pause more and let the silent sink in. I think my leadership vibe could've been better here. She also wasn't really relating that much, doing the whole "I'm boring I got nothing to share" thing. Sometimes I feel like I'm the one who has "let go" more. I made the mistake of cutting her off during the conversation once. I should try to pause more later on in the date next time. I tried to seed some ideas for pull, but she wasn't jumping on the opportunity, so I had to just lead her back to my place by inviting her to look at some of my paintings.

On our way home, we were holding hands but she was still loosely holding onto it, which is an okay sign, but not a solid one. As we got to our place, she was a little hesitant to come up. I asked her if she wanted anything to drink. She said she's fine. Maybe I should have grabbed water myself and chilled in the kitchen for a while before I move her to my room??? So it doesn't seem like I'm eager to get her to my room?? shit..gotta try that next time if the girl seems nervousness and a little unsure lol

Once we got to our room, she left the door open, which was fine. I could tell she was a little nervous and unsure. she waited at the door and asked me where's my painting. I think I was moving too fast. She sat down on my bed. I took some deep breaths to relax myself. I showed her my paintings. She laughed and said I have potential. I put the paintings aside and sat down next to her. My vibe was starting to become serious and heavy, instead of relaxed and fun. I leaned in to kiss her when she was talking but stopped right in front of her face to see if she'll kiss me. She hold the tension for one second and backed off and got up. She walked towards the door, and told me she can't do this. I said ok. and she left.

3 things I did well
1. Escalation. Just go for it then calibrate. (Although in the end she walked away too fast, there was nothing I could do lol)
2. Lead. Just lead.
3. Sharing stories. Getting better at it. Although I need remember to stay present while talking, so there's no try hard vibe coming off. And just take my time enjoying my story.

4 things I could've done better
1. Calibration - always the key. Should've chill and relax more at the river front. Then slow down when we were back at my place. Don't move too fast if the girl's not comfortable.
2. Moving in for the kiss. I felt like I shouldn't have stop right in front of her face and should've just kissed her and maybe she'll melt into it. Because I think MAYBE her logic kicked in during that brief second, and she realized this was moving too fast. Anyway, I was experimenting with this.
3. "I'm in your head" - I should remember the feeling that I'm here to share and have that authority vibe and emotion behind the things I say. I think the authority vibe was gone when we moved to the river front.
4. Collaborative frame. The girl want the same thing as you. You are on the same team. Don't be competitive. Your energy is hers and hers is yours.

Let me know what you think. Appreciate any feedback =) Have another date tomorrow. Hopefully I can take the lessons from here and apply it tomorrow.

 

[Skid]

Hey smith ,

I can totally relate to you here you as far as I can tell you handled everything well up until the kiss. I think your totally right that she is really nervous and by hovering your lips over hers she had tons of time to get into her head and get even more nervous. It's a pretty tough situation when your still learning seduction because you don't really have the experience to make her melt and forget her nervousness because you are nervous too ; I remember at some point you were saying how you had to tell yourself to breathe and calm down. Your vibe is infectious and so it affects her as well.

The fact of the matter is that you and me both aren't master seducers its really easy to picture yourself kissing her and then having her melt and then blowing her mind with orgasms but I've found that often only increases the anxiety I feel and therefore onto the girl as well. Why? Because of all these expectations that you and the girl have created. I think the solution is to remove these expectations and the pressure - call out the elephant in the room. Funnily enough that seems to remove a lot of the pressure in any social situation.

More often than not people get really nervous about sex because it's an act of vulnerability your letting the other person see the flaws on your body and opening up emotionally. Thing is guys are a lot better at hiding their emotions than girls imo and she probably couldn't even tell you were nervous too. Just be honest and smile at her warmly and say :

Hey listen I know your nervous , I'm nervous too - but thing is this is ment to be fun. So I think we should just try and have fun no expectations no matter what happens ok? If you want to stop just say so and its done no questions asked.pinky swear we won't judge each other?

Then go for kiss or other form of escalation if she says ok

See you are still leading her but in a less intimidating way and you aren't trying to pretend you 100 percent know what you are doing hopefully it makes her more secure and comfortable. Remember it's collaboration not competition like you said help each other be at ease.

Keep I mind that this is the advice I have for myself next time I encounter a girl similar to the one you have described , so it's not field tested but I don't see any harm in trying something different. As long as you understand that this is a crutch to help you get to the stage where you can make girls melt.

Skid

 

[Brendan]

Hey Smith, good FR.

When the situation rushes you, it can be tough. I've had it happen, and it's easy to fall into chasing things. You kept your cool enough, and that's something!

One thing that stood out to me is that you went for holding hands. That's a very couple-y boyfriend move. I've done it, and even after realizing what frame that sets I've accidentally slipped into it when I felt I was losing a girl or the sexual tension wasn't there. But it's confusing and incongruent to a girl when her soft white knight leads her to his bedroom -- commitment first or sex first? Your role is to be a lover first.

Sounds like you're doing good at being mindful and avoiding competition and bitterness. I like that and will hopefully remember your story when I'm feeling a little too "versus" rather than collaborative.

Keep at it, man

 

[Smith]

Skid,

Hey listen I know your nervous , I'm nervous too - but thing is this is ment to be fun. So I think we should just try and have fun no expectations no matter what happens ok? If you want to stop just say so and its done no questions asked.pinky swear we won't judge each other?

I felt like this was the right move to do too. call it out and release pressure. Good one!

Brendan,

Thanks for the encouragment man!

One thing that stood out to me is that you went for holding hands. That's a very couple-y boyfriend move. I've done it, and even after realizing what frame that sets I've accidentally slipped into it when I felt I was losing a girl or the sexual tension wasn't there. But it's confusing and incongruent to a girl when her soft white knight leads her to his bedroom -- commitment first or sex first? Your role is to be a lover first.

I have done one night stands where we hold hands like we were lovers, so I don't think it's necessary a boyfriend move. The act itself does not mean you want to be her bf. It just feels good to hold hands and it establishes a physical connection. And most importantly, you're expressing your desire. I've seen RSD instructors pulling girls home from a nightclub and they were holding hands...I doubt the vibe is boyfriend-ish lol. That's just my experience after trying this out a lot of times.

 

[Seppuku]

Hey Smith,

First of all you have an end-to-end process from meet to bed, and you indeed lead well throughout your process. That's the most important.

What strikes me here is, when you guys reach your home it seems like you are both a bit nervous. She's "nervous and unsure", and you need to take some "deep breath to relax". She was already nervous in the first place. Plus, if you are nervous, she will sense it and become even more nervous. Both state of mind has to be fixed before it can go anywhere. No wonder her reaction.

My guess is you didn't build enough comfort and emotional connection before pulling her. You mention "sharing stories". It's a very good thing to do and good skill to have, but did you try to make her talk? The deep diving, having her talk and talk, is much more efficient to build comfort and connection, in my experience, than story telling. She needs to do most of the talking. This girl won't speak of herself spontaneously? So you need to pull the stories out of her. It will just become easier once she started.

Another point: handling the transition. You're in a place, the vibe is good. You pull her to another place, and unless the commute is very short, awkwardness and nervousness builds up in anticipation of what's next. When you reach the new place, the vibe is now off. I don't really know how you handled that here, but it's something you want to watch. You don't want silences when you're commuting between places. That's where knowing how to share stories becomes useful. This is where you can do most of the talking.

About the touch. I would personally take her by the hand and lead her, in a "come with me" fashion. It's much better than no touch at all. So that's good. You can try to be a bit more playful with the touch. You're in the cafe, while you guys are having conversation, you start being touchy. You get her used to your touch. Then you withdraw, and lean back. If she likes you, she will lean into you and touch you back. Later, you become touchy again. Play a little bit with her hair. Etc... All this happening in the background, while you two are talking. Positive, negative, positive. Touch, withdraw. Wait. Touch again. Etc... This builds excitement and sexual tension.

OK man, let me know if this is helpful. If you're not doing this, give it a try on your next date.

Cheers,
Seppuku