Sympathy For Our Indian Brothers

[DarkKnight]

Lot of guys are into gym culture here but only the nerdy guys or really rich guys go to west.

Nerdy guys become the stereotype while rich folks become the cool Indian exception .

Anyways , what I am saying is you are only getting a small and selected sample of indian men ... Which due to criteria of migration ( most of them go to study there and have to work a lot ) .... Is creating a lot of stereotypes which are true but not for all the whole nation .

Hey this is actually interesting to know, so we are dealing with selection bias

 

[ulrich]

The entire South America has forgotten the several millennia old connections with India, Our Indian Epics dating back to about 12,000 BC talk about these connections. This bond is ancient, we fail to see this bond, but others see it.

What???

Also, Mexico is not South America… but that’s a whole different discussion.

 

[Samsara]

Adapt to the market , that's all there is.

WOMEN ENJOY PARADOXES, that is CULTURALLY (ethnically) SAME but SUPERFICIALLY ( racially) DIFFERENT.

Yeah, most woman want exotic looking men who are culturally similar to them (ethnically same, racially can be anything). Most Indian men are in a cultural limbo here, neither have they integrated completely here, nor do they completely hold on to their roots, it's these kinda people that are in the limbo who have trouble with women from other races. . If he can integrate successfully, there is no question of his ethnicity being Indian, Women do not have problem with race as such.

This is pretty much in accordance with Chase's SAC model, and somewhere he has spoken about "othering" and why it should not be triggered.
The problem why Indian men have trouble with women from other races is because of the DIFFERENCES IN ETHNICITY AND NOT RACE. this can be done easily, by changing food habits, clothing style, consciously picking up the lingo by hanging out in social clubs, and in that process he loses his Indianess and woman start noticing him.


My entire post was because of @Adventurer incorrect statements. Had to set the record straight

 

[Spyce D]

My entire post was because of @Adventurer incorrect statements. Had to set the record straight

Agreed . No doubt .

@Samsara I see your point but I remember @Chase wrote somewhere that cuz he didn't fully integrate in some cultures that lead to women cutting him more slack .

What I believe is that you have strong game , strong frame , high fundamentals , and know the market well enough ... No need to integrate .. but do adapt .

Example , SC Bose married a German women during 1930-40s ,.MN Roy married American women before 1940s I guess .

I don't know if they lost their indianess to get white woman .

For those who don't know both were Indian freedom fighters and revolutionaries in their own right .

Many other examples in history.

Greek princess ( Greeks who were ruling Afghanistan , transoxianna ) marrying In Mauryan ( indian empire ) family .

He didn't become less indian for her.

 

[Michael Chief]

@Michael Chief
I'm not saying Indians do not have a lot to improve, true there is much to improve, but what I want others to Understand is that, 1000 + years of invasions has changed the psyche of India radically, it is going to take trust and time to change that image. We know media always portray a narrative, this narrative has never painted India well.

And I wasn't necessarily saying that Indians as a whole have to improve. I was just acknowledging the existence of certain stereotypes in the American psyche.

What matters more is what we do as individuals in response to the circumstances we were given. In my case, being ethnically Korean, I purposefully went against the negative Asian stereotypes and found some success that way. Korea also has a long history of being invaded, but that doesn't have shit to do with me, especially since I'm culturally as American as they come. I don't know why you're hung up about India's history. Do you think that ranting about it on a forum about getting girls is going to somehow shift the societal narrative and negate some stereotypes in the minds of non-Indian women somehow?

What you are basically saying is take an Indian, remove the Indianess or the Indian culture in him, aka make him "American" then the woman will accept him.

If an Indian wants to do well with woman outside of India, what you suggest might be the easiest way.

I will assume that you are just referring to the thing I said about accents. I believe you can be muscular, confident, masculine, etc. without sacrificing any "Indianness."

Yes, if I had a Korean accent, it would likely hurt my chances with most American women for the same reason about consonants and vowels I mentioned before. Some aspects of some cultures are perceived as either sexier or less sexy. The way Latinos stereotypically dance can give them an advantage. The way Germans stereotypically lack humor could give them a disadvantage. It is what it is.

 

[raiden]

Adapt to the market , that's all there is.


Well , I can't wait to visit west now cuz to me it feels like a worthy challenge .


Hopefully , by that time I will be advanced and with my exotic factor will help too .

Isn't the point that a guy can't adapt to the market because he can't change his ethnicity? The guy could have had approach invitations if his ethnicity were different but, with his ethnicity, he doesn't get them. He starts his approaches off on the back foot compared with others who got an approach invitation first. He can work to make up for that but the point of the OP seems to be that it's a travesty that he has to.

 

[Spyce D]

Damn ! This thread went from " sympathy for indian brothers " to " indian brothers fighting among themselves " .


I am done .

 

[Samsara]

Isn't the point that a guy can't adapt to the market because he can't change his ethnicity? The guy could have had approach invitations if his ethnicity were different but, with his ethnicity, he doesn't get them. He starts his approaches off on the back foot compared with others who got an approach invitation first. He can work to make up for that but the point of the OP seems to be that it's a travesty that he has to.

The issue is not ethnicity itself, it's about how one ethnicity is being graded as superior or inferior to the other, The OP didn't get AI because he was mistakenly associated with an ethnicity wrongly labelled as "inferior". It takes maturity and understanding to realize that there is nothing called an "inferior" ethnicity. Most women/men do not have that understanding or maturity.

What makes it seem like an ethnicity is "superior" or "greater"? To understand this we must look at history, the victors have rewritten the books to come out smelling like roses, and the others to smell like crap.

I don't know why you're hung up about India's history.

@Michael Chief This is why I was talking about Indian history and I know Korea has been invaded, one of my heroes is the greatest naval admiral the planet has seen, Korean admiral by the name Yi Sun-Sin.
For instance:

The Western perception is that accents that emphasize vowels and have less stress on consonants are sexier. Accents that emphasize consonants and shorten the vowels are a turn-off.

This is a great example of victors rewriting history, and the effects are still felt long after

Do you think that ranting about it on a forum about getting girls is going to somehow shift the societal narrative and negate some stereotypes in the minds of non-Indian women somehow?

Ranting? I haven't even started, not cool trying to paint my response as a rant,

I don't particularly care to change the minds of anyone, I'm just trying to set the record straight with a good discussion for anyone who reads this page with a straight mind.

Yes, if I had a Korean accent, it would likely hurt my chances with most American women for the same reason about consonants and vowels I mentioned before. Some aspects of some cultures are perceived as either sexier or less sexy. The way Latinos stereotypically dance can give them an advantage. The way Germans stereotypically lack humor could give them a disadvantage. It is what it is.

It is what it is because nobody talks about the uncomfortable truth, no one wants to change the record and set it right. INDIAN MEN HAVE IT TOUGH BECAUSE IT HAS BEEN PAINTED THAT WAY by the victors whereas in most regions WHITE MEN are viewed as a catch BECAUSE they painted themselves as a catch. THESE ARE UNCOMFORTABLE TRUTHS NOBODY WANTS TO TALK ABOUT.


Again you're right, it is time to look forward and keep marching, the only thing that matters now is to do what can be done with what is given to us. It is also important to remember what GEORGE SANTAYANA said " Those who forget the past are condemned to repeat it" .Currently Indian men have been given the short end of the stick, and it will help to set things right if everyone can recognize and understand that. Which I think was the aim of THE OP.

 

[Michael Chief]

This is a great example of victors rewriting history, and the effects are still felt long after

Not sure I buy that. Even in music, sustained notes that emulate vowel-like sounds will have a greater calming effect while staccato notes and other consonant-like sounds will elicit a more jarring feeling. Universally. And I originally learned that consonant and vowel thing from a NLP/Speed Seduction source, which is supposedly about subconscious stuff (I know it's pseudoscience at best, though).

But OK. Let's assume that your hypothesis is true, and that everything you're saying is right.

The way you're engaging with all this information about Indian history and stereotypes makes it seem like you've got some serious personal insecurities about race. I'm not trying to insult you. It's just worth focusing on this point here because this forum is supposed to be about making ourselves more attractive and masculine, and insecurity is among the least attractive or masculine things there is. This might be a good opportunity for you to reflect and level up.

Note that I'm not suggesting that you simply hide your insecurity by just masking the symptoms, like just forcing yourself to not type in all caps, forcing yourself to be more like the white man as you implicitly accept that he has the superior ethnicity, or any shit like that. Just try to imagine how a mature, grounded, masculine Indian man would engage with the world. If he is happy and living in abundance, it does not look like what you've shown us here. If he's impassioned with a calling to change the world for the better, it'd still probably look different. Explore the reframes.

 

[Samsara]

The way you're engaging with all this information about Indian history and stereotypes makes it seem like you've got some serious personal insecurities about race. I'm not trying to insult you.

I have no personal insecurities man, I have been respectful on the forum, rehashed the history my people have been through and you seem to think I'm insecure. Seems like you have an image of how I should have replied to this post ,I don't fit that image of yours and then you call me insecure.

this forum is supposed to be about making ourselves more attractive and masculine, and insecurity is among the least attractive or masculine things there is

Indeed, most Indians do not know their own history and rely on biased non Indian sources for that, which in turn make them insecure, this can be said for any other culture that had similar situations to India. Not many people have met an Indian who knows his own history well and naturally when there is an interaction, pushback is quite expected.

This might be a good opportunity for you to reflect and level up.

You seem to think I need to reflect and level up, but I disagree with you, also I have no beef with you or anyone else here

forcing yourself to be more like the white man as you implicitly accept that he has the superior ethnicity, or any shit like that.

I never said anything like that, all I said is Indians have been dealt a bad hand this round and we need to continue playing nevertheless, while understanding why we got dealt a bad hand so that it doesn't repeat again.

it does not look like what you've shown us here. If he's impassioned with a calling to change the world for the better, it'd still probably look different.

This smells of a judgy power move. Again I disagree, I have been more than respectful, grounded to everyone and only struck to facts.

 

[ElChe]

I find this a very dangerous way of thinking, because if you think like this you simply assume your ethnicity is inferior.

Guys please, asian, Indian, Namek or from planet Orion. Show some pride.

Couldn't agree more

 

[Michael Chief]

If they are wrong about something, rather than be chill and humble and gracious about it, they will get defensive or try to one-up you or claim that you are incorrect...They tend to be extremely rigid in their worldviews, too; they are right, everyone else is wrong, and trying to talk with them about anything it is like your words just do not get through. People who don't share their background find all this behavior (know-it-all-ism, posturing, ladder climbing, rigidity of viewpoint, and so on) frustrating and off-putting, so you end up with these stigmas.

Oh.

Well, TIL.

 

[Spyce D]

Just try to imagine how a mature, grounded, masculine Indian man would engage with the world. If he is happy and living in abundance, it does not look like what you've shown us here. If he's impassioned with a calling to change the world for the better, it'd still probably look different. Explore the reframes

This should be highlighted somewhere .

Kudos .

 

[ElChe]

I can clarify a bit about certain things here.


In west , if a guy from India has to migrate ...most likely he has to get into college there , work 3 jobs , pay rent , send money back home ( or not ) , try to make a life for himself cuz

1. His parents sold their land to send him for a better future .
2. His parents took loan which he repay while working , studying .

And due to indian economy , rupee being weak against dollar ... Life is tough for indian students there ( a lot of my friends , relatives are there so I know it from them )

So , this leads to them being more competitive ( social ladder ) , more nerdy otherwise they won't have a job and will be sent back home .

And those who manage to get a job and marry ... End up raising kids with these same principles cuz this lead them to success .

This is actually really interesting man, thanks for sharing this.

This could help me relate to Indian people here (including Indian women), so I think this is valuable from a social and seduction point of view

 

[ElChe]

Guys this thread got derailed. I learned some cool stuff about Indians but now I command everyone to chill out.

Anyway, thanks for the cool info, I was feeling sad and lame before I started reading this thread and now I'm gonna go back to that

 

[Spyce D]

This is actually really interesting man, thanks for sharing this.

This could help me relate to Indian people here (including Indian women), so I think this is valuable from a social and seduction point of view

Just don't take what I said to the extreme .. but more of a guideline as you might find exceptions too.

 

[ElChe]

Just don't take what I said to the extreme .. but more of a guideline as you might find exceptions too.

Yeah, for sure. I won't go assuming anything about anyone until I find out their actual background.

But it does make me curious!

 

[Swati]

Indians are secretly self hating on their own skin complexions and on each other, they hate their own kind and wants some attention from other race to fix their own skin problem, or just how to stop being Indian

Most of them just a want to vent their insecurities, it's always the Indians wanting a different ethnic group for girls. especially the "white girls" lol, cause they think it ascends them to a higher caste of some shit.

 

[Samsara]

Oh.

Well, TIL.

"labelling someone as "argumentative" irrespective of whether he is or not and when he fights back against the mis labelling people jump in to say exactly"

@Michael Chief you haven't addressed a single point I raised, you just use personal attacks man.

Indians are secretly self hating on their own skin complexions and on each other, they hate their own kind and wants some attention from other race to fix their own skin problem, or just how to stop being Indian

Most of them just a want to vent their insecurities, it's always the Indians wanting a different ethnic group for girls. especially the "white girls" lol, cause they think it ascends them to a higher caste of some shit.

LOL,
and @Michael Chief calls me insecure!

 

[Spyce D]

white girls

They are actually misinterpreted as being easy to get laid with cuz of their open ness , more sexually liberated compared to indian women .

I will try to explain by analogy .

A guy who has always lived in village will see city women as being sluttier , and would think that they must be really easy to get with but when he goes in the city ... Do you think he will have any luck if he doesn't adapt ... And that will lead to him whine about city girls not liking him / his kind .. and how city girls have weird standards.

I think that something similar is happening with indian guys fantasizing about white women .

I may be wrong tho , but that's just my observation.

@Swati even though I agree with what you say , but there is lot to it . So , I just request you to avoid talking about things that might cause trigger to some folks on the forum .