Moving Too Fast?

[ProblemSolving]

Hey gents,

I've recently encountered some new problems and I'm trying to find out how to solve them.

My typical date process is as follows: meet at a location near my place, grab a frozen yogurt, walk back to my place to eat, a little touching throughout as I get to know her, watch movie and escalate on my bed.

Very fast and very efficient; HOWEVER, it can scare off some of the more inexperienced girls. One of the things I screen for when considering a long term relationship prospect is how conservative she is, but my process screens OUT some of these girls.

For example, the last girl I had over was really young, attractive, and I later found out, conservative. I could tell she wasn't super comfortable, but I escalated anyway. I felt up her legs while watching the movie and tried to get my hand on her pussy. She let out a nervous giggle and crossed her legs hard. No biggie, girls usually put up some resistance before letting it happen. I gave her space and tried again, but this time she wanted to leave. I know the difference between experienced resistance (they want you to keep trying) and inexperienced resistance (they want you to stop), so I drove her home and I of course couldn't get her out again.

I'm trying to figure out what I would have done differently. I hate having to consider it, but maybe moving slower is the answer? Some girls just need more time to cook, but how do you find that out without scaring them off?

 

[Franco]

PS,

With more inexperienced girls, you certainly want to make them feel comfortable, even if they want to leave. When they leave, they should still feel like they really wanted to have sex with you (possibly giggling on the way out the door) but they just didn't let it happen. If you let the mood get awkward and/or sour as they're heading out the door, then that's the mood that they'll remember when you try to contact them again.

Being extra playful scores extra points here on getting a chance to see them again. If you begin escalating on a girl and she looks uncomfortable in the "I want to leave now" way, then it means you need to take a giant step backward and focus on making her comfortable again before you attempt escalation. If she has the look of, "I know what you're doing, and I want it, but I'm going to make you work for it," then you only need to take small steps backward and continue attempting to make escalation strides quickly after.

Your escalation "tempo" needs to match her comfort level -- the more comfortable she is, the faster you cycle through your escalation steps; the less comfortable she is, the slower you cycle through your escalation.

If it seems she's really wanting to leave and you decide it's not going to happen, then I would suggest keeping her around for a bit before she goes and making her laugh/smile for awhile so she walks out the door with a good impression of you. Sometimes you will push a girl a bit too far into the uncomfortable zone that it's nearly impossible to get her back, but you really have nothing to lose at that point if she's ready to leave, so give it your best shot to try to have her leave on a good note. A little makeout session at the door (with you cutting it off quickly before she does) can sometimes be the perfect antidote!

- Franco

 

[ProblemSolving]

This really struck a chord with me as, living in the Bible Belt, I've always questioned the "you should have sex on the first date or your out" rule, since I've felt many times I'd push and frame and hang in there and then lose the girl for good.

This is usually the advice that you get from guys that do a lot of night game. They never encounter any conservative girls at the bar or club, so the thought of a girl not putting out back at their pad does not compute.

Some girls I had no problem laying right away and I couldn't pull out a major difference that I made with those girls vs the ones I lost other than the girl was more conservative.

Yep, it mostly boils down to the girl's sexual experience level and expectations. I have actually run into quite a few virgins (they are not as rare as some people think) in my time and you really have to treat them with kid gloves when it comes to escalation. Even if you arouse them enough to want to have sex at that moment, they tend to beat themselves up for "being a slut" when the lights turn back on.

With more inexperienced girls, you certainly want to make them feel comfortable, even if they want to leave. When they leave, they should still feel like they really wanted to have sex with you (possibly giggling on the way out the door) but they just didn't let it happen. If you let the mood get awkward and/or sour as they're heading out the door, then that's the mood that they'll remember when you try to contact them again

I wouldn't say the mood was sour, but the jig was up - my dirtbag player card was revealed. If I had to guess, she'd was probably thinking something like, "You got me over here to fuck me and probably dump me. Good thing I didn't fall for it."

Sometimes you will push a girl a bit too far into the uncomfortable zone that it's nearly impossible to get her back, but you really have nothing to lose at that point if she's ready to leave, so give it your best shot to try to have her leave on a good note.

Yeah, when I dropped her off at home, she had a big smile on her face and hugged me before she left, but I knew it was going to be the last time I saw her. I played my hand too aggressively and spoiled the ending to the movie, so I didn't really attempt to salvage it. I tried to get her out again, but no one goes to see a movie when they already know the ending and she was no exception.

I think when I'm dealing with a girlfriend prospect in the future, I'll escalate more gradually. My last girlfriend was a virgin and it was a much slower escalation. I had her lie down beside me with my arm around her while watching a movie, I rolled on top of her and kissed her, at which point she told me she was a virgin and asked if we could just watch the movie. I agreed and didn't try anything else. She left my house ecstatic and couldn't wait to see me again. This would be a terrible date for an experienced girl, but for the inexperienced girl, it met all of her expectations.

Inversely, being very aggressive like grabbing a girl's pussy before kissing her, is HIGHLY effective for experienced girls, but as I have recently found out, it can scare off the inexperienced ones.

 

[mindful]

I was going to talk about this exact scenario in my next field report.

I was out of town for a week and ended up meeting a few girls off tinder. The second girl I met was very out going and sexually forward with her comments. I thought it was a shoe in just from the things she was saying. We were locked armed and arm as we left the second bar and headed back to my place. Got her to my room and tried escalating but got hard resistance on the kiss. I got the player card thrown my way. This doesn't always happen but sometimes down. I brushed it off in a light hearted manner.

Anyways, this girl reminded me of another girl a few months back that I couldn't lay. Some girls just internalize that they don't hook up with a guy the first night. I think it has to do with their ego honestly, and they treat it as a point system. They might really be into you, like this girl was. But it just wasn't happening. I ended up walking her back to her car and we chilled there for an hour and a half. Again, I tried escalating but the farthest I could get was grabbing her boobies.

Either way I didn't get far with her sexually. We ended up having brunch a few days later and she paid (after I jokingly said it was on her).

I generally don't like to see a girl again if I don't get with her the first night but I guess it's not a hard fast rule and more a guideline.

 

[Franco]

Anyways, this girl reminded me of another girl a few months back that I couldn't lay. Some girls just internalize that they don't hook up with a guy the first night. I think it has to do with their ego honestly, and they treat it as a point system. They might really be into you, like this girl was. But it just wasn't happening. I ended up walking her back to her car and we chilled there for an hour and a half. Again, I tried escalating but the farthest I could get was grabbing her boobies.

Either way I didn't get far with her sexually. We ended up having brunch a few days later and she paid (after I jokingly said it was on her).

I generally don't like to see a girl again if I don't get with her the first night but I guess it's not a hard fast rule and more a guideline.

Yeah, the one thing to keep in mind with inexperienced girls, though, is that they have a higher likelihood of being willing to see you again (assuming they liked you). If you find the girl very attractive and don't mind the wait, you can still see her multiple times and get the lay. It depends on how much effort you're willing to put into it.

That's the downside with experienced girls though -- if you didn't get the lay on the first date, there's a much lower likelihood of her taking time out of her busy schedule to give you another chance. An experienced woman has a lot of options, and she'll more often take the more aggressive guy who makes things happen quickly rather than waste her time with the guy who wants to move slowly (and possibly not give her what she's actually looking for anyway).

- Franco

 

[mindful]

How do you tell if a girl is inexperienced before actually making a move then? I thought she was down to fuck from our convos and vibe. But she fooled me haha. Because a girl can still be inexperienced but you can push through. I think it's more an internal thing and her beliefs. Is there an article on this?

 

[ProblemSolving]

How do you tell if a girl is inexperienced before actually making a move then? I thought she was down to fuck from our convos and vibe. But she fooled me haha. Because a girl can still be inexperienced but you can push through. I think it's more an internal thing and her beliefs. Is there an article on this?

This girl was experienced and DTF; HOWEVER, because Tinder girls tend to be very experienced, they have all kinds of tactics to try to strong-arm you into the Boyfriend category and away from the Lover category.

My last tinder lay, pushed back hard when I went for her pussy. I endured a big lecture about how, "Sex was definitely NOT going to happen" and how "I'm 10 moves ahead of you, you're playing checkers and I'm playing chess." I smiled and replied, "Okay no more checkers, let's play chess." I escalated again, and 5 minutes later we were having sex - CHECK MATE. She left my place a happy girl, all because I could see through her bullshit.

The difference is HOW they resist your advances. An inexperienced girl will be nervous and uncomfortable when she resists, while an experienced girl will be confident. The confidence comes from experience.

An inexperienced girl resists because this is new ground for her. She is not comfortable moving so fast with a guy. Best to take it easy with them. An experienced girl resists, not because she is uncomfortable, but because she wants more investment out of you before giving up the goods. With these girls, it's a matter of getting them aroused enough for them to say, "Ah, screw it. Let's doing this!"

 

[ProblemSolving]

Hey radeng,

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