What's new

Power games...should i start playing?

Ezio

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Messages
82
Sometimes some things or happenings seem small and not of any effect, but it happens that in the long-run these small details become factors in a power dynamic that is going through a relationship, at a particular moment in time.

I, myself, have always been a noble, sincere, honest and principled man in essence. I have always been a man of word and able to go out of my way to keep my promises. I was a pure child thinking the world is all flowers and bright, so i thought people should be like this too, i expected others to be honest and sincere, like me. I would always say the truth, being direct about what i thought, even if it didn't sound good to the other person. Being sincere, was one of my principles and i could not break it, because i deeply believed that even white lies should not be told. But, later i came to think that anything that is excessive, also tends to get harmful. To metaphorize it, I called it "My syndrome of sincerity".

People with this syndrome, are an easy prey for manipulators, whether be it people or the life itself. Many of nice guys and white knights carry this inside themselves. Maybe all people are born like this, with this innocence, but we continue with this even at a later age. To understand it better, imagine a guy with this syndrome and a lion - he would go talk to the lion expecting that he will be nice and polite with him, but we know the reality is that at the first chance the lion would eat him, and if he survives the attack, he would go wondering why did it happen....why the world isn't all rainbows and sunshines like he thought?

I used to wonder about this for a long time. In my reality at that time, I believed people could lie, but never to the extent where they would try to convince you that the sun is blue. It was a shock to my internal world, to find out these things exist. I was sincere, i expected the other side to be the same. Okay, time passed by, I understood where it comes from, i accepted the fact and moved on with this thing.

But on the other hand, I could never imagine people do things, small or big or seemingly nonsense, just for the sake of establishing power. For example, I would never do things such as delaying a message in an instant chat, just to make the other person think i'm busy when i wasn't, for the sake of establishing more power or value to my side; I would not never flake in a meeting, just to make the other person seem less important than me; I would never be the one to rush to be the one saying good-bye first just for the sake of appearing less needy or the one breaking the conversation; I would never test and challenge people just to gain some power over them; I would never do things just to see how they would react; I would not switch different personas simply for getting what i want; I would not treat a person differently than before, before he was weak, just because now i would have the chance of gaining some power;
I would never ask for not needed compliance just for the sake of establishing authority.; simply i was never trying to outpower somebody in a single relationship or group. I'm talking about the relationships with both genders, at some points especially with guys.

Nowdays, it has been a time since i got into seduction stuff and frankly I have learned a lot of things that I never thought would be running underneath - for instance, the power dynamics. Maybe most of people get it intuitively but i didn't. I learned about humans, their psychology and mind - how it works, evolutionary explanation of things and so on, thus, i came to understand them instead of judging. I rarely keep long resentment when somebody tries or manipulates me or tries outpowering me using emotional knowledge or taking advantage of different dynamics, consciously or unconsciously. I am not judging these actions. This is how the world works and i am okay with it.

But, when i get outpowered or manipulated, now i am able to know it but i can't counter it because of that syndrome, of that man i am in essence. I still tend to hold to my innocent way of viewing things. When i try to play a power game, like doing something just for the sake of it, i don't know why but i feel bad. I think it sucks of not being free to be transparent because people can manipulate with what they see through it. I feel guilty when i do a power game.

But, honestly, i grew tired of it. I'm tired of being the noble man. It seems to be that when you are not playing with the same card, just because you wanna be nice, you put yourself in unfair position.

So here comes, my question, should i start playing the power games just for the sake of it?

I hope i was clear. As always, feel free to ask anything unclear to you.

-Ezio.
 
the right date makes getting her back home a piece of cake

ray_zorse

Modern Human
Modern Human
Joined
Aug 12, 2014
Messages
1,982
I wouldn't really regard these as power games. Check out Chase's ebook, he describes most of the same things, but he phrases it like this "A social novice will do X... whereas a social veteran will do Y". So, you're saying you don't want to be a social novice anymore. I agree. I was exactly like you, now I'm still exactly like you, except I'm sometimes less of a social novice. :) Do all the things you describe. Sometimes, overdo them, for the sake of gaining calibration. And then, apply the techniques judiciously. With girls who are genuine and show you their vulnerable side, and will have sex whenever you want, and follow your lead 100%, and do not place any demands on you, then, obviously you don't need to worry too much about the power balance. Focus on attainability instead of value (show your vulnerable side as well at times, etc).
Ray
 

Drck

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Feb 14, 2013
Messages
1,488
That's a good topic, excellent post, I'm actually surprised that people still care...

Personally I believe that sincerity and honesty, telling the truth and being direct are great. We could only wish that politicians and businessman were sincere and honest in stead of being slick and deceitful, right there we could eliminate half of the useless laws. We could only wish that people are sincere and honest, right there we could eliminate the other half...

You are right, as the person gets older those characteristic disappear, he usually starts following the crowd because it is much easier to take shortcuts, he becomes the same as the rest of the crowd...

Don't be like the crowd, don't be deceived by great and loud liars that are unfortunately leading our society. Don't be mislead by a man who can fake sincerity and honesty, who can pretend being a true man, yet who has no spine...

Be your own man, be true and sincere to yourself and others, be an honest man. This should be your mental spine, once you get strong there is just no way anybody could manipulate you. You simply stick to the truth no matter what.

But you got to be smart and you can't be naive. You cannot go and hug a lion, that is insanity, you will be eaten alive. You cannot tell the great liars about their lies, because you might be prosecuted either in direct or in a slick way. You simply let the lion where he is, you let the liars live their great lies - and you live your life in truth and honesty, not giving a damn what the rest of the crowd thinks about it... Let people lie, yet you live in truth.... Don't be a crowd, don't follow any crowd. Walk your own way, and walk alone if you have to...

That is actually a TRUE power, if you have ambitions to become a leader, and if you built your values on those characteristic, if you have common sense, people will follow you without questioning. They will trust you, they will want to be like you because they know you are a TRUE man, and not just a loud fake...

As far as seduction, you have to build your life first. You have to have important things to do in your life, whether it is fitness or business or something else. Girls come only after that, they are on 3rd or 4th place on your list of importance. This way you won't jump on every message they send you, this way it make take you couple of hours to reply, this way it make take you several days before you can even find time for a date - because your important things have to be finished first...

Once you develop that life style, you don't actually have to worry much about compliance, authority, leading skills and lots of other seduction stuff. You don't have to pretend anything because you are a true man - you like the girl and you go after her with genuine interest. You have your values and you follow them, you follow your believes - and the girl will simply join you on your way because she will FEEl that you are a strong leader....

See, the whole seduction is many times just an imitation of successful men, that's why many people think it is a fake. You basically imitate characteristics and behavior of men who are successful and true leaders (commonly known as alpha males), you polish it, add to it some smartness to it - and you are a great seducer. Or, you can forget the whole seduction, built a real values as you described, become a true, genuine, open and non-judgmental man who walks his own way - and you will also have the same characteristics and behaviors, without faking it...

Be a TRUE genuine man, build your whole personality around those values, stick to those values, follow those values and don't follow other people no matter what... and you will build TRUE power. Maybe not in a year or two, but eventually yes...

Good luck on Your Way...
 

Ezio

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Messages
82
Ray,

Which of the ebooks are you talking about? The free one?

Are you suggesting me to start playing these "power games"? -because, anyway, i think these are games at the end.

Thanks for your input, you and Drck are the guys who are contributing to my questions mostly, and i thank you both a lot for that, without excluding the others who are doing a great job in helping me as well.

Drck,

You really are a fountain of generosity. I wonder where you get all this energy to contribute man, that is marvelous! I congratulate you for that!

I don't know you personally, but i believe from the vibes that i recieved from you through reading your posts in the forum, that you also share the traits i once had - nobility, sincerity and honesty. You are right about these traits being great. Understanding that you value these characteristics a lot, i understand why you would reinforce me to hold into these.

You are not wrong, that is how an ideal world would look like for us, but in the reality maybe these traits need adjustments. You are also right when you say about building the values. At the time, when i had these values at their best, people respected me more, but I was not happy. I was always striving to walk my own way, not following the crowd, i always wanted to be different, but i felt alone, because we are social creatures and we need to socialize, but in order to do that, we need to know how to work within the society, which means that within the society, there are liars or bad people, but ultimately, they are only human creatures driven by primitive emotions. That is why i don't judge them. Their perception of the reality might not be the same as ours, therefore, they don't know that what they are doing is what we from our perception call wrong. So, the problem is that they use different cards in life, maybe you have to play their game or they fucking beat you. You can't escape from the people playing games, they happen to be your friends, old friends, family, or every person in general, because people play these psychological games unconsciously, not rarely. Yet, I agree that building the values is one of the solutions to this, but what to do while in the transition time? What could be the adjustments?

This also might be a limited vision of mine, in which case, please enlighten me further. Could you please structure your next answer like a step by step method on what concrete actions i should take after reading it to apply the given advice? For example, one step i should take is to start building my life.

It is not that i am not understanding you already, i just want to break it down, so i can absorb it even more.

That is all of what i can think right now.

Thanks,

-Ezio.
 

Drck

Cro-Magnon Man
Cro-Magnon Man
Joined
Feb 14, 2013
Messages
1,488
"I was always striving to walk my own way, not following the crowd, i always wanted to be different, but i felt alone"

>>>> you are touching very deep subject, I could write the whole book just from the top of my head... It always depends on what you want and what's your personality (duh), when you want to be more social you have to adjust yourself to the crowd; if you walk your own way, you will be more alone. Based on my experience, crowd is fake, you sort of have to behave like a sheep without your own thinking, you learn to be a follower and not a leader because you do the same things like everyone else. You have to be sort of a follower because you have to agree with lots of people to keep "social".

If you keep your 'strong' opinions though you will create lots of enemies, just for the fact that you believe in something. Classical example is politics or religion, if you express freely your opinion or believe without being careful in choosing words, you may "lose" many friends from your social circle. Once I posted something silly on my FB and about 10 "friends" de-friended me, LOL. Those were people I worked with for months. Not that I care, just trying to show the 'power' of opinions, try it and you'll see...

So people that are good in crowd are very careful in expressing their opinions and believes, they are rather 'light', appear more tolerant, and they are more socially tuned. You sort of have to be a Nice Guy to be good in groups, see e.g. Dale Carnegie's "How to win friends and influence people". That's a great book, in essence it is teaching you to be classical Nice Guy. Which in a sense is an exact opposite behavior of a seducer. Maybe I'm not describing in in a right way, it would take too long to explain, but I believe that if you learn from this book you will be quite popular in groups, but at the same time you will also have lots of problems with girls... So eventually you will have to un-learn some stuff, or integrate it into seduction...

You could became a leader of a group, sort of Alpha guy as classically described. You climb the ladder up, build friends and acquaintances, keep your strong opinions... Except if you become good, e.g. you become a great politician or businessman, you will also become easily corrupted. It's always great ideas and great talks - before you get the position. Then, once you get to some higher position and because you are a social creature, you will also do the same like most other leaders - spreading filth, lies, corruption, become a master of deception, talking with big smile, honest tone and enthusiasm in your voice - while doing the exact opposite in secrecy... You'll do it because it is much easier and everybody does it anyway. That's why it is so important to base your life style on great morals, people may not like you for your strong opinions a and possible criticism, but they will trust you because you follow TRUE values...

Nothing is of course just black or white, you can find some friends with similar believes or seduction as a hobby, LOL. With some assertiveness and good communication skills you can become good in crowds. It is just more and more difficult as you are becoming older, you are meeting new and new people, they have their own believes and opinions, you always sort of have to explain yourself if you want to be this sort of "friends"... But you sort of learn as you go, just because it is my experience it doesn't mean that others experience the same.

As there are "Alpha" and "Beta" labels for guys, there is also "Sigma" label. Don't remember the exact definition, it's sort of Alpha without all the crowds, leading and following. You do what the fuck you want to do, you are highly motivated and accomplish great things, you are very attractive to females, you still have some friends, but you are more of a loner, perhaps on a periphery of society. There are actually lots of guys like that. Oh, here, I found the definition: "By the time guys decide who is Alpha and who Beta in the group, Sigma fucks all the desirable females, and disappears without anyone noticing"...

So, I don't know where you fit, just try not be Beta or Nice Guy. Learn from leaders, be more Alpha if you don't get frustrated with crowds, or be more Sigma.

----------

As far as building your life, IMO it is good to build it in multiple levels. Once you get through seduction you'll actually realize that problems with girls exist only because your life is not in certain order. Once you build your life girls will naturally flow into it. So, IMO these are some of the great areas you should work on, not necessary in the order but in general:

* Get higher education, even if you don't like studying. Education IS great and IS for everybody. If you are in your early 20's, I wouldn't accept anything less that Master's degree. Remember, most classy girls are very smart, they know where to look for a good man.

* After education, see if you can open your own business. Nothing better than having your own business, being your own boss, being independent ... Get your finances together. Yes, you want to be filthy rich, forget all the sorry ass "he does it for money only". That's a lie, most people who have money work hard for in in some way, they spent countless hours on it. Mostly those who have nothing do nothing. That's the truth that nobody wants to see. At the same time, there are unfortunately lots of crooks out there as well. And yes, you want to start saving for retirement already, the sooner the better... $100 today will be several thousands 40 years from now...

* Forget exercise 3x per week. Exercise for Life. Make it a habit, lift those weights, make the testosterone and adrenaline pumping, even light or moderate weights are more than enough. Impress girls in fitness with your sweat :)

* Do Martial Arts. Looking back, these were my best years of my life. Everything I have or am today is thanks to Martial Arts - great education, access to money, confidence, desire to be healthy, desire for honesty/truth, self reliance, great fundamentals, self esteem, motivation, winner attitude, ability to love or feel for other people, you name it. It is not just fighting or practicing kicks couple times per week, it's a way of life. It will transfer your life on many levels because you will learn to live and think like a warrior. Not just couple of weeks, but the whole life... Weights and Martial Arts are great hobby anyway, they will keep you out of depression and healthy, you will meet great friends, and you always find some girls there as well... I actually want to go back to it, even just recreationally, just for the spirit of it...

* Nutrition, food you eat. Very important. Eat healthy, lots of veggies, some fruits, eat fresh. It's difficult and expensive but try organic, grown without pesticides, ... Try to avoid GMO, it is actually forbidden in many countries, yet approved as "safe" in states. It is so safe that they even don't want to label it, go figure.... Avoid processed foods, minimize meats, minimizes or eliminate all the fried, smoked and fast food. No sodas and no sweets - it is all garbage, it is poison poisoning your body. I wish I could live to day when most of the current diet will become illegal and considered criminal. Again, this is very important, you don't care now because you are young, but 20-40 years from now the garbage and poison will accumulate in your body, and you may be very very sick just because of poor diet choices....

* Spirituality. IMO also important, don't limit yourself only to one religion, explore. Don't limit yourself to atheism, explore the other side as well. Go to church if you've never been to, read some atheist logic if you never did. Read about Jesus, Buddhism, Hinduism, read about yoga, talk to your Muslim friend. Read Bhagavad Gita, Osho... Read philosophy, browse through history... Read about Life, and read about Death. Read science if you can, about universe, quantum mechanics... Read works of great writers from different countries, E.A. Poe, Dostojevski,... There is just so much stuff, far beyond one person can even comprehend...

* Learn to be independent, financially and emotionally. Learn to think independently. Always explore ideas of others, but also make sure you do lots of your own work. Do your own research, for example the nutrition mentioned above. Don't trust anyone just because they label it "safe". Trust yourself, always trust your logic. Learn to be happy without girls, that's also important.

* Build your values as described above. Build honesty, trust, keep your promises, return your debt. When I buy a car or other product, I want reliable car that I can trust. If I get it, if it is exactly as promised, I'll buy it next time too. If you are a bank and lend someone money, you want the money back too. You will lend only if you trust that person. If I find a friend or girl that I can trust and rely upon, I want to keep them too. I want to keep things and people that have value. Don't get fooled by easier life in groups, build your own value, and once you have higher value girls will recognize it fast. Girls are smart, girls are not stupid, quality girls recognize and keep guys with high value...

* Love your life, love whatever you do. Became a lover, love females, love other people, love animals, love the ocean or mountains... Love is not that you fall in love with a girl, and if she doesn't give you blowjob you get all depressed and suicidal because you feel that all your life is worthless.... True love is when you just smile and walk away, wishing her all the best, that's a true value. Find your passion, and love yourself the way you are. Make and keep at least some friends, see them when you can. Two friends in fitness, three from martial arts, five from school, one in business. Good enough, don't become a Facebook face with 680 "likes"... Also learn to give without excepting back. It's a good exercise, on your last day on this planet you will have to give EVERYTHING away, and that day will eventually come for everyone of us...

* There is of course more, but good enough. Seduction should be only at the bottom, it is just a fine tuning, it is just skills to make it easy for girls to join your life....

Anyway, the above is not "do exactly this and that". It's more about exploring and integrating more areas into your life. Maybe you like to climb up the mountains or bungee jumping instead of martial arts, who knows? Do what's good for you...
 

Ezio

Space Monkey
space monkey
Joined
Jan 28, 2015
Messages
82
Thanks a lot for all this great help, Drck.

I am still trying to understand, apply, try and mostly trying to grasp all this wisdom.

When i feel that i have some more thoughts to share, i will post again in this topic.

Until then, i ll be trying to figure it out, because this topic about "powers" is really deep, at least for me.
 
Top